Episode 303 with Anthony Gedell, Author of Love Lies in the Throes of Rhetoric, and Brilliant Creator of Worlds Internal and External, and Dystopia in its Macro and Micro

Notes and Links to Anthony Gedell’s Work       ANTHONY GEDELL writes from New Jersey publishing in Hobart, Poverty House, Variant, Revolution John, Punk Noir Magazine, and Bull. His debut novel, Love Lies in the Throes of Rhetoric, was released in October 2024. Buy Love Lies in the Throes of Rhetoric   Anthony's Instagram   Anthony’s Writing for Hobart Pulp   Video Review for Love Lies in the Throes of Rhetoric   At about 1:40, Pete and Anthony talk about inspirations for the podcast At about 3:00, Anthony talks about how teaching informs his writing, and vice versa, with observations on  At about 5:20, Anthony talks about being a concerted listener and always being cognizant of “getting into the room” of wonderful writers and writing conversations At about Anthony talks about the ways in which he and the book’s significance have evolved in the year since publication   At about 8:40, Anthony talks about ideas of “writing from comfortability" and  At about 9:40, Anthony responds to Pete’s question about what texts have resonated with his students, which includes a major shout out for Eli Cranor At about 13:00, Anthony highlights Of Mice and Men as one example of “high intensity emotion” that moves/interests readers  At about 14:50, Anthony cites Marlon James saying that “the new American novel is the crime novel” and talks about the “writer as journalist” in discussing ideas of writing dystopian in a dystopian world and “writing towards genre”  At about 20:10, Pete and Anthony discuss ideas of the continuity of writers and writing over the centuries  At about 25:00, Anthony expands on ideas of nihilism in contemporary society  At about 31:00, Pete reads the Ecclesiastes, Ch 9, Verse 4, the introduction for Love Lies in the Throes of Rhetoric At about 32:20, Anthony responds to Pete’s questions about the book’s opening and significance for the rest of the book At about 35:00, Anthony talks about lessons and questions brought out in Biblical passages At about 36:00, Pete responds to Anthony’s questions about how Anthony’s novel is evocative of Catholic/catholic themes At about 39:30, Anthony shares moving connections in real-life and in the novel and ideas of misery and tragedy and compassion  At about 43:40, the two discuss the “snare” trope and how Eudora has been seen in two ways by a lot of readers, and Anthony shouts out Light Years by James Salter-its beautiful sentences and the possibility of Nedra in Salter’s book as a “snare character” At about 48:50, The two connect meaningful scenes and quotes from the novel to memorable Scripture At about 49:50, Anthony responds to Pete’s musings about the interesting “too young to feel this old” after Pete rambles about a writing project that “got away” At about 52:40, Anthony references Conrad in talking about nihilism and hopelessness, particularly with regard to Trasc and Eudora, the book’s protagonists  At about 55:25, Pete compliments Anthony’s use of “snappy dialogue” and asks Anthony about ideas of impotence, especially as seen with Trasc and Eudora At about 1:00:15, Anthony details particular scenes and reflects on some meanings that come from the portraits of masculinity  At about 1:04:30, Trasc and his sensitive nature is discussed, and Anthony talks about   At about 1:06:30, Anthony talks cryptically and profoundly on the writing process for his novel and quotes a memorable line from Salter’s Light Years At about 1:09:30, Pete and Anthony stan Who’s Afraid of Virginia Wolff? and talk about the play’s “dialectical violence”   At about 1:12:00, Anthony reflects on his writing style and the place from which he writes and how boredom and “soccer dad” literature enervates  At about 1:14:50, a quote from the novel leads to the two dissecting David Foster Wallace’s work and its significance, and some texts that are thought to be overly celebrated   At about 1:18:00, Anthony reflects on dystopia, worldbuilding, and “collective human behaviors” and how the physical atmosphere he creates can shadow feelings and characters’ characteristics  At about 1:23:00, Anthony emphasizes the intentionality of the writing in the novel,  while at the same time allowing for the speculation that comes with the uncertain world and readers’ experiences At about 1:24:40, the two reflect on Biblical connections to revelation and Revelation and dystopia and apocalypse  At about 1:26:40, Anthony responds to Pete’s question about “The Court” and connection the Greek Chorus      You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content!    This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place.    Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 304 with Erin Somers, a writer, reporter, and book critic based in the Hudson Valley. Her fiction, essays, and criticism have appeared in The New York Times Magazine, Esquire, Best American Short Stories, and elsewhere.      Her second novel, The Ten Year Affair, was named a most anticipated book by The New York Times, The Washington Post, Vulture, Bustle, LitHub, W Magazine, Orion, and Our Culture, and it will be published by Simon & Schuster on October 21, the date the episode airs.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Ellen Birkett Morris’ Work        Ellen Birkett Morris is the author of Beware the Tall Grass, winner of the Donald L. Jordan Award for Literary Excellence, judged by Lan Samantha Chang, published by CSU Press. She is also the author of Lost Girls: Short Stories, winner of the Pencraft Award and finalist for the Clara Johnson, IAN and Best Book awards. Her fiction has appeared in Shenandoah, Antioch Review, Saturday Evening Post, and South Carolina Review, among other journals. She is a winner of the Bevel Summers Prize for short fiction. Morris is a recipient of an Al Smith Fellowship for her fiction from the Kentucky Arts Council.    Morris is also the author of Abide and Surrender, poetry chapbooks. Her poetry has appeared in The Clackamas Literary Review, Juked, Gastronomica, and Inscape, among other journals, and in eight anthologies. Morris won top prize in the 2008 Binnacle Ultra-Short Edition and was a finalist for the 2019 and 2020 Rita Dove Poetry Prize. Her poem “Abide” was featured on NPR’s A Way with Words. Her essays have appeared in The New York Times, Newsweek, AARP’s The Ethel, Oh Reader magazine, and on National Public Radio.    Morris holds an MFA in creative writing from Queens University-Charlotte. She attended the Kentucky Women Writers Conference on fellowship and teaches creative writing at The Virginia Piper Center at ASU in Tempe, Arizona and The Carnegie Center for Literacy and Learning in Lexington, Kentucky. Morris has spoken and taught at the 2018 Antioch Writers Workshop, 2019 Kentucky Women Writers Conference, 2022 Writer’s Block Festival and 2022 Louisville Book Festival. Buy Beware the Tall Grass   Ellen's Website   Review of Beware the Tall Grass from Heavy Feather Review  At about 3:40, Ellen responds to Pete’s question about receiving the Donald L. Jordan Award for Beware the Tall Grass At about 5:30, Ellen talks about the different resonance the book has a year plus after its publication; she highlights feedback from people with interesting comments about the continuing resonance of the Vietnam War At about 7:10, Ellen provides a summary of the novel At about 8:20, Ellen relays seeds for the book, particularly based on a NPR segment from 2014 At about 10:30, Ellen responds to Pete’s questions about any cynicism in exploring the stories of past lives’ remembrance, and she expands on how she dealt with the spiritual/reincarnation  At about 12:45, Pete and Ellen stan over Andrew Porter’s (Episode 294 guest) The Imagined Life At about 13:25, Ellen speaks beautifully of her mother as an “advocate”  At about 14:50, Ellen talks about how she put into practice the saying about “put your characters into trouble,” particularly with regard to Eve, one of two protagonists, and her mother  At about 16:05, The two discuss the exposition for main character and one of two narrators, Thomas, and how the loss of his horse affects him  At about 18:00, Ellen describes the agony in writing a particularly brutal and sad scene from the book At about 19:00, The two discuss Eve’s friend, Amy, and ideas of peace and tranquility  At about 20:00, Ellen reflects on the “hasty decision” pointed out by Pete, made by both Thomas in the novel and in real-life, for those who signed up for the army At about 21:30, Ellen talks about Dan in the novel and his family history that makes him act more logical even when the surreal comes out At about 23:00, The two discuss Thomas’ decision to enlist for Vietnam, and how it was perhaps subtly influenced by his father’s past service At about 24:00, We Were Soldiers Once and Young and Ellen’s uncle and soldiers' logs are cited as inspirations for Ellen’s writing At about 26:00, Pete lays out some of Charlie’s  At about 27:00, Ellen reflects on Carrie’s faith in Thomas’ coming back safe from Vietnam At about 27:40, The two reflect on connections in the novel to Tim O’Brien’s The Things They Carried At about 28:50, The two discuss two crises that bring much stress to Eve At about 29:50, Ellen talks about a caustic and “sinister” fellow soldier of Thomas’ and giving him some “roundness” At about 31:30, Ellen talks about the emotional difficulty in writing a death in the novel At about 34:40, Ellen cites her poet background as she discusses the book’s titular metaphor and its multiple uses, and she describes the background of the book’s cover  At about 37:45, The two discuss family histories and shared traits over the generations in discussing Charlie’s channeling of past traumas  At about 39:00,   At about 41:00, Pete asks Ellen about regression theory and therapists who deal with those thought to be experiencing past lives At about 43:20, Ellen responds to Pete’s question about how home and Carrie and his child on the way inspire Thomas; Ellen tells an anecdote about almost changing POVs in the novel At about 44:30, Ellen talks about balancing the personal and the geopolitical in drawing up the Vietnam War scenes At about 46:40, The two discuss the idea of the story that repeats itself throughout the generations, and Ellen describes a moving and profound trip to Ireland that shows the “continuity of history” You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content! This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place. Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 303 with Amber Sparks, the author of the short story collections And I Do Not Forgive You and The Unfinished World. Her writing has appeared in The Paris Review, Granta, Slate, and elsewhere.    This episode airs on October 14, Pub Day for her novel Happy People Don’t Live Here.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Nishant Batsha’s Work       Nishant Batsha is the author of the novel A Bomb Placed Close to the Heart (ecco/HarperCollins). Set between California and New York at the dawn of World War I, A Bomb Placed Close to the Heart is an expansive and poignant story of love, radical ambition, and intellectual rebirth—all drawn from a lost American history.   His first novel, Mother Ocean Father Nation (ecco/HarperCollins) was a finalist for 2023 Lambda Literary Award, longlisted for a 2023 Mark Twain American Voice in Literature Award, and named one of the best books of 2022 by NPR. It also won Honorable Mention in the prose category of the 2024 Association for Asian American Studies (AAAS) Book Awards.   He is currently at work on a third novel. This project has received monetary support from The de Groot Foundation and the New York State Council on the Arts.   Nishant holds a PhD in history from Columbia University where he was a Paul & Daisy Soros Fellow. He also works as a ghostwriter for public officials, CEOs, and leaders across various industries. Material he has ghostwritten has appeared in the New York Times and Politico, among other publications. He lives in Buffalo, NY with his wife and two children. Buy A Bomb Placed Close to the Heart   Nishant's Website   BookPage Review for A Bomb Placed Close to the Heart   Interview for Los Angeles Review of Books   At about 1:15, Nishant gives purchasing info for his novel At about 1:45, Nishant talks about his childhood connections to language and literature  At about 4:15, Nishant recounts how he began to embrace history and becoming a historian  At about 7:20, Nishant responds to Pete’s comments about connections between his main character Cora and him and other writers with regard to “the intoxication” of writing finding audience At about 9:20, Nishant talks about history and literature and “seeking out sameness”  At about 10:30, Nishant talks about being “so taken” by Marilyn Robinson’s Gilead At about 11:40, Nishant shouts out as writers who have thrilled and inspired him, including Sebald and Han Kang At about 14:30, Nishant reflects on Conrad’s Heart of Darkness At about 16:50, Pete asks Nishant about seeds for the book At about 19:00, Nishant lays out much of the work of M.N. Roy and Evelyn Trent, inspirations for the book’s protagonists, Indra and Cora At about 22:05, Nishant talks about research for his book At about 24:25, Pete lays out some of the book’s exposition At about 25:30, Nishant responds to Pete’s question about what draws Indra and Cora together  At about 28:10, Nishant reflects on the “in-betweeness” of Cora and how she connects to Indra At about 32:25, Nishant gives background on the Ghadar Party, which is so important in the novel At about 35:15, Nishant responds to Pete’s question about how Indra saw “action” and resistance  At about 38:40, Nishant outlines how he sees the novel as a sort of “parlor drama” At about 39:45, Nishant explains the significance of Indra receiving being called “cosmopolitan” as a compliment  At about 42:30, The two discuss the etymology of the term “cosmopolitan” At about 44:40, Pete and Nishant reflect on ideas of consumerism and creativity, and Nishant gives background on the real-life Rachel Crothers At about 46:25, The two discuss the contradictions of Dawson in the novel, based on David Starr Jordan and his views on anti-imperialism and eugenics  At about 49:40, the two reflect on the “strange and weird ideas” of the late 19th and early 20th centuries-a “heady time” and connections to the US military in the Philippines  At about 50:45, Scullion (based on John Osborne Varian) and his views of political and cultural change are discussed, in how the beliefs affect Indra At about 54:00, Nishant discusses ideas of class and caste in connection with Indra At about 58:15, Nishant traces the real-life connection between M.N. Roy and Bal Gangadhar Tilak At about 1:00:20, Nishant reflects on lies as a throughline of the novel, and the “danger” of the lie At about 1:01:20, Pete notes the universal and singular beauty of the book At about 1:02:00, Pete shares one of many examples of the beautiful sentences in the novel, and Nishant talks about his philosophy of writing-sentence length, etc.  At about 1:05:00, Nishant talks about the history and significance of the novel’s title You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content! This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place. Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 302 with Ellen Birkett Morris, a second-time guest and the author of Beware the Tall Grass, winner of the Donald L. Jordan Award for Literary Excellence, judged by Lan Samantha Chang, published by CSU Press. She is also the author of Lost Girls: Short Stories, winner of the Pencraft Award and finalist for the Clara Johnson, IAN and Best Book awards. Her essays have appeared in The New York Times, Newsweek, AARP’s The Ethel, Oh Reader magazine, and on National Public Radio. This episode airs on October 7. Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Nathan Thrall’s Work       Nathan Thrall is an American writer living in Jerusalem. In 2024, he received the Pulitzer Prize for General Nonfiction for A Day in the Life of Abed Salama. An international bestseller, it was translated into more than thirty languages, selected as a New York Times Book Review Editors’ Choice, and named a best book of the year by over twenty publications, including The New Yorker, The Economist, and Time. He is also the author of The Only Language They Understand. His reporting, essays, and criticism have appeared in the London Review of Books, The Guardian, The New York Times Magazine, and The New York Review of Books. He spent a decade at the International Crisis Group, where he was director of the Arab-Israeli Project, and has taught at Bard College.  Buy A Day in the Life of Abed Salama: Anatomy of a Jerusalem Tragedy   Nathan's Website   2021 The New York Review of Books Article: “A Day in the Life of Abed Salama”   At about 1:15, Nathan recounts the experience of winning the Pulitzer Prize, and notes the wonderful ways in which the book’s protagonists and others close to him have celebrated the achievement  At about 3:20, Nathan provides purchasing info and book details  At about 4:15, Nathan responds to Pete’s question about the added significance of the book being published on October 3, 2023, four days before a pivotal event At about 6:30, Nathan reflects on how “nothing [much] has changed” regarding the organizations (the “gatekeepers”) who cancelled events with him and Abed Salama, with perhaps more of these organizations digging in on standing with Israel At about 9:30, Nathan notes that “organized political money” is all on one side in the “corrupt political system” At about 12:35, Pete wonders about the “tail wagging the dog” regarding the voting public and the politicians, and Nathan expands upon the reasoning and details for this “gap” At about 14:35, Pete asks Nathan about seeds for the book, and about how the book speaks to the idea that the Israeli/Palestinian conflict did not start on October 7, 2023 At about 15:35, Nathan explains the apartheid and “walled ghetto” at the center of the book, and talks about how this ghetto is a microcosm for Israeli policy At about 18:30, Nathan responds to Pete’s questions about and admiration for his objective hand in writing the book At about 20:45, Pete sets the book’s exposition At about 21:45, Nathan notes the “striking” fact of talking to parents with their “unwarranted” guilt since the bus accident, in response to Pete wondering about Nathan’s broaching such a horrible topic with survivors At about 24:05, The two reflect on the innocence of youth as Nathan recounts the details of parents and family looking for their children and relatives after the bus accident At about 27:30, Nathan explains how just the telling of the basics of Abed’s story, including his odyssey just to find his son in the hospital, was to “tell of apartheid” At about 29:00, Pete compliments the ways in which Nathan’s tracing Abed’s childhood and youth and Nathan expounds on how the personal stories have the reader see “the world through [the character’s eyes]” At about 31:45, Nathan shares a recent experience that shows how life is micromanaged for Palestinians in Israel, revolving around a bridge crossing for Abed, his wife Haifa, and Nathan At about 34:45, Pete asks Nathan to explain the colored-permit system involving Palestinian ID cards and how the intifadas changed the processes, including for Abed At about 39:50, Pete and Nathan talk about different Palestinian cultural and political factions, as described in the book At about 40:30, Nathan explains “bypass roads” and the ways in which they represent Israeli control of Palestinians' lives; in so doing, he points out inaccuracies in the ways that democracy and Israel have often been linked  At about 47:35, Nathan expands on “fabric of life roads” and “sterile roads”-brutally racist as an official name-and “gerrymandering”-mapping-done by Dany Tirza, featured pretty prominently in the book At about 50:05, Nathan talks about schooling for Palestinians and how Israeli control is rendered in the book-he describes the "forensic analysis” of the bus accident and homes in on the forced walling-in of Palestinians  At about 53:00, Nathan further explains land use and land possession as strategies  At about 54:35, Pete remarks on the banal of the Israeli Occupation and asks Nathan’s thoughts on the “reverberations” of Israel’s seemingly-small and detailed actions/policy of moving the Palestinians out  At about 58:00, Nathan responds to Pete’s questions about how an average Jewish Israeli lives his/her life with “informational apartheid”  At about 1:01:05, Nathan states the common narrative about Israel’s history and the continued bloodshed for average Israelis At about 1:04:15, Nathan recounts an anecdote about a publishing company that has asked him multiple questions about early Israeli history  At about 1:06:05, Nathan reflects on the task of sitting with parents and relatives during the emotionally-wrenching times and listening to their stories     You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content!    This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place.    Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 301 with Nishant Batsha, the author of the novel A Bomb Placed Close to the Heart, his 2025 novel set between California and New York at the dawn of World War I. His first novel, Mother Ocean Father Nation was a finalist for 2023 Lambda Literary Award, longlisted for a 2023 Mark Twain American Voice in Literature Award, and named one of the best books of 2022 by NPR.    This episode airs on October 7.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Matthew Boedy’s Work        Matthew Boedy has written for many publications and authored three books. He's appeared on CNN and MSNBC and in The New York Times, The Washington Post, and other media outlets.    He has been a leader in faculty organizing since 2020 as president of the Georgia conference of the American Association of University Professors, a national higher education advocacy group.     He completed his Ph.D. in English in 2015 at the University of South Carolina where he also received in 2010 a master's in creative writing. He most prizes his bachelor's degree in journalism in 2001 from the University of Florida and his work at the campus newspaper, the Independent Florida Alligator.     He is a full professor of rhetoric at the University of North Georgia. He researches and writes about religious rhetoric, particularly in the last few years about the rise of Christian Nationalism.     Buy The Seven Mountains Mandate: Exposing the Dangerous Plan to Christianize America and Destroy Democracy     Matthew's Website   Matthew Speaks on WBUR’s “Here and Now” on The Seven Mountains Mandate   Article from Mother Jones: “His Book on Charlie Kirk Was About to Come Out. Then His Subject Was Murdered.   At about 1:50, Matthew responds to Pete’s question about “exercising different muscles” in writing fiction, academic, and journalism At about 3:15, Matthew gives information on his book-publisher, summary, etc. At about 5:00, Matthew gives background on the book’s title and subtitle in cover in response to Pete’s question about added resonance for the book since Charlie Kirk’s murder At about 8:25, Matthew responds to Pete’s question about what Matthew has learned about the Turning Point and Charlie Kirk’s influence as seen from outside the United States   At about 10:20, Matthew discusses seeds for the book At about 11:40, Matthew talks about why he wrote two Prefaces for the book, and how the 2024 Presidential Election was a huge turning point for Turning Point At about 12:45, Pete and Matthew trace the book’s opening timeline and its significance in tracing the history of the Seven Mountains Mandate  At about 13:55, Matthew summarizes the Seven Mountains Mandates and talks about Charlie Kirk’s “conversion” to the philosophy   At about 17:25, Matthew reflects on whether or not Charlie Kirk’s “religious fervor” was authentic and on his turn to Christian nationalism  At about 19:45, Matthew responds to Pete’s musings about the connection between “grifting” and Charlie Kirk’s career At about 21:00, Matthew talks about the connections between the prosperity gospel and the Seven Mountains Mandate At about 22:15, Pete lays out some of the book’s early writing on Project 2025, and Matthew expands on its connection to the mandate At about 23:30, Matthew emphasizes how the book is a lot about post-January 6 and connections to the “Mountain of Government" At about 24:10, Matthew talks about Bill Bright and Loren Cunningham and some early iterations of the mandate  At about 27:25, Sara Diamond's prescient writing on the mandates is discussed  At about 29:15, Pete uses a unique analogy to ask Matthew about the ideas of mandates, and Matthew makes a key point about the Mandate as being part of a “minority movement”  At about 32:10, Matthew reflects on Trump’s connection to the Mandate and the movement and mutual benefits At about 33:30, Pete and Matthew discuss a staggering stat about American’s beliefs in and knowledge of the Mandate At about 34:25, Matthew responds to Pete’s question about Charlie Kirk’s death and its influence on religious conversion and political engagement  At about 35:20, Matthew talks about Charlie Kirk’s role in fulfilling a hole for many millennials and Gen Z and young men, particularly with reradds to a religious direction and “finding [one’s] purpose] At about 36:45, Pete asks Matthew about ideas of nonengagement and engagement and connections to Christian fundamentalism  At about 40:10, Matthew explains the “salt and light” metaphor often used by proponents of the Mandate At about 41:10, Matthew talks about Jimmy Carter’s “falling out” with evangelicals  At about 43:00, The two discuss the naming of the mandate and tracing the history of the title/metaphor At about 44:20, Matthew talks about his personal experiences and those others who have been listed on the Professors’ Watchlist At about 47:00, Matthew traces Charlie Kirk’s connections and contradictions involving higher education, as well as his “origin story” At about 49:40, Matthew recounts a memorable trip to a TPUSA event at the University of GA where higher ed was ridiculed   At about 51:05, Matthew reflects on connections between state budgets and philosophies on public school and voucher programs  At about 52:40, Matthew discusses distinctions between “republic” vs. “democracy” and notes important links to the Mandate At about 56:15, Matthew reflects on the usage and meanings of “stewardship” in certain circles  At about 57:30, Matthew responds to Pete’s question about Charlie Kirk’s seemingly-contradictory attitude towards Israel and Jewish people   At about 1:00:05, Pete and Matthew talks about ideas of manhood and male bonding and “warrior” archetypes and TPUSA’s tokenization and abuse towards minorities of all types  At about 1:02:55, Matthew discusses Erika Kirk’s trapeze act of being an emboldened and powerful businesswoman and political force, as well as complementary partner/“stay in the home” woman and mother At about 1:05:15, Pete quotes a line about Charlie Kirk astutely learning how to “erase history,” and Matthew discussed particular mentors who taught him this lesson At about 1:07:30, Conspiracy theories and religious connections to the Mandate are discussed, including how The Great Reset as a conspiracy was hyped and sidelined by TPUSA  At about 1:08:50, Andrew Breitbart and Jon Root as representative of the Entertainment Mandate are discussed  At about 1:10:25, Matthew discusses Benny Johnson and the “cultural buckets” that have been repurposed through meme culture At about 1:11:55, Matthew talks about Neil Postman’s book, Amusing Ourselves to Death, and its close connection to the Seven Mountains Mandate and politics as entertainment  At about 1:12:55, the two discuss the “pomp and circumstance” that pervades politics, including the proposed UFC fight at the White House At about 1:14:55, Pete asks Matthew about the idea of Charlie Kirk’s possible future as a “martyr”      You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content!    This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place.    Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.    Please tune in for Episode 300 with Nathan Thrall, an American writer living in Jerusalem. In 2024, he received the Pulitzer Prize for General Nonfiction for A Day in the Life of Abed Salama. An international bestseller, it was translated into more than thirty languages, selected as a New York Times Book Review Editors’ Choice, and named a best book of the year by over twenty publications, including The New Yorker, The Economist, and Time. He spent a decade at the International Crisis Group, where he was director of the Arab-Israeli Project, and has taught at Bard College.     The episode airs on September 30, and Pete is thrilled and stunned to make it to Episode 300. Thanks to all of those who have helped him make it to 300 episodes.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Robert Paylor’s Work     Robert Paylor was paralyzed from the neck down during the collegiate rugby national championship after a spinal cord injury left him with a prognosis that he would never walk or move his hands again. Refusing to accept that fate, Robert embarked on an extraordinary journey of recovery, re-learning life’s most basic functions and defying the odds to walk again. Now an inspirational speaker and author, Robert shares his powerful story and the mental tools that helped him overcome quadriplegia with organizations worldwide. Through his keynote, Paralyzed to Powerful, Robert inspires audiences to conquer what “paralyzes” them and turn their adversity into triumph.    Buy Paralyzed to Powerful: Lessons from a Quadriplegic's Journey   Robert's Website   Book Coverage and Article about Robert’s Journey in The Guardian   Robert's TED Talk: "Lessons in resilience from a quadriplegic"    At about 2:25, Robert talks about the four-month journey since the book has been published At about 3:25, Robert responds to Pete’s question about how he endeavored to make his individual story universal and widely-relatable At about 4:35, Robert expands on the genesis of the book’s structure, and why he needed to balance storyline and reader takeaways At about 7:00, Robert reflects on the writing process and knowing when a writing project is done (or not) At about 10:45, Robert talks about seeds for the book, and ideas of what the plan is for his life At about 11:45, Robert details the injury that led to his paralysis At about 17:00, Robert talks about “controlling [his] mindset” upon being so severely injured  At about 21:15, Robert responds to Pete’s question about the incredible support and love shown by his brother and friends At about 23:45, Robert talks about a key turning point at age 12 in raising the level of his aggression and success in sports At about 26:50, Robert expands upon an interesting and inspirational idea in setting goals, “moving from right to left” At about 31:00, Robert shares how hard it was to write about such personal pain, catharsis, and how the phrase “no tears in the writer, no tears in the reader” informed his writing At about 33:50, Robert gives more detail on the idea of the “mental diet” and using it to help bring progress At about 34:45, Robert describes the “relief” provided for the reader and for Robert through an impromptu hospital visit by Bill Murray At about 37:15, Robert and Pete talk about underrated scenes and quotes from Forrest Gump, and Robert describes marathon viewings of the movie in the hospital and ideas of destiny and deeds At about 38:40, Robert remarks on the beauty and selflessness of Joyce Zuidema and Talon Bonnano and those who prayed for Robert, as he also reflects on ideas of inspiration and comparison  At about 43:10, Robert talks about “get to v. have to” as a paradigm for his recovery and inspiration At about 45:25, Robert responds to Pete’s question about not wanting to be referred to in certain ways regarding disabilities  At about 46:30, The two discuss the “fraternity” of rugby and wonderful mentors and friends and coaches At about 47:40, Robert reflects on ideas of forgiveness and the rage he felt and has felt after his injury was caused by an illegal move  At about 51:20, Robert expands on the ways in which USA Rugby “neglect[ed] their duties” and Coach Jack Clark and Robert’s family At about 53:45, Robert responds to Pete’s comments and the question of “how [he’s] overcome” versus “what [he’s] overcome” At about 55:55, Robert talks about ideas of failures and successes and living with “joy, positivity, and “purpose”      You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.      Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content!    This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place.    Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.    Please tune in for Episode 299 with Matthew Boedy, who has written for many publications and authored three books. He's appeared on CNN and MSNBC and in The New York Times, The Washington Post, and other media outlets.    The episode airs on September 30, Pub Day for The Seven Mountains Mandate: Exposing the Dangerous Plan to Christianize America and Destroy Democracy.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Cynthia Miller-Idriss’ Work       Cynthia Miller-Idriss is the author of Hate in the Homeland: The New Global Far Right and Man Up: The New Misogyny and the Rise of Violent Extremism. She is an opinion columnist for MSNBC and writes for The New York Times, The Atlantic, Foreign Affairs, The Washington Post, Politico, USA Today, The Boston Globe, and more. Buy Man Up: The New Misogyny and the Rise of Violent Extremism   Cynthia's Website   At about 1:25, Cynthia talks about the run-up to Pub Day, and how it’s different than for her previous books At about 3:00, Pete asks Cynthia about the unfortunate “timeliness” of her work, especially the book At about 5:45, the two discuss seeds for the book, as Cynthia expands on the Turning Point Suffragist Museum and its history and importance At about 7:35, the two discuss the not-so-distant history of misogyny and Simone de Beauvoir, and rising "hostile sexism and misogyny” in the social media and outside world At about 9:55, Cynthia talks about the silence that often is pervasive regarding “gender policing” how misogyny must be central in more explorations of violence  At about 12:05, Cynthia shares some insightful and profound quotes from young people regarding gender norms and expectations At about 16:35, Pete and Cynthia discuss Eliot Rodger and a recent school shooter and the ways in which the “warning signs” were so numerous for a long period of time, but resources are often hard to tap into, even from well-meaning parents and adults and friends  At about 21:25, the two discuss The Death of Expertise and ideas of “alternative facts” and a pervasive lack of trust in “experts” and government At about 23:00, Cynthia responds to Pete’s noting that she purposely avoids naming past shooters At about 25:00, the two lay out the book’s structure  At about 24:25, Pete reports some eye-popping stats of misogynist violence  At about 26:05 Cynthia and Pete reflect on the profound quote from the book that contemporary girls have “more freedom but less power, and boys less freedom and more power” At about 24:40, Cynthia discusses masculinity/sexuality paradigm shifts  At about 29:35, Cynthia and Pete laugh and almost cry regarding fitness as being claimed by the masculine right, such as with jeans-clad RFK At about 30:35, the two reflect on the moral arc of the universe and disturbing trends with Gen Z men At about 32:20, Cynthia responds to Pete reflecting on Trump voters and his misogyny and fixed and demanding gender rigidity and policing  At about 34:15, Pete notes the “intersectionality” of Christian nationalism and masculinity, and Cynthia expands on the adherents’ beliefs At about 36:15, the two discuss ideas of “containment” and visceral hatred and misogyny in hate email and chants and lashing out at women  At about 37:20, Cynthia talks about the data that charts female elected officials and hateful attacks, including from online vitriol and memes At about 39:35, Cynthia talks about people downplaying and excusing male behavior  At about 40:55, More discussion of women needing to be in the home/domestic sphere and women as a “safety net” in parts of the West, especially in the US, even up to Taylor Swift At about 42:30, Cynthia uses an anecdote from Sonia Sotomayor’s confirmation to illustrate racist/sexist policing of women and women of color At about 44:50, “bonding through slurs” and online gaming’s influence on misogyny and young men is discussed At about 48:30, The two discuss some stunning (or not) numbers about the way Andrew Tate is viewed At about 49:35, Cynthia responds to Pete’s question about what sets Andrew Tate apart  At about 52:10, Scapegoating of sexual and racial minorities is discussed, and the “spiral” of keeping children safe and QAnon, anti-vax, etc. At about 54:40, Cynthia responds to Pete asking about possible remedies in her book, and how one avoids “preaching” in talking to those who have been radicalized online and off At about 57:00, Cynthia talks about multifaceted remedies for a multifaceted issue At about 58:00, Cynthia puts a puzzling and "hilarious" and telling interaction with a young man into perspective At about 1:02:05, Cynthia shouts out resources provided in the book’s appendix, and how proceeds from the book often benefit and highlight local gender-based violence organizations       You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content!    This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place.    Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 298 with Robert Paylor, an Inspirational speaker, quadriplegia survivor, resilience expert, and author. His book is Paralyzed to Powerful:  Lessons from a Quadriplegic's Journey.    This episode airs on September 23.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Ursula Villarreal-Moura’s Work     A native of San Antonio, Texas, Ursula Villarreal-Moura is the author of two works of fiction. Her debut novel Like Happiness is a finalist for The Rudolfo Anaya Fiction Award, longlisted for The Crook’s Corner Book Prize, selected as an Indie Next Pick, and was named a Best Book of 2024 by NPR, San Francisco Chronicle, ELLE, and Them. Math for the Self-Crippling, her flash fiction story collection, was a small press bestseller and has been taught at numerous universities. Her stories, essays, and interviews can be found in Lit Hub, Electric Literature, Story, Alta Journal, and The Rumpus, among others. She is a longtime advocate of reading diversely and of Land Back.    Buy Like Happiness   Ursula's Website   Book Review for Like Happiness from NPR   At about 30:50, Ursula expands on “subverting” ideas of teenage rebelliousness and daughter/parent relationships At about 34:40, Pete talks about Happiness, M. Dominguez’s book, as an “oasis”  At about 35:15, Ursula responds to Pete’s questions about Tatum “using her voice” and revisiting past events with Mateo At about 36:20, The two discuss the initial email correspondence between Tatum and Mateo At about 37:40, Ursula responds to Pete’s question about At about 39:40, Pete remarks on the literary world’s idiosyncrasies, and Ursula shares an amazing story about the National Book Awards and some writing industry “slipper[iness]” At about 42:05, Pete and Ursula reflect on book readings and their myriad crowds; Ursula shares a cool summary of seeing Sigrid Nuñez speak   At about 44:00, Ursula expands on Pete’s wondering and asking about Mateo and Tatum’s early relationship and ideas of a platonic and perhaps unequal relationship At about 47:35, Ursula gives background on real-life parallels to the nunnery portrayed in the novel  At about 49:00, Ursula talks about the juxtaposition of Mayumi and Valeria as reflections of Tatum’s naivete and growth At about 51:10, Ursula talks about the “limbo” that governs Tatum’s reaction to early indications of Mateo’s possible womanizing At about 54:05, Pete wonders about Tatum being in denial and also aware that Mateo may be guilty of charges, and Ursula talks about the Kitty Genovese story and it “always staying with [her]” At about 55:15, Ursula expands on her interest in the “bystander effect” and how this phenomenon has played out with outreach for Gaza At about 56:50, Pete asks Ursula about the importance of Tatum staying in New York At about 59:00, Ursula responds to Pete’s question about the pull of teachers and teaching in Tatum’s life At about 1:01:30, the two discuss the phases of life and subtleties of the Mateo and Tatum relationship At about 1:02:10, Pete talks about Tatum reading Maria Luz’s account of the abuse inflicted by Mateo At about 1:3:00, Pete asks Ursula about writing the phases of the relationship  At about 1:06:00, Pete and Ursula talk about Tatum’s writing her own account of his time with Mateo and if her “ ‘complicated feelings’ ” are helping to “sanitize” Mateo’s behaviors      You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content!    This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place.    Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 297 with Cynthia Miller-Idriss, who is an opinion columnist for MSNBC and writes for The New York Times, The Atlantic, Foreign Affairs, The Washington Post, Politico, USA Today, The Boston Globe, and more. The episode airs today, Sept 16, Pub Day for Man Up: The New Misogyny and the Rise of Violent Extremism.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Wright Thompson’s Work       Widely regarded as one of the nation’s leading sports journalists, Wright Thompson is a senior writer for ESPN, an Emmy Award-winning reporter, and the executive producer of the TV show TrueSouth. He is the author of several bestselling books including Pappyland, about the storied whiskey distillery, and, most recently, The Barn: The Secret History of a Murder in Mississippi, a New York Times bestseller that confronts the haunting legacy of Emmett Till’s killing.    A Mississippi native, Thompson is at heart a southern storyteller who believes that understanding the place one lives is both an obligation and an act of love. By exploring foodways, beliefs, identities, and histories—both remembered and forgotten—he seeks to reveal the truths of the region he calls home.   Buy The Barn: The Secret History of a Murder in Mississippi   Wright Thompson's Website   Book Review for The Barn from Washington Post   At about 1:45, Wright talks about the paperback release of The Barn and feedback on the book as “resonat[ing] with readers” in an “urgent” way At about 4:10, Wright responds back to Pete’s questions about what connections he sees between the events of The Barn and contemporary politics and culture At about 7:00, The two reflect on and Wright highlights the open-casket funeral of Emmett Till At about 8:10, Wright responds to Pete’s questions about the biased/blind books that he was exposed to in his Mississippi schooling; he also highlights North Towards Home and Faulkner’s Absalom, Absalom as his favorite book of all-time    At about 10:30, Wright asks Pete about books/writers that his guests have consistently hailed as the best; Pete is unsure, but thinks right away of Toni Morrison At about 11:50, Wright shouts out Ian Toll as a favorite writer At about 12:10, Wright speaks on the best barbecue, highlighting Scott’s-Parker in Lexington, TN At about 14:30, Pete notes the myriad connections between Mississippi/Southern/cotton economy and so many disparate parts of the country and world; Wright expands upon international connections and the need to “go back across the ocean” to fully understand the events of the book and so much more history At about 17:30, the two discuss the “incredible” Gloria Dickerson and her incredible work in Drew, MS, a “stripped” town ruined by economic chains At about 19:15, Pete notes his close connection to Christopher Rufo, and Wright envisions a conversation with him and others railing against “Wokeism” about differences in Black history and CRT  At about 21:55, Wright discusses the “entry point” for The Barn, an article about the family tree for Lakers' players At about 23:00, Wright discusses an incredible connection between Avery Bradley and Chamillionaire and highlights  At about 24:00, Wright talks of his reverence for Sam Anderson, especially his work regarding Weird Al Yankovic  At about 25:05, Wright responds to Pete’s question regarding Frank DeFord, Bill Naack, Ric Telander, Gary Smith, Tom Junod, Michael Paterniti and other inspiring and chill-inducing sportswriters   At about 26:10, Pete stans Wright’s wonderful collection, The Cost of These Dreams, an incredible anthology focusing on top-tier athletes At about 27:05, Pete traces the book’s beginning, with Willie Reed seeing Emmett Till in his killers’ truck and Pete asks Wright about the titular barn and its standing as a living being in 2025 At about 29:50, Wright responds to Pete’s questions about the impunity with which white people terrorized Black people in Mississippi; he talks about a “moral test”  At about 33:35, Wright highlights family members who passed and failed the aforementioned “moral test” and ideas of all Mississippians being bound together  At about 35:30, Wright talks about history as being weaponized in recent years, versus something to be analyzed/examined with its “disparate datapoints” At about 36:40, Wright points to connections between Chicago and the Mississippi Delta At about 37:25, Wright talks about tracing the intimate last days of Emmett Till, and Keith Beauchamp’s and Jerry Mitchell’s intrepid work that inspired and lifted his own At about 40:40, Wright responds to Pete’s question about ideas  At about 42:40, Wright discusses the “death penalty” that Roy Bryant and J.W. Milam suffered after their killing of Emmett Till At about 43:45, Pete wonders about the short-term and long-term  At about 44:20, Wright connects “The Lost Cause” of the past and the Mississippi and MAGA movement of today;   he highlights great work by Sven Beckert At about 46:35, Wright traces the land history of the grid and lawmaking that led to The Barn becoming the place where Emmett Till was killed At about 49:05, Wright reflects on his attendance at a special White House commemoration  At about 50:15, Wright reflects on Emmett “Bobo” Till and how he is “not a symbol” to those eight-12 people still alive who remember him as he was  At about 51:45, Wright highlights how Mamie Till “rose to the occasion” and was such an incredible civil-rights icon and hero      You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content! This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place. Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.    Please tune in for Episode 296 with Ursula Villarreal-Moura, the author of Math for the Self-Crippling (2022), selected by Zinzi Clemmons as the Gold Line Press fiction contest winner, and Like Happiness, named a Best Book of 2024 by NPR    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.

Notes and Links to Andrew Porter’s Work     Andrew Porter is the author of four books, including the short story collection The Theory of Light and Matter (Vintage/Penguin Random House), which won the Flannery O’Connor Award for Short Fiction, the novel In Between Days (Knopf), which was a Barnes & Noble “Discover Great New Writers”  selection, an IndieBound “Indie Next” selection, and the San Antonio Express News’s “Fictional Work of the Year,” the short story collection The Disappeared (Knopf), which was longlisted for The Story Prize and the Joyce Carol Oates Prize, and the novel The Imagined Life, which was published by Knopf in April 2025. Porter’s books have been published in foreign editions in the UK, Australia, and New Zealand and translated into numerous languages, including French, Spanish, Dutch, Italian, Bulgarian, and Korean. In addition to winning the Flannery O’Connor Award, his collection, The Theory of Light and Matter,  received Foreword Magazine’s “Book of the Year” Award for Short  Fiction, was a finalist for The Steven Turner Award, The Paterson Prize  and The WLT Book Award, was shortlisted for the William Saroyan International Prize for Writing, and was selected by both The Kansas City Star and The San Antonio Express-News  as one of the “Best Books of the Year.” The recipient of a Pushcart Prize and fellowships from the James Michener-Copernicus Foundation, the W.K. Rose Foundation,  and the Helene Wurlitzer Foundation,  Porter’s  short stories have appeared in The Best American Short Stories, One Story, Ploughshares, The Southern Review, The Threepenny Review, The Missouri Review, American Short Fiction, Narrative Magazine, Epoch, Story, The Colorado Review, Electric Literature, and Texas Monthly, among others. He has had his work read on NPR’s Selected Shorts and numerous times selected as one of the Distinguished Stories of the Year by Best American Short Stories.  A graduate of the Iowa Writers’ Workshop, Porter is currently a Professor of English and Director of the Creative Writing Program at Trinity University in San Antonio.   Buy The Imagined Life   Andrew's Website   Andrew’s Wikipedia Page   Book Review for The Imagined Life from New York Times   At about 3:30, Pete makes a clumsy but heartfelt comparison between The Imagined Life and Hemingway's Old Man and the Sea and Andrew shares feedback from readers of his novel At about 5:10, Andrew responds to Pete’s question about the book’s seeds and talks about “tinker[ing]” with the book’s opening for years At about 6:45, Pete remarks on the book’s first-person account, and Andrew and Pete discuss the book’s opening and ideas of naivete and fallible parents At about 8:45, Pete asks Andrew, who expands about structuring the book and its connection to revision  At about 10:45, Pete compares the setting of the book, 1983 Fullerton, CA, to The Smashing Pumpkins’ “1979,” and Andrew discusses similarities  At about 12:30, Pete reflects on the importance of the age given to the book’s narrator and the two characterize the book’s “father” and Andrew talks about using a 70s/early 80s atmosphere through the young narrator’s lens At about 17:30, Pete summarizes an important character introduction and Andrew talks about the importance of an embarrassing faux pas by the narrator’s father that might have "professional ramifications” At about 19:30, Andrew responds to Pete’s question about the visits that Steven takes to speak with his father’s former colleagues in the present-day At about 23:20, Andrew explains connections between Proust (“Proo-st”) and the father, who is obsessed in some ways with Proust’s work; Andrew notes personal parallels between the father and Proust At about 26:10, Andrew gives background on Uncle Julian’s connection to his brother and his family  At about 27:40, Andrew responds to Pete’s questions about the importance of the book’s cabana and complicated coupling  At about 29:40, Andrew reflects on Chau’s relationship with Steven and the connection as a shared “escape from their home lives” At about 33:00, Andrew responds to Pete’s questions about fleeting beautiful moments between father and son At about 34:25, Pete wonders about how Andrew picks character names At about 36:10, Andrew discusses the narrator’s son, Finn, and his acting out in school as a function of his parents’ marital shakiness  At about 37:30, Pete asks Andrew about a pivotal party and any “ruptures” in relationships that may have followed   At about 40:00, Andrew reflects on possible foreshadowing through letters and notes left behind by Steven’s father  At about 42:40, Andrew discusses his mindset in writing an important and off-the-wall culminating scene At about 45:35, The two reflect on ideas of traumas and cycles and anger, especially with regard to Steven’s recognition of same  At about 48:30, Pete compliments the ending of the book, ideas of legacy and wonderful book timing At about 49:30, Andrew reflects on his book’s setting as key in exploring contrasts between Steven’s life then and now, as well as with the world as a whole At about 50:30, Swatch Watch discourse! and vague Bel Biv Devoe reference!      You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Stitcher, Spotify, and on Amazon Music. Follow Pete on IG, where he is @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where he is @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch other episodes on YouTube-watch and subscribe to The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. Please subscribe to both the YouTube Channel and the podcast while you’re checking out this episode.       Pete is very excited to have one or two podcast episodes per month featured on the website of Chicago Review of Books. The audio will be posted, along with a written interview culled from the audio. His conversation with Hannah Pittard, a recent guest, is up at Chicago Review.     Sign up now for The Chills at Will Podcast Patreon: it can be found at patreon.com/chillsatwillpodcastpeterriehl      Check out the page that describes the benefits of a Patreon membership, including cool swag and bonus episodes. Thanks in advance for supporting Pete’s one-man show, DIY podcast and extensive reading, research, editing, and promoting to keep this independent podcast pumping out high-quality content! This month’s Patreon bonus episode features an exploration of flawed characters, protagonists who are too real in their actions, and horror and noir as being where so much good and realistic writing takes place. Pete has added a $1 a month tier for “Well-Wishers” and Cheerleaders of the Show.     This is a passion project, a DIY operation, and Pete would love for your help in promoting what he’s convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form.    The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.     Please tune in for Episode 295 with Wright Thompson, a senior writer for ESPN, contributing writer to the Atlantic, and the New York Times bestselling author of Pappylandand The Cost of These Dreams. The Barn, a captivating story of the tragedy of Emmett Till’s racist murder, is out in paperback on the day the episode airs, today, September 9.    Please go to ceasefiretoday.org, and/or https://act.uscpr.org/a/letaidin to call your congresspeople and demand an end to the forced famine and destruction of Gaza and the Gazan people.