FBF | Vas Narasimhan & Steven Baert: The CEO & The Chief People and Organization Officer Perspective

In this milestone 100th episode of The Curious Advantage Podcast, Paul Ashcroft, Simon Brown and Garrick Jones reflect on six years of conversations exploring curiosity, leadership, learning, AI and the future of work.What began during lockdown has grown into a global platform for ideas spanning neuroscience, psychology, education, business transformation, technology and the arts. In this special episode, the team looks back at the guests, themes and moments that shaped the first 100 episodes and explores why curiosity has moved from being an advantage to becoming an imperative.They discuss standout conversations with guests including Amy Edmondson, Alexia Cambon and Giles Yeo, while also introducing the thinking behind their upcoming book, The Curious Imperative.You’ll hear reflections on how curiosity helps us navigate AI, disruption, uncertainty and change and why asking better questions may be one of the most important human skills for the future.Resources The Curious Advantage Website Learn more about The Curious Imperative Buy The Curious Advantage The Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross and video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

Professor Robert “Bob” Kegan (Harvard Graduate School of Education) joins The Curious Advantage Podcast to explore curiosity, adult development, and why meaningful change is often so difficult.Bob explains curiosity as a “delight in the knowing gap” and shares how adults grow through different stages of psychological development, from the socialised mind to self-authorship and the self-transforming mind. He also introduces the idea of “immunity to change,” revealing how hidden assumptions and internal defences can prevent us from making the changes we genuinely want to make.The episode also looks at AI, digital transformation, leadership, feedback, and how curiosity can help us test our assumptions, build self-authorship, and adapt in a rapidly changing world.Resources mentioned: Immunity to Change by Robert Kegan and Lisa Lahey In Over Our Heads by Robert Kegan The Curious Advantage by Paul Ashcroft, Simon Brown & Garrick Jones Chapters:00:00 Introduction to Bob and Curiosity and Adult Development 01:30 Defining Curiosity as Delight in the Knowing Gap04:50 Curiosity and Psychological Growth08:19 Learning vs. Development: Transcending Frames12:28 Stories of Development: The Olympic Skater and Lincoln17:21 Stages of Adult Development: Socialized to Self-Transforming22:13 The Small Percentage Achieving Self-Transforming Mind39:02 Immunity to Change: Why Change is Difficult56:22 AI and Development: Opportunities and Challenges01:10:00 The Power of Inner Inquiry and Self-Understanding01:14:48 Conclusion and Key TakeawaysThe Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross and video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

Vas Narasimhan, the Novartis CEO and Steven Baert, Novartis’ Ex-Chief People and Organization Officer join the authors of The Curious Advantage Simon Brown, Paul Ashcroft and Garrick Jones, to discuss the importance of Curiosity in Business. They talk about how Novartis has worked to ‘unleash the power of their people’ and change the culture driven by an ‘Inspired’, ‘Curious’ and ‘Unbossed’ people strategy. Why is curiosity becoming more important in the digital age? Why is it important to have curious leaders? What does it mean to have a curious mind and how can curiosity impact individuals and organisations? Subscribe to this exclusive podcast today to listen to this fascinating conversation. 

Join Simon Brown and Paul Ashcroft as they explore Tara May's inspiring journey from journalism to leading Aspirtech, a company championing neurodiversity and harnessing the unique strengths of autistic adults. Discover how curiosity drives innovation, leadership, and social impact in the digital age.Chapters00:00 Introduction to Neurodiversity and Leadership02:59 Tara's Journey: From Journalism to CEO06:06 Understanding Aspirotech's Mission and Model08:48 Defining Autism and Neurodiversity11:51 The Unique Strengths of Neurodivergent Individuals15:13 The Role of Technology and Human Collaboration18:08 Creating a Supportive Workplace Environment20:56 Fostering Neurodiversity in Organizations23:50 The Impact of Creativity and Problem Solving26:56 Global Efforts and Collaborations for Neurodiversity29:59 Leadership Lessons and the Importance of Kindness ResourcesAspirtech NeuroWorks HAPI The Curious Advantage Podcast Simon Brown LinkedIn Paul Ashcroft LinkedInTara May LinkedIn The Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage is available on Amazon and Audiobook Follow us on LinkedIn and InstagramDiscover more about The Curious Advantage hereThe Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross and video editing by Jessica Wickham.

Unlock the secret to building an authentic, high-quality brand in a saturated market.In this episode, we’re joined by Finn Hall, CEO of Headstrong and former Team GB cyclist, who is redefining the functional mushrooms space through an uncompromising focus on quality, design and curiosity.Finn shares his journey from elite sport to young entrepreneurship, revealing how a personal discovery sparked a mission to challenge industry standards and build a brand people can genuinely trust. He opens up about the realities of starting and scaling a premium brand in a saturated market, and what it takes to stay authentic while growing fast.We explore how curiosity fuels innovation, why authenticity is non-negotiable in today’s landscape, and how social media and community have become powerful drivers of modern brand success. From building trust with your audience to creating a loyal following, Finn shares what it really takes to turn a product into a movement.From the science behind functional mushrooms and extraction quality, to the role of design, storytelling and digital presence, this conversation is packed with insight for anyone building a brand today.Show LinksHeadstrong Website Headstrong Instagram Finn Hall LinkedInThe Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage is available on Amazon and Audiobook Follow us on LinkedIn and InstagramDiscover more about The Curious Advantage hereThe Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross and video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

In this episode, Simon Brown and Garrick Jones speak with leadership expert Shawn Vanderhoven about how curiosity, and the often overlooked power of pausing, can transform leadership, decision-making, and team performance.In a world that rewards speed and constant action, Shawn challenges the assumption that great leaders need to move faster. Instead, he explores how creating space, through better questions, clearer priorities, and intentional pauses, can unlock stronger thinking and more meaningful contributions across teams.Drawing on insights from his book Pause: How to Lead Brilliant Work in a Busy World, Shawn shares practical strategies for building an intelligence culture, avoiding common leadership traps, and helping teams focus on what truly matters. The conversation offers a fresh perspective on how leaders can shift from doing more to enabling better work.Show LinksShawn's LinkedInWiseman GroupPause: How to Lead Brilliant Work in a Busy World available on AmazonThe Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage is available on Amazon and Audiobook Follow us on LinkedIn and InstagramDiscover more about The Curious Advantage hereThe Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross and video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

In this episode of The Curious Advantage, former Navy SEAL officer and human performance expert Rich Diviney joins Simon Brown and Garrick Jones to explore what truly drives leadership, performance under pressure, and the neuroscience behind stress and fear. Drawing on two decades in the SEAL Teams, Rich breaks down why attributes and not skills determine success in high-pressure, high-uncertainty environments.Rich explains how elite performers build situational awareness, adaptability, and neural agility, and why concepts like dynamic subordination are essential for modern leadership. He dives into the neuroscience of stress management, the role of curiosity in high-stakes decision-making, and how understanding duration, pathway, and outcome can help the brain stay calm under uncertainty.Whether you’re leading teams, navigating complexity or curious about the psychology behind human performance, this conversation offers powerful insights into attributes, curiosity, and the mindsets required to thrive in chaotic environments.Show Links: Attributes WebsiteAttributes HubRich Diviney LinkedInThe Attributes: 25 Hidden Drivers of Optimal Performance book is available on AmazonThe Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage is available on Amazon and Audiobook Follow us on LinkedIn and InstagramDiscover more about The Curious Advantage hereThe Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross and video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

Today we are joined by Salvatore Manzi, a communication and leadership coach who helps data-driven leaders turn expertise into influence.For over 20 years, Salvatore has guided executives and founders through high-stakes moments, from boardrooms and investor meetings to global stages such as SXSW and the United Nations, and even a U.S. presidential campaign. His work focuses on one critical shift. Moving from information delivery to human connection.In this episode, he explores why empathy is not a soft skill but a leadership advantage, and introduces his powerful You-Then-Me Principle, starting with acknowledgment, validation, and reflection before sharing your own message. The result is collaboration instead of resistance.In his book Clear and Compelling: Communication Strategies for Big Thinkers with Bold Ideas, he distills two decades of experience into practical tools that help leaders transform complex ideas into messages that resonate, inspire, and drive action.Show Links Find out more about Salvatore Manzi and his work here Find Salvatore on LinkedIn here The Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage is available on Amazon and Audible.Follow us on LinkedIn and Instagram, and discover more at curiousadvantage.com.The Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross | Video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

In this episode of The Curious Advantage, Art Kleiner — author of The AI Dilemma — joins Simon Brown & Garrick Jones for a conversation about what it really means to build Responsible AI.Together, they explore the tensions at the heart of today’s AI landscape: rapid innovation vs accountability, efficiency vs empathy, and the risks of bias, misinformation and unintended consequences. Drawing on the “five fundamental principles” from The AI Dilemma, Art explains why responsible technology requires human judgment, transparency, and a deep understanding of our social systems.The discussion dives into: How AI systems amplify human behaviour — good and bad The rising challenge of misinformation and synthetic media Where bias enters the system and how organisations can address it Why empathy, forgiveness and human values are essential to AI governance What leaders must understand as AI becomes embedded in everyday work A thoughtful, human conversation about technology, responsibility and how we navigate the future.Lean More about Art Kleiner and his work hereAbout The Curious AdvantageThe Curious Advantage is available on Amazon and Audible.Follow us on LinkedIn and Instagram, and discover more at curiousadvantage.com.The Curious Advantage explores curiosity and its growing importance in the digital age. From history, neuroscience, and anthropology to business and culture, it takes the widest possible view of curiosity. At its heart is the ‘Sailing the 7C’s of Curiosity’ model, a practical framework to help individuals harness curiosity as a power skill for growth and transformation.The Curious Advantage Podcast is executive produced by Jessica Wickham and Aliki Paolinelis. Audio editing by Danny Cross | Video editing by Jessica Wickham. 

FBF -- Flashback Friday In this throwback episode of The Curious Advantage Podcast, Simon Brown, Paul Ashcroft and Garrick Jones speak with Alexia Cambon, Senior Director of Research at Microsoft, about how AI is transforming work and what sets today’s Frontier Firms apart.They explore insights from Microsoft’s Work Trend Index—including Agent Bosses, digital labour, and Intelligence on Tap—and discuss how curiosity, leadership, and HR are evolving in an AI-powered world.🎧 Listen & explore the 2025 Work Trend Index:https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/worklab/work-trend-index/2025-the-year-the-frontier-firm-is-born