S2:E8 Ask the Experts

The music in this episode is “Let it Burn,” by Oliver / Aberson. Find the notes and documents referenced in the episode at https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-11 This is the finale of Season Two – we discuss the different measures of justice each survivor got in the courts and we ask: is it enough? _________________________TRANSCRIPTSPEAKERSLeslie Briggs, Colleen McCarty, Marci, Heather, Christen, Karrah Colleen McCarty  00:00This episode contains references to accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular and language that is not suitable for listeners under 18 years of age. We also discuss suicide, sexual assault, addiction and relapse. Please use caution while listening. Leslie Briggs  00:35Welcome to the last episode of season two of panic button operational wildfire. Up to now we've been complaining about a system that fails to hold abusers accountable in a meaningful way. We've spoken to survivors, recanters, law enforcement, district attorneys, restorative justice experts, community advocates, and lawyers. We've reached out to Jim and his family, his business partners and generally tried to find anyone we could, who would give us insight into how these events could have unfolded over three decades, three states and many, many victims. Colleen McCarty  01:12Today, we're going to take you through the survivors efforts to seek criminal and civil justice through our courts. Even where they were, quote, successful in having charges brought the actual consequences of those charges were relatively minor. When Justice was fleeting, or altogether absent, several of the women turned toward each other and employed tactics that may raise some eyebrows when you hear about them. You've already heard about the flyer and the defamation case that followed. But what about the others? Heather, Marcy, and Christen. What justice have they seen through the courts? What measures have they relied on the courts failed them? What should survivors do when the system that's supposed to advocate for them doesn't is raising the village and assaulting the earth? The only choice left? Leslie Briggs  02:06I'm Leslie Briggs. Colleen McCarty  02:08And I'm Colleen McCarty. Leslie Briggs  02:10This is panic button season two episode 11. Colleen McCarty  02:13Vigilante shit  Leslie Briggs  02:16It might just be easiest to take this pre and post wildfire that is before and after the flyers. Before the flyers Christen suffered her her violent assault in 2015. And you heard those details in Episode Six. But after officer Rusty Shouse found her in the park bloody and afraid he arrested Jim. Colleen McCarty  02:36Officer Shouse filed a police report and an affidavit of probable cause. And here's what he wrote on 320 to 2015. At approximately zero to 31 hours. I was on patrol in the city of Cleveland. When I saw black Dodge Charger parked up Billy vessel's Park on West Cherokee Street. I gave the dispatcher the license plate information and advice that I would be making contact with the person in the vehicle. When I approached the

In this episode, Colleen and Leslie interview one of Jim’s survivors who has never spoken to anyone about the incident (aside from the police and her mother) in thirty years.The music in this episode is “I Can’t Make you Love me,” by Combsy.You can find the documents and pictures that support this episode at https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-10______________Episode Transcript SPEAKERSCarisa, Colleen McCarty, Leslie Briggs Colleen McCarty  00:00This episode contains references to accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular in language that is not suitable for listeners under 18 years of age. We also discuss coercive control. Please use caution when listening. Leslie Briggs  00:23Last week we finally gotten to the subject for which this podcast is named Operation Wildfire. Operation Wildfire was the act of a desperate woman, the act of someone who no longer has faith in her justice system to protect victims from her abuser, the act of someone who was powerless to stop someone else from getting hurt. Some would argue that she acted recklessly. Others would argue that she was bold and brave. One reason the courts didn't believe care about Jim's violence is because she made herself less credible by associating with his other victims. For becoming friends with Kristen, going on a cruise with Kristin and Amber, and continuing to go out of her way to warn his girlfriends about his behavior. All gave rise to questions about her truthfulness. Colleen McCarty  01:11Welcome to panic button. Operation Wildfire. This is episode 10. Eureka. If you're just joining us, we recommend you go back and start listening from episode one. The idea that by associating with each other they've heard their cases is a harsh reality. It not only calls Kara's case against Jim into question, but all of these women's cases, it allows Jen to continue to say these women are just crazy bitches who are all obsessed with him. Because we already don't believe women, more women compounded together unfortunately doesn't mean more credibility, it means more suspicion. Imagine if a group of men all alleged someone was violent, instant credibility. But multiple women claiming a man as violent. Instantly everyone starts saying witch hunt. Leslie Briggs  02:07When you're dealing with an unreliable witness, or one whose credibility has been attacked, or what we would call, quote, impeached in a court of law, you've got to try to rehabilitate them. You can do that through introducing corroborating statements, maybe you have the ability to put on character evidence for truthfulness. That's one of the exceptions to the no character evidence rule, which we talked about extensively in season one. Or, as we have here, you can put on a witness to testify to their independent experiences, untainted by the corruption of having worked as a group, which is the primary source for having attacked the other witnesses credibility in this case. So Arkansas. Colleen McCarty  02:49The crazy thing about the Arkansas case is that Kristen, and Cara have known about it for a really long time. It's not really clear to us how they came to know about it. But they put it on the flyer. Right. And it's only a police report. Right? Kristen spent years looking for this person. And they she was told when she called the Eureka Springs police department that you have to be a

The song in this week's episode is "Surefire," by Wilderado.You can access the show notes at https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-9S2:E9 WILDFIRE follows the story of one of Jim's survivors as she tries to hold him accountable in the court of public opinion. She was told by the Sapulpa police that they would not pursue charges. Once she learned about all the other survivors, she created a flyer to distribute about Jim's past abuses. Can your abuser sue you for spreading the truth? Can he win?_________EPISODE TRANSCRIPT SPEAKERSLeslie Briggs, Colleen McCarty, Josh Kidd, Karrah Leslie Briggs  00:00This episode contains references to accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular, and language that is not suitable for listeners under 18 years of age. We also discuss coercive control. Please use caution when listening. Karrah  00:16Yes, he retaliated and takes my weed mugshot, which is like hysterical because I got, I got pulled over with a little bit of weed one time and the smile, I smiled in the mug shot, because I was like, I'm gonna take advantage of this mug shot. And I'm like, I'm gonna smile. And like, I didn't even I didn't have to, like, put the clothes on or anything. I didn't have to like go behind bars or anything. He takes that mugshot and makes a he tries to get it put on a billboard. But nobody would do it for him, I guess. And he bought a website, know your neighbors dot biz or something like that. And puts my mug shot on there. But you can't tell it's a mug shot because I was smiling really big. And he put my face all over town and was warning neighbors about me. I got a call. At work. I start getting calls. And they're like, carry out your faces on signs around town. He put one by my daughter's school, which was also a violation of my protective order. I but they didn't. When I reported it as a violation. They didn't count it as one. They didn't count any of his violations as any as a violation. He did. And I found this out. This was like right before, this was in 2021. Right after he beat his wife number five. His house was on Zillow. And somebody sent me a link to his house. And I could see my face on the sign and this yard next to his house. In Iowa. Colleen McCarty  02:04Everything in life has a tipping point. No matter what, at some point, the way you've been living becomes too much and something has to get for Jim lumen. The tipping point came when he met Karrah. He didn't know that was the moment and neither did she. But the end of the relationship sparked a series of events that's almost too crazy to believe. Leslie Briggs  02:34In Episode Six, you heard the survivors accounts of abuse and harrowing detail. Karrah was the survivor who Jim took to Branson on their first date. They only dated for three weeks in October of 2014. Three weeks that would change both of their lives in immeasurable ways. The thing about Karrah is that she has a very fundamental and pronounced sense of what's right and wrong. There's no compromising, and there's no excuses. So when she found out about all the other women that Jim had abused, including the women who she was told to hate when she was dating, her basic humanity transcended all of the mental manipulation. And she began to reach out to them. She and Christen really became close and they bonded over what they went through. What happens when these women begin to organize is...

This week's episode is a break from the heavy story telling to ask the experts. Our expert panel features: Ashley Nix, Assistant District Attorney and Director of the Special Victim's Unit at the Tulsa County DA's OfficeXavier Graves, Executive Director of the Restorative Justice Institute of OklahomaDetective Amy Hall, Supervisor Family Violence Unit, Tulsa Police Department Aurelius Francisco, Co-Executive Director of Foundation for Liberating Minds Listen as they discuss the real on the ground realities of dealing with domestic violence in a state like Oklahoma, that has some of the highest rates of interpersonal violence in the country. 

The song in this episode is Nightmares by Keyland. Documents and Resources for this episode are available here: https://panic-button-episode-7-show-notes.tiiny.co   Episode 7 “Didn’t Think It Could Get Worse” follows the survivors of Jim Luman after their breakups. Nails in your driveway? DHS showing up at your house? A professional complaint filed on you at the Board of Nursing? The abuse never seems to end, even when you leave.   ______   TRANSCRIPT       Colleen McCarty  00:00 The contents of this episode includes topics that cover separation abuse and legal abuse as well as violence against women, and potentially bestiality. It's not suitable for children under 18.   Heather  00:21 So after I left him, he made a formal complaint to that I worked nursing. So I had to go and sit in front of the board and answer to everything that he said I did. There was a HIPAA concern, because I looked at his files, which I was consulting, so whatever, um, there was a, an accusation that I was guilty of Beast reality. There was, there's like six things. The number one thing that stands out is he said that I cut the GPS locator off of my state car. I left that office, I drove to our state garage, went to the mechanic and said, Tell me my GPS is working. He in fact, told me my GPS was gone. They looked back. My GPS was disabled in October. So he took that GPS off my car in October, I don't even know where the damping is, I wouldn't know how to take the thing off. So this was before we got married, that he cut this locator off.   Leslie Briggs  01:28 That was Heather, Jim's fourth wife. Extracting yourself from an abusive relationship is difficult, even when you have an incredible support system and everything falls in place. But with Jim, he makes every effort to interfere with manipulate and threaten other aspects of your life that make it much more difficult to leave. And with Heather, you can see he tried to get her nursing license taken away. It's a form of coercive control, post separation, abuse, Colleen Do you want to tell us what legal abuse and post separation abuse are?   Colleen McCarty  02:09 Yeah, so there are some kinds of abuse that are so covert and misunderstood even now that we're just as a society starting to build a language to even talk about them. And two of the types that are particularly prevalent in Jim's cases are legal abuse, also called litigation abuse, and the second one is post separation abuse or also called separation abuse. So firstly, legal abuse and domestic violence relationship refers to instances where the abuser is using the legal system to manipulate or exert control over their victim. And this can range from frivolous filings of lawsuits protective orders, falsely accusing the victim of crimes, manipulating custody agreements or arrangements and potentially withholding financial support. The abuser can use legal means to further isolate the victim from friends and family, such as by falsely obtaining protective orders, or making false complaints to government agencies like in our state, it's called DHS, like making child custody or saying that you're not parenting your child appropriately. Right. And then the second one host separation abuse is particularly in domestic violence relationship where the abuse continues after the victim leaves. And this can include harassing the victim through phone calls, text messages, social media, stalking, making face, sorry, making false accusations to friends, family, or law enforcement and using custody arrangements as a means of control. It's also like, using threats against someone's life, against their children's lives, threats or future violence to try to keep someone from leaving. Because we know that once someone does leave a relationship like

Panic Button, Season 2 Episode 6: Plenty of Fishhooks in the SeaThe music in this episode is Wicked Games by Desi and Cody. Show notes and resources are available at https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-6 Most true crime stories are about one of two things: solving a mystery, or learning about how you can avoid being killed. Women around the world have become consumed with true crime, to the point that some of our listeners have admitted to listening to true crime podcasts as they fall asleep–because it soothes them. Usually, you’re watching and listening to stories about killers who have either been killed or been put in prison–so they’re no longer an active threat. Killers like Jeffrey Dahmer or Jack the Ripper. We can pick apart their methods, study the psychology, and run scenarios in our minds of how we would get away, or how we would solve the crime. In truth, these kinds of sensational crimes represent less than 1% of murder crimes committed in the US. Far more common are women killed in domestic partner offenses. And even more common than those are women hurt and assaulted in domestic assaults. Oklahoma is ranked number two in the nation for the number of women killed by men. Twenty people per minute in the United States are physically assaulted by an intimate partner. Perhaps the reason we don’t tell these stories, and the reason they don’t make the true crime top 100 list is because these incidents are so common. They hit pretty close to home, especially in Oklahoma. It’s interesting that psychologically we would rather focus on the 1% of sensationalized murder cases than on the 99% of intimate partner violence cases that gum up every criminal docket in America. This episode is going to be tough. In a way I think we’ve been trying to protect our listeners from the particularly intimate and horrific details of Jim’s abuse. But here we are, it’s Episode 6, and we have to dive into the details of the domestic violence assaults that form the basis of this podcast.  ____________________________ TRANSCRIPTSPEAKERSHeather, Christen, Leslie Briggs, Rusty Shouse, Marci, Colleen McCarty, Karrah Leslie Briggs  00:00This episode contains graphic accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular, animal abuse, and language that is not suitable for listeners under 18 years of age. Please use caution when listening. So since starting this podcast, we have had lots of different people reach out to us with their thoughts, opinions, and just impressions about what we've done. Over the last five episodes, we've actually heard from a couple of people who I would call on Jim's side, people who believe that the things that we're saying are untrue, or not factual. And unfortunately, none of them are willing to go on the record, or provide us or they have yet to provide us with anything that we could look at to verify or even consider as something that would warrant us issuing a correction. But this is my message to everybody listening. If you have information that refutes the things that we're saying, if you can provide us with documentation or personal lived experience that we can corroborate or consider, we'll issue a correction if it's warranted, we've always been willing to do that. So you're a little frustrated. Colleen McCarty ...

The song featured in this episode is Street Light by Branjae. Season 2, episode 5 of Panic Button brings us face to face with the red flags in Jim’s relationships. Bringing dates to a graveyard? Talking about leaving your fiancé in a field to get eaten by animals? Following fetish accounts on Instagram? Going through your girlfriend’s phone? These are just some of the red flags the survivors who have dated Jim saw waving as the walls of their abusive relationships began to close in on them. Pictures and source documents available here: https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-5____________ TranscriptSPEAKERSKarrah, Tisha, Colleen McCarty, Jim Luman, Leslie Briggs, Kimber, Marci, Branjae, Operator, Christen, Heather Leslie Briggs  00:00This episode contains graphic accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular, and language that is not suitable for listeners under 18 years of age. We also discussed coercive control. So please use caution when listening. Tisha  00:16And you know, we sat and talked, you know, everything was good. And yeah, something in his little brain flipped after we left that's because we were already back to my house. You know, he was dropped me off. And yeah, it something triggered, and he showed up, bit me on my bit me on my cheek completely out of nowhere. I mean, when I say it's like you flip on a light switch. That's exactly what it what it is, you know, and I don't I really don't remember what happened other than we were talking. And the next thing I knew, I thought he was grabbing me to kiss me. And he grabbed me and said, my face, I have never had anyone like, nibble my face. This was straight up, I had teeth marks and a bruise, somebody was like, You need to call the cops. And I'm like, what for? What are they gonna do? Oh, you went out with this guy, one time and he bit you. Don't go out with him again. Kimber  01:11So when you start seeing red flags, acknowledge them and let it go before you really get hurt. It's too good to be true. It probably is too good to be true. Leslie Briggs  01:24Have you ever been in a relationship that seemed to be going so well? And then out of the blue? Your partner says or does something that goes up like flare in your mind? Was that a red flag? Does that mean I need to leave? Is that the last straw? Maybe it's just a bad day. When you are in relationship with an abusive person. The red flags come in many forms and those behaviors are deployed for different purposes. There are a million books and research papers on abuse and why people are abusive. The most recent research confirms that abuse is about control. And there are a lot of different tactics to get control over someone. Some of these tactics are minor and almost undetectable. Others are violent and scary. Colleen McCarty  02:11On last week's episode, we showed you what it was like to fall in love with Jim lumen. This week, we show you what happens when that love turns toxic. This is panic button, Operation Wildfire, and you're listening to Episode Five bloody red flags. I'm Colleen McCarty. Leslie Briggs  02:32And I'm Leslie Briggs. Colleen...

Our first bonus episode this season features an interview with Forrest Smith. Forrest ran for sheriff of Pawnee County in 2010. He hired Jim Luman, the subject of this podcast, to help him with his campaign. Forrest opens up about his experiences with Jim and the aftermath of a separate assault against a woman named Brandi. Forrest also speaks about the system's response to domestic violence, and the tragic consequences that happen when we don't get it right.

The song played in this episode is "Getaway" by Bandelier. To access pictures, maps, and other sources, click here: https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-4Welcome to the newest episode of Panic Button: Operation Wildfire. This is Episode 4: Not Hard to Fall in Love.Last week, we told you about Jim's professional life and a little bit about what was going on in his life while he was also simultaneously physically and sexually abusing numerous victims. This week, it's all about the love, baby. Anyone who's ever fallen in love will tell you that falling in love can depend a lot on where you are in life, and what you've gone through and how you perceive yourself. Sure, it matters a lot what the other person is like, if you're attracted to them, and how you interact together. But if you're in a particularly emotional or vulnerable place in your life, like if you've just had a painful breakup, or a divorce, or if you've just lost someone--falling in love can make you vulnerable._____________PB S2:E4 Not Hard to Fall in Love (Transcript)SPEAKERSColleen McCarty, Karrah, Heather, Marci, Leslie Briggs, Christen Leslie Briggs  00:00This episode contains graphic accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular, and language that is not suitable for listeners under 18 years of age. Other themes that you may hear in the following episode deal with suicide and addiction. Please use caution when listening.  Finally, we've heard from some people who were at the high school at this time that Dawn and Jim were not really high school sweethearts, but they did end up having a son and getting married. We also want to make it clear that the two women who shared the conversations Jim had with them about necrophilia were doing just that, sharing topics of discussion that Jim brought up. No one has ever come forward to allege that Jim actually did have sex with a dead body and that they have some proof. As Colleen and I stated in episode three, we have no opinion on whether or not he ever committed necrophilia and we would rather not think about it now on to our regularly scheduled episode. Karrah  01:38Here also you didn't want to be like the others you wanted to be in the beginning was his big thing was he wanted you wanted to be his unicorn. It's like he had this.... one of the first things he asked me was, "Are you my unicorn?" and he, for some reason, you wanted to be his fucking unicorn, you wanted to be that cool girl that could hang out and be cool and watch him do his millionaire business deals. You know, you wanted to be that girl. Leslie Briggs  02:14Last week, we told you about Jim's professional life and a little bit about what was going on in his life. While he was also simultaneously physically and sexually abusing numerous victims. This week. It's all about the love, baby. Anyone who's ever fallen in love will tell you that falling in love can depend a lot on where you are in life, and what you've gone through and how you perceive yourself. Sure, it matters a lot what the other person is like, if you're attracted to them, and how you interact together. But if you're in a particularly emotional or vulnerable place in your life, like if you've just had a painful breakup, or a divorce, or if you've just lost someone falling in love can make you vulnerable, or if you've had a traumatic childhood, if you're abused or belittled as a child, or if you have particular insecurities about your body...

Serial Somethin’: Jim grew up to be a serial entrepreneur, have serial marriages and engage in a serial pattern of prolific abuse. Often using our courts as a tool to carry out that abuse. Jim's professional, and personal life are part of what makes him interesting and enigmatic for the women who go on to love and then eventually leave him. He's a sort of most interesting man in the world type of character when you first meet him. Or if you look at it from another lens he learned about how to become a serial fraudster from his father, and never looked back. You can find the court records and sources for this episode at https://www.panicbuttonpodcast.com/season-2-operation-wildfire/episode-3 ____SPEAKERSJosh Kidd, Colleen McCarty, Donna, Leslie Briggs, Heather, Jim Luman, Newscaster, Tisha, Christen Colleen McCarty  00:00This episode contains graphic accounts of domestic and sexual violence, violence against women in particular, and language that is not suitable for listeners 18 and under. There are also discussions of necrophilia. Please use caution when listening, Donna  00:16my energy never vibed with his energy. There was just something about him that was dark, you know, you know how you know, but you don't know how you know why they've done anything at all for that man. I mean, besides just stepping on the risks, why is it hard that the evidence is there if that had been a man, he had done that too. They would have had him on assault and battery when we didn't have What's so hard about that. He's an awful man. Our justice system system is a reason that women are killed every day. Men like him, man like him that get off, repeat offenders that get off. I could walk in a Walmart and take something and then give me more than what they've ever given Jim and I've looked at his record. Colleen McCarty  01:11That was Jim's old landlord, Donna. She learned firsthand what an expert manipulator Jim Luman is, particularly when it comes to court proceedings like an eviction. Donna's struggled to get him out of her home in 2014. When Donna leased the property to Jim she had no idea what kind of person she was dealing with. Like so many others who have done business with Jim, she learned the hard way that he is ruthless, maniacal and an expert manipulator. Leslie Briggs  01:41Jim's behavior in Donna's home and throughout the eviction proceedings, evidence a person who is willing to use the courts and manipulate their inefficiencies to his advantage in a serial fashion. Jim grew up to be a serial entrepreneur, have serial marriages and engage in a serial pattern of prolific abuse. Often using our courts as a tool to carry out that abuse. Jim's professional, and personal life are part of what makes him interesting and enigmatic for the women who go on to love and then eventually leave him. He's a sort of most interesting man in the world type of character when you first meet him. Or if you look at it from another lens he learned about how to become a serial fraudster from his father, and never looked back. Every narcissistic abuser has one thing in common charisma and charm. To the naked eye. Jim doesn't look like anything more than just a country boy from Oklahoma. Even though everything he does is an attempt to set himself apart from that. With Jim, there's always something else going on a new scheme, a new job, a new woman a new trip. Just join him for a while on this cruise called life. But how long before you get the rug pulled out from under you