Staying Aggressive in the Sharky and Spicy with Rob Dickinson

Pete Wagner was building proprietary software to customize golf clubs when he bought a pair of skis in the early 2000s. The mechanical engineer and computer scientist wrestled those skis for a season before realizing he had purchased the wrong skis for his style. Why wasn’t anyone designing skis like he was designing golf clubs or like boot fitters adjusted ski boots? In 2006, the expert skier launched Wagner Custom Skis with an exploratory questionnaire that helps skier identify their dream skis and software that guides a warehouse full of machines in building those skis.  Nearly 20 years later, Wagner’s team of 15 ski builders in Telluride are crafting skis built precisely for individuals taking their skiing to the next level. Tune in to hear Pete's riff on ski design and the manufacturing process, trends in ski designs, and how a customized ski - like a custom-fit ski boot — can improve your every minute on snow.   Topics:  1:00 - A background in material science and design software for golf  6:00 - Buying the wrong skis. How come no one is focusing on fit like in golf and cycling?  7:10 - 2006 launch of Wagner Skis with “rapid prototyping” software  8:00 - How custom ski boot fitters inspired the Wagner business plan  13::40 - Building a database of ski designs  16:00 - Customization for beginner and intermediate skiers  18:00 - Optimizing ski design with 2,500 different material combinations  19:00 - Versatility for beginners  23:00 - Ski design trends in the mid-2000s to now  25:00 - Adding rocker to the tip and tail with camber underfoot  27:10 - Matching individuals to skis  28:20 - Manufacturing without molds  36:00 - Repeat customers and changing designs as skiers refine their demands  Quotes:  “A ski that has the right flex pattern and stiffness, the benefit of that is that it will be stiff enough to give you good stability if you’re going fast.” - Pete Wagner   “The business model of the big companies is not about customization or agility. Their business model is that they go out in the late winter and spring, get people to try their next year’s models, collect orders, mass produce stuff throughout the spring and summer, and then deliver them to the shop in the fall.” - Pete Wagner   “What we realized is that you can keep things simple.” - Pete Wagner   “Skiing has a lot to offer people. There are different things you can focus on and that’s what makes it such a great activity and way to spend your time. And that’s our goal.” - Pete Wagner   Resources: Wagner Custom Skis 

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Willie Volckhausen started skiing when he was 2 and raced with Sunlight's local ski club for over a decade. He spent 18 years coaching young skiers with the Aspen Valley Ski Club, developing not just ripping racers but athletes with a lifelong passion for skiing. And now he’s a ski instructor with the Aspen Ski School who spends his summers working his family’s farm near Paonia. Over his decades of being coached and coaching, Willie’s picked up more than a few techniques for improving our turns. Listen in and hear Willie talk about critical drills, his description of the best coach in the world, how farming has informed his skiing and when to find the perfect turn.   Topics:  1:00: 18 years skiing with the Bad News Bears of ski racing at Ski Sunlight  3:10: Transitioning to alpine racing coach for U12s for the Aspen Valley Ski and Snowboard Club  6:20: Balancing performance and victory with sustaining a passion for skiing  7:00: The best year for winning at Aspen Valley Ski Club wasn’t about the podiums  10:10: No pedestals for elite skiers  12:10: What coaching and young racers taught him about skiing  16:00: “Skiing is the easy part” about being a ski instructor  17:00: Standing on the outside ski  19:40: The up and over drill  20:20: The best coach in the world “should be totally deaf and totally mute.”  26:00: How learning patience through farming helps with skiing  30:50: How can you identify the perfect turn? Wait.  Quotes:  “Ski racing is an individual sport that is dominated by teams.” - Willie Volckhausen  “It’s not all about that one person. Only one person’s gonna win and there’s ten of us. So what are the other nine kids supposed to do the day that so-and-so wins the race? That’s what we focused on a lot.” - Willie Volckhausen  “Coaches and mentors have that opportunity every day to not put their elite athletes on a pedestal. The kids who win know they’re good. They know they’re going to win again. They know they’re expected to win. I think that’s some of the worst pressure we could possibly put on junior athletes.” - Willie Volckhausen  “If you tuck and roll, get your feet back below you, and you stand up without ever stopping, technically that's not a crash; that’s a ground trick.” - Willie Volckhausen     Resources:  Willie’s Instagram  Wagner Custom Skis 

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Brody Leven doesn’t dabble. He’s an all-in type of skier. When he decided he was done with park skiing, he moved from 100 days of high-flying park time every season to 100 days of climbing and skiing mountains. And now it’s been 10 years since the Fischer Ski-sponsored athlete has ridden a chairlift. He’s never eaten meat. During the pandemic, he started exercising outside every day. Now he’s more than four years in without missing a single day. He’s a lifelong vegetarian, a vehement climate advocate, and, as he says, “obsessed with ideas and doing things that are hard.” Tune in and hear Brody talk about growing up skiing in Ohio, his pursuit of untracked sno,w and his evolution into one of the world’s top ski mountaineers who considers his skiing outside the traditional definitions used by both pro skiers and ski mountaineers.   Topics:  1:10: An after-school ski program in Ohio.  4:00: Moving to Salt Lake City in 2005 for the skiing  12:10: Going from 100 days in the park to 100 days in the backcountry.  14:20: Ten years without riding lifts.  15:40: Principled skiing.  24:00: Perfecting turns without ever skiing on a groomer.  28:30: Climbing and skiing peaks in Uganda, Romania and Georgia.  30:10: The “thief of credibility” in the culture of ski mountaineering.  36:00: The light and fast ethos in ski mountaineering.  41:00: Jumping into exercising outside every day  49:00: Tackling climate change is like coming to a mountain with lots of little steps.  Quotes:  “When you're back there, you're listening to what the mountains are telling you and what your intuition is telling you and the frequency with which you do it, you know, getting out there so regularly and, you know, kind of higher risk terrain, you develop that fluency, right? And you push yourself to a spot where you have an intuitive fluency.” Jason Blevins  “I'm not like a woo-woo person, I'm very logical. And so when I say the essence of skiing, I do not mean that in any sort of woo-woo way. I mean, literally, it's how you move around the mountain on skis.” Brody Leven  “There's this culture of doing cool things and being quiet about it but secretly hoping other people hype you up in the parking lots. And like that's, it's just so weird for me. It's uncomfortable for me. I don't know. So I hype it up myself because I get back and I'm proud of it that part of my job is letting people know what I've done.” Brody Leven  “In hindsight, I didn't know it at the time, but I think in hindsight, finding that consistency was some way of having control over such an otherwise out-of-our-control situation. And so much of my life seems to lack that control.” Brody Leven  Resources:  brodyleven.com  Wagner Custom Skis     

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Unless you live in Crested Butte, you likely haven’t heard about Rob Dickinson. He’s a former big mountain competitor who moves like a ninja through the Butte’s scary steps. You really only catch glimpses of Rob … a flash in the trees, a splash of snow on a rocky face, a blur beneath impeccable tracks. He’s coming up on 20 years skiing Crested Butte and is one of the mountain’s handful of inspirational soul skiers.   Rob doesn’t have a sponsor. He runs his own painting business. But he’s got skills and style for miles. Tune in and hear the 45-year-old Rob riff on how CBMR has honed his skiing, how to ride the clutch in technical terrain, and why you should never drop your uphill hand in gnarly steeps.  Topics:  2:20: From upstate New York to New Hampshire to Steamboat  4:15: Crested Butte keeps you honest  7:10: Ride the clutch to stay fluid in technical terrain  11:10: Competing in big mountain comps from 2009 through 2014 with a CB shred posse  18:30: Injuries, replacing body parts, and shifting your mindset   24:15: How steep creek kayaking hones ski skills, risk assessment  26:10: Taking vanity out of the equation.  28:00: Check in with yourself  31:00: Finding happiness in healthy, sustainable places  33:00: Gear adjustments and added protection for steep skiing  36:30: Don’t change anything on race day  37:30: Play, don’t work, in the ski industry  Photo credit: Garrett Grove  Quotes:  “All I did was chase skiing and kind of got the feeling that maybe I was chasing skiing from too far away.” - Rob Dickinson  “Trying to get better and trying to pull better results at, at freeskiing competitions, like, you just learn how to, I always say, ride the clutch, learn how to instead of like jamming on the brakes to see what's coming next.” - Rob Dickinson  “Crosstraining is really, really valuable.” - Rob Dickinson  “You have to steel  your mind and  you have to make yourself present and you have to check in with yourself.” - Rob Dickinson    Resources:  Precise Painting CB  Wagner Custom Skis   

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Lou Dawson is a ski pioneer who has been setting the skintrack for countless skiers for decades. Since he arrived in the Roaring Fork Valley as a teenager in the mid-1960s, Dawson has helped shape backcountry skiing. From being the first person to ski all of Colorado’s 14ers — finishing in the early 1990s — to meticulously documenting nearly every technological advancement in ski gear, Dawson has shepherded backcountry skiing from its nascent roots in the 1970s to today’s global juggernaut. His recent memoir, Avalanche Dreams, traces his life from a hard-charging skier to a thoughtful father, husband, and alpinist.   Tune in to hear Lou talk about his first ski tour, the 1982 avalanche that nearly killed him, leaning on his spirituality, penning more than 3,000 posts at his WildSnow.com site, the evolution of touring gear, and the art of setting a skintrack. Topics:  2:30: Life in Aspen in the 60s as a teenager with hippie parents.  7:40: First-ever touring up to Conundrum Hot Springs at age 16.  9:40: The “radical sensibility” of progressive adventurers in Colorado  10:50: The 1982 avalanche in Aspen Highlands Bowl.  13:40: The Peter Pan Syndrome challenges many ski town men.   16:10: The spiritual awakening after the avalanche.  19:00: Finishing all the Colorado 14ers in 1991.  20:40: Writing posts for Wild Snow, tinkering and modifying backcountry gear.  24:50: The role of alpine tech bindings in ski mountaineering.  26:40: How gear and improved education have helped protect backcountry skiers.  35:40: North American versus European skin tracks.  36:40: “A beautiful combination of technology and athletic ability and a mystical awareness of the environments and the mountains.”  40:40: The fun of low-angle touring  Photo credit: Lou Dawson skis Long's Peak in 1990. Photo by Glenn Randall    Quotes:  “I started on wooden Bonna skis without edges and I literally would take those up and go powder skiing on those things back behind Aspen Mountain and places like that.” - Lou Dawson  “The difference between the 60-something millimeter skis we were skiing back in the 1970s and 80s with these with say an 80-millimeter ski or a 90-millimeter ski is like night and day.” - Lou Dawson  “In a lot of ski posses, people would look at you and think, ‘Well, I wish he or she had taken an avalanche course.’ And, you know, the avalanche course might not serve you to be able to predict whether a slope is safe or not, but it just makes you more aware of the danger.” - Lou Dawson  “I've always applied my craft to just anything I do. And I think one of the crafts of ski touring is the skin track. It's how you create it.” - Lou Dawson     Resources:  Avalanche Dreams  WildSnow.com  Wagner Custom Skis     

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Mike Hattrup has moved from bump skiing boss, to ski movie star to gear designer, covering smooch ground on snow that his work has touched just about every skier in the sport. From chasing his four siblings on the slopes of Alpental to winning mogul medals to hanging with Stump, Schmidt, and Blake in the seminal “Blizzards of Aahhh’s” to building backcountry skis and gear for top ski shops, Hattrup’s career has covered a lot of ground. Today, he’s the director of skiing for Eleven Experience, helping folks plunder powder in Alaska, British Columbia, Chile, Colorado, France, and Iceland. Listen in as Mike traces his extraordinary career from pro skier to guide to gear builder.  Topics:  3:05: Growing up skiing during the freestyle rage of the 1970s  4:00: Athleticism of mogul skiing  6:30: Training for mogul competitions  10:00 Filming with Greg Stump in “Time Waits for Snowman” in 1985  11:20: Filming “Blizzard of Aahhh’s” in Europe  14:00: Why “Blizzard” resonated so deeply with skiers  16:00: Moving over to K2, helping the company transition from race  22:50: The emergence of the transformative K2 Four  26:00: Moving into telemark ski design, flexible ski boots, and backcountry gear  34:00: Working at Kastle, Fisher, Black Diamond, Marmot  40:30: AMGA guiding on Mount Rainier  46:00: Improving through technique as we age  Quotes:  “I never thought that skiing was a career. Not like now, I mean, you can go be a film skier, right? But back then it really wasn't an option.” - Maike Hattrup  “We'll for sure look back on that era from early to mid-90s to the mid-2000s as the golden era of ski design.” - Maike Hattrup  “I learned to tele purely from a touring standpoint.” - Maike Hattrup  “In terms of fitness, that certainly becomes more of a challenge as you get older and I think you just gotta find a way to, I mean, find a way to keep training and make it fun.” - Maike Hattrup  Resources:  Maike Hattrup, LinkedIn  Maike Hattrup, Instagram  Eleven  Wagner Custom Skis 

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Amie Engerbretson grew up ripping Palisades Tahoe, the daughter of a pro skier and filmmaker. She has starred in dozens of ski movies, highlighting a grace and flow honed from years of training as a dancer. Now she’s making her own movies, advocating for climate action, and helping women hone confidence on and off snow. Tune in and hear Amie about how dancing influences her skiing, how films can reveal the emotional challenges and rewards of skiing, and how to foster confidence for improving our time on snow.   Topics:  1:20: Pro skiing is the family business.  6:10: Grace, rhythm, and flow.  7:20: Years of competitive dance influencing skiing.  10:00: Dance, skiing, and filmmaking as performance art  11:00: “Hypocrite” and “Blue Hour” ski films revealing “the full gamut of emotions in the human experience.”  12:20: The changing business of ski films as storytelling.  13:10: Advocacy work with Protect Our Winters.  14:20: “Knowing it’s OK to be scared and do something anyway because it’s important.”  17:00: Life happens in the in-between; savoring the moment of transition between turns.  19:40: How skiing changes as we grow.  21:30: Being mindful of the choices you make as an individual.  23:00: The wisdom of Roy Kent in “Ted Lasso.”  26:10: The power of the ski community.  29:30: The importance of recovery days in training regimens.  30:00: Ski camps for women at Palisades Tahoe  31:00: Growing confidence through mind-body connections  Quotes:  “I was super into dance and ballet also when I was younger and both ski racing and ballet became quite serious and intensive to the point where they kind of have to become your only thing at some point.” - Amie Engerbretson  “What I'm doing is telling stories, trying to somehow communicate the joy and the ineffable awesomeness of skiing to people through a screen or through a photo or something like that. That's my job is, in a way, it is like a performance, like a ski performance, like a film strip is performing, I think.” - Amie Engerbretson  “What I do as an individual absolutely matters, but the most important thing I can do as an individual is be part of a collective. To change the system so that then all of us as individuals can make better choices in that system.” - Amie Engerbretson  “What I've learned as an athlete is to understand my fear, understand when it's rational, irrational, all those things, but also know that it's okay to be scared and do something way because it's important and you want it.” - Amie Engerbretson  Resources:  Amie Engerbretson Official Website  Wagner Custom Skis 

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis. Today’s guest is Kristen Ulmer, who is one of the most accomplished big mountain skiers ever. She is now a fear and anxiety expert, helping her clients overcome disabling confusion or chaos. After studying Zen concepts for more than a decade, she authored “The Art of Fear” as a guidebook for improved mindfulness. Her three-day Fear Ski Camps at Alta are renowned for helping skiers improve their athletic performance and bury the fear and anxiety that can hinder, not just skiing, but living. Take her Fear and Anxiety Assessment on her website.  Her decades-long reign as one of the top female skiers in the world has transferred over to expertise in helping people foster stronger mindsets, find flow states, and improve their health and happiness.   Topics:  2:00: First full season skiing in Little Cottonwood Canyon after growing up in New Hampshire  4:00: Skiing all day, working in banquets at the Cliff Lodge, competing in moguls comps  5:00: Transitioning from moguls to big-mountain in the early 90s  6:20: “No girls were doing that back then.”  7:50: Studying the Eastern approach to fear and readjusting relationships with fear  09:45: Finding flow state through fear. “We are stronger together than apart”  11:50: Interviews with top action sports athletes  16:00: The problem with resisting fear  18:25: Intimacy with fear manifests as focus  21:30: Performance-enhancing relationships with fear  27:40: Ski camps at Alta  34:50: Three themes in why we love skiing  Quotes:  “I was just trying to hang out with friends and have a good time with friends and go on the trips with them. And I really didn’t have any goals in skiing, but the next thing you know, I wound up on the US ski team for moguls.” - Kristen Ulmer  “We probably should define that [extreme sports] mean that the consequences of failure are death or injury. That’s what makes something extreme.” - Kristen Ulmer  “What he has is, he has a willingness to feel fear. He’s young, hungry, and talented. He’s stepping 4% out of his comfort zone every day, connecting the dots. This is how y ou become better at anything.” - Kristen Ulmer   Resources:  Kristen’s Instagram  Kristen’s Website  Wagner Custom Skis 

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis!   A few years ago I got to join Kim Beekman on a ski trip to the San Juans. We skied at and around Telluride and all over Red Mountain Pass. I don’t think she ever wondered why everyone always wanted to ski those backcountry lines before her. It was because we all wanted to get down and watch her ski.   Few ski with more grace, ease, and power than Kim. She is a flawless skier. And an incredible writer. As the editor at Skiing and a longtime ski journalist, she has shepherded years of ski reviews, charting the evolution of ski design for decades. She’s raised an amazing daughter who rips and has all sorts of insights into making the most of our time on snow. Tune in and learn from a master.   Thanks for listening to Next Level Skiing. Topics:  3:40 Growing up chasing her older brother  2:50 The secret sauce of being a good skier: having a ripping older sibling  3:55 Honing her writing chops at the Jackson Hole Guide in the 1990s  6:36 What makes a good ski story?  7:50 Her new children’s book about Hilaree Nelson  11:10 The emergence of rocker and shape in skis  18:30 Her favorite ski designs  21:50 Raising young rippers. Candy bribery.  26:00 When ski skills spill over into life  30:30 Hands up!    Resources:  Kimberly Beekman  Wagner Custom Skis 

Welcome back to the Next Level Skiing podcast, brought to you by Wagner Skis.   I love watching Aaron Blunck ski the pipe. The Crested Butte native has spent 26 of his 27 years on skis and it shows, with amazing airs and unrivaled style. Earlier this season I got to see Aaron ski in the Copper pipe and he was throwing this ridiculously cool pipe-grinding, snow-spraying slash in the middle of his run, and the crowd loved it.  This is a fun chat with the three-time Olympian who grew up dreaming of competing in the X Games, which he won in 2017. He spent his younger years chasing his older brother Nolan around the steeps of Crested Butte Mtn Resort, where he honed his aerial prowess in gnarly cliffs and trees.  Listen and learn from one of Colorado’s best as Aaron shares insights into bouncing back from injuries, the relentless pursuit of new challenges in skiing, celebrating every turn, and embracing gratitude on snow. Thanks for listening to Next Level Skiing.  Topics:  2:00 - Copper performance  4:49 - Skiing at 18 months  5:24 - Chasing his older brother  7:21 - Unlocking a new wave of younger rippers at Crested Butte  9:10 - Big mountain laps with pipe and terrain park to finish  11:00 - Still living the dream  13:40 - Not just skiing: hockey, baseball, soccer  17:25 - Pay to play: injuries and recovery  22:00 - Mind over matter to bounce back from injuries  24:24 - Overcoming the life-changing injury  26:00 - Why not go skiing?  28:00 - This is my purpose  30:00 - Never stop learning new things  32:00 - Little-kid cruising and embracing gratitude  Resources:  Aaron Blunck Instagram  Wagner Custom Skis