330. Getting Your Head Above the Clouds: Creating Space to Savor What Comes Next

How can you create enough space to notice what you need and trust yourself? In this warm conversation, family physician and physician leader Dr. Kelly Derbin shares how coaching, mindfulness, yoga, and two Connect in Nature retreats helped her navigate clinical burnout, leadership, caring for her aging mother, and the decision to retire from clinical practice.  She shares how these tools have helped her savor a meaningful season rather than simply survive it. In this episode, Dr. Jessie Mahoney and Dr. Kelly Derbin talk about the pause that changes everything: the small gap, a coaching conversation, an immersive retreat, or an intentional choice that helps us get our heads above the clouds long enough to hear ourselves again. Might you also be "trying to make something work because of what the vision was in my head, as opposed to being open to what could be"? Listen to learn: Why getting above the clouds can change how we see work, life, and big decisions The difference between institutional leadership development and outside coaching Why physicians need both small pauses and more immersive resets How a retreat can help regulate a nervous system that has been carrying too much Creating a microculture of intention within a large healthcare organization Letting go of the imagined plan in order to make space for what is actually possible Caring for an aging parent while carrying a full professional life Retirement as a transition into a new season, not a falling-off-a-cliff decision Using mindfulness not only to survive difficult moments, but to savor tender ones How intention changes the "landing" of conversations with colleagues and family "If you're just using your mindfulness to navigate the hard moments, you might miss the beauty of those really special moments." If you are a physician who feels successful on the surface but knows something needs to shift underneath, this conversation is an invitation to pause.  You do not have to decide everything today.  You may simply need enough space to hear yourself. About Dr. Kelly Derbin Dr. Kelly Derbin is a family physician. After early academic and community-based family medicine roles in Alabama, she returned to California and spent 17 years with Palo Alto Medical Foundation. She served as the founding medical director of a leadership development office for nearly a decade and will continue to provide leadership coaching within her organization as she retires from clinical practice. Learn more about coaching, retreats, and mindfulness offerings on www.jessiemahoneymd.com Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog *Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.

Hope is deeply human. It can keep us going when life feels uncertain, painful, or out of our control.  But hope is not a plan. In this solocast, Dr. Jessie Mahoney shares what she is learning while caring for her aging parents through a season of medical crises, changing needs, family decisions, and more chaos than she expected. Then she widens the conversation to the endurance races many of us are living: our own health, caregiving, medicine, work, relationships, and change we did not choose. This is an episode about accepting reality without giving up, finding agency when you cannot control the outcome, caring for your nervous system, and meeting hard moments with wisdom and grace. Jessie shares practical mindfulness tools for staying steady, including letting go, trust, presence, gratitude, generosity, helpful questions, and her guiding questions: What will I wish I had done? and What would love do? In this episode, you'll hear about: Why hope can be inspiring—and still not be an action plan Acceptance as radical honesty, not resignation How to find agency without taking over someone else's agency Why chaos can become a place to learn and grow Managing your mind, nervous system, and physiology in a long endurance season Risk mitigation instead of perfectionism Helpful questions that interrupt spiraling and return you to clarity The power of pauses, rest, nourishment, and self-compassion How sibling relationships can be both hard and unexpectedly healing "Health and wealth," "brave and bold," and "the exquisite" as practical ways to navigate change Resources and invitations: Learn about one-on-one coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/physician-coaching Learn about Advanced Coaching / Deeper Connections: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/deeper-connections-advanced-coaching Explore 2027 Nicasio Creek Farm retreat dates: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/nicasio-creek-farm-coaching-immersions Connect in Nature with Dr. Ni-Cheng Liang, December 2–4: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreat-connect-in-nature 2027 Transition Well Group Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/transition-well Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.

What if the conversation in front of you is not asking you to fix anything? As physicians, caregivers, parents, and partners, we are trained to notice suffering and move quickly toward a solution. But even when our intention is to help, fixing can sometimes land as judgment. It can leave the other person feeling unseen, rushed, or as though they need to change. In this episode, Dr. Ni-Cheng Liang and Dr. Jessie Mahoney explore mindful communication as a practice of presence, curiosity, and generosity. They share why listening without immediately advising, correcting, rescuing, or preparing your response can be deeply healing—for the person speaking and for you. Together, they discuss practical ways to arrive more fully before an important conversation: a breath, a hand to heart, a quiet walk, a moment of noticing, or simply an intention to connect. This is not about performing perfect communication. It is an invitation to pause, listen, and remember that sometimes the most healing thing we can offer is our willingness to stay. In This Episode, We Explore Why the instinct to fix can unintentionally communicate judgment The difference between "How can I help?" and deciding what someone needs Listening as a gift of presence, not a tool for solving Why presence and monotasking can conserve emotional energy The question beneath our urge to fix: whose discomfort are we trying to relieve? Simple ways to prepare your body and mind for a difficult conversation How to practice mindful communication with patients, colleagues, children, partners, and parents Reflection Questions When someone comes to you with a problem, is your first instinct to fix or to simply listen? Where might your desire to help sometimes carry an unintended judgment? What does it feel like in your body when you are truly listening? What helps you arrive with presence before an important conversation? Who in your life might benefit from being listened to rather than being fixed? Connect in Nature Retreat Drs. Liang and Mahoney will be offering another Connect in Nature retreat in December, with CME available. Learn more and join them here: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreat-connect-in-nature If this conversation resonates, Jessie's coaching offers a place to pause, hear yourself more clearly, and make changes with more presence, self-trust, and ease. 1:1 Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.comCME Wellness Retreats: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

What if you did not have to earn your rest, optimize your time off, or have the next chapter all figured out before it begins? In this episode of Healing Medicine, Dr. Jessie Mahoney talks with Dr. Jenny Kohr, a breast radiologist in the space between two jobs. After leaving a role she held for nearly 14 years, Jenny took nine weeks before starting the next one. She did not travel the world. She did not reorganize her whole life. She did not turn her time off into another ambitious project. Instead, she practiced pacing. Jenny shares what she learned from leaving space in her schedule, sitting outside with coffee in the morning, moving her body, taking a meditation class, writing, and learning to sing. Together, she and Jessie explore the old patterns that can make change so tiring for women in medicine: urgency, perfectionism, striving, and the belief that we need to prove we used our time well. This is a conversation about trusting yourself enough to let things take the time they take. About noticing when your strengths are serving you—and when they are asking too much of you. And about beginning again without abandoning yourself in the process. In this episode, we explore How to navigate a career transition without recreating the same pace Why "pacing" can be more helpful than simply telling yourself to slow down The urge to fill time off with travel, achievement, and productivity How urgency and perfectionism can masquerade as responsibility Why a reasonable pace can help you do better work, not less work What singing can teach us about strain, self-trust, and finding what fits How writing your story for yourself changes the way you see your life The difference between helpful strengths and patterns that have become draining How to ask better questions when you are new, uncertain, or in transition Pearls of wisdom Things take the time they take. What if the way you spent your time off was exactly what you needed? If you feel yourself straining, try something different. You do not need to explain every decision that is right for you. We do not have to get rid of our strengths. We can be discerning about when they are helpful. You do not have to have it all figured out right now. And if you did, how boring. Reflection questions Where am I cramming something in rather than letting it take the time it takes? What is my sense of urgency asking me to prove, finish, or figure out? Where do I feel strain—and what might it look like to try something different? What if this season is giving me exactly what I need? What would it look like to trust myself a little more in the change I am navigating? If this conversation resonates, Jessie's coaching offers a place to pause, hear yourself more clearly, and make changes with more presence, self-trust, and ease. 1:1 Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.comCME Wellness Retreats: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

Guilt heavily influences women physicians' decision-making. I see it day in and day out as a physician coach. Dr. Jessie Mahoney talks with psychiatrist and author Dr. Jennifer Reid about her book Guilt Free and the guilt equation she uses with patients: guilt as our expectations minus our perceived reality. They walk through the four expectations Jennifer calls "the four furies"—constant caretaking, hyper-accountability, seeking perfection, and the myth of having it all—and why these are especially expensive for women physicians. Jessie and Jennifer talk through the difference between adaptive guilt, which prompts real repair, and maladaptive guilt, which keeps us doing more. They cover disappointment as one of the most stressful things for physicians to navigate, why boundaries and delegating feel unsafe, and Jennifer's SPEAK framework for moving toward guilt-free decisions: showing up, paying attention, examining the evidence, taking action, and "keeping going," which = continuing the practice. Guilt also functions as a form of social control in medicine—training that keeps physicians giving more instead of questioning the system asking it of them. Awareness is the most important shift. In this episode:  The guilt equation: expectations minus perceived reality The four expectations that keep women physicians trapped in guilt Adaptive guilt versus maladaptive guilt Why disappointment feels so dangerous in medicine The SPEAK framework for moving toward guilt-free decisions How guilt functions as social control in medical training Pearls of Wisdom: Guilt equals our expectations minus our perceived reality—and perceived reality is rarely accurate. Guilt motivates the way junk food does: briefly, at a high cost. Adaptive guilt prompts repair; maladaptive guilt just prompts more and more. Disappointing others is often unavoidable—the litmus test that matters more is not disappointing yourself. Guilt functions as social control in medicine, keeping physicians giving more instead of questioning the system. Awareness is most of the shift. Reflection Questions Where do you notice yourself making decisions from guilt rather than desire or alignment? Which of the four expectations—caretaking, hyper-accountability, perfection, or having it all—shows up most for you? Where does disappointing someone else actually mean not disappointing yourself? What would it look like to delegate, set a boundary, or let someone be disappointed this week? More about Dr. Jennifer Reid: her book Guilt Free is available here, and she writes at her Substack, A Mind of Her Own, and at jenniferreidmd.com. Ways to Work with Jessie 1:1 Coaching: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/ CME Wellness Retreats: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

Dr. Jessie Mahoney and Dr. Erica Bove are birthday twins. Once a year, they sit down to reflect on what they are proud of, what they have learned, and what they want for the year ahead. This year, the conversation moves through self-kindness and what it actually looks like. They also talk about surrender as a lived experience rather than a concept, the courage it takes to rest inside a life built for productivity, and what it means to choose fun and alignment over achievement and obligation.  Jessie walks through her TED talk, becoming a grandmother of twins, creative grandparenting, finishing certifications on her own timeline, and the story that changed how she thinks about legacy.  Erica shares how self-kindness led to a resignation, opened space for her mother's illness, made room for a new relationship, and reshaped her approach to rest and female friendship. Listen to Explore What it looks like when self-kindness moves from a mantra into an actual decision How surrender shows up differently in career, family, health, and relationships Why rest and non-productivity are essential to a physician's whole health, not extras Creative grandparenting and the courage to do things your own way Female friendship as a vital, non-optional part of a well-lived life The story that reframed legacy around fun, not achievement Pearls of Wisdom Coaching, career pivots, fertility, parenting, relationships: the access point differs, but the deeper work overlaps. Sometimes speaking up means standing tall, and sometimes it means letting other people be them. Patience and trust often deliver what pushing and forcing cannot. Rest is not a reward for finishing. It is what makes the next season possible. Female friendship is not optional. It is part of your whole health system. Reflection Questions What would be kind to yourself this year? Where are you pushing through something that patience or rest might serve better? What would your children or the people closest to you say about whether you are having fun? Which friendships are you letting drift that deserve an intentional reach? About Dr. Erica Bove: Dr. Erica Bove is a double board-certified OBGYN and reproductive endocrinologist who practices at the University of Vermont and runs a fertility coaching practice for female physicians.  www.loveandsciencefertility.com www.loveandsciencefertility.com/thepodcast   Ways to work with Jessie 1:1 Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.com CME Wellness Retreats: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

There is a moment many of us know is coming: a parent's health changes, and our role changes with it. For physicians, caregiving can be especially complicated — our medical knowledge comes with responsibility, worry, and a powerful instinct to fix. We can know what might be medically best and still not be the person who gets to decide. Jessie and Ni-Cheng explore how mindfulness and coaching don't remove the difficulty of caregiving, but can change how we carry it and help us remain present, connected, and buoyant along the way. In This Episode: Why being "the doctor in the family" can complicate caregiving instead of easing it The difference between resilience and buoyancy Walking alongside aging parents versus managing them Letting go of overfunctioning and over-optimizing in caregiving What overwhelm, frustration, and resentment are actually telling us Pearls of Wisdom: Being "the doctor in the family" can make caregiving harder rather than easier. We may recognize every red flag and feel responsible even when the decisions are not ours to make. Buoyancy is different from resilience. Most physicians already know how to endure; buoyancy is about capacity, nervous system steadiness, repletion, and rising again when life pulls us under. Walking alongside our aging parents is different from managing them. We can offer knowledge and be helpful while still respecting their autonomy. Sustainable caregiving requires letting go of overfunctioning and over-optimizing. Doing something most efficiently doesn't automatically mean it's ours to do. Overwhelm, anger, frustration, and resentment aren't evidence that we're failing. They're information that may be asking us to rest, ask for help, regulate, or set a boundary. Reflection Questions: Where has caregiving opened us to a conversation or relationship we didn't expect? Where is caregiving difficult right now in a way that doesn't need to become a lesson? Where might our medical training be making caregiving harder rather than easier? What might change if we used mindfulness or coaching instead of our instinct to fix? Ways to work with Jessie 1:1 Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.com CME Wellness Retreats: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

Shame around failure and rejection isolates physicians and fuels burnout. Dr. Jessie Mahoney and Dr. René Roberts explore why, and what failure actually teaches us instead. Dr. René Roberts is a board-certified family medicine physician, a three-time Castle Connolly Top Doctor, and a TEDx speaker who got into medicine the hard way — rejected by every school she applied to for three years and failing her boards not once but twice. For years, she hid her story from almost everyone in her life. In this conversation, she and Jessie unpack the real cost of that hiding, why vulnerability is a skill worth practicing, and why how we receive someone else's vulnerability matters just as much as the courage it takes to share it. What We Explore Why failure and rejection are data, not evidence of inadequacy How shame fuels isolation and physician burnout Why the physicians who've struggled the most often become the most connected ones The overlooked role of the receiver — why not trying to fix someone's story is its own skill, and one that's rarely talked about Why elegant vulnerability changes culture faster than perfection does What it means to model wellness and vulnerability for the next generation of physicians Pearls of Wisdom Failure is data. It is not a personality trait or a scarlet letter to wear. The struggles that feel most disqualifying often become the equipment that makes you a better doctor. Hiding shame has a cost. It isolates us from our colleagues and from ourselves, and that isolation is part of what burns us out. Patients don't want a perfect doctor. They want a human doctor who understands what it's like to be given bad news. Sometimes the most healing thing you can do is just receive someone's story without trying to fix it. It's not what stops you. It's what you choose to do next. Reflection Questions Is there a failure or rejection you've never told anyone about? Where have you mistaken inadequacy for evidence, instead of equipment? What might shift for you and your colleagues if you were willing to show up with a bit more vulnerability? Are you someone people feel safe being vulnerable with — do you listen, or do you try to fix? What would change if leaders in your workplace modeled vulnerability instead of self-sacrifice? Ways to Work With Jessie 1:1 Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.com CME Wellness Retreats: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Jessie's Blog: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog  Podcast Page: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

Dr. Jessie Mahoney talks with family medicine physician Dr. Karen Fromhold, ten days into her hospice and palliative medicine fellowship. Karen had a good enough job. One she had loved and was a great fit for a while. She wasn't burned out. She simply had a dream she'd carried for over 20 years.  Our conversation explores what it took to voice her dream, trust it, and finally move toward it and the role retreats and coaching played at each step along the way. In This Episode: Why leaving a job you love can be harder than leaving one you don't How retreat spaces create room for clarity to surface The difference between moving away from something and moving toward something Why Karen waited for the right opportunity instead of rushing What it means to give yourself grace as a beginner again How the Retreat Space Made Room for This Decision Karen attended four retreats over four years, each one meeting her at a different point in the decision. At her first retreat, the dream was voiced out loud for the first time — in what Karen calls a "fragile, baby idea" state. Coaching conversations that followed helped the idea take shape. By her second retreat, she'd begun pursuing an alternate mid-career fellowship path. Jessie offers a framework for why this kept happening in the retreat space specifically: stepping out of daily environment and into relaxation activates the parasympathetic nervous system, which is often why clarity that's been hidden or hard to access at home surfaces in that container of safety. Karen also describes going back through her retreat journals before quitting her job and noticing the same themes recur and deepen each time she returned — what Jessie calls "peeling a different layer of the same onion." Pearls of Wisdom Once you make the decision, you make it the right decision. We don't want to run away from something — we want to move towards something. A busy life makes it easy to leave a dream on the shelf. If not now, when? Reflection Questions Where have you made do with "good" instead of pursuing "great"? What dream have you left on the shelf, telling yourself it's too late? What would it look like to move toward something instead of just away from what isn't working? Ways to work with Jessie: 1:1 Coaching: www.jessiemahoneymd.com CME Wellness Retreats: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.  

Many physicians reach a point where they are functioning well on the outside — delivering good care, staying credentialed, showing up — and yet something beneath the surface feels flat, restless, or not quite right. Not burned out exactly. Not unhappy exactly.  Just not fully found. Dr. Abhay Dandekar, a pediatrician who was a resident with Jessie, shares his journey of not feeling lost but also never feeling found either.  In this conversation, Abhay shares the arc of a career that has moved through clinical hospital medicine, residency program director, leaving for full-time administrative leadership in another institution, and then his journey back – to the exact clinical home he left. What changed when he returned was not the place. It was him. This is a generous conversation about navigating the pulls of medicine, the stories physicians tell themselves about staying and going, the difference between mentors and sponsors, and what it actually means to find yourself –  from the inside out.     What We Explore The specific feeling of "not yet being found" — distinct from being lost or burned out Why binary thinking narrows physician careers  What it means to return to a familiar place as a genuinely different person How to build what keeps you stable without stopping what keeps you moving The inner work of agency — and why waiting to be seen keeps you stuck How thought partners and daily reflection sustain longevity in medicine     Pearls of Wisdom The roses and the trash smell the same no matter where you are. What changes is how you show up. You can be functioning well on the outside and paying a real cost underneath. Agency does not come from the institution. It has to start from within. You can take a step without calling it a misstep. Sometimes it is a sidestep — or a diagonal forward step that puts you somewhere truer. Find thought partners, not echo chambers. The people around you carry wisdom you have not seen yet. Appreciating diastole — pausing and reflecting — is not recovery. It is practice.     Reflection Questions Where do you feel the gap between how you appear on the outside and what you are carrying underneath? Are you waiting for your institution to solve something that might need to start with you? Where is binary thinking shaping the choices in front of you right now? Who are your thought partners — and where are you in an echo chamber when you need honest conversation? What would it mean to appreciate diastole in your own career this week?     Ways to Work With Jessie 1:1 Coaching: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/ CME Wellness Retreats: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/retreats Free Live-Stream Mindful Yoga: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/yoga Jessie's Blog: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/jessies-blog Podcast Page: https://www.jessiemahoneymd.com/mindful-healers-podcast Nothing shared in the Healing Medicine Podcast is medical advice. The Healing Medicine Podcast was formerly known as the Mindful Healers Podcast.