#34 Dark Territory – Rethinking Safety Beyond Signalling

About My Guest My guest in this episode is Artificial Intelligence. Instead of inviting a traditional expert, I asked AI directly.AI Transparency NoteThis is an editorially prepared AI interview, not a live conversation with a human expert.My opening introduction is recorded in my natural voice. After that, all voices are AI-generated, including an authorised synthetic version of my own voice.The dialogue was developed with AI under my editorial direction and based on researched material.Key TakeawaysAI can gain influence gradually — without ever formally being put in control.Before AI optimises the railway, humans need to define what success actually means.Efficiency and profitability do not automatically make rail more relevant.AI's biggest potential lies in coordinating the railway as one connected system.More AI is not automatically better. Too much dependence on AI can create new operational, organisational and safety risks.There always needs to be a backup. Critical railway functions must remain resilient when AI, data or communication systems fail.A human clicking “approve” is not necessarily meaningfully in control.One major risk is overreliance — when AI is right so often that people stop questioning it.A consistent digital picture can still be wrong if the underlying data is wrong.AI could help create a very different railway by 2040 — but the direction, limits and responsibility must remain a human choice.AI Transparency ReminderRAIL^UP #35 is a prepared, AI-assisted thought experiment using synthetic voices.After the naturally recorded introduction, all voices are AI-generated, including an authorised synthetic version of host Sebastian Sperker's voice.Sebastian [email protected]

About Constantine IssakidisConstantine is the founder of Athena Industrial. Bringing an outside perspective to one of rail’s oldest safety challenges, he is driving a vision of safer railways through smarter sensors, less physical infrastructure and – most importantly – actionable data.About Athena IndustrialAthena Industrial is a Calgary-based company developing  safety technology and equipment for the  industry.  Athena has taken its Autonomous Rail Condition Detection (ARCD) technology from R&D to more than 1,350 units deployed in real-world railway operations. Athena originally came from outside the traditional rail industry. Its journey into rail began with a call from researchers in Pueblo, Colorado, who saw the potential of the company’s expertise in electromagnetics.https://www.athenaindustrialservices.comKey TakeawaysNot every railway needs more infrastructure: remote and low-density networks need smarter solutions where legacy systems are too complex or expensive to deploy.Innovation can start with one unexpected call: Athena’s journey into rail began when researchers in Pueblo recognized the potential of its electromagnetic expertise.ARCD keeps infrastructure small and autonomous: a 20 × 40 cm, solar-powered unit can monitor around 1.65 km of track for broken rails and train presence.Connectivity does not require continuous coverage: even with only one LTE/GSM connection across 300 km, ARCD can deliver data within five minutes.Built for extreme environments: the system is designed for –65°C to +85°C.From R&D to real-world scale: more than 1,350 ARCD units are already deployed, with the majority operating on Class I railroads.Validation happens under extreme conditions: MXV tested ARCD for 24 months, with 120–130 train movements per day and axle loads of around 36 tonnes.Railway safety requires measurable reliability: MXV verified a 100% rail break detection result and a false-positive potential of just 0.00136% for broken-rail and train-presence detection.The future is about actionable data: railways may need less physical infrastructure but much more intelligence – because the real value is not more data, but data that enables better decisions.Sebastian Sperker [email protected]://www.railup.club/

About Giorgio TravainiGiorgio is Executive Director of the Europe’s Rail Joint Undertaking, the European partnership driving rail research and innovation. He has played a key role in leading Europe’s rail research and innovation programmes, being responsible for the €1.2 billion Europe’s Rail R&I Programme since 2021 and supervising the €920 million Shift2Rail R&I Programme since 2015. Before joining Europe’s Rail, he was Senior Corporate Advisor at UNIFE, advising on strategic topics and contributing to the preparation of Shift2Rail. Since 2007, he has supervised several R&I projects, teams and technical committees and served as Secretary of ERRAC. He holds an Engineering Degree from the Polytechnic University of Turin and a Master’s Degree in Public Affairs from London South Bank University. About Europe’s RailEurope’s Rail Joint Undertaking is a European public-private partnership established in 2021 under the Horizon Europe programme, succeeding Shift2Rail JU. It brings together the European Commission and the rail sector to drive research, innovation, and digitalisation, focusing on removing interoperability barriers and accelerating the deployment of innovations to create a high-capacity, sustainable, and integrated European railway network.https://rail-research.europa.eu/Key Take Aways:Europe’s Rail is a €1.2 billion public–private partnership dedicated to accelerating rail research and innovation and supporting the transformation of the European railway system. Together with its predecessor, the Shift2Rail Joint Undertaking (S2R), it has reshaped the European rail R&I landscape, contributing to the development of key technologies and greater system harmonisation. The Shift2Rail programme delivered over 700 prototype tests and around 70 innovative solutions, showing that innovation is not the main bottleneck.  The main challenge is now deployment: bridging the gap between successful demonstrations and large-scale uptake across Europe's fragmented rail network.  Rail remains central to Europe's sustainability and competitiveness priorities, accounting for only 0.4% of transport greenhouse gas emissions while enabling decarbonisation, resilience, digitalisation and cybersecurity Digital Automatic Coupling (DAC) is progressing through pioneer trains today, with wider commercial deployment expected from the 2030s.  Rail automation is already becoming a reality, with Grade 4 autonomous operation demonstrated in operational conditions on an open railway line in Prague, Czech Republic.  FRMCS will replace GSM-R, providing the digital backbone needed for future automation and high-capacity rail operations.  Faster and more harmonised authorisation and standardisation processes are essential to reduce costs and accelerate innovation deployment across Europe.  The proposed next programme would more than double R&I funding to around €3 billion, complemented by €15 billion for pre-deployment and market rollout.  The vision for 2050 is a highly automated, more integrated European railway system, delivering higher capacity, more services and global technology leadership. Sebastian Sperker [email protected]

About Sam BemmentDr Sam Bemment is Co-Founder and Chief Innovation Officer at Universal Signalling. With more than 18 years of experience in engineering, operations, consulting, and railway innovation, Sam brings a deep understanding of both the technical and commercial challenges of rail.He holds a degree in Aeronautical Engineering and a PhD in Railway Systems Engineering, is a Chartered Engineer, and has worked across the client-supplier interface with operators, infrastructure owners, universities, SMEs, and major rail organisations. At Universal Signalling, he focuses on turning client pain points into faster, more affordable solutions.About Universal SignallingUniversal Signalling is a UK-based railtech company founded in 2022 with the goal of making digital railway signalling products faster to fit, simpler, and more affordable. Its core philosophy is “Signalling in Days, Not Decades”, with the stated goal of offering clients benefits now, not in a decade’s time.The company develops low-cost, rapid-deployment technologies, initially for regional, rural, and lower-density railways. Its U-Cross product uses trackside beacons and onboard reader units to provide more accurate train location information, helping improve safety and operational efficiency at user-worked crossings and on lines where traditional signalling upgrades are difficult to justify.https://www.universalsignalling.com/Key TakeawaysETCS is a the European signalling interoperability standard. It was originally specified in the mid 1990s, and due to complexity/cost is often difficult to justify on lower-density regional and secondary lines.Regional railways are essential for the wider network, often providing the first and last mile for freight customers and basic mobility for rural passengers.Many rural lines operate under tight budgets, and large signalling upgrade programmes can take longer than a typical 4–5 year political or funding cycle.In signalling projects, the biggest cost is usually not the equipment. Sam explains that in UK signalling projects, around 83% of project cost can be labour and project delivery, while only around 17% is equipment.A single Eurobalise may cost around £2,000–3,000 as hardware, but once design, installation, testing, and verification labour are included, the installed cost can rise to around £25,000.Universal Signalling’s beacons cost around £20–30 per unit including installation, and test labour, roughly 1000 times cheaper than a Eurobalise.Instead of installing one expensive balise every kilometre, Universal Signalling can deploy many low-cost beacons, for example every 20 metres. This gives radically better train positioning and enables fault tolerance.The company’s U-Cross trial in Wales covered around 18 kilometres, or 11 miles, of track and was installed in just 2.5 overnight shifts, without any prior design work. This will only get faster as the team get more experience.U-Cross helps at user-worked crossings, where crossing users may currently have to wait up to 40–45 minutes because signallers do not know exactly where the train is within long rural block sections.Universal Signalling’s long-term vision is “Signalling in Days, Not Decades”, reducing deployment times from years to days or weeks and making digital signalling viable for regional railways in the UK, Europe, and potentially a large share of the global rail network.Sebastian Sperker [email protected]

About Oliver von Sperber Oliver is an entrepreneur, technology expert, and rail innovator who brings experience from investment banking and sensor technology to the railway sector. As the founder of AXO, he focuses on making rail infrastructure more resilient through smart, data-driven predictive maintenance.With a background in forestry, he takes a long-term view of infrastructure—seeing railways as complex systems and vital public goods that require sustainable, generational thinking.About AXO AXO enhances the stability of rail networks by providing specialized sensor systems for rail switches. As critical infrastructure nodes, switches are essential for capacity and safe operations, yet remain maintenance-intensive and prone to failure.With around 20% of infrastructure-related train delays caused by switch failures, AXO focuses on practical solutions to prevent disruptions. By detecting anomalies early, its technology enables infrastructure managers to take preventive action before operations are affected. AXO’s mission is to strengthen the long-term reliability and resilience of railways as a vital public good.https://axotrack.de/My Key Takeaways A single failed railway switch can disrupt an entire journey — that’s why people avoid tight connections.Railways and forests have more in common than you think: both are complex systems managed over decades.There are ~60,000 switches in Germany alone — each one a potential failure point.Just one local defect can trigger system-wide delays, showing how fragile rail networks are.In rail, every minute of delay costs ~€100 — small issues quickly become expensive.AXO sensors measure extreme forces up to 500 G, far beyond lab expectations.Early field tests completely destroyed the hardware, revealing real-world conditions.Instead of “AI-first,” AXO focused on understanding physics and data first.The mission is to digitize the intuition of experienced technicians before it disappears.The opportunity is global: high-speed, heavy haul, and metro systems all face the same challenge.Sebastian [email protected]://www.railup.club/

About Vicky AlmanVicky, CEO of NIART Systems, a distinguished engineer who holds two advanced degrees, bringing a background from the highly regulated aerospace sector to the rail industry. At NIART, she leads the application of advanced AI and sensor technology to create predictive rail infrastructure. As a recognized industry leader, she specializes in the digital transformation of rail, focusing on how these innovations mitigate supply chain risk and eliminate the massive, hidden financial costs associated with incidents and infrastructure failures. She offers a crucial, data-driven perspective for global rail professionals.About NIART Systems The company offers a unique radar-powered railway obstacle detection solution. Uncovering hidden obstacles and providing real-time insights in any condition, NIART aims to transform the rail industry by offering a solution that prevents accidents, reduces delays, and accelerates the shift towards safer, smarter and more reliable railways.https://niart-systems.com/About Lido Costa Lido was the Lead Technical Engineer for the AutoHaul® Driverless Trains system for Rio Tinto, Australia, responsible for system integration, hardware and software architecture approval, and safety assurance strategy.Over the past five years, he has served as an Expert Consultant to DB Cargo (German Railways) on the ATO/RTO Betuwe Project — Europe’s first freight ATO and Remote Train Operation initiative — and is also an Expert Consultant with NIART Perception Systems.With over 35 years’ experience in railway signalling, communications, and control systems, Lido has held senior roles on major projects across Europe (including the Madrid–Seville High Speed Line), Asia, Africa, and Australia.He is a Chartered Professional Engineer (Australia), a Fellow of the Institution of Railway Signal Engineers (FIRSE, UK), and winner of the 2021 Australasian Rail Industry Awards – Signalling and Systems Engineering Award.My Key Takeaways Perception is the “eyes and ears” of autonomous trains — without it, autonomy is blind.Rail automation is reaching its limits with rule-based systems; higher capacity and safety demands push the next step.Sensor fusion (radar + cameras) is essential — no single sensor is reliable enough on its own.NIART (train spelled backwards) brings aerospace-grade, mission-critical engineering into rail.AutoHaul is called the “largest robot in the world.”The trains are massive: 2.5 km long, up to ~40,000 tons, fully automated in mainline operation.Biggest business driver: avoiding driver-change stops — restarting a 40,000-ton train costs serious time and fuel.Unexpected benefit: highly consistent driving reduces wear variability and improves maintenance planning.Fun fact: Western Australia reportedly has more camels than Saudi Arabia — and trains regularly encounter them.Next evolution: adding onboard perception systems to further reduce residual risks and increase flexibility and safety.Sebastian [email protected]://www.railup.club/

About MilanMilan Karunaratne is a Vice President at Wabtec with nearly two decades of experience pioneering digital solutions in rail transportation across GE and Wabtec. He leads the global Digital Advanced Technology organization within the Office of the CTO, bringing a startup-style approach to innovation within a large enterprise. A Railway Age "25 Under 40" award recipient with an MS in Mechanical Engineering (Stony Brook) and MBA (UCLA), Milan and his team specialize in translating emerging technologies like automation, robotics, and AI into production-ready solutions that deliver measurable impact to safety, reliability, and operational performance.About WabtecWabtec Corporation is revolutionizing the way the world moves for future generations. The Company is a leading global provider of equipment, systems, digital solutions and value-added services for the freight and transit rail industries, as well as the mining, marine and industrial markets. https://www.wabteccorp.com/My Key Takeaways Big players can innovate too – As Wabtec’s history shows, even long-established rail companies can reshape the industry when innovation is taken seriously.Autonomy is a must for the future – It’s not hype, but essential to improve safety, efficiency, and rail’s competitiveness against road transport.Rail is already a high-tech system – Rail networks are among the most complex and data-rich platforms in the world.Maverick is the North Star – The Maverick project represents the long-term vision for autonomous rail, especially in shunting and local operations.Pathfinder delivers value today – A pragmatic upgrade that brings modern digital, safety, and automation capabilities to existing locomotives.Big innovation happens in steps – Breakthroughs come from many smaller innovations, not one giant leap.Autonomy needs the whole system – Locomotives, yards, IT, data, and processes must evolve together.Humans stay in the loop – Automation supports people; it doesn’t replace them.Safety and regulation come first – Rail autonomy must respect the unique physical and operational constraints of rail.Get your hands dirty – Real innovation means experimenting, iterating, failing fast, and learning by doing.Sebastian Sperker https://www.railup.club/[email protected]

About Bernhard FreiBernhard is a strategy and innovation expert with 25+ years of leadership experience in mobility, industry, and technology. As Director of Corporate Development at PROSE AG, he shapes the strategic transformation of a leading European mobility engineering company. Previously, he held senior roles at Zoppas Industries, ALPHA ET, and Kraft Foods. He is a SWISSRAIL board member, university lecturer, and holds a PhD in Business Administration, an Executive MBA, and engineering degrees.About Felix SaurFelix is a Senior Consultant at PROSE AG in Bern. For more than 15 years, he has led numerous projects in the field of running gear and measurement technology for rail vehicles. At PROSE, Felix is particularly responsible for troubleshooting projects. In addition, he works on wheelset torsion issues involving wheelset axles, as well as challenges such as the demand-oriented railhead conditioning presented in this podcast, which require interdisciplinary solution approaches.About Prose PROSE is a leading European engineering and consulting company for the mobility sector, with a strong focus on rail transportation. The company supports rail manufacturers, operators, maintenance providers, and authorities in the areas of rolling stock engineering, maintenance, certification, safety, digitalization, and systems engineering.With around 150 employees at several locations across Europe, PROSE combines deep technical expertise with strong strategic consulting capabilities. The company focuses on innovative, sustainable, and economically robust solutions that cover the full lifecycle of rail vehicles and mobility systems.PROSE is regarded as an independent, manufacturer-neutral partner and is the market leader in engineering and consulting for the rail sector within the EU. It guides customers through complex transformation processes, develops future-oriented business models, and strengthens the competitiveness of the European mobility industry.https://prose.one/Key Takeaways A serendipitous beginning: COVID forced PROSE to rethink their approach — leading to an unexpected discovery that kick-started the Bern project.A decades-old problem: Bern’s trams produced loud curve squealing — a nuisance no one had truly solved.AI meets acoustics: Trams equipped with microphones,GPS, and weather data predict noise before it happens.Swarm intelligence: Only part of the fleet needssensors — they collectively guide lubrication like a hive.98% noise reduction: Bern transforms into a “silent city,” with complaints disappearing almost instantly.Lucky discovery, bigger impact: Felix realized acoustic fingerprints reveal much more — enabling new use casesfor freight, passenger trains, and maintenance.Mindset matters: Openness, willingness to fail, andblending digital skills with veteran expertise are key.Swiss rail magic: Strong societal support and integrated planning make Switzerland the ideal birthplace for such serendipitous breakthroughs.Less concrete: Every euro poured into new tracks triggers seven euros in maintenance later — a cost spiral that demands smarter, not bigger, rail systems.Sebastian [email protected]://www.railup.club/

About Dominic Joshua Joshua co-founded Dreamstar Lines to tackle the hassle of U.S. medium-distance travel, inspired by the efficiency of European and Asian trains. He leads the company’s vision and strategy with 15 years’ experience across startups, finance, transportation, and logistics. A U.S. Air Force Reserves veteran specializing in transportation/logistics, he holds an Economics degree from Columbia University. Joshua began in corporate strategy and M&A before moving into startup growth roles at Darktrace and CloudKitchens.About Dreamstar LinesDreamstar Lines is a U.S. startup building premium overnight passenger trains, starting with Los Angeles ↔ San Francisco. The service targets “too long to drive, too short to fly” trips with private sleepers (ensuite showers), a lounge car, morning arrival, optional auto-carry, and pet-friendly cabins. Pricing aims to undercut last-minute flights and flight+hotel, with interiors by BMW Designworks and operations on lightly used nighttime corridors in partnership with track owners. The goal is to launch by the 2028 Los Angeles Olympics and scale into a national network of medium-distance night routes.https://www.dreamstarlines.com/My Keytake aways History comes full circle: Dreamstar flips the Orient Express story—this time a U.S. startup draws on Europe’s night-train revival.Real pain point: A “90-minute” flight often becomes 5+ hours door-to-door; the service targets that hassle, not just speed.Travel cadence: Board around 8–10 pm, unwind in the lounge, sleep, wake to coffee, and arrive meeting-ready.Culture stance: Not anti-car or anti-plane—pro-choice: make trains aspirational so people want to switch modes.Routing logic: Prioritizes arrival time over shortest path, using low-traffic nighttime corridors via host-railroad agreements.Initial consist & classes: Start with 4–6 cars; tiers include lie-flat pods, standard bedrooms, family rooms, and a larger suite—built to scale.Scaling economics: Begin premium to drive adoption, then add cars so revenue scales faster than cost, enabling broader affordability.Market education: Many Americans (outside the NEC) barely encounter passenger rail—opportunity to define the modern U.S. train experience.Amtrak contrast: Public-service obligations shape Amtrak; a private operator can optimize purely for customer satisfaction and viability.Sustainability framing: Position trains as the practical, lower-pollution choice today, while tracking zero-emission tech (batteries/H₂) for tomorrow.Sebastian [email protected] https://www.railup.club/

Episode Highlights – Autonomous Freight Rail 2025 🚆In this episode, we dive into the latest progress from four global frontrunners in autonomous rail freight: Parallel Systems, Nevomo, Intramotev, and OTIV. From pilots to first commercial deployments, these startups are reshaping the future of freight transport.Parallel Systems (US & Australia)FRA-approved pilot in Georgia (160 miles, Phase 2 ongoing). Operations are performed with line of sight and remote safety observersMainline trial with ARC Infrastructure in Western Australia.3rd-gen vehicle finalizing development— better performance, simpler assembly, and lower costsClosed a $38M Series B (January 2025) to scale production.Vision: accelerate the shift from trucks to rail.Team: ~50 staff in LA; hiring into manufacturing.Nevomo (Poland, Germany, India)Pivoted from levitation to MagRail Booster propulsion for sidings & ports.BREMAG project (ArcelorMittal Bremen): cycle cut from 2 hours to 7 minutes.Supported by German rail innovation fund.Global footprint: MoU with DP World & Deendayal Port (India).Intramotev (US)Carmeuse mine (Michigan): TugVolt in full production, >250,000 tons moved.New deployment with Watco at Wood River, Illinois.Growing team (~50); onboarded rail veteran Harry Zander as CCO.Expanding from private sites into regulated mainline operations.OTIV (Belgium, Germany, Netherlands)Partnering with DB Cargo on Europe’s first automated freight locomotive trial.One-year pilot on the Betuweroute (start Oct 2025).Remote control + ATO with supervised autonomy (target: 60–70% autonomous).Autonomous Perception for mainline and shunting yard operations.Scaling into industrial rail sites and urban tram depots.Team ~40, aiming for ~80 in 2026; funding round closing Sept 2025.Key Takeaway:All four companies have moved from vision to pilots and first commercial deployments. Parallel and Intramotev are gaining traction in the US, Nevomo is scaling in Europe and India, and OTIV is embedded in a landmark DB Cargo trial. Together, they are driving the real-world shift toward autonomous freight rail.Links🌍 RailUp🌍 Parallel Systems🌍 Nevomo🌍 Intramotev🌍 OTIV