ER Redux? The Anti-SLAPP Motion That Didn’t Stick

The estate of 'ER' creator Michael Crichton is suing Warner Brothers, claiming their new medical drama 'The Pit' is a derivative of 'ER.' IP and Entertainment attorneys Scott Hervey and Jessica Corpuz discuss this case on this episode of The Briefing. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel.   Scott: A legal battle is unfolding over the hit medical drama, ‘The Pit,’ which the estate of Michael Crichton claims is the unauthorized successor to ER. The estate, represented by a roadrunner, JMTC LLC, has sued Warner Brothers television over The Pit, a new medical drama set in Pittsburgh. Warner Brothers attempted to shut down the lawsuit by using California's anti-slap statute, arguing that the case threatened their free speech rights, but the court didn't bite. I'm Scott Hervey, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub Tobin, and I'm joined today by my partner, Jessica Corpuz. We are going to talk about the court's decision to deny Warner Brothers' anti-slap motion and what this means for contract rights in the entertainment industry on today's installment of The Briefing. Jessica, welcome back to The I'm glad we could get my people to call your people and get you booked again. Jessica: Thanks so much for having me, Scott. Scott: Thanks. Well, why don't we jump right into this? Jessica: Thanks, Scott. So today we're unpacking a high-profile case in the entertainment world, Road Runner: JMTC/LLC versus Warner Brothers Television, which involves the estate of legendary author and screenwriter Michael Crichton, the long-running medical drama, ER, and a new TV show called The Pit. Scott: That's right. This case revolves around claims of breach of contract, interference with contractual relations, and whether the pit is a derivative of ER. Warner Brothers attempted to shut down the lawsuit with an anti-slap motion under California law, but the court denied it. So let's break it down, starting with some background on the parties. Jessica: So Michael Crichton, of course, is best known for Jurassic Park, but he also co-created ER, the wildly successful medical drama that ran for 15 seasons. After his passing, Crichton's widow, Sherry Crichton, on behalf of his estate, represented in the dispute that we're talking about today by Roadrunner J. M. T. C. Lllc, has been involved in legal efforts to protect his contractual rights as the creator of ER. Warner Brothers television, on the other hand, is a dominant force in TV production, and they're behind The Pit, a new medical drama set in Pittsburgh. The estate argues that the Pit is a derivative work of ER, and that Warner Brothers breached the 1994 agreement between Crichton Warner Brothers, concerning the ER pilot and the series. Scott: That's right. The 1994 agreement between Crichton and Warner Brothers specifically freezes any subsequent productions. The exact wording used in the 1994 agreement is as follows, Any and all sequels, remakes, spinoffs, and/or other derivative works shall be frozen, with mutual agreement between Crichton, Amblin, and Warner Brothers being necessary in order to move forward in any of these categories. Jessica: Okay, so that's the contract. But let's talk a little bit about the facts surrounding the party's discussions about the pit, since those facts play a really big role in this outcome we're talking about today. Scott: Yeah, you're right. They really do. So the complaint says that around Thanksgiving 2022, Sherry Crichton got a call from John Wells. Wells was one of the producers of ER, who purportedly told Sherry that there was going to be a big press release on deadline within days announcing an ER reboot, starring Noah Wiley, and that Wells would be producing it with Warner Brothers television for the HBO Max streaming service. According to the complaint, Warner Brothers made an offer, Crichton made a counter offer, and that included a guaranteed created by credit for Michael Crichton.

In this installment of The Briefing, Scott Hervey & Jessica Corpuz cover the landmark defamation case Copeland v. Netflix—dissecting the high bar for public figures to prove defamation and the critical concept of "actual malice." From the Surviving R. Kelly documentary to First Amendment protections, they unpack the legal complexities surrounding public figures and media reporting. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel here. Show Notes: Scott: Surviving R. Kelly was a Netflix documentary series that delved into the extensive allegations of sexual abuse, misconduct, and predatory behavior leveled against the R&B singer R. Kelly. Diana Copeland, Kelly's former personal assistant, claims she was falsely portrayed in the documentary as being essentially a co-conspirator in Kelly's alleged sex crimes. Copeland sued Netflix and the producers of the documentary, Lifetime and A&E for defamation. There was a recent decision in Copeland versus Netflix, one that emphasized the stringent First Amendment protections for media when reporting on a public figure. How high is the bar for a public figure to prove defamation against the media outlet? And what does the legal concept of actual malice truly entail in such case? I'm Scott Herbie, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub Tobin, and I'm joined today by my partner, Jessica Corpus. Stay tuned as we dissect this significant decision and its implications for producers of programming of this type on this installment of the briefing. Jessica, welcome back. It's good to have you. Jessica: Thanks so much for having me, Scott. Scott: This one, I think, is going to be quite interesting. I always like defamation cases because there's always a lot to unpack. Jessica: Oh, they're very exciting cases. We get this question a lot, and having to educate people about the standard of defamation happens all the time in our world, so it's good to talk about it. Scott: Yeah, and more and more, you're seeing defamation claims come out of not just documentaries, but scripted, essentially, fictional docudramas. But today, we're looking at the R. Kelly documentary. And this is the recent decision in Diana Copeland versus Netflix. And it comes out of the United States district Court for the district of Delaware. That's a district we don't hear from very often, but we're hearing from them today. Jessica: So this decision comes as a result of Netflix's motion to dismiss. A motion to dismiss in federal court is called a Rule 12(b)(6) motion, and it's where a defendant moves to dismiss the complaint because the plaintiff has failed to state a claim upon which relief can be granted. In other words, the defendant is arguing that even if everything that the plaintiff claims is true, those claims still don't provide a legal basis for the court to grant them any relief. Scott: Well said. So this case centers on a lawsuit brought by Diana Copeland, who was the personal assistant for the singer R. Kelly. Following R. Kelly's arrest and charges relating to sexual abuse, Lifetime Entertainment produced a documentary series called Surviving R. Kelly. Copeland did not participate in the documentary. However, she alleges that an episode contained several false and defamatory statements about her, portraying her as a co-conspirator in Kelly's crimes. She subsequently sued Netflix, which distributed the series, along with its producers Lifetime and A&E, for defamation. Jessica: Those defendants moved to dismiss Copeland's claims. Netflix based its motion on the following arguments. First, that the fair report privilege protects the statements. Second, that the statements are non-actionable opinions based on disclosed facts. And three, that Copeland is a public figure and that she failed to plea that defendants published the statements with actual malice. Scott: That's right. Now, the court said it didn't need to address the first two arguments advanced by Netflix because Copeland...

A petition is calling for the Supreme Court to decide on the validity of the "discovery rule," which allows copyright claims long after the alleged infringement. NBA teams like the Indiana Pacers and Denver Nuggets are even weighing in, worried that social media posts from years ago could be used as grounds for lawsuits. Scott Hervey and Tara Sattler dive into this game-changing copyright case in this installment of The Briefing. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel.

On the latest episode of The Briefing, Weintraub attorneys Scott Hervey and Jessica Corpuz break down the court’s decision in Pepperdine’s trademark fight with Netflix over the name "Waves" in the new series Running Point. Tune in for insights on this case and how the Jack Daniel's ruling is reshaping trademark law in entertainment. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel. For more content like this, subscribe here.

Did you know the popular Stanley Travel Cup is tied to Stanley Black & Decker? A lawsuit is brewing over trademark rights and branding disputes. Is PMI overstepping, or is Stanley Black & Decker overreaching?  Weintraub Tobin attorneys Scott Hervey and Tara Sattler discuss the legal battle over the iconic cup on this episode of The Briefing. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel here. Show Notes: Scott Most people who have spent any time in a Home Depot, a Lowe's, or an Ace Hardware are well aware of Stanley Black & Decker Company. They're a manufacturer of a wide variety of tools and equipment. Well, did you know that the very popular Stanley Travel Cup is manufactured in connection with an agreement with Stanley Black & Decker? Well, I didn't know of this relationship. Well, it seems that that relationship is soured, and there's some trouble brewing in that Stanley insulated Stanley Black & Decker, which has filed a lawsuit against the Cupmaker Pacific Market International for trademark infringement and breach of contract. I'm Scott Herbie, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub Tobin, and I'm joined today by my partner, Tara Sattler. We're going to talk about this case and some issues related to Stanley Black & Decker's claims on this installment of the briefing. Tara, welcome back to the briefing. Tara Hi, Scott. Always great to be here. Scott Do you own a Stanley Cup? Tara I do. I have one sitting right here on my desk out of the screen. Scott I have one as well. Okay, so that's why I picked this case for us to talk about because I think everybody has a Stanley Cup. Let's set the stage here. Stanley, Black & Decker, let's just refer to them as Stanley. They were founded way back in 1843 and built a solid reputation over nearly two centuries. They have a family of trademarks associated with Stanley, many of which have become incontestable. Tara Now, Pacific Market International's predecessor, Aladdin Industries, started selling Stanley-branded insulated containers in 1913 when William Stanley Jr. Developed the revolutionary vacuum flask. The complaint alleges that beginning in 1966, Stanley and Aladdin entered into a series of agreements which sought to limit Aladdin's use of the Stanley trademark. Scott These agreements, at least as it's alleged in the complaint, restricted Aladdin and the company that bought Aladdin, Pacific Market International, we'll just call them PMI, their use of Stanley to specific goods. Fast forward to 2012, the parties entered into another agreement to address PMIs, then allegedly non-use of Stanley, which exceeded the scope of the previous agreement. This new agreement, according to the complaint, again further limited PMI's use of the mark to insulate food and beverage containers and placed requirements on how Aladdin and PMI could use the Stanley name in advertising and online. Tara Okay, so then what triggered Stanley to file a complaint? Scott Well, according to the complaint, PMI has been willfully and intentionally disregarding the 2012 agreement. Specifically, Stanley accused PMI of dropping PMI in its company name, that it changed its company name to just Stanley. Stanley also says PMI expanded its product offerings beyond food and beverage containers to include items such as apparel. Tara The 2012 Agreement expressly limits PMI's use of Stanley solely to use as a trademark to promote and sell insulated and non-insulated containers for food or beverages and carrying cases for transporting the same. Scott Right, that's what the complaint says. The complaint also accuses PMI of using the domain name www.stanley1913.com without prominently displaying PMI, and also failing to include PMI prominently in advertising materials and on products, including point-of-sale displays. Tara It sounds like Stanley Black & Decker is claiming PMI essentially tried to rebrand themselves as just Stanley in order to capitalize on the br...

Major AI copyright ruling - The Delaware District Court’s decision in Thomson Reuters v. Ross AI could have huge implications for AI training and copyright law. On this episode of The Briefing, Weintraub attorneys Scott Hervey and Andy Tan break down the case, its impact on the AI industry, and what it means for content creators. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel here. Show Notes: Scott: This February, the Delaware District Court, in the case of Thompson Reuters versus Ross AI, issued a decision that will have, in all likelihood, profound ramifications on all pending AI copyright infringement cases. I'm Scott Herbie, a partner at the law firm of Weintraub Tobin, and I'm joined today by my colleague, Andy Tan. We're going to walk through the court's decision in Thompson Reuters versus Ross AI and discuss how this case will impact the other AI training, copyright infringement cases currently pending. We'll also talk about what this case could mean, both for the AI industry and the creators of content on this installment of “The Briefing.” Andy, welcome to “The Briefing.” This is your first time on “The Briefing”, so thanks for doing this. Andy: Thanks, Scott. It's an honor to be part of it. I've been a long-time fan and watcher, so it's great to be on now. Scott Well, we're glad to have you. This case is right up your alley. You do a lot of deals in the AI space, so I thought this one would be appropriate for you to do with me. Andy Yeah, it's definitely coming up, and AI is the hot topic in the legal world for the foreseeable future, I think. Scott Yeah, that's for sure. Well, let's start. Why don't we start with the facts of the case because this case, it's got some interesting twist and turns. Andy, can you take us through the basic facts of the case? Andy Yeah, I would be happy to. I'll run through the basic facts of the case. If you want a more in-depth discussion, you should check out the November 9, 2023, episode of The Briefing, where Scott and our colleague Tara go over it in detail. I'll just go over the facts Again. But so, who are the players? Reuters owns West Law. It's one of the primary legal research tools. Ross was a legal research AI startup. I say was because Ross AI closed down as an operating company in 2020. They said it was due to the Thompson Reuters lawsuit, but its insurance coverage probably allowed it to continue to defend the Thompson Reuters lawsuit, so we're not sure that's the reason. Ross hired a subcontractor to create memos memos with legal questions and answers. Now, these questions were meant to be those that a lawyer would ask, and the answers were direct quotations from legal opinions. They used these memos to train Ross's AI legal research tool so that when a user asks a legal question, Ross's tool responds with relevant judicial opinions, which Reuters is saying is similar to Westlaw's headnotes. Reuters, the provider of the Westlaw Service, contended that these questions were essentially Westlaw case notes, and the court found, as a matter of law, that Ross copied portions of the Westlaw headnotes. Andy Ross challenged Reuters' copyright in the headnotes and raised a fair use defense. Scott That's right. This case is particularly interesting because it features something rare in federal courts: a judge reversing his own prior summary judgment ruling. Let's start with the procedural history because that It's unique. This case, as you said, began in 2020 when Thompson Reuters sued Ross in Delaware district Court. In 2023, Judge Bibas issued a summary judgment opinion that largely denied Thompson Reuters' motions on copyright infringement and fair use. But then something unusual happened. As the case was heading towards trial that was scheduled for August 2024, Judge Bibas took a closer look at the materials and had what you might say is a judicial epiphany. The judge continued the trial date and invited the parties to renew their summary jud...

In the case of Sydney Nicole vs. Alyssa Sheil, a federal district judge ruled that certain vibes and aesthetics can be protected under copyright law. Weintraub attorneys Scott Hervey and Tara Sattler break down this decision and what it means for content creators and brands in the digital age on this episode of The Briefing. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel here. Show Notes: Scott: In December of last year, we talked about the report and recommendation of a magistrate judge that would hold that a vibe or a look could be protected under copyright law. That report was adopted by the district Court for the Western district of Texas. So, it seems, at least in the Western district of Texas, that copyright law extends to protection of ideas, concepts, or general styles. I'm Scott Hervey, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub Tobin, I'm joined today by my partner, Tara Sattler. Given the adoption of the Magistrate Judges recommendations, we are going to discuss the potential implications of this case, Sydney Nicole versus Alyssa Sheil, on the creator marketing industry on this installment of the briefing. Tara, welcome back to the briefing. Tara: Hi there, Scott. Always great to be here. Scott: Good to have you again, Tara. I think this is going to be a real interesting discussion here. As a quick recap, this case involved a dispute between Sydney Nicole, a content creator, and Alyssa Sheil, another creator, accused of copying Nicole's online content. Sydney Nicole alleged that Sheil's work closely mimicked her original content, including the themes, style, and presentation of her videos. However, she'll argue that she was merely drawing on a general model and idea and concept that copyright law has traditionally deemed unprotectible. Namely, this Clean Girl look, a very popular look among content creators and the creator marketing community. Adopters of this look include the likes of Hailey Bieber, Bella Hadid, Selena Gomez and Kim Kardashian, to name just a few. Tara: The federal magistrate judge issued a report and recommendation, which was later adopted by the district court, siding with Nicole. The ruling found that Sheil's content bore sufficient similarity to Nicole's protected expression rather than just her general ideas, effectively expanding the scope of what might be considered copyright infringement in the digital content space. Scott: So we're not going to analyze the decision itself. For that, I recommend our listeners check out our previous episode on this case back in December. We're going to put a link in the episode description to make it easy for you to find. What I want to talk about today are the critical issues for content creators and brands and the broader creator economy because of this case. So The first thing I want to talk about is that the finding of this case potentially blurs the line between protecting expression and protecting ideas. Tara: I definitely think you're right, Scott. One of the foundational principles of copyright law is that it protects the specific expression of an idea, but not the idea itself. However, this ruling raises concerns that court may be moving towards an approach that grants de facto protection to certain creative concepts, especially within digital content creation. Scott: That's right. The similarities in this case were largely thematic or conceptual. I think there's a chance that this decision risks chilling the very creative development that copyright law has meant to foster. Creators often build upon common trends and esthetics and industry norms, and if those elements can be locked down as protected expression, it could deter new entrance and limit creative evolution. Tara: That's right. This case could also open the door to secondary liability for brands that work with influencers. If an influencer unknow post content that closely resembles another creator's work,

On this episode of The Briefing, Scott Hervey and Tara Sattler dive into the landmark Jack Daniels v. VIP Products case that changed trademark law. They break down the Supreme Court's ruling on trademark infringement vs. dilution and explore how a dog toy parody nearly tarnished Jack Daniels' brand. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel.   Show Notes: Scott: VIP products versus Jack Daniels' properties brought a landmark Supreme Court case that forever changed the application of the Rogers Test. However, cross-motions for summary judgment at the District Court following the Supreme Court have provided some degree of closure and finality on the trademark and dilution claims raised by Jack Daniels. I'm Scott Hervey, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub Tobin, and today I'm joined by my partner, Tara Sattler. We're going to talk about a dog toy, a bottle of whiskey, and the Sometimes-murky waters of Trademark Law on this installment of The Briefing. Tara, welcome back to the briefing. It's good to have you back. Tara: Thanks, as always, Scott. Scott: We've talked about this Jack Daniels case as it has affected other cases I think, boy, almost ad nauseam. But there has finally been a resolution itself of the Jack Daniels case. Let me just give a little brief history of the background, and then you can recap the Supreme Court's decision. This legal battle began all the way back in 2014, so over 10 years ago, when VIP Products, a company that makes dog toys, filed a declaratory relief lawsuit against Jack Daniels, seeking a declaration that their Bad Spaniels dog toy did not infringe on Jack Daniels' trademarks. The Bad Spaniels toy was designed to mimic a bottle of Jack Daniels' Black Label Whisky. Jack Daniels counterclaimed, alleging both trademark infringement and trademark dilution. The case has gone through multiple appeals, including a trip to the Supreme Court. Court. The Supreme Court ultimately vacated the Ninth Circuit's decision and remanded that case back to the District Court. From there, let's quickly recap the Supreme Court decision. On June 8, 2023, the Supreme Court decided this case. At the district Court and on appeal to the Ninth Circuit, the issue was framed as whether the dog toy was an expressive work since trademark claims involving expressive works were analyzed under the Rogers test. Tara: Right. But on appeal, the Supreme Court said that the issue was not whether the dog toy was an expressive work, but rather the nature of the use of the Jack Daniels mark. Scott: Right. The Supreme Court found that the IP's use of the marks, while humorous, was for the purpose of serving as a source identifier, a trademark use, in other words. The Supreme Court held that the Rogers test does not apply to instances where the mark is used as a source identifier, regardless of whether it's also used to perform some expressive function. Tara: And then from there, the case was eventually remanded to the district Court to determine Jack Daniels' Lanham Act claims for dilution and infringement. Scott: Before we get into the dilution part, let's briefly touch on trademark infringement. To win on this claim, Jack Daniels needed to show that its trademarks were distinctive and nonfunctional and that there was a likelihood of consumer confusion. The court had previously ruled that Jack Daniels' trademarks were distinctive and nonfunctional. The key issue was whether VIP's Bad Spaniels toy would cause a likelihood of confusion about the source of the product. The Or ultimately found that while Bad Spaniels as a toy did evoke the Jack Daniels brand, it was a successful parody. Tara: That's right. A successful parody of a famous mark, one that conjures up the original yet creates contrasts from the original so that the message of ridicule or pointed humor becomes clear, is not often likely to create confusion. Scott: All right.

A motivational passage from Keith Bell’s book Winning Isn’t Normal sparks a legal battle after Ole Miss coach Lane Kiffin shares it on Twitter. Scott Hervey and Tara Sattler dive into the lawsuit, exploring how the Fifth Circuit’s ruling raises important questions about fair use, copyright enforcement, and Bell’s “serial litigant” status. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel. Show Notes: Scott: In 2021, we reported on the copyright lawsuit filed by inspirational book author, Keith Bell, against the defensive back coach for the Miami Dolphins, Jerold Alexander. This was based on the coach's inclusion of a passage from Bell's 1982 book, Winning Isn't Normal, in a social media post, and a federal court's refusal to dismiss Bell's lawsuit based on Alexander's arguments, including fair use. In that case, the Florida federal court judge said that consideration of the fair use defense on a motion to dismiss was not appropriate unless it's clear, based on the complaint itself, that fair use is applicable. The party The purpose of that case later settled. However, Bell had a much different result in a lawsuit brought against the University of Mississippi football coach, Lane Kiffin. I'm Scott Hervey, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub Tobin and I'm joined today by my partner, Tara Sattler. We are going to take a look at this particular case and a related case in the Fifth Circuit to try to understand why this federal judge and the Fifth Circuit came to such a different conclusion than the judge in Florida based on essentially similar facts on this installment of the briefing. Tara, welcome back to the briefing. I think this is going to be a real interesting discussion. Tara: It definitely is, and it's really timely with the Super Bowl coming up here. Scott: It is timely with Super Bowl coming up, but it's really appropriate that you and I are talking about that Giving all the coverage you and I have done on the Warhol case and the new analysis of fair use. Absolutely. Yeah. So let's get into this case. Like Bell's case against Alexander, Bell's lawsuit against Lane Kiffin, the head football coach at the University of Mississippi, revolves around a passage from Bell's book, Winning Isn't Normal. And that passage is known as the win passage. This passage provides motivational advice, and Bell has separately copyrighted that passage. So Kiffin tweeted the passage, the same passage that Alexander had tweeted. However, here, Kiffin included no other commentary or elaborate on the passage while Alexander had. Tara: As we know from our previous coverage, this isn't Bell's first lawsuit over this passage. Bell has filed dozens of copyright lawsuits over similar social media uses of the wind passage. This became an issue in Bell's lawsuit against the Eagle Mountain Saginaw Independent School district for a similar use. In that case, the Fifth Circuit declared Bell a serial litigant who makes exorbitant demands for damages in hopes of extracting disproportionate settlement. Scott: I want to talk about the Court's criticism of Bell's litigation strategies. But before we have that discussion, let's talk about the Court's treatment of Kiffin's fair use argument. The Kiffin Court cited the Fifth Circuit's decision in Bell versus Eagle Mountain, Saginaw, Independent School district, which dismissed a nearly, on a motion to dismiss, a 12: 06 So not a summary judgment motion, but a motion to dismiss just based on a complaint itself and the defense is advanced by the defendant. They dismissed a nearly identical claim on fair use grounds. So Let's remember that this case is a post-Warhol Fair use case. Tara: Right. The Court's analysis closely followed the framework established in Eagle Mountain. It applied the four statutory fair use factors codified in the Copyright Act. One, the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educa...

As TikTok’s future in the US hangs in the balance, influencers and brands are left wondering how a potential ban could impact their posting contracts. In this episode of The Briefing, Scott Hervey and Jamie Lincenberg dive into the potential legal challenges and share insights on how brands can stay ahead of the curve in this ever-changing landscape. Watch this episode on the Weintraub YouTube channel. Show Notes: Scott: On January 19, 2025, TikTok went dark, forced to cease operations in the US as a result of a federal law that bans the app in the US unless TikTok divest itself from its Chinese parent company. Now, as we record this podcast today on the 21st, TikTok is back up. It has a 75-day stay granted by current President Trump. While TikTok sorts out whether it's going to sell itself or some other deal structure that will allow it to continue to operate in the US. For influencers that use TikTok as a content platform, many are concerned, very concerned that this federal law ban will have a serious impact on their livelihood. But here's something that I haven't heard much chatter about. What happens to those brand integration contracts where an influencer is required to post content to TikTok after the ban date? Does this Does this mean that an influencer is in breach? Can the influencer be liable to a brand for failure to perform, even though it's really out of the control of the influencer? I'm Scott Hervia, a partner with the law firm of Weintraub, Tobin, and I'm joined today by my colleague, Jamie Lindsberg, to talk about whether influencers face potential liability due to the TikTok ban on this installment of the briefing. Jamie, welcome back to The Briefing. Jamie: Thanks for having me again, Scott. Scott: This is an interesting topic, and I got to say, from the time that I put our outline together till today when we're recording this podcast, it really has been about three days, and so much has changed in those three days. But as we're recording this, we're recording this on the 21st, yesterday, the 20th, President Trump granted TikTok a 75-day stay for the band to take effect, pending some deal to work out the issues related to this federal law that would ban TikTok's operations and also would ban any company from hosting or allowing TikTok app to be made available to users in the United States. Let's first talk about the TikTok ban or sale law. This law was passed in April 2024 as part of a broader For an aid package. It gives ByteDance, TikTok's Chinese parent company, approximately 9 to 12 months to sell TikTok's US operations to an American buyer. If ByteDance fails to divest TikTok within the time frame, which we know happened, the app would be banned from US app stores and web hosting services. In between April 2024 and January 19, 2025, which is the band date, there were lawsuits filed by TikTok, lawsuits filed by the FTC and the DOJ, appeals to federal courts, including the Supreme Court, which upheld the ban. As I said, while I was working on our outline for the episode, the Wall Street Journal reported that President-elect Trump said that he would issue in order to reopen TikTok on Monday, January 20th, 2025. As we know, on Monday, President Trump gave TikTok a 75-day stay of the ban. Jamie: Yeah, that's right, Scott. A lot's happened in the last couple of days around this, but we have been anticipating the effects of this for quite some time now. The history of TikTok's bumpy relationship with the US prior to April of 2024 is important to understand. In 2020, the Trump administration had expressed some concerns about TikTok's Chinese ownership and privacy and security issues, and the administration had threatened to force a sale or a ban through executive orders. You may recall that Trump had even pushed for an acquisition Microsoft. But after that fell through, Oracle entered into a commercial agreement with TikTok for the purpose of protecting US data. Scott: