Getting Margins Right: The Essential Mix of Recurring, Product, and Professional Services for MSPs

The episode centers on profit margins and service mix strategies for MSPs, emphasizing the importance of maintaining recurring revenue margins above 50%, preferably targeting 65–70% for long-term sustainability. Industry averages indicate recurring revenue margins as low as 35%, which Speaker B and Speaker C note presents a risk to driving profit down to the bottom line. The discussion identifies that margins tend to erode with organizational growth due to overhead but underscores the necessity of regular price adjustments built into client contracts and regular scrutiny of margin performance as core practices to avoid financial shortfalls. Supporting these observations, Speaker C advises MSPs to gradually move from lower margin brackets to achieve at least 50% in recurring services, acknowledging this transition typically requires sustained effort over several years. For professional services, a margin range of 40–60% is considered attainable, with 50% as the practical target. Regarding income mix, respondents suggest 70% of revenue should derive from recurring services and the remaining 30% from professional or project-based work. Both speakers highlight that smaller MSPs may achieve higher margins, while competitive pressure and organizational complexity often erode these numbers. Adjacent discussions address operational and security challenges. The show covers recent FBI public service announcements warning of increased cyber threats originating from Russian and Iranian actors, specifically targeting government, political, and journalist entities. Speaker C and Speaker B recommend that MSPs communicate only the most relevant advisories to clients to avoid information overload, framing updates as evidence of service diligence rather than sources of alarm. In addition, Microsoft’s new AI security dashboard in Microsoft 365 is reviewed, which uses Defender sensors already present in Windows 11 devices to provide visibility into AI activity and configuration security at no extra cost, provided suitable licensing for Defender is in place. The operational implications for MSPs include the need for rigor in pricing models, clear partnership agreements, and transparent communications with clients about both technology changes and external threats. The recurring emphasis on risk management, margin preservation, and responsible client engagement reflects a harm-reduction mindset. Regular contract reviews, maintaining consultative relationships, and avoiding over-communication of security issues are presented as accountability measures that support stability and trust in MSP operations.Question of the week: What margins should I be targeting? And what is the mix that I should be shooting for? Recurring Professional services Product sales   Talking to clients about international affairs. The Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) are jointly issuing this public service announcement (PSA) to warn the public about ongoing phishing campaigns by cyber actors associated with the Russian Intelligence Services (RIS) targeting commercial messaging applications. The activity targets individuals of high intelligence value, such as current and former U.S. government officials, military personnel, political figures, and journalists. https://www.ic3.gov/PSA/2026/PSA260320   The Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) is releasing this FLASH to disseminate information on malicious cyber activity conducted by actors on behalf of the Government of Iran Ministry of Intelligence and Security (MOIS). Specifically, MOIS cyber actors are responsible for using Telegram as a command-and-control (C2) infrastructure to push malware targeting Iranian dissidents, journalists opposed to Iran, and other opposition groups around the world. This malware resulted in intelligence collection, data leaks, and reputational harm against the targeted parties. https://www.ic3.gov/CSA/2026/260320.pdf   New AI Security Dashboard for M365. Requires Defender onboarding to be effective  Check it out: https://AI.security.microsoft.com Learn: https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/blog/microsoft-security-blog/security-dashboard-for-ai---now-generally-available/449463   Amy’s class is now available for purchase at Coassemble.  This is her Create your AI Service Package.  The purpose of the course is to consider all of the things that you might want to include in your offering. https://www.thirdtier.net/2026/03/20/create-your-ai-management-package/  Coassemble: https://coassemble.com/c/0ZKD2Z Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Microsoft’s decision to increase pricing across its Microsoft 365 product suite, excluding Business Premium, is a notable development for MSPs and IT service providers managing client subscriptions and budgets. According to discussion on the SMB Community Podcast, the price hikes range from 8% to 30% across various plans and products, with only Business Premium escaping the adjustment while still adding new features. Microsoft is also expanding mailbox storage, with each mailbox now receiving an additional 50GB, raising the individual mailbox limit from 50GB to 100GB. Additional details provided in the podcast highlight that Microsoft Business Premium continues to receive feature enhancements without a corresponding rise in cost. Upcoming functional improvements include expanded AI capabilities for Microsoft Chat, which will offer agent-based access to documents and files within the user’s tenant. The licensing distinction is important: while the unlicensed version of Chat requires manual document uploads, the licensed version allows AI features to operate securely within the organization’s environment, keeping sensitive data contained and not exposed externally. The conversation also explored sales strategies and portfolio management for MSPs. Both hosts endorsed a harm-reduction approach to client engagement, advocating for saying “yes” to a broad range of customer needs to protect client relationships and avoid driving clients toward competitors. They noted that even if a requested service is outside of a provider’s core competencies, partnering with another vendor or project-managing the solution maintains client trust. Discussion further addressed the operational and valuation benefits of vertical specialization, particularly as MSPs grow beyond $2 million annual revenue, given higher buyer valuations for vertically focused firms. MSPs and senior IT leaders should review Microsoft’s pricing adjustments in detail to mitigate downstream risk for their own margins and client contracts. Decision-makers are advised to analyze service offerings and clearly communicate distinctions between licensed and unlicensed AI features to minimize operational and security risks. Adopting a client-aligned engagement model—being prepared to source or manage non-core solutions—can reduce customer churn but may also require revised processes for vendor selection, project management, and risk evaluation. Specializing in key client verticals may enhance firm value in acquisitions or exit scenarios.   Microsoft Community Days: https://www.communitydays.org/Find one coming to a city near you! How can MSPs better communicate their full service offerings?  Amy’s blog about saying yes: https://www.thirdtier.net/2024/04/02/amys-sayings-the-answer-is-always-yes/ Should MSPs have a VERTICAL MARKET FOCUS? MICROSOFT IN THE NEWS: Microsoft Suite prices (except for Business Premium) increases and no more grace period for your data https://www.sysdrive.net/two-microsoft-365-changes-coming-in-2026-that-every-business-should-know-about/ Microsoft Business Premium accounts get additional 50GB per mailbox https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/blog/2025/12/04/advancing-microsoft-365-new-capabilities-and-pricing-update/ Copilot Chat without a separate license will be able to see into Outlook and Office products. And work as agents. But you have to upload the data into them. Does not have the same level of protection as the licensed version. E3 and E5 are getting the Intune Suite. It’s a lot of device management features, but one of note is Remote Help. Restaurant Human Robot goes BERSERK in a Cupertino California after employee hit the wrong button https://www.thedailybeast.com/restaurant-staff-struggle-to-restrain-dancing-robot-causing-dining-room-chaos/   Resources and Events for MSPs:   Third Tier’s Continuing Education Program: https://www.thirdtier.net/2026/03/20/stop-drowning-in-m365-security-changes-join-our-continuing-education-program-for-admins-and-security-pros/                      Small Biz Thoughts Community for MSPs: www.smallbizthoughts.org Engage with us at www.smbcommunitypodcast.com Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

https://www.theinformation.com/articles/iran-war-imperils-300-billion-gulf-ai-spending?utm_campaign=article_email&utm_content=article-16718&utm_medium=email&utm_source=sg The war: The USA has bombed three data centers owned by Amazon. This is the first time I've seen data centers be targets. It won't be the last.  The war: Middle eastern countries have promised $300 billion in AI infrastructure investment. Some in their countries and some in ours. That investment is in  jeopardy now as the bombs fall.   Memory Costs Squeeze Entry-Level Hardware as Suppliers Capture Margin Upstream   Apple’s $599 MacBook Neo Signals a Split Hardware Strategy, Not a Budget Play   Big announcement from Microsoft. A long rumored and asked for E7 plan. Finally, Microsoft announced the Microsoft 365 E7 Frontier Worker Suite, also available from May 1, priced at $99 per user per month. The bundle combines Microsoft 365 E5—long the company’s premium business productivity suite—with Microsoft 365 Copilot and Agent 365. It also includes the Microsoft Entra Suite and advanced Defender, Intune, and Purview security capabilities. It'll sell for $99 . The $99 price is below what customers would pay if they purchased these capabilities separately, according to Microsoft. The component pricing of the constituent parts—E5 at $60, Entra Suite at $12, Copilot at $30, and Agent 365 at $15—adds up to $117 per user.   https://www.linkedin.com/news/story/openai-hardware-chief-resigns-over-rushed-pentagon-pact-7064308/?lipi=urn%3Ali%3Apage%3Ad_flagship3_feed%3Bx3AKUbDJSbm6nGyejyaodg%3D%3D     UPCOMING CHANNEL EVENTS:     Mastermind LIVE Event – San Diego March 26-27th https://portal.kernanconsulting.com/mastermind-event Exclusive Small Biz Thoughts Community Members Live Workshop: How AI Helps MSP Radio Production…and Where It Doesn’t Help.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A significant risk area discussed is the challenge of “invisible work” in managed services due to increasing automation and the adoption of artificial intelligence (AI). Customers, according to participants, increasingly lack awareness of the work being performed on their behalf, which raises doubts about the value of services provided by MSPs. With prices for services escalating, clients are demanding higher-touch engagement and visibility into operations, creating a disconnect between automated backend activities and client expectations for tangible service. Supporting this, hosts cited the difficulties in proving the value of proactive prevention, such as security incidents that did not occur, and noted that with further automation, particularly through AI, this challenge will intensify. Customers may question why they continue to pay elevated fees if tasks can be completed by AI or low-cost competitors, amplifying price pressure and the potential for misaligned perceptions of value. Examples included references to the current technology stack, where some tools cost more to integrate and operate—particularly with new AI workloads—than previous turnkey supplier models, often with increased operational complexity and support risks. The episode addressed secondary risks stemming from overreliance on both small, unproven vendors and on large-scale automation. Hosts highlighted the volatility of new entrants in security and infrastructure, pointing out that many lack lifecycle support or robustness, making them unreliable partners for business-critical tasks. Recent events, such as the OpenAI boycott following its Department of Defense contract and operational disruptions at AI provider Claude, were used to illustrate instability among technology suppliers. The conversation also covered the risks of unchecked AI deployment, with examples from military and financial sectors where automation led to errors or was used to rationalize significant workforce reductions. The practical implications for MSPs and IT service providers center on maintaining transparency with clients, reassessing vendor risk (particularly with AI and new software providers), and calibrating expectations for automation. The hosts recommended reinforcing client communication regarding the nature and value of services, conducting due diligence on technology partners, and aligning automation strategies with operational risk management frameworks. Emphasis was placed on the need for ongoing human oversight, especially where automated decisions could lead to adverse outcomes, and on approaching AI adoption as a phase for careful experimentation rather than wholesale business transformation. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The most consequential development highlighted in the episode is Anthropic’s refusal to alter its AI contract terms for the US federal government, specifically regarding the prohibition of mass domestic surveillance and the deployment of autonomous lethal robots. Anthropic declined to allow the government unrestricted, legally permitted use of its software, resulting in the cancellation of a $200 million federal contract and the company’s designation as a supply chain threat. This sequence underscores ongoing concerns about ethical, operational, and governance risks associated with AI technologies deployed at scale by government agencies. Supporting details reveal that all other major AI providers servicing federal contracts—including OpenAI, Google, and xAI—agreed to the government’s revised terms, which permit any legal use without restriction. According to Amy Babinchak, Anthropic’s stance was based on reliability and readiness issues in its platform, specifically in domains of domestic surveillance and fully autonomous military systems, which remain controversial from both technical and moral standpoints. The government’s response, involving not only contract withdrawal but restrictions on federal contractor usage, demonstrates the gravity of compliance expectations and supply chain security considerations. The episode also addresses practical strategies for MSPs seeking to establish themselves as trusted local providers. James Kernan and Amy Babinchak emphasize consistent community engagement, including recurring events, charitable involvement, and practical low-cost networking tactics such as sponsoring social gatherings at local venues. The importance of consistent marketing, ongoing relationship-building with prospects and partners, and active participation in local business organizations are discussed. Additionally, operational news from the IT sector, such as the moderate decline in wage inflation since 2022 and the continued rise in IT spending, is briefly reviewed, as is product development by vendors like NinjaOne adding asset management capabilities. For MSPs, IT service providers, and technology decision-makers, the episode provides quantifiable insights concerning operational risk, vendor accountability, and compliance tradeoffs. AI adoption at enterprise or governmental levels requires rigorous evaluation of contractual terms, ethical boundaries, and supply chain impact. Local reputation-building demands sustained effort and investment, while operational trends such as wage stabilization and product enhancements reflect current market realities. Taken together, these developments point to the need for increased diligence in risk management, careful vendor selection, and ongoing community-facing operations to achieve sustainable business outcomes.   Topics / Events:   https://businessof.tech/2026/02/02/it-services-market-growth-to-1-09t-coincides-with-declining-wage-inflation/ North America IT Services Market is projected to grow significantly, rising from approximately $602.15 billion in 2025 to about $1.09 trillion by 2033, representing a compound annual growth rate of 7.72%. Global technology spending is on the rise,  marking a 7.8% increase as generative artificial intelligence drives the surge. Enterprises are focusing on AI talent, with job postings related to AI accounting for 20% of available tech roles Terms of Service – FEDERAL GOVT  AI   - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-pentagon-vs-anthropic-an-a-i-agent-slandered/id1528594034?i=1000750653008 https://businessof.tech/2026/02/10/ninjaone-adds-asset-management-zoom-launches-ai-workspace-tool-jumpcloud-opens-vc-arm/ Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The primary discussion in the episode centers on the increasing risk to data privacy posed by the adoption of artificial intelligence (AI) applications within SMB environments. Panelists highlighted the challenge of educating clients on how AI systems may access, process, and transmit sensitive information, sometimes integrating client data into broader training datasets owned by third parties. Specific emphasis was placed on the operational reality that data, once shared with AI models, may no longer be under the original owner’s control. This development directly affects both regulatory compliance and client trust, especially for service providers tasked with protecting client environments. Supporting details referenced both technical and procedural countermeasures available to MSPs. Tools such as browser-based security assessments (e.g., Atacama), network analysis at the firewall, and Microsoft 365’s built-in security features (Defender and Cloud App Security) were identified as practical resources for monitoring data flow and enforcing restrictions on AI integration. The approach recommended focuses on assessment-driven education—using tangible network data to demonstrate risks and capabilities, supporting MSPs in facilitating more accountable, informed decision-making among clients. Adjacent topics included a workforce transition in the MSP sector, driven by compliance and security requirements. The discussion referenced an industry demographic shift, with a substantive proportion of MSP owners above the age of 55, and many considering mergers or exits rather than evolving to meet new consulting, compliance, and productivity challenges introduced by AI. Additional coverage addressed the impact of AI and data center expansion on community resources (e.g., demands on electrical grids and water supply), as well as divergent organizational responses to emerging consumer technologies such as smart glasses.   Evolve or Exit -  Many MSP’s are facing this reality https://mspglobal.com/blog/exit-or-evolve-msp-reinvention-cycle/ Browser based security assessment tool http://www.atakama.com   States moving to require AI to pay for its own electricity. https://www.perplexity.ai/page/states-move-to-shield-ratepaye-0_4v24YTRWGbech52eWGZw   Airforce ban meta glasses while army adopts them.  https://www.perplexity.ai/page/air-force-bans-meta-ai-glasses-KTBzW6_tQom3lJ6XuWNcZg Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

This Week's Highlights:1. Elevating Your Business ConversationsEver feel anxious about those business-focused meetings with customers? You’re not alone! In this episode, Amy Babinchak and James Kernan share their personal experiences—like ice-breakers for introverts, why finding common ground matters, and how to move the business convo from awkward to actionable. Here’s Amy’s advice: listen actively, ask about their growth and goals, and let those insights lead you into productive IT conversations. You don’t need to come to the table with all the answers—just be ready to listen and respond.2. Why MSAs MatterAre Master Service Agreements (MSAs) critical? Our hosts agree: absolutely. James Kernan and Amy Babinchak lay out why every MSP should have a clear, enforceable contract with each customer (especially if you ever plan to sell your business). They cover how overcomplicated contracts can be a sales hurdle, the importance of keeping agreements simple, and protecting your liability in the age of fast-moving tech and shadow AI.3. Industry NewsWe touch on the recent Pax8 hack—what was exposed, why you should care, and how leaks can impact negotiations. Plus, a heads-up on the ongoing scarcity and price hikes for memory and storage thanks to AI's heavy demand. Don’t skimp when buying devices for clients! Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

In this episode, hosts James Kernan and Amy Babinchak dive into practical insights for MSPs and IT service providers, powered by Small Biz Thoughts.They kick things off by tackling the question of the week: What should you say in front of a crowd of 100 decision makers if you only have five minutes? James Kernan and Amy Babinchak share strategies for making a memorable impact and overcoming public speaking nerves—offering actionable tips and stories from their own experiences.The episode also covers important industry news, including Microsoft’s cancellation of standalone OneDrive and SharePoint licenses, Apple’s stronger-than-expected quarterly results and AI strategy, upcoming server end-of-life dates, and Tesla’s surprising shift away from building cars towards humanoid robots.Whether you’re looking for advice on public speaking or the latest tech developments, this episode delivers valuable takeaways for MSPs staying sharp in a rapidly evolving landscape. Links:  https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/partner-center/announcements/2026-januaryhttps://businessof.tech/2026/01/30/record-iphone-sales-and-a-2-billion-ai-acquisition-signal-apples-long-term-control-strategy/https://www.cnbc.com/2026/01/28/tesla-ending-model-s-x-production.htmlhttps://www.canalys.com/insights/top-352-industry-events-msps-vars-channel-ecosystem-professionals     Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

In this episode of the SMB Community Podcast, hosted by James Kernan, guest Amy Slater from Innovative Events discusses her transition from the medical field to marketing and events. Amy shares insights on how her company helps MSPs with their marketing, including detailed strategies and processes. She emphasizes the importance of building a strong foundation in marketing and how her team ensures consistent engagement before, during, and after events. Moreover, Amy discusses her involvement with the Managed Service Providers Association of America (MSPAA) and the upcoming events she will participate in. Listeners can learn about her approach to personalized marketing and the valuable services her agency offers. https://innovevent.comAmy Slater: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amy-slater89/  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Overview: In this episode of the SMB Community Podcast, Amy interviews Steve Shattuck, VP of Global Partner Ecosystem and Business Development at GoTo. Steve shares his extensive background with AI from his tenure at Hewlett Packard Enterprise and discusses the transformative impact AI is having on the MSP industry. They delve into how AI can enhance rather than eliminate technician roles, the potential for AI to level the playing field between small and large MSPs, and the integration of AI in GoTo's product suite like LogMeIn Resolve. Key topics include automating mundane tasks, enhancing documentation processes, language translation in support, and the importance of developing a strategic AI approach for businesses. The episode concludes with Steve emphasizing the broader impact of breaking down communication barriers globally through AI. --- Chapter Markers: 00:00 Introduction to the SMB Community Podcast 00:30 Meet Steve Shattuck: AI Expert and Outdoor Enthusiast 04:49 AI's Impact on MSPs and Technicians 07:41 Leveraging AI for Enhanced MSP Services 24:16 AI and Language Translation in IT Support 28:27 Final Thoughts and Conclusion --- New Book Release: I'm proud to announce the release of my new book, The Anthology of Cybersecurity Experts! This collection brings together 15 of the nation's top minds in cybersecurity, sharing real-world solutions to combat today's most pressing threats. Whether you're an MSP, IT leader, or simply passionate about protecting your data, this book is packed with expert advice to help you stay secure and ahead of the curve. Available now on Amazon! https://a.co/d/f2NKASI --- Sponsor Memo: Since 2006, Kernan Consulting has been through over 30 transactions in mergers & acquisitions - and just this past year, we have been involved in six (6). If you are interested in either buying, selling, or valuation information, please reach out. There is alot of activity and you can be a part of it. For more information, reach out at kernanconsulting.com Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.