Solo Series Chapter 10: High Involvement, Low Attachment — Sustainable Behavior Change Explained

In this solo episode, Lisa reflects on the complex relationship between identity, body image, and authenticity as she reads her essay about developing humor and personality as a survival strategy. Lisa explores how weight loss, shifting social responses, and global awakening experiences sparked an identity crisis that expanded into a deeper understanding of privilege, oppression, and the social context that shapes how bodies are perceived. Lisa examines the intoxicating pull of external validation, the grief of benefiting from appearance, and the lifelong practice of returning to embodied safety and self‑connection.Topics Include:Persona vs. Authentic SelfPrivilege and OppressionExternal ValidationSelf Connection[6:29] Lisa shares her Common App essay which focuses on her weight and personality. She describes her weight as her only flaw and the source of disrespect and impatience with herself. To compensate for not physically fitting in, Lisa cultivated a personality, using humor as her confidence. She reflects that her struggles with weight forced her to develop her inner self. Lisa recalls reading the essay years ago and viewing it through the lens of codependency and people-pleasing, a kind of persona created from a feeling of being unsafe. She used humor as a performance because she felt she couldn't be her authentic self due to her body. She concludes the essay with her valuing the person she became.[15:37] Lisa describes her time on Semester at Sea as the first time she entered a new social environment as a "thin person” and she wasn't receiving the same constant praise she previously had on campus for losing weight. She describes this confusing experience where her role in society felt like it was changing, but she couldn't articulate what was happening.[20:26] Lisa now understands this confusion was due to the world responding to her differently and her responding to the world differently. Lisa explains how her eyes were opening to the social context in general, leading to a crisis about how the world works. Her inability to process this existential crisis manifested physically as the origin of her IBS symptoms. [25:43] Lisa describes this period in her life where she became acutely aware of societal issues like racism, sexism, and poverty for the first time. She emphasized how her perception of the world had changed. Sociology 101 introduced her to the concepts of privilege and oppression. She noted that while the class discussed race, gender, and sexual orientation, the lens of body size was her own connection, allowing her to put the dots together.[43:51] Lisa shared a memory of walking down the street and being ignored by a man passing by and she began reflecting on when she began defining herself by how others saw her. She explained that the goal is not to swing the pendulum from being negatively judged to being positively judged but to be seen for who you truly are.[52:13] Lisa explains that to feel safe in one's body as it is, one must be connected to that body and spiritual being. Lisa issued an invitation for listeners to self-reflect on how much mental "real estate" the preoccupation with others' thoughts takes up in their daily lives.[59:46] She wraps up the episode with an invitation to let the current discussion "settle and marinate" and consider their own position as a person with an "animal brain in a social context," living within constructs of privilege and oppression.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.Embody Peace With Food: A Revolutionary Holistic Approach - Omega Institute: July 12-17, 2026LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this solo episode, Lisa takes a deeper, more personal look at the internalized male gaze, embodied safety, and what intentional weight loss can mean through a trauma‑informed lens. She starts with a gentle check‑in about having too much coffee and uses that moment to explore the feelings she pushed aside and how choosing connection helped her regulate instead of leaning on old coping habits. From there, she talks about how denial, dissociation, and building her self‑worth outside of appearance shaped the way she handled body‑based judgments, while also being honest about the real social changes she noticed after losing weight. She reads from a 2014 essay that traces her shift from denial to hyper‑awareness, the cultural experiences that challenged Western beauty standards, and the toll perfectionism took on her. To wrap up, Lisa introduces the ideas of egosyntonic and egodystonic thoughts to help listeners understand those inner conflicts around body‑focused thinking, highlighting awareness, space, and embodied safety as key parts of healing.Topics Include:Internalized Male GazeEmbodied SafetySocial DynamicsEgosyntonic vs. Egodystonic Thoughts[0:32] Lisa begins by noticing she crossed her personal limit on coffee, practicing non-judgmental, compassionate curiosity about the behavior. She connects over-caffeination to an anxiety-provoking event she suppressed due to context, illustrating how coping can mask root emotions. She identifies her need for connection and support rather than substances and texts her best friend to schedule a call to process the event together.[10:50] Lisa introduces the concept "trauma work is slow," explaining that healing from chronic societal trauma is a gradual process unlike a diet. She clarifies her stance on others' judgment of her body, explaining that she built her self-worth on character, not appearance, as a defense mechanism when she was in a larger body. She acknowledges that losing weight made it safer to engage with social constructs.[37:35] Lisa reads an essay she wrote in 2014 during Semester at Sea, a period that served as intense exposure therapy for her eating disorder following her significant weight loss and tummy tuck. The essay details her 150-pound weight loss journey, which was initially prompted by physical pain and practical difficulties.[1:07:50] Post-weight loss, Lisa realized her happiness stemmed from societal validation, not self-acceptance, leading to an obsessive cycle of never feeling good enough. After reading the essay, Lisa explains the weight loss journey woke her up from a state of being disconnected from her body, a profound psychological shift that is the origin of Out of the Cave.[1:11:56] Lisa introduces the psychological concepts of egosyntonic (behaviors in harmony with one's self-image) and egodystonic (behaviors conflicting with one's self-concept). She explains that her own compulsive thoughts about bodies post-weight loss felt intensely egodystonic, which was a positive factor in her healing as it allowed her to separate herself from those thoughts. [1:20:22] Lisa wraps this episode by encouraging listeners to examine if their body image thoughts are egosyntonic or egodystonic, noting that recognizing these thoughts as conditioned can create distance and aid healing. She notes this is the second episode on the topic and a third will follow to bring all the concepts together.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.Embody Peace With Food: A Revolutionary Holistic Approach - Omega Institute: July 12-17, 2026LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this chapter, Lisa explores how body image, trauma, and the internalized outsider gaze pull us out of our bodies and into self‑objectification. She unpacks how fat phobia, the male gaze, and chronic shallow breathing keep the nervous system in fight‑or‑flight, blocking sustainable change. Drawing on somatic research and her own history of dissociation as protection, Lisa shows why healing begins with coming back inside through breath and interoceptive awareness. The episode closes with a grounding practice to shift from “How do I look” to “How do I feel,” the first step toward embodied change. Topics Include:Nervous System SafetyBreathwork for SafetyInternalized Outsider GazeComing Home to the Body[0:20] Lisa begins the episode by announcing that registration for the next OOTC Retreat at the Omega Institute scheduled for July 12–17, 2026 is open. Lisa apologizes for the potentially lower sound quality as she is traveling and recording without her microphone. She frames this as a deliberate choice to prioritize "messy action" and consistency over perfection. [4:50] Revisiting the “Devil’s Snare” metaphor, Lisa emphasizes that healing isn’t about pushing harder—it’s about learning how to breathe and soften back into the body. She introduces a quote taught by Caroline Lee Dewey: "We don't learn how to push. We learn how to breathe." Highlighting that healing and coming back into one's body is about breathing and release, not pushing and control.[8:08] Lisa examines how internalized fear of fatness often shows up as shallow breathing, especially discomfort with the belly expanding during a deep, diaphragmatic inhale. She explains that feeling safe in one's body is presented as a necessary prerequisite for intentional and sustainable weight loss. If a person's breathing pattern is constantly signaling danger, it undermines the foundation required for healthy, lasting change.[18:42] Citing somatic therapist Ailey Jolie from Instagram, Lisa explains the internalized male gaze and that internalized objectification lives in the nervous system, manifesting in micro-adjustments the body makes before conscious awareness. Referencing Iris Marion Young's essay "Throwing Like a Girl," Lisa describes how women learn to move with "inhibited intentionality," taking up less space and moving tentatively, as if always being watched. Lisa also discusses research by Barbara Fredrickson and Tommy-Ann Roberts on "self-objectification," where girls adopt an observer's perspective on their bodies, measurably impairing the ability to feel internal bodily states like hunger or heartbeat.[45:24] Lisa shares her disconnection to the trauma of her younger sister's death when she was five and how she coped with using food. She explains that denial, disconnection, and dissociation became her primary defense mechanisms and sent her the message that the world was safe despite her weight. [1:09:09] Lisa wraps this episode up by inviting listeners to practice re‑centering through two anchors: deep breathing and replacing “How do I look?” with “How do I feel?” She emphasizes that mindful breathing is a skill that must be practiced to come back inside the body and become aware of what is happening within oneself.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.Embody Peace With Food: A Revolutionary Holistic Approach - Omega Institute: July 12-17, 2026LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this episode, Lisa opens with the reminder that real, sustainable change begins not in urgency, panic, or the frantic rush to “fix” your body, but in the quiet, embodied willingness to be exactly where you are. She invites listeners to step out of the urgency of weight‑loss pressure and into the felt safety that makes transformation possible—safety in your breath, in your body, and in the present moment. Lisa unpacks why panic tightens the system, why urgency blocks clarity, and why the path forward only reveals itself when you stop fighting the moment you’re in. Drawing on lived experience, nervous‑system science, and a three‑level coaching framework, she guides listeners toward releasing the fear‑driven chase for change so one can finally see the exit, the path, and the next right step from a grounded, regulated place. Topics Include:Releasing PanicEmotional SafetyFramework for SuccessCommunity[1:55] Lisa shifts the conversation from theoretical groundwork to the "core conversation" of intentional weight loss, specifically focusing on the physiological components of radical acceptance and non-attachment. Lisa emphasizes moving beyond intellectual understanding. The goal is to "embody it until you habituate to it." Lisa explains that safety and acceptance must be felt physiologically to be effective.[3:50] Lisa uses the Harry Potter scene involving Devil's Snare to illustrate the body's response to discomfort.Panic: Struggling and fighting (like Ron) causes the plant to constrict tighter, meeting fear with fear causes physiological contraction and worsens symptoms.Relaxation: Relaxing and "trying on the energy of relaxation" (like Hermione and Harry) causes the plant to release, helping the body to feel safe.[8:35] Lisa applies this to her experience with IBS and chronic pain. Realizing that panic was fueling her physical contraction, she utilized the mantra: "You are uncomfortable, you are not unsafe." The urgency to lose weight is compared to being trapped in a burning room. Panicking and screaming "I have to get out" only adds fuel to the fire and blocks the exit. [25:52] Lisa outlines the three levels required for success:Emotional Sobriety: Learning to feel feelings without using food as a drug.Mind-Body Connection: Connecting with food and the body intuitively.Intentional Weight Loss: This step should only be pursued after the groundwork of levels 1 and 2 is complete. Attempting Level 3 prematurely leads to the cycle of failure.[37:25] For those who react to their reflection as if they are a "predator," Lisa recommends her Mirror Work Challenge to build the capacity to bear witness to one's own body. Lisa addresses facing fears (like wearing a swimsuit in public), one should not throw themselves into the deep end and dissociate. Instead, she urges taking fetus steps to stay in a learning zone rather than a danger zone. She encourages to imagine how one would move, breathe, and exist if they already felt safe, and to start embodying those physical behaviors now. [1:06:06] Lisa argues that individual work is not enough because humans have an "animal brain in a social context."- Quoting "grief cannot be metabolized in isolation," she emphasizes that healing requires safe relationships and the brain needs to learn there are people who can see, love, and accept you without judgment.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this week’s episode, Lisa reflects on her creative process — openly naming her impatience while choosing messy action over perfectionism — and shares the three question framework she uses for personal transformation. She explores why meaningful change requires a slower, more mindful pace to protect the nervous system from chronic fight-or-flight, and how balancing external guidance with personal authority creates space for intuition to emerge. Lisa then describes non-attachment as the future-oriented partner to radical acceptance, shifting from needing outcomes to simply wanting them in order to feel safe in the present. Lisa models how meeting fear with self-compassion and internal validation allows one to act bravely without clinging to results — a practice she frames as foundational for lasting change, from intentional weight loss to healing chronic pain. Topics Include:Brave BecomingMessy CourageInner SafetyLoving Non-Attachment[1:37] Lisa begins by acknowledging her own frustration in not reaching her intended topics yet, modeling how to tolerate the discomfort of a non-linear process. She encourages "messy action," urging action before feeling "ready," inspired by feedback that her own process has helped others let go of perfectionism.[5:34] Lisa shares her "Living As If" method for personal transformation. This framework helps create a blueprint for becoming one's "higher self" by focusing on how one wants to be in relation to their life and pain, rather than immediate comfort. By asking these three questions:"Who is the person that I want to be?""What would she do?""What does that look like for me right now?[10:48] Lisa stresses that time is a critical component of change, highlighting the difference between simply getting a task done and doing it without overwhelming one's nervous system. She contrasts her past "fight or flight" lifestyle of rushing with her current, more mindful pace. She explains that rushing perpetuates a physiological state of fear.[15:17] Lisa examines how seeking help is valuable, it's crucial to avoid giving away personal power to external authorities and the goal is self-reliance, not dependency. Lisa then looks at how creative solutions and intuitive guidance require a "marination stage," which is often blocked by constant distractions.[20:57] Lisa circles back to the non-attachment part of High Involvement, Low Attachment. Lisa frames it as the future-oriented version of radical acceptance; radical acceptance is for the present, while non-attachment is for a future outcome. She discusses the difference between wanting a certain outcome and needing a certain outcome and the signals of fear or safety that are sent to the brain. [53:22] Lisa closes out this episode by explaining the importance of meeting fear with love as a foundational skill for personal evolution. She explains that change is inherently uncomfortable and the key is how you treat yourself during the process. She explains that being present with fear, validating it as a normal human response, and meeting it with love and acceptance is key and the goal is to act while feeling uncomfortable, not unsafe.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this solo episode, Lisa reflects on reaching episode ten of the solo series and the shift from self-doubt to claiming the podcast as her art — a space of joyful, honest self-expression rather than performance. She shares a compassionate, staged approach to behavior change that begins with non-judgmental awareness and an intentional “marination” phase before navigating the other stages, emphasizing the importance of regulating fear, distinguishing it from truth, honoring not knowing, and prioritizing learning before leaping. Throughout the episode, she explores strengthening mind-body connection, embracing beginnerhood and trial-and-error, and applying professional tools to personal recovery, while introducing High Involvement, Low Attachment (HILA) as an energetic framework for pairing full effort with non-attachment to outcomes, creating change that feels safer, steadier, and sustainable. Topics Include:Artful ExpressionFear vs TruthCompassionate ChangeHILA Framework[0:57] Lisa begins with a celebration of reaching ten solo episodes. She compares this achievement to the childhood joy of turning five years old—celebrating "two whole hands." She shares a personal "check-in" regarding her internal journey with the podcast; the fear, doubt, and anxiety regarding how her content would be received. Her view has shifted to see the podcast as a necessary form of "art" and self-expression.. [8:28] Lisa argues that believing one should intuitively know how to exercise is a limiting belief. Lisa shares her personal journey to debunk the idea that she "just knew" how to exercise. She details the specific, and sometimes unconventional, steps she took to educate herself after realizing she didn't know how to strength train properly or avoid injury. [15:52] Lisa discusses the common feeling of being stuck or fearful when facing uncertainty, particularly in areas like self-care, exercise, and nutrition. She shares that this feeling often manifests physically (tingling, tightness, holding breath) and is driven by an underlying fear of not having the right answers. Lisa shares that the first step is to acknowledge and process the fear associated with not knowing, without letting it control actions. [25:17] Lisa shares an anecdote about observing a certified personal trainer encountering a new piece of gym equipment. This experience provided insight into the learning process. The key to learning is not having all the answers but having the confidence to experiment, engage in trial and error, and be willing to be a beginner. [36:34] Lisa shares that a client shared a metaphor that likens the process of personal change to planning a trip. It involves distinct, sequential phases: looking at a travel brochure, going to a travel agent, booking the travel, packing, and then finally going on the trip. Lisa introduces a step between Contemplation and Preparation called "Marination." She urges listeners not to rush from awareness to action but to allow new realizations to "marinate" without judgment so that solutions can emerge from a place of calm rather than urgency.[57:02] Lisa wraps up this episode with an introduction to HILA. She shares that practicing High Involvement means actively taking all necessary steps within one's control to work towards a goal. Low Attachment is practiced by accepting that the outcome is not in your control, feeling the associated discomfort without letting it take over, and returning your focus to living in the present moment which is crucial for maintaining safety and sustainability.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this solo series episode, Lisa invites listeners to rethink change beyond “fixing what’s wrong,” and into a more humane, nervous-system–smart way of becoming. She critiques pathology-first mental health models, centers a trauma-informed, strengths-based lens, and names the difference between compassionate, intentional change and fear-driven extremes. Moving through the six stages of change, Lisa reminds us that real progress is often quiet and internal and shows, through relatable examples, how small, steady steps can create lasting, sustainable change. Topics Include:Person-Centered DiagnosisJudgementStages of ChangeProcessing Emotions[2:17] Lisa begins this episode by revisiting a topic from a previous conversation. She clarified that her position is not to dismiss the reality of mental illness or to discard the DSM entirely. By labeling conditions as "disorders," the system inherently frames them as something wrong or broken within a person. Lisa argues for a shift in perspective, suggesting that these behaviors could instead be viewed as adaptive, wise, or even brilliant coping mechanisms developed in response to difficult circumstances.[11:26] Lisa explores the social-psychological concept of judgment. In our social context, we often believe we want to be judged positively and avoid negative judgment. Using body size as an example, she notes that someone who has experienced shame for being in a larger body might believe that changing their body to receive positive judgment will bring them happiness. The core human longing, she argued, is not to be judged, but to be seen. The goal is to understand that intentional change can be beneficial, if paired with the internal work of self-love and acceptance. [21:19] Lisa focuses on the "Stages of Change" model, a therapeutic framework for understanding how people change behavior. Lisa emphasizes that this model reveals change as a process, not a single event, and explains why simply deciding to change often fails. She outlines the six stages of change:Pre-contemplation: The person is not considering changing their behavior.Contemplation: The individual becomes aware of the issue but has not committed to action.Preparation: The person starts to plan, gather information, and make small, experimental changes.Action: The individual actively implements their plan and modifies their behavior.Maintenance: The focus shifts to sustaining the new behavior long-term and developing coping strategies for temptations.Recurrence/Relapse: Presented not as a failure but as an integral part of the process but an opportunity to learn about triggers, practice self-compassion, and restart the process with new knowledge.[29:53] Lisa points out that three stages occur before any concrete action is taken. She talks about how people often fail to make lasting changes because they try to jump directly from thinking about a problem to the "action" stage which is unrealistic and sets them up for failure.[59:54] Lisa discusses how the real work of change begins internally and invisibly. Lisa reiterates that traditional diets fail because they force individuals to jump from "pre-contemplation" directly to "action," ignoring the nervous system and emotional safety. Lisa revisits the concept of baby steps as the key to any sustainable change.  [1:07:17] Lisa emphasized that our actions are often attempts to solve emotional problems with physical solutions. The answer to "not feeling enough" is not to do more, but to sit with the feeling itself. *The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this solo episode, Lisa takes a step back and asks a different question about “disorders”—especially eating disorders—not as something broken or pathological, but as ways the nervous system learned to survive. Lisa's discussion centers on healing through safety, trust, and behavior-first change—embodying new patterns until the nervous system habituates—through tender and fierce self-compassion, balanced integration, and very small, sustainable steps. Along the way, Lisa offers practical examples that apply to intuitive eating, weight loss, and everyday habits, inviting listeners into a more human, aligned, and compassionate way of changing.Topics Include:Survival StrategiesSelf-CompassionEmbodied ChangeHumanized Healing[0:55] Lisa welcomes listeners and encourages listeners to catch up for the full context of this episode. This chapter marks a transition toward topics she has long been eager to address more directly.[2:45] Lisa discusses graduate social work training where the DSM is treated as authoritative. Lisa discusses how eating disorder categories have expanded over time due to observed patterns, not necessarily because human behavior fundamentally changed.[7:58] Lisa contrasts dissociative identity disorder with Internal Family Systems (IFS), which validates natural inner parts or sub-personalities. She talks about how clients doing the work notice conflicting inner parts; she normalizes this as human, not psychosis..[10:45] Lisa challenges reframing things as not an eating disorder but a strategy to regulate the energetic mind-body-soul system involving food. Similarly, Lisa points out that it’s not about the substance or behavior but the function it serves and how it regulates the nervous system. [16:02] Lisa talks about how some addictions like overworking are socially rewarded; while others are condemned. She talks about how a person in a larger body overeating and a person in a smaller body undereating may be driven by comparable nervous-system conditions. Despite opposite behaviors, both can produce similar nervous-system sensations, reinforcing familiar physiology and cycles.[20:42] Lisa talks about not being impressed by things such as weight loss if they cost health, relationships, and well-being. She values outcomes integrated into a balanced, joyful life—sustainable, gradual changes with work-life balance, fulfillment, family time, and hobbies.  [27:18] Lisa shares her thoughts on how it's more that we accept the love we feel safe to receive, not necessarily the love we think we deserve. She discusses how many are conditioned through diet culture, hustle culture, family dynamics, social systems, into self-objectification and suppression of feelings, relating to themselves as bodies to control rather than whole beings. [31:09] Lisa discusses acting as if you are worthy and safe to receive care, even if feelings lag behind. She suggests one does not need to feel worthy to receive care but be willing to receive it and do the caring behaviors anyway. She states the method for this is baby steps to honor the nervous system; progress paced to sensitivity and regulation rather than idealized timelines.[56:04] Lisa closes the episode with a discussion of the growth zones, embraces the learning zone; avoids overshooting into danger and how discomfort is necessary for learning. She states to integrate action and acceptance across behaviors for sustainable change, one must pair outer steps with inner care.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this episode, Lisa explores how addiction and compulsion extend far beyond substances to include any behavior that offers short-term relief at the cost of long-term freedom. Drawing on Gabor Maté’s framework and her own lived experience, she unpacks how dieting, restriction, productivity, and people-pleasing can quietly become addictive coping strategies that create an illusion of safety and control. Lisa introduces the concept of “dieting addiction” and addiction transfer, explaining how food restriction can be just as reinforcing as overeating, and why these patterns can live in the brain as learned responses to stress. With raw honesty, she shares her own breakdown and eating disorder diagnosis, and broadens the lens to include socially rewarded addictions like caffeine use and workaholism. Topics Include:Compulsion and AddictionDieting and RestrictionAddiction TransferGrief, Slowing Down, and Support[0:56] Lisa begins this episode by checking in with herself the way she does with all of her guests. She shares her feeling of nervousness and excitement about recording the solo episode. Lisa realized she has approached her solo podcast series with a habitual sense of urgency to get to the end of her notes and finish the chapter. She describes the urgency as similar to the pressure one might feel to lose weight quickly, even when there’s no real timeframe.[8:05] Lisa explains that her current intentional weight loss experience has triggered memories and trauma from her previous extreme weight loss. For Lisa to properly convey the depth and gravity of her current experience, she feels it's essential to first provide the context of her past struggles with dieting addiction.[14:41] Lisa presents a model comparing the physical actions of dieting with the psychological rewards. Lisa explains that on the surface, it looks like discipline and willpower, but psychologically, it can be an addiction where the person feels they can't not engage in the behavior out of fear. Lisa talks about how this demonstrates how the brain can equate not eating with stress relief and safety, making it difficult to stop dieting even when consciously desired.[29:48] Lisa explains that proponents of intuitive eating argue that food addiction isn't real, as addictive-like behaviors are often a direct result of either physical or mental restriction. Lisa partially agrees but maintains that for some, including herself, the behavior is a byproduct of the hippocampus storing the memory that food alleviates stress, making it a "drug of choice" independent of dieting. [50:31] Lisa discusses  that one doesn't need to have a formal diagnosis to address addictive behaviors and reclaim personal power. The key is to pay attention to the relationship with a behavior, not the behavior itself. Lisa explains that addiction is present when you feel you can't not do something, rather than choosing to do it freely.[54:48] Lisa talks about how society rewards other addictive behaviors, such as extreme weight loss and workaholism, creating "high-functioning" addicts who appear successful but are internally struggling. Lisa explains that creating safety often requires slowing down, which may mean accomplishing less. [1:12:18] Lisa closes this episode by discussing grief in the process and how one may need to grieve the identity of being a person who "does it all" to prioritize well-being. She compares the process to sitting shiva and when grieving old habits or identities, it is valid to allow oneself to be supported and cared for by others.*The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠

In this episode of her solo series, Lisa examines addiction dynamics in food and eating, integrating neurobiology, trauma, and behavioral psychology with personal narrative. She distinguishes substance vs. behavior addictions and reframes the “food addiction” debate as a semantic distraction, emphasizing why behaviors become compulsive. The discussion links binge eating and self-harm through positive and negative reinforcement, underscores capitalist food industry influence, and advocates grief, radical acceptance, and surrender as foundations for change. A personal story traces undereating/overexercise, malnourishment, cognitive impairment, medical oversight, and eventual surrender from rigid weight control to health-centric practices, leading to weight stabilization and improved well-being.Topics Include:Addiction ModelFood and Eating BehaviorsGrief, Acceptance, and SurrenderDisordered Eating[1:08] Lisa begins by acknowledging her own perfectionistic impulse and the importance of taking "messy action" to overcome it, revisiting the topic of addiction from the previous episode to clarify her stance on food addiction. [4:03] Lisa argues that the debate over whether food addiction is real misses the point; the conversation should focus on understanding and effectively treating the issue, acknowledging that it is both similar to and different from other addictions. She presents the addiction model distinguishing between substance addictions (e.g., drugs) and behavioral addictions (e.g., gambling). She explains that the relationship with food is unique because it involves both a substance (food) and a behavior (eating).[6:12] Lisa discusses how on the substance side, hyper-palatable, high-fat, high-sugar foods trigger a strong reward reaction (dopamine, serotonin) in the brain. On the behavior side, eating-related behaviors like overeating, undereating, and binging can become addictive. Lisa introduces Dr. Gabor Maté's definition of addiction. It shows that any behavior can provide temporary relief/pleasure and craving, but causes long-term negative consequences, with an inability to stop. This model applies to both overeating and undereating. Lisa clarifies she is not saying "food is a drug," but that "some people can use food like a drug" for emotional coping.[34:14] Lisa discusses radical acceptance of one's current reality as the first step toward transformation, which involves grieving the relationship with food one wishes they had.[51:43] Lisa shares a personal story about her weight loss journey. After losing about 80 pounds around December 2012, she experienced severe physical symptoms like lightheadedness, hair loss, and cognitive impairment due to malnourishment, even though multiple doctors offered no clear answers. Lisa’s personal research into the ACE study and the National Weight Control Registry revealed that both childhood trauma and the habits of successful dieters (low-calorie diet, daily exercise) were linked to her struggles.[1:00:20] Lisa’s big surrender moment when she chose to stop dieting, facing an unknown outcome, rather than continue a cycle she knew would lead to more weight gain. She stopped weighing herself, shifted her focus from weight-centric to health-centric goals, prioritized food quality over quantity, and incorporated practices like meditation. Surrender, though frightening and uncomfortable, is a crucial step.[1:19:46] Lisa closes this episode by sharing what topics are to come and inviting listeners to email her with any questions at [email protected]⁠. *The views of podcast guests do not necessarily reflect the views and beliefs of Lisa Schlosberg or Out of the Cave, LLC.LISA IS NOW ACCEPTING: One-on-One Clients!⁠Purchase the OOTC book of 50 Journal Prompts⁠⁠Leave Questions and Feedback for Lisa via OOTC Pod Feedback Form ⁠Email Lisa: ⁠[email protected]⁠⁠Out of the Cave Merch⁠ - For 10% off use code SCHLOS10Lisa’s Socials: Instagram⁠ ⁠Facebook⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠