Episode 262: A Feedback Loop About Feedback Loops

Are SEVEN people too many to have on a podcast?? Not when it's the Bird and Mammal Team from the St. Augustine Alligator Farm! Chris and Ari are joined by Hannah Caster, Jessie Stull, Jordan Hoover, Ramon Castillo, and Shelby McBride to talk about what makes up a cohesive team, the unsung role of the swing keeper, and figuring out the best ways to give feedback to others before succeeding beautifully at an impromptu game of Dragon's Talon! Such a fun conversation with a wonderful group of human beings! If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

Chris and Ari are joined by fellow training enthusiast Anaka Nazareth, Behavioral Husbandry Coordinator at the National Aquarium! Anaka shares the path that took her from America to Austria (a few times) before settling back on the East Coast and eventually into her current role in Baltimore, where she oversees the training of a lot of our favorite (and less celebrated) animals - sharks, fish, and reptiles - as well as her involvement as a Committee Member, Board Member, and eventually President of the ABMA.If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

Chris is joined by NEI's new (but also not really new) Director of Staff Development, Training, and Shows - Ari Bailey - to welcomes Dr Taylor Gilley back to the show! Taylor shares the path that took her from the education world to her current role as Director of Staff Learning and Development at Houston Zoo, and guides us through a great conversation covering the zoo's LIFT (Leadership, Innovation, Focus, and Teamwork) program, the thousand forms of fear that drive humans, the importance of succession planning and protecting institutional knowledge, how everyone can start their own little development cohort, and the advantages of asking for forgiveness instead of permission. We're all lucky to have people like Taylor working with the humans in our zoos so they can do their best work with their animals. If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

In another in our series of podcasts about other podcasts, Ari and Chris share their thoughts on a recent episode of the Radical Candor podcast with Kim Scott, featuring their guest Stephanie Chung. Chris recently started reading her book "Ally Leadership: How to Lead People Who Are Not Like You," which gets a great overview in the podcast, and gives us a chance to talk about the importance of curiosity, professionalism, "assuming good intentions," admitting your ignorance, and ways that we can all be better humans to each other. If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]! References in the show:The Radical Candor Podcast: Leading Through Chaos with Stephanie ChungAlly Leadership: How To Lead People Who Are Not Like You

Ari and Chris are back together and excited to be joined by Joey Golden, Curator of Animal Behavior Programs at Maryland Zoo! Chris and Joey both attended the recent ABMA and ISZAW conferences, and we wanted to bring him on to chat about the great presentations he gave about his zoo's progress towards "24/7 welfare" for all their animals. We chat about the importance of leaning on innovators, how Hal Markowitz has influenced his thinking about the importance of automation in modern animal care, the new role of Microsoft's PowerBI in collecting and interpreting pretty much every kind of data in a zoo you can think of, and why all of us should be focused on observation, interpretation, and improvement. Such a cool discussion!If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

While Chris is away at the International Symposium for Zoo Animal Welfare in Chicago, Ari is hosting solo—but she’s not alone! She’s joined by former (but also still current) NEI teammate Scott Trauger, who shares what life has been like since he made the big leap to follow his passion outside the animal field. From spreadsheets to showtunes, hear how Scott’s skills in animal care have set him up for success in school, biking, choir, and more!If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

Ari catches us up on her time at Croc School before our hosts tackle an email asking for ideas about how to create opportunities in the professional animal care field for yourself when 1) you've moved somewhere where the immediately employment opportunities might be limited - or non-existent - or 2) you've taken a temporary break from the field and are trying to figure out how to get back in. Will Chris and Ari provide inspiring ideas and action items a person in such a position might benefit from? Listen and find out!If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

Ari Bailey is busy doing cool reptile stuff at Croc School at the St. Augustine Alligator Farm, so Chris takes the opportunity to share the audio from his presentation, "What Does It Mean to 'Prioritize Training'?" from last week's ABMA Annual Conference! He shares some antecedent and consequence conditions that he's seen great teams utilize to make animal training a more fun and more rewarding part of their regular routines, uses the word "stuff" way too much, and shows the audience some fun training videos that will totally make sense on an audio podcast!If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

Chris is LIVE from Zoo Day at the 2025 ABMA Annual Conference in Galveston, Texas! Whilst wandering the grounds of our host facility, Moody Gardens, we chat with Chase Alsup from the Colorado State University Zoo, Aquarium, and Animal Shelter Management Graduate Program, Rae Simmons and Aubrey Wilson from the Moorpark College Animal Care and Training Program, Kelli Carroll and Mikayla Coble from Lake Superior Zoo, and Sierra Smith, Kiana Lucero, and Omar Luna from Tanganyika Wildlife Park about their conference highlights, the people they've met, and the talks that have impacted them. Thanks for chatting with us, Future Zoo Leaders of America (and Beyond)!If you have a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!

Chris is in the editing (and possibly scrapping-and-starting-over) phase of his upcoming ABMA workshop "Your Feedback Loop: Evolving the Way We Give Feedback to Peers," so he decided to reach out to one of the smartest feedbackers around - Ari Bailey - and see how their notes compared when she was given the assignment to jot down what she considered to be the most important things she thinks about when she thinks about feedback. The feedback loop about feedback loops that results is filled with some real gems! Think we missed something important? If you have feedback for us, a shout-out you’d like us to share, a question or a topic you’d like us to discuss, or a suggestion for a guest we should have on the show, let us know at [email protected]!