AJR: The Writing Secrets Behind TikTok's Viral Sounds | How I Write

I interviewed Jack and Ryan from AJR, the band that has built one of the most original voices in modern music. We talked about how they use humor and vulnerability to write songs that connect on a deeper level, why embarrassment is often the best creative compass, how Broadway and magic inspire their live shows, and what they’ve learned about navigating TikTok, streaming, and the new economics of the music industry. We also explored their thoughts on AI, why imperfection makes art feel authentic, and how they’ve grown from writing dorm-room party songs to filling arenas around the world. If you want to understand the future of music, create art that’s both playful and profound, or learn how to stay true to yourself in a world driven by algorithms, this conversation will give you a rare inside look at the creative process of AJR. 00:00:00 The truth in music 00:09:41 Embarrassment as creative fuel 00:20:05 Context is everything 00:29:24 From 2D to 3D songwriting 00:39:36 Live shows as the real artwork 00:49:42 Truth, AI, and the future of music 00:59:41 Haters, resilience, and regret-proof songs 01:09:27 Writing a thousand bad songs 01:18:58 Partnership and balance 01:28:32 Themes, loss, and the arc of Maybe Man Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Every so often, I’ll re-publish one of my favorite How I Write episodes. This classic episode is with Steven Pressfield, the author of more than 25 books who speaks as beautifully about the creative process as he writes. He waded through 27 years of Resistance so you don’t have to. Come learn his best practices for doing your best work. TIMESTAMPS: 00:00:00 Intro 00:00:40 Your career in writing 00:07:00 Writing rough drafts 00:11:10 Copywriting 00:13:20 Hemingway 00:14:20 The Legend of Bagger Vance 00:18:40 Fiction vs Non-fiction 00:19:15 Storytelling advice 00:29:20 Editing your work 00:40:55 Discipline in writing 00:43:45 Villains in writing 01:02:45 How Steven started writing 01:05:15 Robert Greene 01:08:50 Tim Ferriss 01:12:00 60 scenes method 01:13:20 Writing styles 01:20:20 Make your heroes suffer 01:23:55 Steven Pressfield's new book "The Daily Pressfield" Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I interviewed Jimmy Soni, who is currently writing a book about Kobe Bryant. He spent six years on his previous book about the origin story of PayPal and has mastered the art of investigative biography. We talked about his 4am writing routine, how he blends research and writing to battle writers block, why he finds the best stories by talking to people on the periphery, his thoughts on using AI as a writing tool, and his experience creating a new publishing company. If you're interested in writing better non-fiction, doing deeper research, or finding the stories everyone else misses, this conversation will show you exactly how to do that. Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I interviewed John Lennox, the Oxford mathematician who's spent decades bridging science and faith. We talked about why John 1:1 reveals we live in a word-based universe, how to recognize God-breathed scripture, why scientific explanations don't exclude God, and his fascinating take on AI as humanity's attempt to "make God." He also shared practical writing advice about self-criticism and why young people struggle with metaphors. If you're curious about how faith and reason work together, or worried about what AI means for humanity's future, this conversation will challenge how you think about both. Enjoy! 00:00:00 Why John 1:1 Reveals a Word-Based Universe 00:09:30 How to Know Scripture Is God-Breathed 00:17:40 Why Scientific Explanations Don't Exclude God 00:23:24 Why Style Is As Important As Substance 00:29:29 How to Balance Argument and Self-Criticism 00:33:35 How Narrow vs General AI Create Different Risks 00:41:40 Why the AI Race Is About Making God 00:46:02 How AI Changes What It Means to Be Human 00:52:47 How Christians Can Lead in AI Ethics Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I interviewed Henrik Karlsson, a writer who's developed a five-step method for writing that starts with exploring without pressure and ends with crafting the opening last, after everything else is done. We talked about why looking away from the page improves your writing, how to suck reality into your descriptions, why protecting young ideas from early critique matters, and how to access pre-linguistic mental states where the best ideas live. He shared strange experiments that actually work, why breaking grammar rules improves your voice, and how writing becomes a search query for finding your perfect audience. If you want to write with more depth, develop your authentic voice, and learn how to turn mental chaos into compelling essays, this conversation will show you exactly how. Enjoy! Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I interviewed Jayne Anne Phillips, who won the Pulitzer Prize for fiction for her novel Night Watch. We dug into passages from her writing that will show you how she thinks about voice, character, and the poetry of great writing. As you listen, I want you to notice something: pay attention to how many times Jane describes writing as a full-bodied experience. She sees the creative process almost like an archaeologist would, feeling her way into the hidden and mysterious world of her own novel. Now that sounds fascinating, but how do you actually do that? Well, that's what this interview is all about. Enjoy! Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I interviewed Rosanne Cash, a 4-time Grammy winner who's been writing songs for over 40 years. She's mastered something most writers struggle with: turning raw emotion into beautiful, lasting songs. She writes songs like a painter, starting with visual images, and brings the same rhythmic approach to both music and prose. We talked about how to turn pain into art, why anger and grief are powerful creative forces, how to deconstruct great songs to learn from masters like Bob Dylan, and how to develop your authentic voice through decades of deliberate practice. If you want to write with more emotional depth and turn life's difficulties into meaningful art, this conversation will show you how. Enjoy! 00:00:00 Why Great Writers Love Language Early 00:07:47 When to Ask for Feedback on Songs 00:14:46 How to Deconstruct Songs Like Bob Dylan 00:21:25 How to Study Different Songwriting Traditions 00:25:19 Why Truth Should Drive Your Creative Work 00:31:11 Why You Must Master Rhyme Schemes First 00:35:13 How to Use Anger as Creative Fuel 00:42:15 Why Emotions Are Invitations for Discovery 00:50:56 How Your Voice Changes Over Your Career 00:56:06 How Songs Start as Visual Images 01:01:25 Why Music Survives When Everything Else Dies 01:05:48 The Dream That Changed Everything About Art Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I interviewed David Whyte, a poet who has mastered the art of turning life's deepest experiences into beautiful writing. We talked about how to write from the place where your inner world meets the outer world, why difficult emotions like grief and anger are actually forms of care, how memorizing poetry changes how you experience reality, and practical techniques for developing deeper attention. If you want to write more authentically, develop a stronger presence, or learn to find beauty in ordinary moments, this conversation will give you specific tools to do that. Hey! I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible. Follow me Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel X: https://x.com/david_perell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices