Episode 476: Greg Spittle talks about problem solving like an engineer, listening to your customers and gamifying active play

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning. Attending IAAPA Expo presents incredible opportunities for networking, professional development, and discovering the latest innovations in the attractions industry. However, with thousands of attendees, hundreds of exhibitors, and a packed schedule of events, maximizing the experience requires intentional planning and a willingness to embrace unexpected opportunities. For the annual AttractionPros Thrival Guide, Matt and Josh share insights from attractions industry professionals about the experiences that have shaped their careers, strengthened their relationships, and reinforced their passion for the industry. In this episode, Matt and Josh talk about building meaningful connections, stepping outside your comfort zone, discovering new opportunities, and making the most of #IAAPAExpo. Building meaningful connections "It's the people in the industry that are coming together to celebrate the industry and to keep moving the business forward." While IAAPA Expo showcases the latest attractions, technologies, and innovations, its greatest value often comes from the people who attend. The concentration of industry professionals creates opportunities to establish relationships that can lead to lifelong friendships, career advancement, and business growth. Several members of the community shared how seemingly small interactions developed into meaningful professional relationships. Whether approaching an industry leader, reconnecting with colleagues, or introducing two people who could benefit from knowing each other, these connections can create opportunities that extend far beyond the event itself. Building relationships also requires looking beyond transactional networking and recognizing the value of genuine personal interactions. Stepping outside your comfort zone "It's just a new group of friends that you haven't met yet." IAAPA Expo brings together professionals from every corner of the attractions industry, creating an environment where attendees can explore unfamiliar areas, challenge their assumptions, and expand their perspectives. However, taking advantage of these opportunities often requires stepping away from familiar colleagues and established routines. Rather than attending every session or networking event with the same group, attendees can benefit from branching out and engaging with people they haven't met. Sitting at a different table, attending an unexpected educational session, or initiating a conversation with someone new can introduce fresh ideas and valuable relationships. These experiences can also strengthen an attendee's sense of belonging within the industry. Discovering new opportunities "You can find a new passion. You can find a new area of the business." The Expo can become a defining moment in someone's professional journey. Listener submissions highlighted how unexpected conversations and exposure to unfamiliar disciplines helped individuals discover career paths, identify their professional purpose, and gain confidence in their abilities. From pursuing opportunities with admired organizations to discovering an interest in specialized areas of the industry, these experiences demonstrate the importance of remaining curious and receptive. The Expo also provides an opportunity to reconnect with the excitement that originally attracted people to the industry, reinforcing their passion and inspiring continued professional growth. Making the most of the Expo "There are going to be times when you want to be spontaneous, and that's okay too." With the 2026 Expo expanding into both the North-South and West Concourses of the Orange County Convention Center, thoughtful planning becomes even more important. Scheduling meetings, organizing activities geographically, and identifying priorities can help attendees navigate the larger event efficiently. At the same time, leaving flexibility in the schedule creates room for spontaneous conversations and unexpected experiences. Taking care of physical well-being through comfortable shoes, hydration, and adequate rest also helps maintain energy throughout the demanding week. The value of the Expo continues after the show floor closes. Following up with new connections, applying lessons learned, and maintaining relationships allows attendees to turn a few days of activity into lasting professional opportunities.   We want to hear your ideas, experiences, and suggestions for thriving at IAAPA Expo! Whether you've attended once or dozens of times, your insights can help fellow attractions professionals maximize their experience. Share your recommendations with us and help make future Thrival Guides even more valuable for the AttractionPros community. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   Gil Perez is an experienced attractions industry executive and author of the forthcoming book Radical Welcome. His nearly 40-year career began at Disney's Magic Kingdom before he helped open Universal Studios Florida in a management role. He has since held leadership positions at the Luxor in Las Vegas, Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago, The Shed in New York City, and Florida Aquarium. Most recently, Gil served as the opening General Manager of Meow Wolf Houston and worked with The Light Park. Throughout his career, he has focused on creating exceptional guest experiences across theme parks, museums, aquariums, and entertainment venues. In this interview, Gil talks about Radical Welcome, controlled mayhem, and breaking out of the haze. Radical welcome "We are designing experiences, whether you intend to or not." Radical Welcome goes beyond friendly employees and traditional guest service training. Gil explains that every policy, procedure, and operational decision shapes the guest experience. By intentionally designing each interaction throughout the guest journey, organizations can create consistently positive experiences rather than relying on a few exceptional employees. For example, at the Luxor, Gil encountered frequent guest conflicts over ride height restrictions. Although the safety policy worked, the process created unnecessary friction for guests and employees. By introducing color-coded stickers to communicate height eligibility between employees, the team eliminated approximately 95% of these conflicts. The example demonstrates how even successful procedures can be redesigned to improve experiences without compromising operational requirements. Controlled mayhem "Opening a facility is like controlled mayhem a lot of times. It's controlled chaos." Having opened multiple attractions throughout his career, Gil recognizes that even the most carefully developed plans must evolve once guests enter a facility. Guest behavior often differs from expectations, revealing unexpected bottlenecks, operational challenges, and opportunities for improvement. While experience makes openings more manageable, each new facility presents unique circumstances requiring flexibility and collaboration. Gil emphasizes the importance of preparing employees to adapt rather than rigidly following predetermined plans. During the opening of Meow Wolf Houston, frontline employees became valuable partners in identifying challenges and developing solutions through pre-shift and post-shift discussions. Regardless of an attraction's size, business model, or organizational structure, guests are concerned with their experience, not the policies and departments operating behind the scenes. Breaking out of the haze "When you're doing something over and over and over again, eventually you become blind to it." Gil describes the haze as the tendency to overlook familiar surroundings and processes through repeated exposure. He recalls discovering a severely peeling wall during a routine facility walkthrough, despite having passed it countless times alongside other managers. The problem had become practically invisible because everyone was accustomed to seeing the same environment every day. To combat this, Gil began deliberately changing what he looked for during walkthroughs, focusing on specific colors or features to disrupt his normal observation patterns. He encourages leaders to examine even their most successful procedures from a fresh guest perspective. By challenging assumptions and recognizing that good intentions do not always translate into positive experiences, organizations can uncover friction that otherwise goes unnoticed.   Gil can be reached on LinkedIn, where he regularly shares stories and lessons from his career. He also plans to share updates about his forthcoming book, Radical Welcome, through his LinkedIn profile. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)  

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Daniel Billington is the Head of Business Development of Air Parx division of Airquee Group, a manufacturer of inflatable attractions and active entertainment solutions. Daniel began his career in sports and leisure after graduating with a sport and fitness degree. His experience includes facility operations, business development with Technogym, and interactive entertainment with Rugged Interactive before joining AirParx in 2021. AirParx specializes in inflatable parks while also manufacturing trampoline equipment, soft play, and other attractions. In this interview, Daniel talks about community, competition and challenge, reinvesting in your venue, and a record-setting bounce house. Community, competition and challenge "If there's no challenge, no competition, and no community, what is it doing to bring us back for more?" Daniel believes active entertainment can learn from the fitness industry's ability to build communities and encourage repeat participation. Whether through climbing, interactive games, or group activities, attractions can create experiences that motivate guests to return and improve their performance. Leaderboards, personal achievements, and friendly competition provide opportunities for guests to challenge themselves and connect with others. Daniel also distinguishes between competition and challenge. While competition involves measuring performance against others, challenges can focus on overcoming personal obstacles. Both should be accessible and rewarding, allowing guests of different ages and abilities to participate. By incorporating these elements into attraction design, operators can encourage repeat visitation while promoting physical activity and social connection. Reinvesting in your venue "The question wasn't whether to invest in park improvements. It was about which attraction and when." Daniel encourages operators to take a proactive approach to renovations rather than waiting until attractions become outdated or require urgent repairs. Daniel recommends developing a 12-month investment roadmap and setting aside approximately 3% to 8% of gross revenue for improvements. This allows operators to plan upgrades strategically and avoid relying on a few successful months to fund necessary changes. Reinvestment does not always require installing a major new attraction. Daniel recommends evaluating underutilized spaces, safety concerns, and the entire guest journey. Replacing worn padding, refreshing branding, improving accessibility, or upgrading food and beverage amenities can meaningfully improve the experience. He emphasizes that parents influence return visits, making comfortable seating, quality coffee, reliable Wi-Fi, and other conveniences important considerations alongside the attractions themselves. A record-setting bounce house "If we take the largest we've ever done, it’s two and a half thousand square meters." AirParx began when a customer challenged the company to create an enormous indoor inflatable attraction. What initially appeared to be a one-off project evolved into a growing business manufacturing interconnected inflatable parks. Its largest installation spans approximately 2,500 square meters, featuring a four-lane obstacle course, towering slides, climbing challenges, open bouncing areas, and a dedicated toddler section. The massive attraction demonstrates how inflatable parks can appeal to audiences beyond young children. Larger features and more challenging activities have attracted adults and encouraged dedicated sessions for guests over 18. Daniel explains that these installations consist of interconnected modules powered by electric fans, with designs customized to each venue's dimensions and safety requirements. Their flexibility, relatively quick installation, and variety of activities make inflatables an attractive option for both new facilities and existing parks looking to expand.   Daniel can be reached on LinkedIn, as well as by email at [email protected]. To learn more about Air Parks and Air Key Group, visit www.airparx.com and www.airquee.com. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Greg Spittle is the Co-Founder and CEO of Intelliplay, a technology company that gamifies active entertainment experiences. Greg began his career in chemical engineering before transitioning into the attractions industry in 2013, when he partnered with a friend to open two Flight Deck Trampoline Parks in Texas. His experience as an operator led him to create Activ8, a point-of-sale software company he later sold to ROLLER. After four years with ROLLER, Greg shifted his focus to leading Intelliplay, combining his engineering background, entrepreneurial mindset, and operational experience to help attractions improve the guest experience. In this interview, Greg talks about problem solving like an engineer, listening to your customers, and gamifying active play. Problem solving like an engineer "As an engineer, your whole job is to go solve problems." Although Greg's career has taken him far from chemical engineering, the mindset he developed continues to influence his approach to business. Engineering taught him to break complex problems into smaller components, understand how those components interact, and develop practical solutions. He applies this process to everything from building technology to improving attraction operations. Greg believes these skills are increasingly valuable as artificial intelligence changes how people work. While technology can handle many technical tasks, knowing how to define problems and break them into manageable pieces remains essential. His entrepreneurial approach also comes from firsthand operational experience. Rather than developing technology simply because it is innovative, Greg focuses on solving problems he knows attraction operators encounter. Listening to your customers "Showing them that you actually want their negative feedback is something that helps to get it out of them, and that's all helpful in creating a better system, better product." Building Activ8 taught Greg that some of the most valuable improvements come from criticism. One customer who ultimately left the platform suggested a dashboard that displayed upcoming bookings and daily activities. Rather than dismissing the feedback because the customer had departed, Greg's team developed the feature. It eventually became one of the platform's most appreciated capabilities. Greg also learned that requesting feedback is not enough. People need to feel comfortable sharing criticism. During one visit to a trampoline park, he repeatedly encouraged frontline employees to identify problems with the software. When one employee finally offered criticism, Greg gave him a high five. The recognition immediately encouraged others to speak up. For Greg, creating an environment where negative feedback is welcomed helps organizations identify problems and build better solutions. Gamifying active play "Competition and excitement about being on the leaderboard drives them to do more." Intelliplay uses smart wristbands to transform physical activity into a gamified experience. Guests earn points for participating in activities, compete on leaderboards, and can redeem points for rewards. Greg saw the impact firsthand when his son, who typically preferred less active play, became motivated to jump more and reached seventh place on a leaderboard. Beyond encouraging activity, Intelliplay provides operational and financial benefits. Greg shared examples of parks experiencing increased repeat visitation after introducing the technology, along with additional spending driven by more active guests. The wristbands also replace traditional paper wristbands, displaying time expiration through flashing red lights and allowing guests to extend their visits through their phones. By simplifying time management, Intelliplay allows frontline employees to focus more attention on safety and guest interactions. The company is also expanding its technology beyond trampoline parks into adventure parks, indoor playgrounds, and other attractions, with the goal of connecting multiple activities into one gamified experience.   Greg can be reached by email at [email protected]. To learn more about Intelliplay and its technology, visit www.intelliplay.io. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Michael Savastano is the President of Hospitality for PE Management Group. After beginning his career as a stockbroker, Michael transitioned into hospitality and spent approximately 18 years with Hyatt Hotels, opening and operating properties around the world. Today, he oversees PE Management Group’s hospitality portfolio in Southern California, which includes golf courses, restaurants, bars, resorts, and Belmont Park, the century-old beachfront amusement park in San Diego. In this interview, Michael talks about positivity with accountability, experiential luxury, and heart-centered leadership. Positivity with accountability “Finding that balance of positivity with results is super important more now than ever.” When Michael stepped into his leadership role at Belmont Park, he inherited a strong culture with long-tenured employees who genuinely care about the park. Rather than trying to replace what already worked, he focused on bringing his own leadership style to the organization, which he describes as positivity with accountability. His high-energy approach includes enthusiasm, high fives, and creating positive momentum while maintaining a strong focus on business performance. Michael believes a leader produces results through others, making it important to encourage people to bring their best every day. That positive environment still requires execution. Particularly during challenging business conditions, organizations need motivated employees, strong decisions, and consistent performance to continue delivering value to guests. Experiential luxury “I think experiential luxury is the name of the game.” Michael’s background in luxury hotels shaped his perspective on what luxury means within an amusement park. Rather than defining it through chandeliers, white gloves, or expensive amenities, he views luxury as something personal to each guest. It can come from removing obstacles, anticipating needs, and creating an experience that feels welcoming, comfortable, and easy. A lesson from Michael’s Hyatt career distilled guest expectations into three fundamentals: everything is clean, everything works, and people care. These principles apply across hospitality, regardless of price point. Experiential luxury can be as simple as anticipating what someone needs, offering useful information, or making a meaningful gesture. At Belmont Park, that means understanding the entire guest journey and finding opportunities to make families feel cared for so they want to return again and again. Heart-centered leadership “Let’s figure out why they get up and come to work, what matters to them, and drive that home so that they pass that positivity on to our guests.” With many young employees working at Belmont Park, Michael believes leaders need to create an environment that offers more than a paycheck. That requires understanding what motivates each individual, helping employees recognize that they are part of something special, and giving them opportunities to contribute ideas. Leaders also need to be present on the front lines, build relationships, and understand what brings out the best in each person. For Michael, leadership is also personal. He wants to be remembered as someone who was there for his team, built people up, and helped them grow. When someone trusts him enough to ask for help, he views it as an opportunity to demonstrate his commitment. By investing in people and helping them succeed, leaders can create loyalty and inspire employees to extend that same level of care to others.   Michael encourages people to visit Belmont Park and the other hospitality destinations within the PE Management Group portfolio. To learn more about Belmont Park, visit www.belmontpark.com. To learn more about Lakehouse Resort in San Marcos, visit www.thelakehouseresort.com. The portfolio also includes Cannonball, Draft, Fit Social, and Orfila Vineyards and Winery. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Chris Matern is the Director of Operations for Airborne Trampoline Parks. With nearly 25 years of experience in restaurants, bars, and family entertainment centers, Chris has helped open approximately two dozen businesses across national and local brands. Today, he oversees Airborne’s two 50,000-square-foot Utah locations, which have evolved from traditional trampoline parks into broader family entertainment centers with playgrounds, sport courts, ninja courses, and other attractions. He also operates a consulting business focused on improving FEC operations. In this interview, Chris talks about removing friction, people above profit, and practical pivots. Removing friction “Why did I just tell that guest, ‘no, I don't want your money'?’ He's standing in front of me with his credit card ready to commit to Airborne.” Chris focuses on identifying operational processes that make sense internally but create unnecessary barriers for guests. After watching a guest abandon a membership upgrade because he was directed from the concession stand to a long front desk line, Chris realized that Airborne’s own procedures were getting in the way of the transaction. That philosophy extends throughout the business. Rather than limiting birthday party bookings because handling several parties simultaneously is operationally difficult, Chris views high demand as a problem worth solving. Airborne cross-trains employees, plans for busy weekends days in advance, and practices its processes consistently so the team can accommodate demand while protecting the guest experience. People above profit “I don't want to put profit above people. I want to put people above profit.” Chris’s approach is influenced by his own childhood, when a birthday party at a family entertainment center would have been financially out of reach. At Airborne, he looks for ways to maintain profitability without adding fees or restrictions that frustrate families. One example was eliminating the requirement that guests purchase Airborne-branded grip socks. Sock sales declined only slightly, while complaints about the policy disappeared. Airborne also sells bottled water for $1, allows outside food with birthday parties, and includes its attractions with general admission rather than creating multiple upgrade tiers. Chris sees these choices as investments in loyalty. His philosophy follows a simple cycle: take care of employees, employees take care of guests, and guests take care of the company. Practical pivots “The less expensive the mistake, the less amount of time we should spend thinking about it.” Chris believes the cost and risk of a decision should determine how much analysis it receives. A six-figure attraction deserves extensive research, while testing a $35 case of mini corn dogs does not. For low-risk ideas, Airborne would rather experiment, collect feedback, and adjust than spend excessive time debating possibilities. That willingness to pivot also means acknowledging when an idea does not work. Chris once changed Airborne’s birthday party structure to increase room capacity, only to discover immediately that guests disliked it. The change was reversed after one Saturday. For Chris, agility is one of the advantages of being a smaller operator. Decisions can be implemented quickly, tested with actual guests, and changed just as quickly when the results point in another direction.   Chris can be reached on LinkedIn by searching for Chris Matern. To learn more about Airborne Trampoline Parks, visit airbornesports.com. To learn more about Chris’s consulting business, visit maternco.com. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Jon Tozer is the Vice President of Strategy at Holovis. With a background in sound engineering, Jon joined Holovis approximately 10 years ago as a design engineer before expanding his expertise into the commercial and strategic sides of the business. His combination of engineering knowledge, business acumen, and lifelong passion for themed entertainment ultimately led him to his current role. Holovis is a show systems integration firm that brings creative concepts to life through technology, including screens, audio, interactive elements, real-time systems, and other technical story elements within attractions and entertainment experiences. In this interview, Jon talks about the deeper meaning of “immersive,” transforming sensory experiences, and authenticity at the human level. The deeper meaning of “immersive” “I think it has definitely a deeper meaning.” While “immersive” has become a common industry term often associated with projection, audio, and interactive technology, Jon believes true immersion goes much further. He describes it as a combination of engaging all five senses and carefully layering an experience through anticipation and reveal. Rather than expecting guests to become immersed instantly, an experience can gradually allow their senses and subconscious to move into another world. Jon points to Diagon Alley at Universal Studios Florida as a prime example. Taste comes through Butterbeer, guests feel the heat of the dragon’s fire, music and environmental sounds build the atmosphere, scents reinforce the setting, and controlled sightlines create powerful visual reveals. The experience also has physical and narrative depth, progressively carrying guests from the streets of London into Gringotts. Transforming sensory experiences “If something is transformational, it’s to change something completely in a way that improves.” “Transforming sensory experiences” has remained central to Holovis for more than a decade because each word reflects the company’s approach. Jon distinguishes transformational experiences from transactional ones. A transaction involves exchanging something to achieve an outcome, while transformation creates meaningful change and improvement. The sensory component encompasses all five senses. While Holovis is commonly associated with sight, sound, and touch through audiovisual and interactive technology, Jon also recognizes the roles of taste and smell. The final component, experiences, covers everything from dark rides and roller coaster queues to interactive walkthroughs and exhibits. Together, the three words provide both a description of Holovis’ work and a guiding principle for its team. Authenticity at the human level “I think the future of immersive experiences is that they’ll all be authentic. And I think that they need to be authentic at a human level.” With technology evolving rapidly, Jon believes predicting the specific tools or intellectual properties that will define the future is increasingly difficult. Guests may actively interact and play within an experience or passively watch a world unfold around them, but the underlying requirement will remain authenticity. That authenticity applies to the IP or story, the way guests engage with it, and the people and methods used to create it. Jon believes decisions should ultimately be made for guests before shareholders. Regardless of what new technology emerges, experiences that connect authentically with people will have the strongest foundation for success.   Jon can be reached on LinkedIn and welcomes people to connect with him directly there. To learn more about Holovis and its work creating immersive entertainment experiences, visit www.holovis.com. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning. What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Tim Benson is the CEO of the Fremont Family YMCA in Fremont, Nebraska. Prior to joining the YMCA, Tim spent nearly seven years at the Omaha Children’s Museum, where he worked in operations and helped lead the organization through COVID while achieving record attendance. Earlier in his career, he spent 13 years with Target in big-box retail management. Across each of these roles, customer service and understanding what drives people have been central to his work. At the Fremont Family YMCA, Tim leads a 240,000-square-foot facility that serves as a fitness center, recreation provider, childcare provider, community gathering place, and increasingly, a source of family entertainment for the Fremont community. In this interview, Tim talks about consumer behavior, an attractions mindset at the YMCA, and Tim’s accountability process. Consumer behavior “Sometimes we don't even know what we want.” Tim’s fascination with consumer behavior began long before his professional career. As a child, he would straighten shelves at Target before shopping so he could see everything available and make the best decision. That interest continued through college, where consumer behavior became his favorite course, and into his careers in retail, attractions, and the YMCA. Regardless of whether an organization is selling products, experiences, or lifestyles, Tim believes the fundamentals are similar. Leaders need to understand what people want, what problems they are trying to solve, and even what they may want but do not yet know to ask for. That requires listening to consumers while also testing new ideas and finding ways to present choices that help people make decisions. Attractions mindset at the YMCA “The attractions is a deliberate use of the word and deliberately bringing some of that to this community.” The Fremont Family YMCA is far larger and more diverse than the traditional “gym and swim” model associated with many YMCAs. Tim sees an opportunity to rethink how its spaces serve a changing community, particularly as families increasingly seek activities they can experience together. Rather than maintaining facilities built for one specific purpose, the YMCA is working toward more flexible, multi-use environments that can appeal to different ages and interests. That approach has led to additions including a three-story climbing structure, ninja floor course, and an all-ages gathering space with food service, games, puzzles, video games, and comfortable seating. The strategy grew from community surveys, focus groups, listening sessions, and stakeholder research identifying a need for more indoor family activities. For Tim, adopting an attractions mindset is both mission-driven and operationally important, helping the YMCA reach residents who may have little interest in a traditional fitness membership. Tim’s accountability process “They have to know exactly what is expected of them.” Tim’s approach to accountability starts with clarity. He believes employees should know their goals, responsibilities, and expectations, not simply so leaders can hold them accountable when something goes wrong, but so they know what success looks like and what accomplishments should be celebrated. To put that philosophy into practice, Tim uses a customized one-page document for each direct report. It tracks personal and staff check-ins, projects, responsibilities, metrics, and recurring discussion points. Employees know exactly what is on the document before their one-on-one meetings, and Tim updates it after each conversation. Over time, those pages create a straightforward record of accomplishments, unfinished work, coaching conversations, and performance. The process reduces emotion from accountability while providing structure for reviews, corrective action, and recognition.   Tim can be reached by email at [email protected] and is happy to connect with people interested in conversation or mentorship. To learn more about the Fremont Family YMCA, visit www.fremontfamilyymca.org. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Data can provide leaders with valuable insight, but numbers rarely tell the entire story. Decisions are also shaped by experience, observations, conversations, and instincts that may never appear on a spreadsheet. The challenge is knowing how much weight to give each source of information, especially when a decision needs to be made before every possible data point is available. In this minisode, Matt and Josh talk about balancing data with gut instinct to make informed decisions without falling into analysis paralysis. The numbers are only part of the story “That is one very important piece in a larger puzzle.” Metrics can reveal trends, measure progress, and provide objective evidence of performance, but focusing exclusively on the numbers can leave important context behind. A 4.8 Google rating across thousands of reviews is certainly meaningful, but moving that number to 4.9 does not necessarily capture the full impact of an improvement initiative. Narrative feedback, observations, employee interactions, and guest experiences can reveal progress that a single metric cannot. Your gut is a data point “Your gut is going to tell you certain things.” Gut instinct does not need to be viewed as the opposite of data. Experience creates its own collection of information that influences how situations are interpreted and decisions are made. The eye test can reveal nuances that quantitative measurements miss. When instincts align with the numbers, leaders may have greater confidence in what they are seeing. When they conflict, the discrepancy can be a signal to investigate further rather than automatically dismissing one in favor of the other. Leaders rarely have all the information “Leaders are required to make decisions when they don't have all the information.” Waiting until every question has been answered can prevent an organization from moving forward. One decision-making framework suggests moving ahead once roughly 80% of the necessary information is available, recognizing that obtaining the remaining 20% may be unrealistic or not worth the delay. Leadership requires becoming comfortable with incomplete information, making the strongest decision possible at that moment, and remaining willing to adjust when new information becomes available. Show your work “Even with your gut, you have to show your work, and you have to be able to justify your position.” Trusting your instincts does not mean making decisions without justification. Experience, anecdotes, team input, observations, and quantitative metrics can all contribute to the reasoning behind a decision. Being able to explain why a particular direction makes sense creates greater understanding and buy-in. If the decision later proves incorrect, there is a clear rationale for why it was made based on the information that was available at the time. Be willing to change direction “We made the best decision we could for the information that we had, but now we have new information, so now we're going to change directions.” A decision does not need to become permanent simply because a leader made it. New information may reveal that the original direction was incorrect or that circumstances have changed. Strong leadership includes the vulnerability to acknowledge that and pivot. Moving forward with a reasonable decision can often be more productive than remaining stuck while searching for certainty, particularly when the consequences of changing course are manageable. Avoid paralysis by analysis “If we are too focused on trying to get so many more sources of data, we're never going to do anything.” More information does not always make a decision easier. At some point, collecting additional metrics, opinions, examples, and possibilities can create more uncertainty instead of greater clarity. The goal is not to choose between data and instinct. It is to use the numbers, experience, observations, and other available inputs together, determine when enough information exists to move forward, and stay open to adjusting along the way.   How do you balance the numbers with your instincts when making decisions? Have you ever had the data point in one direction while your experience told you something different? Find AttractionPros on social media or email [email protected] to share how you approach the balance between gut and data. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)  

Looking for daily inspiration?  Get a quote from the top leaders in the industry in your inbox every morning.   What’s the one premier event that brings the global attractions industry together? IAAPA Expo 2026, happening in Orlando, Florida, November 16th - 20th. It’s where more than forty-thousand professionals come to share the wonder, explore over a thousand innovative exhibitors, and discover future-focused solutions. From education to networking to ideas that drive real business impact, IAAPA Expo is where what’s next takes shape.   Register now and save up to 30% at IAAPA.org/IAAPAExpo.   Bob Rogers is the Founder of BRC Imagination Arts. Since founding the company in 1981, Bob has helped create award-winning museums, brand homes, visitor centers, and immersive experiences around the world, earning nearly 500 international awards for creative excellence. His new book, Deep Story, shares many of the principles that have guided his work over the past four and a half decades. In this interview, Bob talks about deep story, show business identity, and getting fired from Disney. Deep Story “You need to go deep, deep, deep into two things and find a common link. You need to go deep into the hearts of the audience... then you go deep into the subject or deep into the brand... and what you're looking for is the same emotional truth.” Bob explains that meaningful attractions are built by connecting the emotional core of an audience with the authentic emotional core of a brand or subject. Rather than relying on technology, clever ideas, or spectacle alone, he encourages creators to begin with the desired outcome and design experiences that inspire lasting change after guests leave. Using examples ranging from the Milwaukee Brewers to the Las Vegas Raiders, Bob demonstrates how emotional resonance creates memorable experiences that influence behavior long after the visit ends. These principles form the foundation of Deep Story and can be applied well beyond themed entertainment. Show business identity “Part of what I was doing there was show business identity.” Bob reflects on his first job demonstrating magic tricks at Disneyland, where he realized that the performance was only part of the experience. Beyond entertaining guests and selling magic tricks, he was helping visitors see themselves differently. Someone entered the shop as a Disneyland guest and left believing they might be a magician. That realization shaped the philosophy behind BRC Imagination Arts. Throughout his career, Bob has focused on creating experiences that do more than entertain. His goal has been to inspire positive changes in how people think, feel, and act, making transformation the true purpose behind the show. Getting fired from Disney “I've been fired by Disney three times. So if I can do it and just keep going, then so can they.” One of the interview's most memorable stories centers on Bob's curiosity as a young Disneyland Cast Member. Fascinated by how the park operated behind the scenes, he wandered into maintenance areas and asked countless questions about everything from Audio Animatronics to operations. That curiosity eventually led to his dismissal and a permanent "no rehire" designation. Rather than allowing those setbacks to define him, Bob used them as motivation. His entrepreneurial journey began after another opportunity led him to form BRC Imagination Arts, ultimately turning a career disappointment into the foundation of one of the industry's most respected creative firms. He shares this story to encourage young professionals to persevere through setbacks, recognizing that career obstacles often become turning points.   Bob can be reached on LinkedIn, and readers can learn more about Deep Story at www.bobrogers.com. To learn more about BRC Imagination Arts, visit www.brcweb.com. To connect with AttractionPros: AttractionPros.com [email protected] AttractionPros on Facebook AttractionPros on LinkedIn AttractionPros on Instagram AttractionPros on Twitter (X)