40: Kayvon Tehranian & Sebastian Sanchez—Digital Art Post Boom with Peter Bauman

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/melanie-lenz-generativity-and-vera-molnar-at-the-va In this episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with Melanie Lenz, Curator of Digital Art at the V&A, about Vera Molnár and Degrees of Disruption: Vera Molnar and Generative Art, her display at V&A South Kensington, open until May 2027.They follow Molnár's practice per the show's layout. It goes from her early geometric paintings in Paris through the machine imaginaire, her first access to a computer in 1968 and decades of plotter work. Lenz explains how the display draws on the V&A's computer art holdings, including the Computer Arts Society and Patric Prince collections, and why it closes with contemporary artists such as Casey Reas, Harm van den Dorpel, Licia He, William Mapan and Entangled Others.They also discuss how museums show the process behind computer art, the stigma around artists who work with machines, and why Lenz avoids the word "pioneer."Read our editorial, Degrees of Disruption: Vera Molnár at the V&AThe display runs at V&A South Kensington until 30 May 2027, free: https://www.vam.ac.uk/exhibitions/degrees-of-disruption-vera-molnar-and-generative-art Also in this episode: François Molnár, Degrees of Disruption, Groupe de Recherche d'Art Visuel (GRAV), Charles Csuri, Sougwen Chung, John Cage, Cybernetic Serendipity, François Morellet, Gottfried Jäger, Julio Le ParcRead next: Molnár's ParisListen next: Ep. 17, Digital Curators Series 01—Douglas Dodds on Collecting and Valuing Emerging Technologies, Ep. 5, Timeline Ch 4—Digital Era Pt II (1960s) with Michael SpalterOn the Living Timeline: Vera Molnár Develops Her “Machine Imaginaire” (1959), Vera Molnár Begins her Computer Art Phase with the Interruptions Series (1968)Chapters 📖:00:00 Introduction01:31 Why Vera Molnár, why now05:12 Disruption as a way of life07:31 Paris and the output space11:25 Rules, art history and the art world14:39 GRAV, François and agency18:31 Entangled Others and generative AI23:51 Showing the process27:43 The machine imaginaire30:55 Getting the computer33:43 Generative principles today37:36 Rules and learned models41:51 The P word44:37 Stories still to tell

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/ai-psychosis-summit-macy-gettles-quasimatt-and-kevin-esherickIn this episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with Macy Gettles, Quasimatt and Kevin Esherick about the community around the AI Psychosis Summit that took place in Downtown NYC, April 30, 2026.They cover the origins of the community, from a memey, joke tweet to a packed Chinatown DIY community gathering. It's a scene where devs make art and artists ship products, where the point is the community rather than any individual art object. They also discuss managing AI euphoria with backlash, slop discourse and whether New York is over as Josh Kline's October article suggested.Read Kevin's Monday Editorial with us, What Was the AI Psychosis Summit??Also in this episode: Anthropic, Basel Social ClubListen next: Ep. 44, Figure31—Discussing and Demonstrating DEL with Peter Bauman, Ep. 38, 2025 Art in Review with thefunnyguys, Conrad House & Peter BaumanChapters 📖:00:00 What was the AI Psychosis Summit?05:04 How AI showed up in the work11:30 Facing the anti-AI backlash16:58 Cottagecore, aesthetics and slop25:08 The image in 2026. Process vs. concept28:03 AI psychosis, defined36:36 Founding myth: a joke tweet38:23 The Kline essay: is New York art over?46:50 Scene tech and the Shake app53:07 'What's next' and where to find everyone

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/figure31-discussing-and-demonstrating-delIn this special video episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with artist Loucas Braconnier (Figure31). They discuss DEL, a two-year project that began life as a terminal-based C application with a "Grim Reaper" persona before becoming a browser-native work. It consists of globular "bodies for the Ethereum network" rendered in real time as ASCII art. They go over Braconnier's path into blockchain art and his attraction to work that evolves over time, the discipline of building for longevity, and a wider conversation about how AI and new tools shift the artist's focus from technical skill toward conceptual intent. In the second half, Braconnier gives a live demo of the work and a visual walk-through, showing how its entities express network data through behaviors like twirling, meditating, or trying to escape the viewport.Monday's Editorial: Jakob Kudsk Steensen on Non-Human Pathways Also in this episode: Rafaël Rozendaal, ArtforumRead next: Rafaël Rozendaal on a Liquid CanvasListen next: Ep. 45, AI Psychosis Summit—Macy Gettles, quasimatt and Kevin Esherick with Peter Bauman, Ep. 30, Parker Ito—Understanding the World through Images with Peter BaumanChapters 📖00:00 — Introduction: meet Loucas Braconnier (Figure31) and the work01:02 — Finding blockchain: the spark that drew him to Ethereum03:02 — Why blockchain: what it brings to art that evolves over time05:30 — Sculpture Garden & "Traveler": protocol art and the contract's inner space09:38 — How DEL relates: dialogue with and departure from his earlier work15:19 — On-chain & longevity: immutability, repairability, committing to the future18:22 — Two years of work: from a terminal "Grim Reaper" agent to the browser22:07 — Bodies for Ethereum: liveliness, behaviors, giving voice to the network25:53 — Live demo: walking through the main collection28:58 — Reading behavior: behavior modes and the 3D object behind the ASCII30:41 — Browser as space: native viewing, reproduction, and the original34:35 — The data readouts: exposing configuration, logs, and block hashes40:10 — Owner tuning: editing parameters and giving away control44:57 — Custom sites: bespoke builds over marketplace platforms51:00 — AI and making: technical skill versus conceptual intent56:02 — Closing: final reflections and what comes next

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/new-york-frieze-week-michael-connor-regina-harsanyi-and-karyn-nakamuraIn this episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with Regina Harsanyi (Associate Curator of Media Arts at the Museum of the Moving Image), Michael Connor, Executive Director of Rhizome, and artist Karyn Nakamura about Frieze Week in New York. In particular the discussion focuses on the week's programs on May 16th, with Rhizome's 7 on 7 at New Museum, as well as MoMI's Open Worlds: An Afternoon of Digital Art Encounters.They cover an anatomy of Frieze Week itself, (art fair, satellite fairs, Whitney Biennial, and all) before zeroing in on what each guest is bringing to the table. Connor traces the sixteen-year arc of 7x7, this year organized around the theme of "Containment." Nakamura discusses her own 7x7 project with Lucas Gelfond, which probes the geometry of meaning inside language models and the possibilities of interpretability research as artistic material. Harsanyi walks through the museum programming in depth.See our "New York Digital Art Guide"Monday's Editorial this week is an essay by Bauman on the relationship between protocol art and worldbuilding: The Cerebral SambaAlso in this episode: Josh Kline, Édouard Glissant, Linda Dounia, Rhea Myers, Experiments in Art and Technology (E.A.T.), MIT, Avery Singer, Ken Knowlton, Sarah Friend, Travess SmalleyRead next: Reprogramming Sensory Habits, Wendi Yan & Karyn Nakamura on the Artifice of KnowledgeListen next: Ep. 18, Digital Curators Series 02—Regina Harsanyi & Jon Ippolito on Preserving the Digital, Ep. 25, Recapping Digital Art in 2Q 2025Chapters 📖:00:00:00 Intro00:02:18 Frieze Week: What It Is and Why It Matters00:07:20 The Saturday Battle Royale: 7x7 vs. MoMI00:08:52 7x7: The Commons Residency and the "Containment" Theme00:13:11 Karyn Nakamura: Interpretability as Artistic Material00:16:19 MoMI x Tezos: Digital Materiality and the Fellowship00:18:38 Edgar Fabian Frias and the Nureyka Performance00:20:17 Travess Smalley's Pixel Rug Book and OONA00:23:52 The Artist/Technologist Binary00:35:20 Corporate Sponsorship and Artistic Subversion00:38:27 The Josh Kline Essay: Real Estate and Art Quality00:42:10 Rhea Meyers & Linda Dounia collaboration

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/strange-rules-and-protocol-art-at-the-venice-biennaleIn this episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with artists Trevor Paglen and Primavera De Filippi about Protocol art.The occasion is Strange Rules, the landmark group exhibition co-conceived by Hans Ulrich Obrist, Holly Herndon, and Mat Dryhurst, running at the Palazzo Diedo in Venice for the full duration of the Biennale. The show offers the most institutionally significant framing of protocol art to date, and Paglen and De Filippi represent two of its most distinct vantages.The conversation opens with the question of how each artist situates their practice within the protocol framework. Paglen, long known as a revealer of hidden infrastructures, reflects on a career built between systems observation and systems intervention. He and on how his new work Voyager marks a turn inward, toward consciousness rather than exposure. De Filippi, a longtime Protocol art theorist and one of the few artists to self-define as a protocol artist, walks through her Protocolism Manifesto and the decade-long Plantoid project that preceded it, sharpening a key distinction: the difference between making art on top of a protocol and making the protocol itself as the creative act.Meanwhile, our Monday Editorial with Shohei Fujimoto completes our Venice Biennale coverage for the week. (More to come!)Also in this episode: OpenAI, Sam AltmanRead next: Living Aesthetics: A Grammar of Protocol Art and Worldbuilding, Trevor Paglen on Technological Points of ViewListen next: Ep. 38, 2025 Art in Review with thefunnyguys, Conrad House & Peter Bauman, Ep. 43, New York Frieze Week—Michael Connor, Regina Harsanyi & Karyn Nakamura with Peter BaumanChapters 📖:00:00 Introduction & The Strange Rules Exhibition01:39 Trevor Paglen's Work: Voyager and the Pivot Inward02:49 Trevor Paglen on Protocol Art & Post-Minimal Influences04:57 Primavera De Filippi Defines Protocol Art & the Protocolism Manifesto08:13 Voyager Explained: AI That Hypnotizes You10:22 Plantoid: The Self-Replicating Blockchain Sculpture13:34 The Breadth of Protocol Art & the Venice Biennale as Platform17:43 Why Protocol Art Is Rising: Generative AI & the Meta-Layer20:57 Photography, Modernism & the Current AI Rupture23:35 Capital-A Algorithm: Fear, Critique & Alternatives26:36 Embracing the Algorithm: Open Source & Artistic Autonomy30:05 Consciousness, Entanglement & Voyager's Six Journeys33:41 Synthetic Life, Symbionts & Machine Qualia39:05 Protocol Art as a Lens for Economics, Politics & Technology42:34 Protocol vs. Instantiation, Copyright & Closing Thoughts

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/james-bridle-questioning-machine-intelligenceIn this podcast episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with artist and writer James Bridle about what we actually mean when we say "intelligence." They discuss whether building our most powerful technologies around such a narrow version of it is a fundamental mistake.They also unpack author Bridle's argument from Ways of Being that intelligence has always been a political construct, and that contemporary AI represents a reduction of a reduction. The conversation moves through the three effects Bridle sees AI concretely producing right now: consolidation of power, environmental destruction, and a spreading ontological crisis. They end by widening to consciousness, ecological thinking, and what a genuinely non-human intelligence might actually require.It is one of the more skeptical conversations Le Random has hosted on AI, and one of the most clarifying. Enjoy!Monday's Editorial: Keiken on the Worldbuilding LensAlso in this episode: James Bridle, Gene Kogan, Hito SteyerlRead next: Hito Steyerl on How It Uses UsListen next: Ep. 36, Stephanie Dinkins—AI, Memory & Survival with Peter Bauman, Ep. 39, Lawrence Lek—World Entry Points with Peter BaumanChapters 📖:00:00 Introduction: What Is Intelligence?02:01 The Human Bias in How We Define Intelligence08:03 Boosterism vs. Doomerism: Bridle's Dual Critique15:10 Can Agentic AI Produce Ecological Intelligence?20:07 Citizens' Assemblies and the Power of Diversity24:37 Symbionts: A Third Way to Engage with AI?29:55 AI Coding, Relationships, and What Actually Changes Us36:16 Three Real Effects of AI: Power, Environment, Uncertainty41:00 Art, Ethics, and the Glitch Residency45:10 Consciousness Beyond Language: Mountains, Machines, and Standing Waves

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/kayvon-tehranian-and-sebastian-sanchez-digital-art-post-boomIn this special episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with Kayvon Tehranian (CEO and co-founder of Foundation and Rodeo) and Sebastian Sanchez (formerly Christie's Manager of Digital Art Sales, now independent advisor and curator) about the structural challenges of the digital art market following the 2021 NFT boom.They discuss Foundation's recent sale to Blackdove and how Christie's, Sotheby's, and Rodeo have had to dissolve departments or shut down entirely because growth models built on crypto speculation proved unsustainable. The conversation explores where growth actually stalled and why none of the business models worked. Tehranian and Sanchez discuss what their organizations achieved, what can endure, and the need to rebuild from scratch.In the end, this conversation moves into the lofty topics of digital art becoming independent of volatile crypto cycles, moving into physical displays, and developing self-sufficient institutions built through slow, intentional work by committed participants.Also in this episode: Kayvon Tehranian, Sebastian Sanchez, NODE, Mike Winkelmann (Beeple), Becky Kleiner, Micky Malka, MoMA, Tyler Hobbs, XCOPYRead next: Micky Malka & Becky Kleiner on the Birth of NODE, NODE's 10,000: Fast Art, Slow LookingListen next: Ep. 27, Reviewing Digital Art in 3Q 2025, Ep. 38, 2025 Art in Review with thefunnyguys, Conrad House & Peter BaumanChapters 📖:00:00 Introduction01:40 Are These Isolated Incidents or Symptoms?09:52 The Business Model Problem14:13 Crypto Speculation vs. Art Collecting19:13 Why Are Auction Houses Pulling Away?25:45 The Role of Institutions30:56 Anti-Establishment Energy and What Endures36:00 The Physical Display Problem38:40 What Will Endure: Rooted Practices43:55 How Close Was It to Being Sustainable?48:02 Leaner Models and the Future

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/lawrence-lek-world-entry-pointsIn this special podcast episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random’s editor in chief) speaks with artist and filmmaker Lawrence Lek about NOX Pavilion at The Bass Museum of Art in Miami, an immersive installation centered on a self-driving car in a “therapy” program for malfunctioning AIs.They unpack Lek’s long-running NOX universe: a speculative rehab center where care can slide into control, and where machine interiority is treated as a technical defect. The conversation moves from the politics of nonhuman rights and legal gray zones (“it depends”) to Lek’s recurring fascination with autonomous creative agency and what it would mean for an AI to make art as a choice that conflicts with its intended function.In the second half, Lek and Bauman widen the lens to world-building: why a world isn’t one thing but multiple entry points, how ideas like Umwelt and worldview shape what any intelligence can perceive, and why Lek increasingly thinks of his simulations as “superficial models”—interfaces to reality rather than claims to foundational truth.Monday’s Le Random Editorial: "Embodying AI at NeurIPS 2025: Creative AI Track" by Luba Elliott and "Ian Cheng on Composing with Systems" by Peter BaumanAlso in this episode: Luba Elliott, Ian Cheng, Karl Sims, Sarah FriendRead next: Lawrence Lek on AI Reinventing PlaceListen next: Ep. 41, James Bridle—Questioning Machine Intelligence with Peter Bauman, Ep. 31, Ian Goodfellow on Inventing GANs with Peter Bauman (Deep Learning Series 02)On the Living Timeline: Lawrence Lek Wins 2024 Artist Award at Frieze London (2024)Chapters 📖:00:00:00 Intro + Monday editorial highlights (NeurIPS / Luba Elliott)00:07:06 From ecology to AI: nonhuman agency, rights, and “mature” discourse00:13:39 Repairing AI interiority: Enigma’s “Revery” and malfunction-as-psychology00:19:58 Legal personhood + Empty Rider: blame, responsibility, and the “it depends” machine00:27:35 The crash test dummy: guide character, onboarding, and corporate voice00:32:11 The empathy transition: why people resist empathizing with machines (for now)00:38:25 Narratives vs “living code”: simulation stories and instantiated lifeforms00:44:21 What counts as a world? Umwelt, worldview, and multiple entry points00:53:23 Where immersive worlds may head: metaverse hangover, AI’s role, and formats shifting01:00:50 Outro + goodbye

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/2025-art-in-review-with-thefunnyguys-conrad-house-and-peter-baumanIn this end-of-year episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random’s Editor-in-Chief) is joined by thefunnyguys (Le Random CEO) and Collection Lead Conrad House to look back on 2025: its biggest storylines, their favorites of the year and what they’re watching in 2026.They unpack a defining tension of the year: as crypto-native attention and prices stayed weak, institutional and traditional-art adoption of digital art kept accelerating. The conversation moves through platform and ecosystem shifts (VVV’s rise, Verse as gallery infrastructure, Art Blocks nearing the end of AB 500, Fxhash’s next chapter). Next is a discussion of “worlds”—protocol stacks getting richer, more modular, and increasingly entangled with AI, physical spaces and simulation.They close with Le Random highlights (including Raster and a more nimble publishing rhythm), personal favorites of the year, and a forward look at Node Foundation in Palo Alto, Canyon in New York, Colección Solo in Madrid, and Zero 10’s next iteration in Hong Kong.Mentioned:"Ian Goodfellow on Inventing GANs""THE PEOPLE ARE IN THE COMPUTER—PART I" on Alec Radford (most popular piece of 2025)"The Ultraintelligent Machine and Gaberbocchus Common Room" by Jasia Reichardt and Our 100th article"Drifella III: Room for Complexity" - 4,000+ word deep dive on Evil Biscuit's classic"Parker Ito and Evil Biscuit on Possessed Spirits""Standout Artwork of 2025"Also in this episode: Raster, Evil Biscuit, Copper Giloth, Art Basel, Gene Kogan, Ian Goodfellow, Kim Asendorf, Matt DesLauriers, Zach Lieberman, Jan Robert LeegteListen next: Ep. 27, Reviewing Digital Art in 3Q 2025, Ep. 25, Recapping Digital Art in 2Q 2025Chapters 📖:00:00 Intro + agenda01:29 Big takeaway: digital art’s institutionalization04:23 NFTs fade in crypto, rise in trad art (two camps)07:12 Capitulation vs institutional growth (NFT categories)09:53 Macro check: S&P vs ETH/BTC/XTZ13:30 What brings collectors back? (liquidity + catalysts)23:08 Fairs & infra: Art Basel, minting tech, new spaces26:00 Platforms reposition: Art Blocks + fxhash30:08 “Worlds” as the frame (protocol stacks + world models)42:07 AI art maturity: from hype to diffusion44:23 Le Random focus: Raster + collecting strategy49:30 Q4 editorial shift: Friday pods + agility50:45 Favorites of 2025: kickoff50:56 Favorite group shows58:56 Favorite releases: Claude/Gemini/Marble → vibe coding1:07:54 Favorite solo works1:17:46 Favorite artist picks1:27:23 Looking ahead to 20261:38:11 Outro

Episode page and full transcript: https://www.lerandom.art/episodes/terra0-what-the-autonomous-forest-wantsIn this special episode, host Peter Bauman (Le Random's editor in chief) speaks with Paul Seidler and Paul Kolling from art collective terra0 about their project Autonomous Forest (2025)⁠. They cover the nearly decade-long journey from ⁠white paper (2016)⁠ as university students to the project's NFT launch in December 2025.The collective shares how the original idea in the white paper mutated with projects like Flowertokens, Premna Deamon and now Autonomous Forest. They also cover why working through German law and smart contracts creates better frameworks than pure speculation, how the project evolved from startup pitches to nonprofit governance, and what it means to build living systems that exist outside economic (and human) exploitation.Monday's Le Random Editorial on "Standout Artwork of 2025"Thursday's Le Random Editorial: "Zero 10 Part 1: Beeple Casts a Spell" by Kevin BuistAlso in this episode: Christiane Paul, Holly Herndon, Mat Dryhurst, Philip Galanter, Sasha Stiles, Simon Denny, Sol LeWittListen next: Ep. 44, Figure31—Discussing and Demonstrating DEL with Peter Bauman, Ep. 22, Protocol Art & Blockchain Formalism—Mitchell F Chan, Ania Catherine, Dejha Ti, matto & maltefrChapters: 📖00:00:00 Intro: terra0 + “Autonomous Forest” (what it is)00:10:01 The long arc: Flower Tokens, Premna Daemon, and the road to Autonomous Forest00:17:02 The pivot: from “forest as economic agent” to removing ecosystems from the market00:22:00 Why blockchain matters: voting, trust, governance, and accountability00:26:03 Repeatability + policy experiment vibes — and where AI fits (and doesn’t)00:29:01 Legal fictions: “corporations as slow AIs” and the problem of intention00:32:04 Personhood for nature: who can speak for rivers/forests/nonhuman interests?00:38:04 Protocol art roots: relational aesthetics, software art, and law as medium00:41:01 World-building + generative art lineage (instructions → systems → protocols)00:49:00 Guattari’s “Three Ecologies,” land art links, and closing reflections