Operators Titans E004: David Herrmann, the Media Buyer’s Media Buyer

Learn what separates top 1% creative strategists from everyone else - and why AI is making this the most valuable role in performance marketing.The Marketing Operators break down the exact skills, mindset shifts, and creative strategy frameworks that will make you indispensable in 2026.Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trends

Brought to you by Applovin. Get access to the Operators channel expansion playbook, online masterclass, and up to $5k in ad credits.https://9operators.com/applovinDespite a one-page website with nothing but his name and a contact button, David Herrmann is easily the world’s most influential media buyer. Famous or infamous (especially if you’re an ad platform that triggers his X-posting wrath), he’s been shaping the face of ecommerce advertising for almost two decades.One part storytelling, two parts tactical insights … David shares his journey from selling MRI machines online to managing over a billion dollars in ad spend. Discover the challenges and triumphs of media buying, creative strategy, and the surprising roles of inhouse versus outsourced agencies. Whether you're a seasoned marketer or just starting out, this episode is packed with valuable takeaways and industry insights.

The trio is back together and today we’re getting into the topic of the evolution of the media buying role, and how media buying has transformed from button-pushing inside ad platforms to a more strategic role that demands creativity, data fluency, and taking ownership of the entire customer funnel. We explore friend-of-the-show Taylor Holiday’s growth engineer concept, how automation is reshaping the skill set needed, and we compare notes on how our companies are structuring our growth and paid media teams.From this, we get deeper into hiring and team culture - what traits we look for in senior marketing hires, how to build and curate self-starting teams, the importance of cultural fit, why marketers today must act like CEOs of their channels, and more.Watch the last week's episode for more on hiring for marketing: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4uFeSjSwBqe1e39cLQI78x?si=SZH0mEDkQU6VTqX9_QgMkQIf you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00:00 - Introduction00:06:06 - Deconstructing a Successful Product Launch00:22:35 - The Evolving Role of the Media Buyer00:37:48 - The "Marketer First" Mindset00:51:49 - How to Hire for a High-Performance Culture01:03:02 - Going Beyond the Resume to Find the Right FitPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsHaus.http://Haus.io/operatorsSubscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here: https://9operators.com/

First up today, we’re getting into OpenAI and ChatGPT shopping with the Shopify integration - including how we’re approaching GEO, why bigger brands might have the edge, and why we’re not going all in on optimization just yet.We also dig into SMS and email, where the real limit is on frequency, and the balance between driving conversions short-term vs unsubscribes vs retaining subscribers in the long-term.We share what we’ve tested, what the data shows about diminishing returns, and why most brands are probably leaving money on the table. We break down the difference between flows and campaigns, why flows can handle more volume, and how post-purchase upsells fit into this, from one-click add-ons to holding orders “double dash” style.We also check in on how podcast ads are performing at Jones Road - what the early results look like, why standard tracking under-attributes, and how we’re thinking about picking winners to scale. To finish up, we talk through the first three marketing hires we’d make if we were building a brand from scratch today.If you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00:00 - Introduction00:10:22 - Our Approach to ChatGPT Shopping & GEO00:27:13 - Finding the Real Limit on SMS & Email Frequency00:38:37 - Post-Purchase Upsells: One-Click vs. "Double Dash" Style00:51:51 - Podcast Ads: Jones Road's Early Results & Attribution01:01:18 - Drafting Your First 3 Marketing HiresPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsRivo.https://www.rivo.io/operatorsSubscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here: https://9operators.com/

Brought to you by Applovin. Get access to the Operators channel expansion playbook, online masterclass, and up to $5k in ad credits. https://www.9operators.com/applovinDive into the inspiring journey of McCoy Merkley from Portland Leather Goods. From answering a Craigslist ad to becoming a pivotal figure in the company's exponential growth, McCoy shares candid insights on transitioning from a one-man army to leading a full marketing team.Discover the challenges and triumphs of scaling a business, the importance of courage in leadership, and the strategic marketing mix that propelled Portland Leather Goods to success. Tune in for a conversation filled with practical wisdom and lots of humor, as McCoy reflects on the lessons learned along the way.

Today we’ve got a jam-packed episode for you, hitting on some of the things that are top of mind for us this week - product launches, Meta, partnerships, and more.First, we get into the value of teasing products and tactics on the best way to do that, how to make sure there’s social proof and community buzz from day one, and the role reviews play in building momentum at launch. We also discuss how Hollow turned an organic Joe Rogan plug into a marketing moment, before diving into Meta tactics and what’s actually moving the needle for Cody in terms of net new reach, from exclusions and bidding to the way we’re approaching mid-funnel.Finally, we get into partnerships and what we’ve got going on at Jones Road and HexClad - why we’re taking bigger swings, how persona-driven funnels fit into our strategies, and why it feels more like portfolio management than simple channel testing.If you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00:00 - Introduction00:11:18 - Pre-Launch Hype Strategies00:20:00 - The Power of Day-One Reviews & Social Proof00:33:40 - Joe Rogan's Organic Hollow Plug00:41:16 - Is Podcast Advertising Worth It?00:50:06 - How to Increase Your New Customer Rate on Meta01:00:02 - Unlocking Growth with Big-Bet Influencer PartnershipsPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsHaus.http://Haus.io/operatorsSubscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here:https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here: https://9operators.com/

In today’s episode, we’re getting into how and why direct mail can be an impactful part of your retention strategy. We discuss why the first 7–14 days post-purchase are critical, how we’re approaching cross-sells and multi-channel retention, what’s working from postcards to premium catalogs, and where direct mail fits into our overall growth strategies.We’re also joined by Michael Epstein, co-founder of PostPilot, who talks about how the platform makes direct mail fast and easy for brands to actually use. We discuss why coupon codes and QR scans don’t tell the full story, how holdout testing gives you a real read on incrementality, and what attribution looks like at the household level. Michael also shares how brands are using predictive targeting and peer benchmarking inside the platform, and why premium catalogs can create a brand moment that digital ads just can’t match.If you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00 Introduction06:02 Multi-Channel Retention Strategies17:53 Customer Experience and Retention Management24:00 Direct Mail Campaigns and Effectiveness30:04 Postpilot and Direct Mail Solutions43:39 Revolutionizing Direct Mail Marketing01:03:29 Optimizing Direct Mail Tactics01:19:36 Acquisition Strategies Through Direct MailPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsRivo.https://www.rivo.io/operatorsPostPilot.https://www.postpilot.com/Subscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here:https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here:https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here:https://9operators.com/

In today’s episode, we’re joined by George Davis, CMO at Cozy Earth, to talk about their viral social challenge - the Cozy Earth Bed Rot Challenge.George shares the story behind the challenge and how it started as a little MVP test in season one with five employees and a $1k prize, and how it grew into season two with a 24/7 livestream, 50M+ impressions and 15k emails collected. We dig into what worked, where the limits were, the brand’s goal of building cultural relevance over direct sales, and how marketing plays of this size stack up against running ads. We also get into the importance of taking big swings and risks, and George shares how brand partnerships and a refined strategy are shaping plans for season three.From there, we dive into incrementality — one of the trickiest parts of performance marketing. We talk through channel holdouts, overlapping signals, directional insights, negative incremental ROAS, long-term readouts, and why the numbers don’t always tell the full story.To hear more of our thoughts as the Cozy Earth Bed Rot Challenge played out, listen to: https://open.spotify.com/episode/6z40HWMVQoBFOBY0Xk6S7v?si=1CoayJh-TkaMi2gsylIyZAIf you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00:44 Introduction05:09:17 What is the Bed Rot Challenge?18:28:47 Brand Building vs. Driving Direct Revenue33:24:55 The Risk of Failure44:03:84 Deep Dive on Incrementality54:37:06 The Case for Longer Holdout TestsPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsRivo.https://www.rivo.io/operatorsSubscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here:https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here:https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here:https://9operators.com/

Today we’re exploring how DTC brands can reach new audiences on Meta using partnership ads, and how they can improve performance and strengthen the paid social mix, as well as checking in on how Ridge's sweepstakes are going so far. We talk through how partnership ads compare to whitelisting, our experiences working with creators of all sizes, and what’s actually driving ROI. We also get into the role of gifting, why ads run from a creator’s handle often outperform those from a brand handle, and why single-handle creator ads usually feel the most native. Finally, we cover how partnership ads function as signal engineering, whether they truly deliver incremental reach, and the role of creative in making them work.If you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00 Introduction07:06 Influencer Marketing Strategies18:06 Partnership Ads vs. Traditional Ads27:23 Signal Engineering and Audience Insights35:20 Navigating Meta's Advertising Challenges44:37 Leveraging Influencer Marketing for Targeted Reach01:00:20 Enhancing Customer Experience Through PersonalizationPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsHaus.http://Haus.io/operatorsSubscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here: https://9operators.com/

Today we’re joined by Brett Curry from OMG Commerce, and we’re grilling him on all things YouTube advertising - where to start, strategy, creative, and how to drive results.We discuss where YouTube sits in the channel mix, how it compares to Meta, why it’s still underused by most operators, as well as the challenges of measuring success on YouTube - from attribution challenges to incrementality and brand lift.We also get into creative: what makes a good hook, how to structure a YouTube ad, and the differences between polished content and UGC-style ads. Brett also shares his approach to testing, how many creatives you really need, and the metrics that matter most.Finally, we cover bidding, account structure, and how YouTube can unlock performance across your whole media mix when it’s done right.If you have a question for the MOperators Hotline, click the link to be in with a chance of it being discussed on the show: https://forms.gle/1W7nKoNK5Zakm1Xv6Chapters:00:00 Intro11:42 Understanding YouTube: Consumption Patterns and Measurement22:36 The Lift Trifecta: Measuring Success on YouTube30:07 Navigating Attribution Challenges in YouTube Advertising37:34 Optimizing Conversion Events42:39 Account Structure and Automation45:59 Creative Strategies for YouTube Ads01:01:06 Measuring Success and Iteration in CampaignsThe Black Friday Operators Online EventSign up here: https://www.9operators.com/black-fridayPowered by:Motion.⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/pricing?utm_source=marketing-operators-podcast&utm_medium=paidsponsor&utm_campaign=march-2024-ad-reads⁠⁠⁠https://motionapp.com/creative-trendsPrescient AI.⁠⁠⁠https://www.prescientai.com/operatorsRichpanel.⁠⁠⁠https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=MO&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescAftersell.https://www.aftersell.com/operatorsRivo.https://www.rivo.io/operatorsSubscribe to the 9 Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@Operators9Subscribe to the Finance Operators Podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here: https://9operators.com/