Cutting a 5-Round Sales Interview Process Down to 3 with Mike Clapson, Ashby

AI fluency is becoming part of the hiring bar, but assessing it is still a work in progress.Maksym Dziarmaga of Loop Earplugs joins Shannon to share how Loop evaluates AI capability throughout its hiring process. He explains why the company established "capable" as its baseline, how hiring teams assess candidates across different levels, and where subjectivity can make consistent evaluation difficult.Maksym shares how Loop encourages candidates to use AI in business cases while looking closely at the thinking behind their work. He also explains why curiosity can be a valuable signal and how Loop is working toward a more consistent approach to evaluating AI skills across hiring teams.Key Takeaways:Critical thinking matters: Look beyond whether candidates use AI and probe how they evaluate, edit, and challenge its output.Set a realistic baseline: Match AI expectations to the role instead of requiring advanced fluency when the work does not call for it.Calibrate your interviewers: Give hiring teams shared examples of different AI capability levels so individual experience does not set the bar.Treat assessment as data: Use interview results to identify gaps in your hiring process and understand where teams may need stronger AI skills.Timestamps(00:00) Introduction(00:07) Meet Maksym Dziarmaga(01:24) Why Loop assesses AI capability during hiring(03:14) Deciding how much AI fluency each role needs(05:25) Creating a practical scale for AI capability(07:34) Why critical thinking matters more than AI output(08:06)  Applying AI case studies during hiring(13:31) How curiosity and critical thinking shows in a candidate(16:34) How AI stewards support teams at Loop(20:02) How Loop help employees upskill(22:46) What Loop learned from its AI interview data(25:28) Standardizing AI assessment as expectations evolve(27:23) Where to connect with Maksym

A great hire can still become an attrition problem when success is unclear.Nic Weatherhead, Global Vice President of People at The Stepstone Group, joins Shannon to share why recruiting teams should think beyond the point of hire. After joining a company that had grown through acquisitions across 32 countries, Nic saw an opportunity to connect recruiting more closely with performance, progression, and long-term talent needs.Nic explains how The Stepstone Group created clearer career frameworks. They tested the approach within recruiting and worked with business leaders to anticipate changing skill needs. She also shares how the work helped cut attrition by more than half and why AI is prompting her team to rethink how scope, autonomy, and complexity are defined. Key Takeaways:Define roles before people: Establish what each role and level requires before mapping current employees into the framework.Use recruiting as a signal: What recruiters see in the market can help leaders identify emerging skills and changes to roles earlier.Reconsider how scope works: Direct reports may no longer be the best measure of responsibility as more individual contributors work with AI agents.Connect the talent system: Hiring, onboarding, performance, and progression work better when teams share a clear definition of success.   Timestamps(00:00) Introduction(00:42) Meet Nic Weatherhead(01:43) Why hiring success extends beyond the offer(04:26) Connecting recruiting to the wider talent system(05:28) 3 focus areas of a career framework(09:54) Diagnosing attrition and hiring challenges(10:59)  Goal of a focused career framework(14:56) Partnering with leaders on future skill needs(15:42) Testing the career framework within recruiting(19:55) How AI is changing scope, autonomy, and complexity(22:58) Cutting attrition by more than half(24:10) Applying progress that keeps the whole team's connection intact(26:53) Where to connect with Nic

Just as revenue pipelines demand weekly tracking from sales leaders, hiring pipelines require that same level of focus.Mike Clapson, VP of Sales at Ashby, sits down with Shannon to share how his team successfully streamlined their account executive interview process from five stages to three, all while maintaining high standards. He reveals which interview stage was eliminated first, the clear data driving that decision, and the crucial question he evaluates before removing any step. Mike breaks down the mechanics of their challenge round, detailing why candidates perform two iterations of the demo role-play. Additionally, he highlights the necessary operational shifts made as their leadership expanded from 3 to 14 hiring managers.Key takeaways:Cut with evidence: An interview step that keeps returning the same score is a signal you already have.Shadow before you solo: New hiring managers run three shadows and three reverse shadows, debriefing after each one.Keep the field level: Every candidate gets the same prep materials, including referrals who know someone inside.Track return on tenure: Longer-tenured reps performed better on average, which turns retention into a hiring result.Timestamps:(00:00) Introduction(00:31) Meet Mike Clapson(01:57) Why hiring gets the same attention as the sales pipeline(02:47) Collapsing a 5-round AE process down to 3(04:39) The problem statement that shortened the hiring process(06:26) Evaluating which part of the hiring process to remove(09:22) Scenario questions that show how candidates think(14:04) What candidates want most from a hiring process(15:40) Challenge rounds: demo role plays(18:29) Leveling candidates' playing field(19:32) Expanding from 3 to 14 hiring managers(20:37) Shadows and reverse shadows for new hiring managers(23:32) Lower attrition and the return on tenure analysis(26:20) How Ashby's clients grow up and through the company(29:37) Next evolution of continuous improvements(32:03) Where to connect with Mike

Recruiting operations does not scale on good intentions alone.Natalie Mercuri, Recruiting Operations Program Manager at Plaid, joins Shannon to share how her two-person team supported thousands of interviews a year while migrating the company to a new ATS. Natalie explains why she brought her customer support background into talent, why centralizing every question into one channel changed how recruiters and hiring managers get help, and how she layered ticketing and AI tools on top of that channel to speed up response times.Natalie also shares how her team pushed first reply resolution to 85%, cut down on one-off DMs, and taught the wider company how to troubleshoot before asking for help. She closes with her honest take on why cover letters waste everyone's time.Key TakeawaysCentralize every question: One intake channel makes it easier to track, prioritize, and delegate incoming requests.Automate the first response: Tools like Glean can handle routine questions so your team can focus on the harder ones.Teach people to troubleshoot: Coaching employees to try one more step before asking builds a stronger self-serve culture.Protect quality during ramp: Moving fast only pays off when your team still has time to get the answer right.Timestamps(00:00) Introduction(00:47) Meet Natalie Mercuri(02:31) Why strong recruiting operations start with trust(04:46) Migrating to a new ATS while keeping hiring on pace(07:48) Centralizing every recruiting question in one channel(09:32) Choosing the right tools for ticket intake(11:47) Balancing AI automation with human follow up(15:35) Teaching recruiters and hiring managers to self-serve(21:12) Borrowing lessons from customer support and engineering(28:34) The results behind an 85% first reply rate(33:53) Where to connect with Natalie

Scaling fast and scaling with intention are not the same thing.Maggie Fish, Director of Recruiting at Grafana Labs, joins Shannon to explain how her team built an ideal candidate profile for every role, starting with sales and expanding it across the business. She walks through the deep dive into attrition data and interview feedback that separated what actually predicted a great Grafanista from what just looked good on paper, and why removing bias from the hiring bar mattered more once her team scaled across the US, Europe, and Australia.Maggie shares how that work led to a guiding principles engine that generates role-specific interview questions, how her team cut the interview process from six stages to five, and how the first hired cohort came through with zero non-regretted attrition.Key takeaways:Data first, opinions second: Bring interview and performance data into the room before asking hiring managers what they think, or the conversation stalls on gut feel.Test what you value: If a guiding principle actually matters, build it into an interview question, then check with AI note takers that interviewers are getting there.Async beats scripted calls: Letting hiring managers think through what they need before a recruiter call gets everyone further before the conversation even starts.Confidence earns a seat: Speaking up and challenging the status quo, done thoughtfully, builds the kind of trust that gets you pulled into decisions you were not even in the room for.Timestamps: (00:00) Introduction(00:44) Meet Maggie Fish(02:21) Scaling with intention versus scaling fast(04:49) Getting every team aligned to one north star(08:53) Digging into attrition data to define the ideal account executive(11:43) Rebuilding the interview process around critical attributes(15:36) Rolling the ideal candidate profile out beyond sales(16:24) Building the guiding principles engine(20:32) Roadblocks to watch for when you start this work(21:48) Zero non-regretted attrition and other early results(24:02) The vision for an ICP copilot(28:02) Where to connect with Maggie

Quality of hire does not end at the offer.Veronica Salcido, who leads the recruiting, HR, and coaching and L&D org at GrowthAssistant, joins Shannon to unpack how her team turned 50% churn into a 10% retention lift in 6 months. She explains why speed and volume stopped being useful signals once quality became the real cost, and how tracing 80% of failed hires back to durable skills, not hard skills, changed how her team hires, coaches, and measures success.Veronica walks through the four durable skills her team built into every stage of the journey, why half of a recruiter's KPI is now tied to 90-day quality of hire, and how that accountability turned recruiting from an execution function into a strategic partner to the business.Key takeaways:Durable skills outlast tools: Character, communication, and critical thinking hold their value for seven to nine years, while tool skills like ChatGPT or Klaviyo fade out in under two.CEO buy in matters: The fastest way to get a hiring framework adopted across an org is making the CEO or founder its first champion.AI can prep coaching: Aggregating performance data ahead of a coaching call helps leaders focus on the one durable skill that actually needs work.Curiosity beats sounding smart: The people who ask questions freely tend to go further than the people busy managing how they appear in the room.Timestamps: (00:00) Introduction(00:48) Meet Veronica Salcido(02:01) Why operational rigor matters more than ever(04:22) Inside the GrowthAssistant model(08:07) Inheriting speed and volume without quality(09:55) Tracing 50 percent churn back to durable skills(13:37) Naming the four durable skills framework(17:52) Connecting the through line from hire to retention(19:34) Tying 90 day quality of hire to recruiter KPIs(24:12) Why shared accountability changes the recruiter's role(30:09) The results after 6 months and 18 months(36:40) Where to connect with Veronica

A hiring goal only works when the team believes it is possible.Liz Woodfield, Head of Talent Acquisition at SentiLink, joins Shannon to share how she built a single north star metric for her recruiting team and used it to drive a 60% increase in hires without adding headcount. She breaks down the framework she leans on for every role, volume, velocity, and calibration, and how weekly dashboards brought a skeptical team and leadership along.Once the team started hitting their weekly numbers, the results followed. SentiLink hit its first half of the year goal, and Liz has kept the same system in place as the team scales into the second half, adding more layers around competency based hiring along the way.Key takeaways:Sprint hiring unlocks roles: Breaking a role into a tight weekly plan turned a year old opening into a one week hire.Debriefs surface bias: Talking live catches details that written feedback and Slack threads tend to miss.Hiring is everyone's job: SentiLink's leadership repeats the hiring goal at every all hands so recruiting is not carrying it alone.Interviews should inform onboarding: The insight gathered from candidates can shape a stronger first few months on the job.Timestamps: (00:00) Introduction(01:00) Meet Liz Woodfield(02:30) Why every recruiting team needs a north star metric(03:10) Turning a CEO's gold metric into a team wide goal(04:04) Setting a bigger hiring goal with the same size team(06:51) The volume velocity calibration equation behind recruiting success(08:06) Winning leadership buy in during the uncomfortable early weeks(09:51) Building weekly dashboards recruiters actually trust(12:01) Using sprint hiring to close a role open for over a year(13:40) Application data gathering for results(15:55) Recruitment goals inspired by revenue goals(17:51) Running towards the collective but improve individually(18:50) 7 months in, measuring what the new system delivered(22:21) What comes next for SentiLink's hiring goals(24:42) Where to connect with Liz

What if your hiring process was designed to screen people in instead of screen them out?Jen Ayala, Head of Recruiting at Clay, joins Shannon to discuss why traditional hiring often filters out great talent too early. She shares how Clay replaced resume reviews with project-based evaluations for high volume hiring, giving career transitioners and new graduates a better opportunity to demonstrate their strengths while helping the team hire faster.Jen also explains how AI supports recruiters without replacing human judgment, why hiring for potential creates stronger teams, and how designing a fair process can improve both candidate experience and hiring outcomes.Key takeaways:Screen people in, not out: Replace early resume filtering with practical assessments that help candidates demonstrate their strengths.Keep humans involved: Use AI to organize information and speed up evaluations while leaving hiring decisions to recruiters.Hire for potential: Focus on learning ability and unique strengths instead of matching every requirement on a job description.Build together: Partner with hiring managers, recruiters, and cross functional teams to continuously improve hiring processes.Timestamps: (00:00) Introduction(00:55) Meet Jen Ayala(02:12) Why traditional hiring screens out great talent(04:18) Giving candidates projects before resume reviews(08:35) Eliminating resume screening for high volume hiring(12:05) Building an AI assisted project evaluation system(19:12) How recruiters became stronger decision makers(20:40) Candidate reactions to project based hiring(24:10) Results from Clay's hiring pilot(27:46) Where to connect with Jen

Recruiting teams earn influence when they understand what the business is trying to build.Mike Bettley, VP of Talent Acquisition at StackAdapt, joins Shannon to share how he rebuilt a TA function that was stretched, fragmented, and operating without a clear hiring plan. Before changing systems or metrics, Mike focused on the team’s confidence. He created space for honest feedback, reset expectations, and helped recruiters move from asking for permission to making informed recommendations.Mike also explains how his team became more involved in workforce planning, compensation conversations, and FP&A partnership as StackAdapt scaled from 170 to 1,800 people. He shares why every intake should start with the business problem, how recruiters can challenge unrealistic profiles, and where AI can support better planning before a role ever reaches TA.Key takeaways:Start with business needs: Define what the role must accomplish before writing the job description.Context beats pedigree: A great background does not always match the company’s current stage.Alignment prevents drift: Shared definitions help interviewers evaluate candidates against the same bar.Process builds confidence: Strong hiring systems reduce overreliance on back channels and outside validation.Timestamps: (00:00) Introduction(00:35) Meet Mike Bettley(01:30) Why recruiter confidence drives business impact(03:33) Rebuilding a fragmented talent acquisition team(06:11) Creating trust through vulnerability and transparency(11:00) Earning hiring manager trust across the organization(12:00) Shifting from job descriptions to business problems(15:30) Teaching stakeholders what great TA partnership looks like(18:30) Fixing operational bottlenecks through TA Ops investment(21:00) Lessons learned from launching recruiting KPIs(24:00) Measuring success through consistency and hiring quality(28:00) Using AI to improve hiring planning and intake processes(30:05) Where to connect with Mike

Hiring senior leaders on gut feel is a risk most companies cannot afford.Cristina Navarro, Senior Director of Global Talent Acquisition at Tubi, joins Shannon to discuss why traditional interview formats fail at the executive level and how her team built a structured leadership assessment to close that gap. She explains how the process was co-created with senior leadership, why prompt design matters, and how thorough prep on both sides of the table leads to better decisions.Cristina also walks through how debrief structure protects against groupthink, how candidate feedback from the process informs onboarding strategy, and why the goal was never to add friction but to give everyone involved more confidence in one of the most consequential hiring decisions a company can make.Key takeaways:Co-creation drives adoption: When senior leaders help build the assessment, buy-in follows naturally once results come in.Prompt design is the foundation: A role-specific, well-scoped prompt is what separates a meaningful assessment from a generic exercise.Debrief order changes outcomes: Hearing from the most senior voices last protects the room from influence bias before a final decision is made.Recruiting data shapes onboarding: Themes that surface during the assessment can directly inform how a new executive is set up from day one.Timestamps: (00:43) Meet Cristina Navarro(02:08) Why executive hiring carries more risk than any other level(03:49) What Tubi does differently in senior leader hiring(05:20) How the leadership assessment was built and who was involved(07:14) Preparing both candidates and interviewers for the assessment(10:25) Why no new faces in the room is an intentional design choice(11:42) How debriefs are structured to reach a confident hiring decision(12:55) What candidates say after going through the process(15:37) Plans to expand the assessment beyond VP-level roles(17:07) Using recruiting findings to inform executive onboarding(19:25) Where to connect with Cristina