Summer Essentials: Mastering Parallel Parenting: Surviving High-Conflict Divorce with Dr. Courtney Evans #430

Not every co-parenting relationship can be fixed through better communication. What do you do when the other parent refuses to cooperate, no matter what you try? There's a name for the path forward: parallel parenting. Susan Guthrie welcomes divorce and recovery coach Dr. Courtney Evans, who has lived through high-conflict co-parenting herself and now helps others build the boundaries that get them out of it. This episode continues Divorce & Beyond's summer series, picking up where last week's conversation on uncooperative co-parents left off. Dr. Evans explains what parallel parenting is, when to use it, and how to create real peace for you and your children even when the conflict doesn't stop.  Episode 6 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series. This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one.   What You'll Learn  Parallel Parenting: a transformative approach that can help you manage high-conflict situations with greater ease and clarity “There is no one solution for how to divorce, co-parent or parallel parent or how to recover after. Every situation is unique.” The difference between counter-parent, co-parent, and parallel parent Why Courtney likes to refer to parallel parenting as peaceful parenting How and when to get started with parallel parenting or make the transition Episode 6 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series. This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one.  About this week's special guest: Dr. Courtney Evans Dr. Courtney is an experienced divorce and co-parenting coach who also holds a DNP. Her two-decade career in the healthcare field has lent to her deep understanding of mental health and the importance of self-care during challenging life transitions. In 2021, after a traumatic family court journey, she switched gears in her career, determined to turn her experience into a source of healing. She began coursework in Alternate Dispute Resolution strategies. In 2022, Courtney received her Divorce Coach and Recovery Coach certifications from the CDC® International Divorce Coach Certification Program and a specialization in Divorce Conflict from the Divorce Coach Academy®. Courtney is currently in school working on her MBA as well as continued work in co-parenting and high conflict dispute resolution specializations. She is also currently writing her first book, Uncaged: Redefining Forgiveness out January 13, 2025. Find More Information on Dr. Evans: Dr. Courtney’s website: https://drcourtney.me Dr. Courtney on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drcourt_everafterco Dr. Courtney on Facebook: http://facebook.com/drcourt_everafterco Resources mentioned in this episode: The Parallel Parenting Solution (book)  Get Uncaged: The Key to Happily Ever After by Dr. Courtney Evans with a Forward by Susan E. Guthrie   If This Episode Helped You Follow Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, a five-star review makes a real difference in helping the show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod About the Host: Susan Guthrie, Esq. Susan Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping people navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is a Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Town & Country, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with more than 1.3 million downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together leading legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at divorceandbeyondpod.com/about.   Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.  

Co-parenting takes two people willing to show up. Susan Guthrie says that when only one parent is willing, it is one of the most common and most exhausting struggles she sees, and it is exactly the situation divorce parenting expert Christina McGhee helps families navigate.  Parenting even under the best of circumstances is challenging. Add in a co-parent who is uncooperative or high-conflict, and it becomes downright exhausting, leaving you feeling like you are constantly trying to protect your kids while managing someone who is not making it easy.  Christina tackles one of the toughest situations of all, co-parenting when there is no real co-parent on the other side, and shares her top tips for working through the feelings of hopelessness and exhaustion that come with it. Together, she and Susan talk through how to get to a place of being in control of yourself and your emotions, so you can stay grounded, set boundaries, keep your children out of the middle, and show up as an empowered, consistent, engaging, and confident parent no matter what your co-parent is doing. What You'll Learn  What Christina means when she says “When there’s no “Co” in Co-parenting…” Instead of staying focused on fixing the co-parent, lean into your co-parenting values and work on yourself Radical acceptance: Adjust your expectations and accept things the way they are…for now. “It may not get easier, but how you manage it makes a difference.”  Ask yourself: How is your response going to impact your children? Talk about the problem, not the person. “Making the other parent look small will never make you look big.” Don’t forget about the power of one!  Episode 5 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series. This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one.  About this week's special guest: Christina McGhee Christina McGhee is a speaker and divorce parenting expert who believes divorce doesn't have to equal devastation for families.   While splitting up is undeniably hard, with the right kind of information and support, she thinks parents can be children's absolute best resource as life changes.   As a coach with 20+ years of experience, Christina is dedicated to providing parents with the tools and practical support they need to get it right for their kids.  She is also the author of the highly acclaimed book, Parenting Apart: How separated and divorced parents can raise happy and secure kids.   As a child of divorce and as a bonus mom (aka step-mom), Christina gets plenty of opportunities to practice what she preaches.  Together she and her husband have four “adultish” children (2 bonus, 2 bio), an ever-growing community of rescue dogs/cats, and an obscene number of chickens. You can nd out more about her at divorceandchildren.com Find More Information on Christina: Website: www.divorceandchildren.com  Co-Parenting Specialist (CoPS) Certification Training with Mosten Guthrie Academy:  https://mostenguthrie.com/co-parenting-specialist Parenting Apart: How Separated and Divorced Parents Can Raise Happy and Secure Kids: https://amzn.to/3PpdW3m Instagram: http://instagram.com/divorceandchildren Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/divorceandchildren   If This Episode Helped You Follow Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, a five-star review makes a real difference in helping the show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod About the Host: Susan Guthrie, Esq. Susan Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping people navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Town & Country, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with more than 1.3 million downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together leading legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at divorceandbeyondpod.com/about.   Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.  

What happens when you suspect your spouse isn't telling the truth about the finances? Susan Guthrie says it's more common than you think, and it's exactly what forensic accountant Tracy Coenen does for a living. Tracy Coenen has spent more than 25 years uncovering hidden money in corporate fraud cases and in divorces too. She calls it "divorce financial planning," when someone sees a split coming and starts thinking about what they can do with the money so they don't have to divide it or pay support on it. She also calls out "divorce amnesia," the sudden inability to remember an inheritance or a bank account on a financial disclosure form. Tracy returns to Divorce and Beyond to walk through the five most common ways people hide money when a marriage ends. As a divorce attorney for more than three decades, Susan has seen plenty of these sneaky moves herself, and she knows a forensic accountant can almost always find them. Together, she and Tracy go through the practical, do it yourself steps to spot the signs using bank statements, tax documents, and a little pattern recognition, without hiring a small army of experts. If the numbers in your divorce have ever felt off, this one is for you. What You'll Learn What to look for when a spouse is only depositing part of their paycheck into the joint account Why a sudden increase in cash withdrawals, or a spouse suddenly hitting the ATM, is worth a closer look How gift cards and cash back at checkout can become a quiet way to siphon money out of the marital estate How to spot a secret credit card, especially when it's hiding at the very same bank as your main account Why a paycheck, bonus, or commission that vanishes right as a divorce begins may not be a coincidence How pulling together the right bank statements and tax documents lets you spot these patterns yourself, without paying a forensic accountant Episode 4 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series. This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one.  About this week's special guest: Tracy Coenen Tracy has been investigating fraud for more than 25 years, but she didn’t always want to be a forensic accountant. With a dream of one day being a prison warden, Tracy went to Marquette University in Milwaukee, WI to get a criminology degree. A class on financial crime investigations reminded her how much she loved Encyclopedia Brown books as a kid. She continued her criminology degree, but added accounting and economics courses so she could sit for the CPA exam… and here Tracy is, finding money in cases of corporate fraud, high net worth divorce, and other financial shenanigans. Find More Information on Tracy: Fraud Coach: http://fraudcoach.com/beyond Find Me The Money: Take Control, Uncover the Truth, and Win the Money You Deserve In Your Divorce https://amzn.to/3A105ep Take the assessment: Is there financial fraud in your marriage? https://www.fraudcoach.com/a/2147522699/Epr7xfEb  The Divorce Money Guide: https://www.fraudcoach.com/a/2147518094/Epr7xfEb  Win Your Divorce:  https://www.fraudcoach.com/a/2147528573/Epr7xfEb  Win Your Divorce All Access Pass: https://www.fraudcoach.com/a/2147528572/Epr7xfEb Check out Tracy's previous episode: How to Spot the Red Flags of Financial Abuse in Divorce with Top Forensic Accountant, Tracy Coenen If This Episode Helped You Follow Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, a five-star review makes a real difference in helping the show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod About the Host: Susan Guthrie, Esq. Susan Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping people navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Town & Country, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with more than 1.3 million downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together leading legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at divorceandbeyondpod.com/about.   Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.  

Susan Guthrie turns to a subject that keeps more people up at night than almost any other one in divorce: money. Specifically, how to protect it, and how to stop spending it in the wrong places. Heather Locus is a CPA, certified financial planner, and certified divorce financial analyst with a rare gift for taking the most complicated financial pieces of divorce and making them feel manageable. In this episode, Heather shares her top strategies for saving money in your divorce, from the common mistakes that quietly drain your settlement to the smart moves that keep more of your hard-earned dollars where they belong, with you. Together, Susan and Heather walk through her five ways to save money in a divorce, from getting organized early and assembling the right support team, to keeping business and emotion separate, to using her Settle Smart projections to see the road ahead. As Heather points out, these are critical points whether you have millions in the bank or are living paycheck to paycheck. What You'll Learn Why something as simple as setting up a separate email for divorce communications can save real time, money, and stress What discernment counseling is, and how pausing to consider it can save money in your divorce negotiations, even if you still end up divorcing Why having laser focused priorities, for yourself and for your spouse, is the key to smart negotiating How to assemble the right support team, and when mediation, collaborative divorce, or traditional litigation is the better fit Why remembering "it's business" helps you make financial decisions instead of emotional ones What Settle Smart is, and how modeling your financial future helps you know what to accept, and what's worth continuing to negotiate for Episode 3 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series. This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one.  About this week's special guest: Heather Locus Heather founded the National Divorce Practice Group at BDF Private Wealth to help divorcing individuals consciously navigate their divorce’s emotional and business aspects. From hiring the right fit attorney through their SettleSmart™ analysis, then implementing the divorce decree and auditing it annually, Heather ensures you have the resources you need to start your next chapter on a firm footing. Heather founded our Women’s Service Team in 2006 to help female executives and business owners, widows, and women transitioning through divorce. After going through her own divorce in 2011, she realized how much more we could do to support divorcing women and men with a practice dedicated to serving their unique needs. Heather is driven by deep empathy to help divorcing individuals have clarity and confidence in finalizing their divorce. A Forbes “America’s Top Women Advisor,” Heather is a nine-time “Five Star Wealth Manager” according to Chicago magazine, was named an “Influential Women in Business” by The Business Ledger, a “Top 200 Wealth Advisor Mom” by Working Mother, and an InvestmentNews “Woman to Watch.” Heather is an author of two books on divorce and has contributed to leading publications, including The Wall Street Journal, Crain’s Chicago Business, Family Lawyer Magazine, and Divorce Magazine on multiple topics. She is a CPA, CFP® practitioner, and a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst (CDFA®) professional and has completed intensive executive coaching and divorce mediation training. Heather loves learning from her teenage son and daughter and working with organizations she is passionate about, including After School Matters, The Lilac Tree, Between Friends, and Make-A-Wish Foundation. For more information on Heather: Call/Text Heather at 312-312-2144 or email [email protected] if you or a friend are contemplating or in the middle of a divorce. Financial Issues in Divorce: A Client Handbook: Heather's latest book written for the American Academy of Matrimonial Attorneys. Listen to Heather's prior episode of Divorce & Beyond:   Negotiating Your Financial Future: Key Factors to Consider with Leading Divorce Financial Professional, Heather Locus" on The Divorce & Beyond Podcast with Susan Guthrie, Esq. #114 If This Episode Helped You Follow Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, a five-star review makes a real difference in helping the show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod About the Host: Susan Guthrie, Esq. Susan Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping people navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Town & Country, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with more than 1.3 million downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together leading legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at divorceandbeyondpod.com/about.   Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.  

Susan Guthrie has been a divorce attorney and mediator for 35 years and she thinks that in almost all cases, your first hire in divorce should be a coach. This episode explains why. How do you find the right divorce coach for you? The popularity of divorce coaching has grown enormously, and with so many kinds of coaches out there, it can be hard to know what a divorce coach actually does or how to find the right one. People hear the word coach and think of life coaches, athletic coaches, business coaches, and divorce coaching gets lumped in with all of them. This episode clears that up and answers the questions many people need early in the divorce process. Susan is joined by Tracy Callahan and Debra Doak, the founders of The Divorce Coaches Academy, who train and support divorce coaches and are themselves practicing coaches, mediators, and Susan's colleagues in the dispute resolution field. They explain what a divorce coach really is, a flexible, goal-oriented process recognized by the American Bar Association as a form of alternative dispute resolution, designed to support and guide people through both the business side and the emotional management of divorce. Together they walk through how to find a coach who fits, what questions to ask on a complimentary discovery call, why training and certification matter in a field with no national standards, and how the right coach can save a client both time and money. Susan makes the case she has made before, that a divorce coach is an essential member of your team and often the best place to start, because the choice can shape who you hire next. Episode 2 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one. The series starts here. What You'll Learn What a divorce coach actually is, and why the American Bar Association recognizes divorce coaching as a form of alternative dispute resolution Why finding a coach before an attorney can change who you hire and how your whole divorce unfolds How to tell if a coach is the right fit, from credentials and training to the complimentary discovery call What to ask about a coach's process, programs, pricing, and how they work before you commit Why training and certification matter in a field with no national standards, and what it means to coach from your scar and not from your wound About Our Guests: Tracy Callahan and Debra Doak Debra and Tracy are both committed to the profession of divorce coaching and the process of alternative dispute resolution. They are both CDC Certified Divorce Coaches®, authors, educators, and founding members of Divorce Coaches Academy, an online education platform that provides continuing education for practicing, professional divorce coaches. Tracy is a Florida Supreme Court Certified Mediator, serves as the Manager of the Mentor and Peer Coaching Programs for the CDC Certified Divorce Coach® certifying body, and has built her practice and reputation as an alternative dispute resolution specialist and conflict expert over the past 13 years.  Get Tracy's book: Divorce: Taking the High Road: Simple Strategies for Creating a Healthy Divorce, Tracy Callahan contributor and reach out to her at www.mediatingmatters.com Debra is also a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst®, Ohio Supreme Court trained Family Court Mediator, and Betrayal Trauma Specialist.  Get Debra's book: High Conflict Divorce for Women and reach out to her at www.debradoak.com For More Information on Tracy, Debra and The Divorce Coaches Academy: Website:  https://www.divorcecoachesacademy.com/ Email: dca@divorcecoachesacademy Social Media Handles  IG: @divorcecoachesacademy FB: @divorcecoachesacademy LI: divorce-coaches-academy Twitter: @AcademyDivorce If This Episode Helped You Follow Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, a five-star review makes a real difference in helping the show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod About the Host: Susan Guthrie, Esq. Susan Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping people navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Town & Country, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with more than 1.3 million downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together leading legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at divorceandbeyondpod.com/about.   Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.  

What do I do first when I find out I'm getting divorced? It is the number one question people ask the moment divorce becomes real, whether they reached the decision themselves or were just told it is coming. In one of her most-requested solo episodes, Susan Guthrie introduces the concept of Divorce Triage, a clear-headed way to assess your situation and decide who to reach out to first based on the urgency and the needs of your specific case. Borrowing from the emergency room, Susan explains that when a crisis hits, whether emotional, legal, or financial, you do not have to solve the whole thing at once. You just have to take the right first step. Drawing on more than three decades as a family law attorney and mediator, she walks through the core members of a divorce support team, the attorney, the mediator, the divorce coach, the therapist, and the certified divorce financial analyst, and uses real scenarios to show who your first call should be. From the affair discovery, to the financial betrayal, to the blindsided stay-at-home parent, to the longtime thinker who is finally ready to act, each situation calls for a different first move. Divorce is not one size fits all, and the first decision you make can shape everything that follows. This episode helps you think clearly and choose carefully, so you move forward with strength and strategy instead of panic. Episode 1 of 8 in the Divorce & Beyond Summer Essentials Series This summer, Divorce & Beyond brings back 8 the episodes listeners reach for most, the conversations with the clearest, most practical guidance for anyone thinking about, going through, or rebuilding after divorce. New Essentials air every other Monday all summer. Follow the show so you never miss one. The series starts here. What You'll Learn Why your first call may not be an attorney, and how to triage who you reach out to based on your circumstances Who belongs on your divorce support team, the attorney, mediator, divorce coach, therapist, and CDFA, and when to bring each one in How to take the right first step when betrayal, fear, or financial shock has your emotions all over the place Why too many voices create confusion, and how to avoid the trap of asking everyone for advice Susan's golden nugget: why divorce is not a DIY project, and why the first decision you make shapes everything that comes next If This Episode Helped You Follow Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, a five-star review makes a real difference in helping the show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod About the Host: Susan Guthrie, Esq. Susan Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping people navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Town & Country, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with more than 1.3 million downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together leading legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at divorceandbeyondpod.com/about.   Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.

Kelly Myers has been on Divorce and Beyond twice before. Once to talk about Divorce Day One. Once to help listeners avoid the divorce hangover that follows too many people into their new life. This time, she comes back to share something she has never spoken about publicly: what the loss of her son Jack taught her about years of high-conflict co-parenting, and her hope that every parent still in the middle of it will find a way through differently. In June of 2024, Kelly lost her son Jack at the age of 23. In the year that followed, she found herself looking back at the years of high-conflict co-parenting that had defined her children's childhoods, and asking questions she could not stop asking. What role did the conflict play? What did her children carry because of it? What would she have done differently if she had known what she knows now? Kelly reached out and asked to have this conversation here, because she believes that what she learned at great cost is something other parents can still choose to learn a different way. This is one of the most generous conversations this show has ever had. Susan Guthrie and Kelly explore the real cost of co-parenting conflict on children, what it actually looks like to drop the rope after years of high-conflict engagement, how the ecosystem around a divorce often makes things worse, and what repair looks like when you still have years ahead to offer it. Covered in this episode: Why dropping the rope has to start with you, and why waiting for your co-parent to change first means waiting forever How the divorce ecosystem, including attorneys, family, and friends, can fan the flames of conflict without anyone asking what you actually want to protect What high-conflict co-parenting looks like through the eyes of the children living inside it, and why each child carries it differently How the BIFF communication method helped shift a years-long dynamic, and what that looked like in practice Why it is never too late to begin repair, and what choosing differently right now can mean for the moments still ahead Referenced Episodes from the Archive: Day One with a Divorce Coach: First Steps with Kelly Myers Avoiding the Divorce Hangover From the Start with Kelly Myers ______________________________________________________________________ This week's guest: Kelly Myers Kelly understands that divorce is one of life's most challenging transitions. She's a divorce and co-parenting coach, mediator, and communication specialist passionate about supporting individuals and families as they move through the complexities of divorce and co-parenting. She partners with clients to understand the divorce process, manage emotional and financial stress, and make strategic decisions throughout their divorce. Her work helps clients stay focused on what matters most while making choices that align with their long-term goals. Kelly specializes in supporting parents as they discover how to become strong co-parenting partners, even when the romantic relationship has ended. She helps parents see their relationship through a new lens-as partners in raising their children-guiding them to create respectful communication patterns and develop comprehensive, child-centered parenting plans that go far beyond custody schedules. Her approach centers on what children need emotionally and developmentally during this transition, while helping parents maintain a healthy family dynamic across two homes. In addition to her direct work with clients, Kelly loves mentoring other professionals. She serves as a co-trainer for the Co-Parenting Specialist® Training Program and provides professional development to divorce professionals seeking to use a more client-centered approach. Kelly's deepest commitment is to help families-both the ones she works with directly and those served by the professionals she trains-have less conflict, more cooperation, and real hope for their futures. Website: http://www.firststepsdivorce.com LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/kellymyerscoach Instagram: http://instagram.comfirststeps_divorce ______________________________________________________________________ If This Episode Helped You Subscribe to Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, leaving a five-star review makes a real difference in helping this show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod ______________________________________________________________________ About Our Host: Susan E. Guthrie, Esq. Susan E. Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping individuals navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with millions of downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together top legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at https://divorceandbeyondpod.com/about Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.

The question comes up in almost every divorce: what happens to the house? It is usually one of the biggest assets of the marriage, one of the biggest debts, and one of the most emotionally loaded decisions people face. Wanting to keep the house and actually being able to keep the house are two very different things. This week Susan is bringing back one of the most downloaded archived conversations from the Divorce and Beyond library, a conversation with Tami Wollensak, licensed mortgage loan originator and Certified Divorce Lending Professional, walking through the real financial realities of keeping the marital home.  Together, Susan and Tami unpack what it actually takes to keep the house in a divorce, from refinancing challenges and equity buyouts to qualifying for a mortgage on a single income, the hidden costs of homeownership, and why making this decision without proper financial planning can create serious problems long after the ink is dry. Covered in this episode: Why wanting to keep the house and being able to keep the house are two very different things, and what a Certified Divorce Lending Professional can do to help close that gap How equity is calculated, why the purchase price is not the value, and what it means to buy out your spouse's share as part of the refinance Why maintenance, alimony, and child support do not automatically count as qualifying income and what lenders actually need to see How a missed mortgage payment can drop credit scores by hundreds of points and why "it was their responsibility" has never once removed a negative mark from a credit report Why getting a home inspection before finalizing your divorce agreement is one of the most overlooked and important steps you can take KEEPING THE HOUSE: WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW BEFORE YOU SIGN Almost everyone walks into divorce negotiations with the same instinct: I want to keep the house. It is understandable. It is the family home. It is where the children have put their heads on pillows for years. But signing a settlement agreement without knowing whether you can actually execute it is not a successful negotiation. Some of the most important things to understand before you commit, are discussed in this episode: Know the fair market value of your home today, not the purchase price, and understand what the actual equity is and how it will be divided Understand that keeping the house means refinancing into your name alone, which means qualifying on your income alone, and your payment will be based on current market rates, not what you are paying today Work with a divorce mortgage professional early in the process, before the settlement agreement is signed, so you can generate real options rather than make decisions based on guesses Get a home inspection before finalizing the agreement, just as you would when buying a new home, so you know exactly what you are signing up for If your spouse agrees to stay on the mortgage temporarily, set up protections: require advance notice if a payment may be missed, and request a duplicate mortgage statement so you can monitor it yourself The goal is not to win the house. The goal is to make the decision that sets you up for the strongest future. Get the answers, both good and bad, and then decide. Referenced Episodes from the Archive: How to Get Your Act Together So that You Can Tackle Your Divorce with Alex Beattie of Divide & Thrive The Solution for Tackling the Divorce Detour with Storey Jones, Creator of dtour.life It's All About the House: What You Need to Think About Before You Decide to Keep It with Tami Wollensak ______________________________________________________________________ This Week's Sponsors:  Hello Divorce - Hello Divorce is a modern platform designed to support people before, during, and beyond divorce, providing legal information, tools, and access to professionals who help individuals navigate the process more thoughtfully. Resources created specifically for Divorce & Beyond listeners are available at HelloDivorce.com/Susan. Yumiyu - YUMIYU Jewelry is Susan’s favorite source for meaningful, handcrafted jewelry designed to empower women and celebrate individuality. Each piece is made with care, using high-quality materials like real gold and vermeil, and is water-resistant, non-tarnish, and hypoallergenic. Explore their stunning collection at yumiyujewelry.com and find your perfect piece today! Be sure to use Code: “BEYOND” for 20% off! ______________________________________________________________________ This week's guest: Tami Wollensak Tami Wollensak is a Divorce Mortgage Specialist and VP Loan Consultant with New American Funding (NMLS #1963450), bringing over 30 years of experience in the mortgage industry. She specializes in helping individuals navigate one of the most overlooked and misunderstood aspects of divorce: what happens to the marital home. After going through her own divorce, Tami saw firsthand how financial decisions made during this time can have long lasting consequences. Today, she works closely with individuals, attorneys, and mediators to bridge the gap between divorce agreements and mortgage lending, ensuring that what is decided on paper can actually be executed in real life. Tami’s approach is calm, strategic, and solution focused. She helps her clients understand their options clearly so they can move forward with confidence, whether that means keeping the home, selling it, or buying again in the future. She is the founder of Empowered Uncoupling, a platform dedicated to helping people transition from endings into new beginnings with clarity, confidence, and financial empowerment. For those navigating this decision now, Tami offers a simple starting point with her guide, Can I Keep the House?, along with a complimentary 15 minute consultation to help bring clarity to the next steps. Website https://www.empowereduncoupling.com Book a 15-Minute Consultation https://calendly.com/tamiwollensak/15min Ebook: Can I Keep the House? https://iwantthehouse.com YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@empowereduncoupling Instagram https://www.instagram.com/tamiwollensak LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/tamiwollensak ______________________________________________________________________ If This Episode Helped You Subscribe to Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, leaving a five-star review makes a real difference in helping this show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod ______________________________________________________________________ About Our Host: Susan E. Guthrie, Esq. Susan E. Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping individuals navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with millions of downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together top legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at https://divorceandbeyondpod.com/about Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.

Do you know what almost no one tells you when you are creating a parenting plan? Some of the biggest co-parenting battles after divorce will not be over the things you think. It may not be the major custody decision or where the children will primarily live. It may be the late pickup, the unanswered text, the forgotten backpack, or the soccer registration deadline no one thought to clarify. That is why Susan Guthrie is joined by Gabrielle Hartley, attorney, mediator, parenting conflict expert, TEDx speaker, bestselling author of Better Apart: The Radically Positive Way to Separate, and creator of Mediator Gabby. Gabrielle has spent decades helping families navigate separation with greater clarity, less conflict, and better outcomes for children. Together, they get practical about why so many parenting plans break down after the divorce is finalized and what it actually takes to build one that holds up in real life. This conversation is for anyone creating a parenting plan, already co-parenting, or supporting someone who is. Because choosing what feels easier right now has a way of creating a much more difficult problem to solve later. Covered in this episode: Why most co-parenting conflict has nothing to do with bad parenting What makes a parenting plan fall apart once real life takes over How the "easier now, harder later" trap quietly sets families up for more conflict Why clarity matters more than detail when building a durable parenting plan How Mediator Gabby helps parents arrive prepared, stay focused, and reach better agreements WHAT IF AN AI MEDIATOR COULD HELP YOU BUILD A PARENTING PLAN BEFORE YOU EVER WALK INTO A ROOM?  There are approximately 29-million children living in single-parent families in the United States, and the vast majority of their parents never have access to a lawyer, a mediator, or any professional guidance at all. Mediator Gabby, Gabrielle's AI-supported parenting plan tool was built with those families in mind.  Using this custom AI tool, each parent completes a guided onboarding on their own before any joint conversation begins, working through the full landscape of a parenting plan so that by the time they sit down together, they already know where they agree, where they do not, and what needs to be worked through. Here is what that preparation can do for families: Save three to five hours of introductory conversation before mediation even begins Help parents arrive focused and prepared rather than reactive and overwhelmed Surface the details most people do not think to address until they become conflict points Lower the emotional temperature in the room so real resolution can happen faster Keep the process moving forward instead of stalling on issues that feel impossible in the moment A parenting plan is the operating system for your family's next chapter. The clearer and more intentional it is from the start, the less conflict it creates down the road, and the better the experience for your children. FREE DOWNLOAD: Parenting Plan Reality Check: The Questions Every Co-Parent Needs to Answer Before Finalizing a Parenting Plan + Companion Article  Find the article and free download on the website at https://divorceandbeyondpod.com/latest-episode Referenced Episodes from the Archive: The 7 Most-Asked Divorce Questions on ChatGPT, Answered by a Top Family Law Attorney with Susan Guthrie Discovery Demystified: Why Fact-Finding is the Most Important Step in Your Divorce with Susan Guthrie Conflict Resolution Made Easy: Managaing the Five Destructive Behaviors We All Have with Gabrielle Hartley Gabrielle Hartley Has the Secret to Helping Us All Get Along Better and It Starts with Y.E.S. Is Your Divorce Taking Too Long? BLITZ IT and BE DONE with Gabrielle Hartley The Best Thing to Happen to Divorce in Ages with Very Special Guest, Gabrielle Hartley If this episode helped you, please share it and leave a review. It genuinely helps the show reach the people who need it most. _______________________________________________________________ Meet This Week’s Guest: Gabrielle Hartley is a New York and Massachusetts divorce attorney, mediator, author, two-time TEDx speaker, and legal tech founder working at the intersection of family dispute resolution and technology. She is the founder of Better Parenting Plan and creator of Mediator Gabby, a technology-supported platform designed to help parents and family professionals reduce conflict and build clearer, more durable parenting agreements. Gabrielle is also consulting with the American Arbitration Association to help launch its first-ever family mediation panel. A former court attorney to Hon. Jeffrey Sunshine in the New York Supreme Court, Matrimonial Division, she has spent more than twenty-five years helping families resolve complex divorce and custody matters constructively. She is the author of Better Apart and The Secret to Getting Along and serves on the ABA Dispute Resolution Council. Website: BetterParentingPlan.com Instagram: http://instagram.com/gabriellehartleyesq _______________________________________________________________ This Week's Sponsors:  Hello Divorce - Hello Divorce is a modern platform designed to support people before, during, and beyond divorce, providing legal information, tools, and access to professionals who help individuals navigate the process more thoughtfully. Resources created specifically for Divorce & Beyond listeners are available at HelloDivorce.com/Susan. Yumiyu - YUMIYU Jewelry is Susan’s favorite source for meaningful, handcrafted jewelry designed to empower women and celebrate individuality. Each piece is made with care, using high-quality materials like real gold and vermeil, and is water-resistant, non-tarnish, and hypoallergenic. Explore their stunning collection at yumiyujewelry.com and find your perfect piece today! Be sure to use Code: “BEYOND” for 20% off! _______________________________________________________________ If This Episode Helped You Subscribe to Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, leaving a five-star review makes a real difference in helping this show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod ______________________________________________________________________ About Our Host: Susan E. Guthrie, Esq. Susan E. Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping individuals navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with millions of downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together top legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at https://divorceandbeyondpod.com/about Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.

One of the biggest fears people face when contemplating divorce is the financial unknown. If you are sitting out there right now feeling overwhelmed, unsure where to begin, or worried about money, this conversation was made for you. This week Susan is bringing you one of the most listened to and most shared episodes from the Divorce and Beyond archive, a conversation with certified divorce financial analyst Hollis Hardiman, also a certified mediator and certified collaborative professional, walking through the foundational financial preparation that can make such a difference when first starting the divorce process. Together, Susan and Hollis get into what it really takes to protect your finances as you enter the process, from building the right professional support team to understanding what your household actually costs to approaching the big decisions, like the house, with clarity and an open mind instead of fear. Covered in this episode: Why money is the number one fear people face when contemplating divorce and why the right professional support team changes everything How to start building a picture of your finances from what you already have access to, even if your spouse handled the money Why alimony and support are temporary and what it means to plan now for when they end How a CDFA helps clients protect their finances not just during the divorce process but for their financial future as well HOW TO HANDLE THE MOST COMMON QUESTION ASKED DURING DIVORCE, "CAN I KEEP THE HOUSE?" Almost everyone walks into the divorce process asking the same thing: can I keep the house? It is an understandable instinct. But when keeping the house becomes a fixed position rather than one option among many, it can stall the process, drain resources, and leave you worse off financially in the long run. Some things to consider, as discussed in this episode include:  One household income divided into two households means the math will not work the same way Understand what it would actually cost to keep the house: refinancing, mortgage qualification, maintenance, and carrying costs Explore all the options: keeping, selling, renting, downsizing You can put the puzzle together a lot of different ways in divorce, but only if you stay open to looking at all the pieces The goal is not to win the house. The goal is to make the decision that sets you up for the strongest financial future. Get the answers, both good and bad, and then decide. Referenced Episodes from the Archive: How to Get Your Act Together So that You Can Tackle Your Divorce with Alex Beattie of Divide & Thrive The Solution for Tackling the Divorce Detour with Storey Jones, Creator of dtour.life  It’s All About the House: What You Need to Think About Before You Decide to Keep It with Tami Wollensak ______________________________________________________________________ This Week’s Guest: Hollis Hardiman, CDFA Hollis provides financial, retirement, and wealth management services to her clients. She specializes in helping people navigate major life transitions including divorce, the loss of a spouse, and preparing for retirement. As a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst (CDFA), Hollis firmly believes in building a support team of divorce professionals including attorneys, mediators, and therapists that can help her clients make the best decisions during these emotional times. As a child of divorced parents, Hollis witnessed firsthand the consequences when sound financial decisions are not made. Hollis is certified in both mediation and collaborative divorce. She is well trained to advocate for one party or serve as a neutral party for the couple during the divorce process. While being part of the support system with the attorneys and mediators, Hollis is able to guide her clients through their short-term and long-term settlement options. Hollis grew up in Fairfield, CT, and now splits her time between Fairfield, CT, and Palm City, FL. In her free time, she enjoys spending time with her husband and extended family, walking her two dogs, and playing tennis. Investment advice offered through Merit Financial Group, LLC, an SEC registered investment adviser. Phone:  203.423.5985 E-mail:  [email protected] Website:  https://divorceresourcect.com/about/ ______________________________________________________________________ If This Episode Helped You Subscribe to Divorce & Beyond so you never miss an episode. Share it with someone who needs clear, reliable guidance right now. And if you have a moment, leaving a five-star review makes a real difference in helping this show reach the people who need it most. Follow Divorce & Beyond Website: divorceandbeyondpod.com Instagram: instagram.com/divorceandbeyondpod ______________________________________________________________________ About Our Host: Susan E. Guthrie, Esq. Susan E. Guthrie is one of the nation's leading family law and mediation attorneys, with more than 35 years of experience helping individuals navigate divorce with clarity and strategy. She is the Immediate Past Chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution, a best-selling author, and a sought-after speaker and trainer. Susan recently appeared as the featured expert on The Oprah Podcast and has been cited in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, The Washington Post, NewsNation, and NBC Chicago Today, among others. As the creator and host of Divorce & Beyond, ranked in the top 1% of all podcasts worldwide with millions of downloads and an Apple Top 100 Self-Help designation, Susan brings together top legal and mental health experts to help listeners move through divorce and into what comes next. Learn more at https://divorceandbeyondpod.com/about Disclaimer: The commentary and opinions shared on this podcast are for informational and entertainment purposes only and do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state regarding your specific situation.