Episode 251: What Do You Say?

For 6 years, Susan and Cynthia have been asking podcast guests, "What do you know?" In Season 11, they'll be asking a variety of Latter-day Saint women new questions about their memories, insights, and beliefs, with a card game called, What Do You Say? Episode 251 introduces the game as C & S break out the decks of cards for a fun and wide-ranging conversation of questions and answers.

How do you feel about sin? Richard Rohr describes our inevitable human missteps as essential to our growth when he says, "Not doing it right seems to teach us much more than doing it perfectly." But for many Latter-day Saints who struggle with ongoing feelings of guilt and/or shame, Rohr's interpretation may sound a bit too good to be true. Our church's focus on worthiness can get in the way of members' ability to look at mistakes—big and small—as growth opportunities, built right into the plan. In Episode 250, Susan and Cynthia are joined by members of the ALSSI community for a conversation about sin. How have your experiences affected the way you think about it? As your faith evolves, have you reframed sin entirely?

Latter-day Saints consider ours to be a non-credal religion, yet nearly all our Articles of Faith begin with the phrase, "We believe...." We're asked questions about our specific beliefs in official interviews where our temple worthiness is dependent on the answers. But what happens when one's beliefs shift over the course of time? How much does subscribing to a specific set of theological convictions matter when it comes to individual members' lives and relationships? In Episode 249, Cynthia and Susan kick off a season of conversations about big ideas by discussing one of the biggest: Belief.

Latter-day Saints are often told that the contemporary Church is built on the same model Jesus Christ used to establish His church. In this bonus re-release, Cynthia and Susan offer a few thoughts on that idea, and also discuss the pattern they see: the Bible doesn't only show Jesus choosing women in the New Testament—beginning with Eve, women are cast in pivotal roles from the very start. The original episode explores how Jesus's inclusion of women was radical within its cultural context. Yet for most of history, his namesake religion has been marked by near-total domination of the patriarchy. What happened? Greg Prince once asked Chieko Okazaki a question that bears repeating: "…where do we need to go to get women in the Church where He wants them to be?" In Episode 248, Cynthia and Susan pose that question again, shining light on a few of the women hidden in plain sight at Christianity's beginnings.

Curiosity should feel foundational for Latter-day Saints—it's the birthplace of our religious tradition. Any member of the Church can recite the story of young Joseph Smith seeking wisdom he lacked. Curiosity is where any search for God—or for anything beyond ourselves—begins. It's an open stance that can help us get comfortable when we find ourselves unexpectedly dropped into liminal space. Empathy has its origin in curiosity, as does creativity. All of this makes it a perfect wrap for our series of discussions centering change and transition. In Episode 247, Susan and Cynthia explore curiosity. It's a season finale conversation that bridges to our upcoming Season 11 focus: Big Ideas.

In a podcast season devoted to talking about change, it makes sense to revisit some previously covered topics to see whether there's been any. In Episode 246, Cynthia and Susan take another look at a foundational ALSSI discussion: What Women Don't Get In Our Church. What's the official messaging for Latter-day Saint women now, and does it reflect movement? Are we going forward? Backward? Nowhere? And do current narratives around women and our relationship to priesthood reflect actual progress...or not?

Every four years, D&C 132 comes around for study again. If you ask a Latter-day Saint woman what she keeps on her metaphorical faith "shelf," there's a good chance polygamy will be there. It's mostly ignored in contemporary church conversations and teachings, a murky doctrine wrapped in a historical wound that continues to fester, easier to ignore than to heal. Many friends and family members won't even share their true feelings about it with each other. But what are the consequences of our silence around polygamy? How long can we collectively carry this enormous weight we never allow ourselves to set down? Bonus Episode 245 is a rerun of Susan and Cynthia's original conversation about polygamy with Channing and Elise from The Faithful Feminists podcast, an honest exploration of where we've been, where we are, and where we might go next.

Though Section 89 of the Doctrine & Covenants describes itself as a "principle with promise," "to be sent by greeting, not by commandment or constraint," contemporary Church leadership has elevated some of its prohibitions to the level of requirement for temple worship. Other suggestions this section contains seem to be completely ignored. To complicate things, current medical research hasn't always supported the specific tenets that have been designated "commandments." No wonder lots of Latter-day Saints have lots of feelings about the Word of Wisdom and its application in our daily lives and choices! In Episode 244, Cynthia and Susan are joined by historian Linda Hamilton for a conversation unpacking it all. What do you think about the Word of Wisdom? What aspects of it feel relevant to your faith life? What are the narratives of women we find in its history and practice? And what parts of Word of Wisdom lore actually hold up to historical scrutiny?

Each Latter-day Saint's path looks different, a combination of unique experiences, choices, and challenges. No matter how insistent our culture may sometimes feel, no woman fits in a mold. "I think my life began with holding dissonance," explains comedian Whitney Call. "I grew up in a very faithful LDS family...but a little squidgy around the edges. We would go to church and activities every week, and we'd watch the Simpsons together on Sunday nights. We'd bear our testimonies to each other, and we used crude humor about sex." In Episode 243, Cynthia and Susan are joined by Whitney for a wide-ranging conversation about all of it—how it started, how it's going, and one thing she knows right now (or did at the time of recording). CW: pornography, sexuality

No matter what language we use to describe the Divine, for spiritual seekers the hope is that our understanding and connection will continue to expand and deepen. As Richard Rohr reminds us, "God is always bigger than the boxes we build for God, so we should not spend too much time protecting the boxes." In Episode 242, Cynthia and Susan take another look at the spaces where their own 'god-boxes' used to be: It's two women getting personal about what's new, what's not, and where and how they're seeking communion and/or communication now.