Peter Swimm: Stop AI-ing the Wrong Things — Put Your Humans First

If your team is losing, will fans still show up? In sports, you cannot control the scoreboard. So what separates the teams that thrive from the ones that see empty seats? Here's why it matters to whatever industry you're in: if great customer experience can drive revenue and loyalty in an industry where you literally cannot guarantee the quality of your core product, imagine what it can do for leaders who actually can. My guest has spent more than 15 years answering exactly that question. Stacy McGranor has led revenue-generating marketing, ticketing, and retention functions across MLB, MLS, the NBA, and made history in the NHL by building the league’s first-ever customer experience function. Stacy shares why controlling the controllable is the real competitive advantage in any industry. We get into how to design for a multitude of customers, why it matters that most sports executives are making decisions in empty venues, and she shares two stories about salads and sundaes that you will never forget. We also dig into why collecting data and asking for feedback is not enough, and how AI can help you navigate to the right insights faster, but your human skills make the difference.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…Designing for multiple customer personasControlling the controllable and making it the best you can in spite of those uncontrollable itemsFocusing on the experience around your product, not just the product itselfUsing data to augment and improve your customer or fan experience “The emotion is the thing that is actually going to bring people back because the emotion is what creates fandom. It’s not how much a ticket cost, it’s how much fun they had in your building.” —  Stacy McGranor Episode References: Jobs to Be Done Theory by late Harvard Business School professor Clayton Christensen: christenseninstitute.org/theory/jobs-to-be-done About Stacy McGranor, Founder, Blueprints & Playbooks, and Head of Customer Success & Implementation, SwitchBase:For more than 15 years, Stacy McGranor has led revenue-generating marketing, ticketing, and retention functions across Major League Baseball, Major League Soccer, and the National Basketball Association. She later made history in the National Hockey League by building the league’s first-ever Customer Experience function, establishing a new standard for how teams engage and retain fans.As Founder and Chief Experience Officer of Blueprints & Playbooks, Stacy partners with sports teams, leagues, and sports technology companies in both fractional and advisory roles. Her work focuses on refining high-impact moments, reimagining end-to-end customer journeys, and building customer-centric strategies and operating models from the ground up.She recently joined the SwitchBase team as the Head of Customer Success & Implementation. SwitchBase is the operations platform that runs everything that business platforms don’t and, from Stacy’s perspective, is the only SaaS out there that is a true driving force in teaching operations teams to think and work in an experience-centric way.A native of Columbus, OH, and based in Salt Lake City, UT, Stacy holds a BA from The Ohio State University, along with an MBA and an MS in Business Psychology from Franklin University.Connect with Stacy:SwitchBase: switchbase.com Blueprints & Playbooks:  blueprintsandplaybooks.com LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/stacy-mcgranor  Connect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red Slice Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

Most workplace conflict isn’t really about personalities, tone, or poor communication. It’s about unmet human needs. And most organizations have never been taught how to recognize or address them.Catherine Cooley has spent her career doing exactly that. Catherine is a communication and conflict coach, mediator, and Certified Trainer of Nonviolent and Compassionate Communication. She’s a conflict and empathy expert who began her work teaching empathy inside federal prisons, and today helps leaders and business teams who dread going to work learn how to resolve differences, restore trust, and build cultures rooted in clarity and connection.From connection during tension, identifying unmet human needs, properly integrating corporate empathy training, and what Catherine calls “precision empathy”, this is a practical, no-nonsense conversation about empathy that works—not as a vibe, not as a script, but as a disciplined, learnable practice that helps people speak honestly, listen deeply, and repair what’s broken.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…Connecting rather than alienating in moments of tensionThe four steps of nonviolent communication - OFNRReclaiming emotion as a compass for human needsHow unmet human needs appear as organizational dysfunctionWhy “feeling literacy” is a form of body intelligence, not just cognitive intelligenceHow poorly done corporate empathy training can make communication worseHow self-empathy can transform workplace relationships "We can pretend all day long we don't have feelings, but our amygdala, meanwhile, is firing the whole time. So let's harvest what it tells us." —  Catherine Cooley Episode References: The Empathy Factor by Marie MiyashiroCenter for Non-Violent Communication (NVC): https://www.cnvc.org/Google Project Aristotle: https://psychsafety.com/googles-project-aristotle/The Empathy Edge podcast: Annalee Hagood-Earl: A Founder’s Masterclass in Values-Driven VelocityAbout Catherine Cooley, Communication &  Conflict Coach and Certified Trainer:Catherine is a conflict and empathy expert who cut her teeth teaching empathy in federal prison; now she gives leaders and business teams who dread their workplace a reliable way to resolve differences, restore trust, and build an empathic culture.She started her career as a geologist, but pivoted early on toward mastering systemized communication “soft skills”. She is a mediator and a Certified Trainer of NVC (Nonviolent & Compassionate Communication), a collaborative communication model that has been used by Microsoft, L’Oreal, Merck, and many others. She coaches and trains leadership teams of mission-driven enterprises with 3x3 Empathy Factors®️, a proprietary NVC-based communication and culture-building system.Catherine is a member of Rotary International E-Club of World Peace, Mediators Beyond Borders International, and the LA chapter of Conscious Capitalism. She was a facilitator for the Alternatives to Violence Project in federal prison.Connect with Catherine:  Peaceabl: https://www.peaceabl.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/catherinedcooley/ Connect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red Slice Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

You do not need more time, more money, or a different career to make a meaningful impact. You just need a better system for using what you already have. My guest is Scott Curran, a social impact lawyer, adviser, educator, founder and CEO of Beyond Advisers, and former general counsel of the Clinton Foundation. Scott's own journey, from corporate law to philanthropy to helping organizations scale their impact globally, is proof that every experience you have accumulated matters, and that you can make a difference in ways you never imagined.When leaders genuinely care about people and purpose, it is not just good for the soul. Companies that embed compassion into their culture grow three times faster than their market peers. We get into his practical framework for identifying your best talents for impact, how organizations can turn collective passion into something real rather than a PR exercise, and the immediate steps you can take right now.If you have ever told yourself you’ll make an impact someday when you have more resources, a bigger budget, a different role, or when your company finally hits its revenue targets, Scott is about to call your bluff in the best possible way. To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…Ways you can create a lasting impact right where you are.How your PPP plus your TTT is the core of your social impact footprint.Looking deeper into what you uniquely do - your own competitive advantage.“Ask yourself what it is you are most passionate about, what you will crawl through glass for, either as an individual or as an organization. Start there. Inventory that." —  Scott M. Curran Episode References: Benevity 2026 State of Corporate Purpose report: benevity.com/state-of-corporate-purpose/2026The Guardian article on firms who stayed committed to DEI outperforming peers: theguardian.com/world/2026/aug/14/dei-policy-company-performanceThe Empathy Edge: Denise Roberson: Mistakes Leaders and Boards Make When Thinking About PurposeAbout Scott M. Curran: Social impact lawyer, educator,  author of Better Good: A Simple System for Creating Lasting ImpactScott M. Curran is a social impact lawyer, adviser, and educator who has spent more than twenty-five years helping leaders and institutions turn good intentions into scalable, lasting impact. He is the founder and CEO of Beyond Advisers and a former general counsel of the Clinton Foundation, where he advised a global nonprofit operating in more than forty countries. He works across the nonprofit, corporate, and legal sectors, advising boards, executives, and organizations on governance, strategy, and systems to do good well at scale. His work spans major foundations, companies, and cross-sector initiatives tackling some of the world’s most complex challenges. He teaches social impact law—recognized by Crain’s Chicago Business as "one of the coolest courses for law students"—and hosts the podcast, Better Good with Scott M. Curran. He lives in Chicago with his wife, Amy, their family, and their rescue dogs. He is the author of Better Good: A Simple System for Creating Lasting Impact.Connect with Scott:Beyond Advisers (Get your free Action Plan): scottmcurran.comLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/scottmcurranInstagram: instagram.com/scottmcurranBook: Better Good: bettergoodbook.comConnect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a LeaderLinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red SlicePick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here: https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here: http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

The world of work is being reshaped in real time, and the companies that are winning are the ones rethinking not just who they hire, but how, when, and why. With over 15 years of experience across staffing, HR technology, and workforce solutions, James Terry, Head of U.S. Revenue for Indeed Flex,  works at the intersection of technology and workforce innovation, helping organizations across hospitality, retail, light industrial, and customer service build more agile, responsive staffing strategies.By flexible work, we're talking about temporary, shift-based, and on-demand work, and also more general agile workforce strategies that meet qualified workers where they are, and why it’s becoming a genuinely strategic path to growth for everyone involved. James breaks down three big shifts changing how companies hire, schedule, and manage workers, and AI is a significant one. We talk about what businesses consistently misunderstand about temporary workers, why their intentions and outcomes are so rarely aligned, and why they need a partner who understands best practices to help them adapt. We also get into how companies can use technology to make the staffing process faster and more efficient without making it feel cold or transactional, and how to create a genuine sense of team even for workers who may not be there long.If you lead people, manage workforce strategy, or care about the future of work, this conversation will change how you think about flexibility, agility, and the very definition of a great hire.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…Insights into the current labor market. Job seeker etiquette and what to do if you’re being interviewed by AI (and why it is may actually be a good thing).What flexible or adaptive staffing can do for your organization.Maintaining the human touch during hiring and after the fact. “Someone is going to crack the code, and it will become the standard for everyone. The question is: Is it going to be you, or is it going to be someone else?” —  James TerryAbout James Terry, Head of U.S. Revenue, Indeed Flex:James Terry is the Head of U.S. Revenue at Indeed Flex, a flexible staffing platform that connects businesses with qualified workers for temporary and shift-based roles. With more than 15 years of experience across staffing, HR technology, sales, and workforce solutions, James helps organizations respond to labor shortages, changing worker expectations, and evolving operational demands.Working at the intersection of technology and workforce innovation, James has helped companies build more agile staffing strategies across industries including hospitality, retail, light industrial, and customer service. He is a frequent commentator on the future of work, AI-powered staffing, workforce flexibility, and the role technology can play in creating faster, more accessible paths to employment.Connect with James:  IndeedFlex: indeedflex.com LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/james-terry-33023717  Connect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red Slice Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

We've long been told that compassion and profitability can't coexist. My guest today challenges that idea, building her business, people systems, and technology around proving otherwise—and helping clients do the same.Rachael Kelly is a bestselling author and founder and CEO of Hive Enterprises. She specializes in strategy, organizational effectiveness, and people and culture, helping mission-driven organizations lead with purpose and measurable impact.Today, we explore psychological safety, how to build it, and what HR often gets wrong about empathy. Rachael also makes the business case for human-centered leadership, showing how it can deliver measurable ROI.If you've ever had to fight for the “soft stuff” in your organization, Rachael will give you the tools and insights to make your case.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…How human-centric leadership helps organizations navigate extreme challengesWhy mission-driven leadership isn’t soft, but has real ROIWhat it looks like to create safe spaces inside organizations, and why psychological safety is the secret ingredient to performance and innovationHow HiveSMART and Hive HEALTH use AI to amplify empathy at scale, freeing people to focus on the human parts of their workDesigning people systems that are both compassionate and accountable"It's not about creating a bunch of extra processes or a bunch of extra tools. It's about energy and focus and presence and being able to receive in that moment." —  Rachael KellyFrom Our Sponsor:Check out this offer from our sponsor, Better Benefits USA: Are You Overpaying for Employee Benefits Without Knowing It? Take the free 10-minute benefits audit at https://findbetterbenefits.org/Join Maria at The Rising Executive Women's Retreat, Nov. 4-7. Use code "Edge500" to get $500.00 off! https://retreat.therisingmastermind.com/ Episode References: The Empathy Edge podcast:Claude Silver: Be Yourself at Work for the Ultimate Leadership AdvantageDr. Cori Lathan: Benevolent Cyborgs and a Techno-Optimist’s View on TechnologyCatherine Cooley: https://www.peaceabl.com/Webinar with Maria and Spark Effect: HR's Make or Break Moment: https://sparkeffect.com/podcast/hrs-make-or-break-moment-leading-your-organizations-ai-transformation/About Rachael Kelly, Founder & CEO, Hive Enterprises:Rachael Kelly is a bestselling author and founder and CEO of Hive Enterprises, comprising HiveSTRONG, HiveSMART Consulting, and HiveHEALTH. She specializes in strategy, organizational effectiveness, people, and culture, facilitating transformation through strategic planning, operating model design, and team development.HiveSMART helps mission-driven organizations lead with clarity and purpose, while HiveSTRONG builds nonprofit capacity and community resilience.HiveHEALTH provides culturally responsive, trauma-informed care through telehealth and in-home services, starting in Texas.Across executive teams, community leaders, and care providers, the message remains the same: Empathy isn’t a liability—it’s a lever for driving measurable impact.Connect with Rachael:  HiveSMART Consulting: https://www.hivesmartllc.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rachael-kelly-7452194  Connect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red SliceCourtesy of our sponsor, JLG Lawyers - Download "The Human Middle," Your free guide to resolving workplace conflict: https://thehumanmiddle.ai/ Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

We're all so busy "AI-ing" everything that nobody stops to ask — are we actually solving the right problems for the real humans on the other end? Peter Swimm is a conversational AI product lead and solutions expert with nearly three decades of experience building and scaling technology that actually works for humans. Peter got his start in tech in 1996 teaching communities how to use the internet through the Chicago Public Library — and that people-first foundation has shaped everything since. He's launched and scaled conversational AI products at companies like Pando Networks and led product strategy at Howdy, where he helped build the Slack API ecosystem before Microsoft acquired the team. He has since done enterprise conversational AI work for Walmart, Loews, Rabobank, and UnitedHealth Care, and at Microsoft Copilot Studio helped spearhead enterprise-grade generative AI capabilities. His firm, Toilville, is AI-aware but technology agnostic — because Peter believes the best asset any organization has is the human minds that shape it.Peter shares why so much technology is being deployed in ways that are shortsighted and frankly unempathetic — cutting costs without actually solving the real problem. Take a listen.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…How to embed empathy-driven requirements directly into your technology specsWhat it means to design systems to enable dignified escalationWhy the best solutions never cross the line from helper to surveillanceWhy you need to understand how work actually happens before implementing AI in your organizationWhat operational compassion at scale really looks like in practice "(Many) clients don't know how work happens today, and so when they go to automate it, they have no A and B to compare against how it was before. Every company has soft-skilled people that are secretly holding the company together through sheer will." —  Peter SwimmFrom Our Sponsor:Check out this offer from our sponsor, Better Benefits USA: Are You Overpaying for Employee Benefits Without Knowing It? Take the free 10-minute benefits audit at https://findbetterbenefits.org/Join Maria at The Rising Executive Women's Retreat, Nov. 4-7. Use code "Edge500" to get $500.00 off! https://retreat.therisingmastermind.com/ Episode References: MIT Study: These Human Capabilities Complement AI ShortcomingsAbout Peter Swimm, Founder and CEO, Toilville: Peter L. Swimm is a conversational AI product lead and solutions expert who started in tech in 1996, teaching the community how to use the internet through the Chicago Public Library.Since then, Peter has built and scaled conversational products from early adoption to enterprise durability, including work at Pando Networks (Intel Capital) and launching the Slack API ecosystem at Howdy, where Peter led product strategy across Botkit and Botkit Studio before Microsoft acquired XOXCO, the team behind Botkit and the Howdy Slackbot.Toilville has supported conversational AI work for major enterprises including Walmart, Loews, Rabobank, and UnitedHealth Care, and at Microsoft Copilot Studio helped spearhead enterprise-grade generative and conversational capabilities, spanning connector ecosystems, customization of language understanding, and architectures for LLM-powered actions.Toilville is AI-Aware but technology-agnostic and believes that the best asset any organization has is the human minds that shape it.Connect with Peter Swimm:Toilville: toilville.com or peoplemakeitbetter.comLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/peterswimm Connect with Maria:BooksSpeakerTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedInInstagramFacebookCourtesy of our sponsor, JLG Lawyers - Download "The Human Middle," Your free guide to resolving workplace conflict: https://thehumanmiddle.ai/  Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

On her 54th birthday, Maria gets personal, fired up, and a little cheeky. She shares the story behind her brand-new speaker reel - three minutes, eighteen years of work, and all the vulnerability that comes with watching your life’s mission condensed into a single video. Then she reads an open letter she wrote to toxic male influencers and leaders, on behalf of boy moms everywhere, about the kind of strength, integrity, and empathy we actually want our sons to see modeled in the world. Because true strength is not force; it is the courage to know who you are, bring people along, and take responsibility for your impact. This one comes straight from the heart.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen to this episode for: A behind-the-scenes look at what it really feels like to launch a speaker reel after 18 years of work and why vulnerability is part of the processAn open letter to toxic male influencers and leaders, written by a boy mom who is done staying quietA powerful reframe of what true strength actually looks like in leadership and in lifeA birthday reflection on why this work matters more than ever in a world drowning in toxic role models "We want to raise boys who become strong adult men who love honestly, feel deeply, and advocate equitably — not through greed, abuse of power, or misogyny." —  Maria Ross From Our Sponsor:Check out this offer from our sponsor, Better Benefits USA: Are You Overpaying for Employee Benefits Without Knowing It? Take the free 10-minute benefits audit at https://findbetterbenefits.org/Join Maria at The Rising Executive Women's Retreat, Nov. 4-7. Use code "Edge500" to get $500.00 off! https://retreat.therisingmastermind.com/ Episode References: My new speaker reel!: https://youtu.be/iMmsYiHhew0?si=JEul0NQ4_G5Ot98tOutspeak Media: https://outspeakmedia.com/My Open Letter to All Toxic Male Leaders and Influencers (please like, comment, and share to amplify this!)On LinkedIn: https://lnkd.in/p/gMUek4cHOn Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DeZStfkAftx/ Connect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red SliceCourtesy of our sponsor, JLG Lawyers - Download "The Human Middle," Your free guide to resolving workplace conflict: https://thehumanmiddle.ai/  Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

What if your energy worked exactly like money? My guest is Claire Mia Burnett, a coach and currently the Director of Operations and Effectiveness at McKesson. She has spent her career working with some of the most recognizable organizations in the world, building the systems meant to help people do their best work. And what she discovered along the way is that the energy problem shows up everywhere: capable people are being asked to give more than the system was ever designed to return.Her new book, Reserve and Release: Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves, is the first framework-driven guide to treating energy the way sound financial systems treat money. Not as a mood to manage, but as a resource to audit, allocate, and protect. This is the ultimate Both/And conversation: individual accountability AND organizational responsibility are not competing; they are sequential. And when your energy reserves are depleted, empathy is the first thing to go. Protecting your energy is not self-indulgence. It is what makes sustained empathetic leadership possible. Take a listen.To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…How you, yourself, are a finite resource and why self-knowledge is essential so you can put a name to what needs to changeThe inputs, outputs, reserves, and deficits people have in their livesAuditing your energy economy from an individual and an organizational lensWhy an entrepreneurial role may be a different energy tax than working for a traditional 9-to-5The one question all leaders should ask instead of “How is my team doing?” "Individual awareness without structural change just makes people more conscious of a system that is still depleting them. So at some point, the role or the system has to be on trial, not the person." —  Claire Mia BurnettFrom Our Sponsor:Check out this offer from our sponsor, Better Benefits USA: Are You Overpaying for Employee Benefits Without Knowing It? Take the free 10-minute benefits audit at https://findbetterbenefits.org/Join Maria at The Rising Executive Women's Retreat, Nov. 4-7. Use code "Edge500" to get $500.00 off! https://retreat.therisingmastermind.com/ Episode References: Leah Ruppanner, et al. “The Invisible Work Draining Your Best Employees” (Harvard Business Review, July 2026)Laura Vanderkam, 168 Hours: You Have More Time Than You ThinkAbout Claire Mia Burnett, Author, Reserve & Release | Director, Operations & Effectiveness, McKesson:Claire Mia is a coach and corporate executive specializing in organizational effectiveness and human sustainability, helping organizations improve performance without exhausting their people. Having worked with leading organizations such as McKesson, AT&T, STAPLES Center, and Anschutz Entertainment Group, and recognized as a 2025 Marquis Who’s Who honoree, she developed frameworks that address how workplace systems impact human energy. Her book, Reserve & Release: Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves, introduces a framework for managing energy like money—as a resource to audit, allocate, and protect.Connect with Claire:Claire Cut Consulting: reserveandrelease.comLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/clairemiaInstagram: @reserveandreleaseBook + Free chapter: Reserve & Release: Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves: reserveandrelease.com/edge Connect with Maria:BooksSpeakerLearning Courses 1 and 2LinkedInInstagramFacebookCourtesy of our sponsor, JLG Lawyers - Download "The Human Middle," Your free guide to resolving workplace conflict: https://thehumanmiddle.ai/ Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

Maria Ross and Rob Volpe are back! Today, we talk about empathy like it's an emotion: something that washes over you, or doesn't. But what if you don't feel it? Does that make you bad at empathy?The science doesn't offer a tidy answer. Some researchers show empathy is deeply felt, sometimes so intensely it leads to burnout. Others argue it's a choice we make, turned up or down depending on who's in front of us and what it might cost us. And at least one prominent thinker says we'd be better off with less empathy and more compassion.Maria and Rob unpack the difference between cognitive empathy, affective empathy, and compassion. They explore whether these are different entry points rather than a sequence, depending on how we are wired.And they wrestle with a big question: if you can act with compassion simply because it's the right thing to do, where does empathy fit in?To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…The difference between cognitive empathy, affective empathy, and compassionWhy empathy and compassion light up different parts of the brain, and why that matters for burnoutWhether empathy is something you're born with or something you can buildHow motivation and social norms shape how much empathy we feelActing with compassion when you don't "feel" empathy, and why that still countsHow leaders can find their natural entry point and strengthen the others "If you don't have the empathy with somebody, you're never going to be able to accurately imagine what they're doing. Empathy is not mind reading. Empathy is about connection; it's not predicting the future." - Rob VolpeFrom Our Sponsor:Check out this offer from our sponsor, Better Benefits USA: Are You Overpaying for Employee Benefits Without Knowing It? Take the free 10-minute benefits audit at https://findbetterbenefits.org/Episode References: Rob's newsletter: readingbetweenthelines.beehiiv.com/p/the-real-answerMaria's newsletter: red-slice.com/newsletterWhy Trait Empathy Is the Wrong MeasureChoosing Empathy: Conversation with Jamil ZakiJamil Zaki, "Choosing Empathy" (Edge.org conversation, with a response from Paul Bloom)Jamil Zaki, "Empathy: A Motivated Account" (Psychological Bulletin, 2014)Erik Nook, Jamil Zaki, et al., "Prosocial Conformity: Prosocial Norms Generalize Across Behavior and Empathy" (Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 2016)Geoff Thomas and Gregory Maio, "Man, I Feel Like a Woman: When and How Gender-Role Motivation Helps Mind-Reading" (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2008)Tania Singer and Olga Klimecki, "Empathy and Compassion" (Current Biology, 2014)Klimecki et al., compassion and empathy training studyKarla McLaren, "Why Trait Empathy Is the Wrong Measure" (Psychology Today)Paul Bloom, Against Empathy: The Case for Rational CompassionJessica Tarlov,  I Disagree: Winning Arguments Without Losing FriendsAbout Rob Volpe:Rob Volpe is the Founder/CEO of Empathy Activist and the creator of The 5 Steps to Empathy, which he chronicles in his award-winning book Tell Me More About That: Solving the Empathy Crisis One Conversation at a Time. He is a recognized thought leader,  speaker, and consultant in the improvement of communication and collaboration in organizations of all sizes in all industries.Connect with Rob:Website: robvolpe.expertBook: Tell Me More About That: Solving the Empathy Crisis One ConversationX: x.com/rmvolpeLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/rmvolpeFacebook: facebook.com/EmpathyActivistInstagram: instagram.com/empathy_activist Connect with Maria:BooksSpeakerLearning Courses 1 and 2LinkedInInstagramFacebookCourtesy of our sponsor, JLG Lawyers - Download "The Human Middle," Your free guide to resolving workplace conflict: https://thehumanmiddle.ai/ Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge

Here is a stat that should make every leader uncomfortable: most companies are overpaying for employee healthcare while their employees are still underserved, afraid to use it, and one medical bill away from a crisis. My guest today is Dan Cosgrove, CEO of Better Benefits USA. Dan spent over a decade at some of the most iconic companies in the world before channeling that expertise into healthcare. His mission is simple and urgent: close the gap on care, cost, and coverage for hardworking Americans.Dan makes the case that better employee healthcare is not just the right thing to do; it is one of the smartest business decisions a leader can make. We get into how employers can actually lower costs while improving the care their employees receive by leveraging tax codes and building plans that prioritize preventative care. We talk about why the status quo feels safe but is actually costing you, and why treating employees as individuals rather than offering cookie-cutter benefits is not just empathetic; it is what they now expect. And Dan shares the story of one nonprofit in New York that took the leap and is now saving approximately 1.2 million dollars per year, which they are reinvesting directly back into their mission.If you have ever thought better benefits were out of reach for your organization, Dan is about to change your mind completely. To access the episode transcript, go to www.TheEmpathyEdge.com and search by episode title.Listen in for…Why your employee benefits package may be costing your employees and your business.The ROI of changing the way your organization does healthcare. Why we need to think about our healthcare system as three things: a sword, a shield, and a safety net. "Employee health plans should not be a one size fits all. It should be customization and curation based on meeting the people where they are in life. So that's where I talk about dignity. Understand the individual." —  Dan CosgroveFrom Our Sponsor:Check out this offer from our sponsor, Better Benefits USA: Are You Overpaying for Employee Benefits Without Knowing It? Take the free 10-minute benefits audit at https://findbetterbenefits.org/ Episode References: Take the free audit at www.findbetterbenefits.org  Rich Dad, Poor Dad by Robert T. Kiyosaki and Sharon L. LechterTax Free Wealth by Tom WheelwrightForbes Article: Your Employees Aren’t Resisting Change. Their Brains AreAbout Dan Cosgrove, CEO, Better Benefits, USA:Dan spent over a decade at Procter and Gamble, Berkshire Hathaway, and Nike before he broke away to focus on his passion for healthcare. The first healthcare company he started broke $4m in under three years. Now his nonprofit Better Benefits USA was just recognized by P&G as one of the top ten companies run by P&G alumni. His group is all about disrupting our broken healthcare system, so hopefully a few insights he shares today can be really helpful for you as well!Connect with Dan:Better Benefits USA: betterbenefitsusa.org LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/myhealthandwealth LinkedIn: linkedin.com/company/bestemployeebenefits  Connect with Maria:Get Maria's books: Red-Slice.com/booksHire Maria to speak: Red-Slice.com/Speaker-Maria-RossTake the LinkedIn Learning Courses! Leading with Empathy and Balancing Empathy, Accountability, and Results as a Leader LinkedIn: Maria RossInstagram: @redslicemariaFacebook: Red SliceCourtesy of our sponsor, JLG Lawyers - Download "The Human Middle," Your free guide to resolving workplace conflict: https://thehumanmiddle.ai/ Pick up Maria's latest book "The Empathy Dilemma" here- https://red-slice.com/the-empathy-dilemma-book/Get your free chapter of Clare Mia's book RESERVE & RELEASE, Rewriting the Hidden Rules of How We Spend Ourselves here- http://Reserveandrelease.com/edge