#857: Tealium's Zack Wenthe on the hidden challenge of AI-driven commerce

Most leaders see Marketing Ops as the team that keeps the trains running on time, essentially the plumbers of the marketing department. But what if I told you they’re actually positioned to be the architects of your company’s most durable competitive advantage? Agility requires moving beyond the transactional nature of campaigns and technology. It demands building a durable, responsive ecosystem around your brand, one that can listen and adapt not just quarterly, but constantly.Today, we're going to talk about how to reframe the marketing operations function from a cost center or tactical execution engine into a strategic driver of growth. And we’ll explore a powerful, and perhaps counterintuitive, way to do it: by building a genuine community, not just as a marketing channel, but as the core of your go-to-market strategy. To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, Mike Rizzo, CEO at MarketingOps. About Mike Rizzo Mike Rizzo is a career marketing operations professional passionate about using a people-first approach to building scalable and efficient solutions to the challenges faced by marketing, business operations, and client success teams. With his extensive background in marketing Mike helped build, launch, manage and optimize Mavenlink's first user community and Client Advisory Board programs. In 2017 he also founded the growing community of MO Pros - a place where thousands of Marketing Operations Professionals connect, collaborate and help elevate the practice of Marketing Ops. He is also the co-host of the podcast called Ops Cast.As the founder of MarketingOps.com, Mike is taking a community-led approach to building a platform purpose-built to elevate Marketing Operations Professionals. Mike Rizzo on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aharze/ Resources MarketingOps: https://www.marketingops.com The Agile Brand podcast is brought to you by TEKsystems. Learn more here: https://aglbrnd.co/r/2868abd8085a9703 Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658 Reach your customers with Reddit. Spend $500 in ad spend, get $500 back in ad credit! Learn more: https://advertalize.com/r/491818c79fb1873f Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstrom Don't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

As you race to adopt AI-powered shopping experiences, are you creating a new data black box that will make your customer journey less understood, not more? Agility requires not just the speed to adopt new channels like generative AI, but the foresight to ensure these new touchpoints don't become blind spots in your customer journey. It demands that our data strategy evolves as quickly as our customer-facing technology. Today, we're going to talk about the hidden challenge of AI-driven commerce. As major brands roll out compelling shopping experiences on platforms like Google's Gemini, they risk creating a new data black box. When customer interactions happen inside these AI environments, the insights from those conversations can become disconnected from the overall customer journey, making it difficult to measure impact and act on what you've learned. To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome Zack Wenthe, Director of Product Marketing & Customer Data Evangelist at Tealium. Zack, welcome to the show! About Zack Wenthe Zack Wenthe is a seasoned product marketing and customer data expert, currently serving as Director of Product Marketing & Customer Data Evangelist at Tealium, where he helps brands unlock the power of unified customer insights and drive meaningful engagement through data-driven strategies with the power of value-add storytelling in product marketing. He’s a prolific speaker, writer, and storyteller in the martech space, known for breaking down complex ideas into practical, revenue-focused narratives. Zack Wenthe on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zackwenthe/ Resources Tealium : https://tealium.com/products/tealium-for-AI/ The Agile Brand podcast is brought to you by TEKsystems. Learn more here: https://aglbrnd.co/r/2868abd8085a9703  Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658Reach your customers with Reddit. Spend $500 in ad spend, get $500 back in ad credit! Learn more: https://advertalize.com/r/491818c79fb1873f Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

When you look at your five-year strategic plan, how much of it is dedicated to defending your current market share versus actively making it obsolete?Agility requires more than just reacting quickly to market shifts; it demands the foresight and structure to initiate those shifts yourself. This episode is brought to by CRMC. Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more about CRMC 2026, June 1-3 in Frisco Texas at www.thecrmc.comToday, we're going to talk about the accelerating pace of change being driven by forces like artificial intelligence and digitization. These changes are creating a clear divide in the market, sorting brands into two distinct camps: the “Disruptors” and the “Disrupted.” We'll explore the patterns that separate these two groups and discuss practical frameworks for how established organizations can learn to shape the future, rather than be shaped by it. To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, Kaihan Krippendorff, Founder at Outthinker, and keynote speaker at CRMC, taking place June 1-3 in Frisco Texas. About Kaihan Krippendorff Kaihan Krippendorff is the Founder of Outthinker, a global think-tank of chief strategy, growth, transformation, and innovation officers shaping the future of business. He has been recognized by Thinkers50 and Global Gurus as one of the world’s top 20 business thinkers. A sought-after keynote speaker and strategic advisor, Kaihan works with CXOs from the world’s most admired companies, helping them to drive transformation, reduce risk, and chart their path to long-term growth and success. Kaihan Krippendorff on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kaihankrippendorff/ Resources Outthinker: https://kaihan.net/ This episode is brought to by CRMC. Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://www.thecrmc.com Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658Reach your customers with Reddit. Spend $500 in ad spend, get $500 back in ad credit! Learn more: https://advertalize.com/r/491818c79fb1873f Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

I would like to recommend a new podcast called The Interface from the BBC. It's the BBC's fiercly informed, fast and funny take on how technology is impacting all of us. I have become regular listeners and hope you enjoy it too!

What's the bigger blind spot for most brands’ digital experience: knowing that a customer is struggling, or understanding why and being able to help them in that exact moment? Agility requires not just identifying customer friction quickly, but having the tools to resolve it in the moment. It’s about shortening the gap between insight and action to create better experiences, faster.Today, we're going to talk about a strategic evolution in digital experience management: moving beyond passively observing user behavior to actively intervening and guiding users toward success, directly within the product. We’ll explore how this shift is being accelerated by strategic acquisitions and how it empowers product, marketing, and CX teams to solve problems in real time.To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, Jason Wolf, President at Fullstory. About Jason Wolf Jason Wolf is an accomplished technology executive with over two decades of experience driving strategic growth and operational excellence across the technology sector. As President of Fullstory, Jason leads sales, customer success, support, professional services, partnerships, and revenue operations.Before joining Fullstory, Wolf served as Ping Identity’s Chief Revenue Officer, leading an international team that cemented the company’s position in intelligent identity solutions that make digital experiences secure and seamless. Preceding his time at Ping Identity, Wolf spent over 15 years at SAP, where he held several executive positions, ultimately culminating in his role as CRO, overseeing the business's spending management and network line. His career also includes valuable experiences at Pfizer Pharmaceuticals and as a consultant for Ernst and Young. Jason Wolf on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jason-wolf-ismatsap/ Resources Fullstory: https://www.fullstory.com The Agile Brand podcast is brought to you by TEKsystems. Learn more here: https://aglbrnd.co/r/2868abd8085a9703 Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658Reach your customers with Reddit. Spend $500 in ad spend, get $500 back in ad credit! Learn more: https://advertalize.com/r/491818c79fb1873f Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

In an era dominated by high-definition home entertainment and endless digital distractions, what does it take to convince a fan that a live, in-person experience is not just worth their time and money, but is something they can't afford to miss? Agility requires not just having a plan, but building a system to listen and respond to your audience in real time. It’s about turning feedback from a retrospective report into an in-the-moment action plan. Following the recent Qualtrics X4 Summit in Seattle, we're going to talk about what it takes to engineer a world-class fan experience. We'll explore how a legacy brand moves beyond the traditional event model to create personalized, memorable moments, and how they use real-time data not just to measure satisfaction, but to proactively shape the fan journey from the moment someone buys a ticket to long after they've left the course.To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, Zach Carlson, Director of Fan Engagement at PGA TOUR. About Zach Carlson As a Director of Fan Engagement - Decision Sciences at PGA TOUR, I leverage my consumer research expertise and project management skills to gather feedback and insights from various stakeholders, including fans, players, and employees. I have over 10 years of experience in applying data-driven marketing and research strategies to support business decisions and optimize outcomes.I am passionate about enhancing the fan experience and creating value for the PGA TOUR brand and partners. I built and managed the PGA TOUR Fan Council, a research community of over 12,000 fans who help us identify what golf fans want and shape the products and experiences we create. I also lead the implementation of @Qualtrics CX and EX solutions throughout the organization to measure and improve customer and employee satisfaction and loyalty. I enjoy working with cross-functional teams and communicating effectively with both technical and non-technical audiences. Zach Carlson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zacharyjcarlson/ Resources PGA TOUR: https://www.pgatour.com The Agile Brand podcast is brought to you by TEKsystems. Learn more here: https://aglbrnd.co/r/2868abd8085a9703 Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658Reach your customers with Reddit. Spend $500 in ad spend, get $500 back in ad credit! Learn more: https://advertalize.com/r/491818c79fb1873f Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

In the race for B2B growth, we often prioritize speed over everything else. But what's the real cost when your brand starts to look like a collection of spare parts cobbled together by different teams? Agility requires a strong, foundational framework to enable speed without sacrificing coherence. It's about empowering teams to move quickly and independently, while still ensuring every customer touchpoint feels like it comes from one unified brand. Today, we're going to talk about why brand and design consistency is often the first casualty of high-growth B2B environments, and paradoxically, one of the most critical assets to protect. We'll explore how that fragmentation happens, from different teams launching products to rapid hiring, and discuss why building a consistent brand isn't just a "nice-to-have"—it's a direct line to building trust and long-term value with your customers.To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, Jenny Sagström, CEO at Sköna. About Jenny Sagström Jenny is cofounder and CEO of Sköna, a B2B creative agency that’s been building brave brands for innovative technology companies since 2004. Jenny entered the agency world in 1998 with Kraftverket in her native Stockholm, Sweden, shortly after graduating with a BA in Economics and International Relations from the University of Reading. In 2000, she moved to the San Francisco Bay Area to work at Corsi & Partners, where she was responsible for a multitude of clients, including the Oakland Raiders. Since founding Sköna, Jenny has helped lead it from a two-person shop to a flourishing global business, where she currently oversees strategy, account management, and global expansion. An occasional public speaker, article writer, and podcaster, she spends her spare time skiing, tinkering with (and even completing!) DIY projects, and enjoying the company of her husband and two daughters. Jenny Sagström on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennysagstrom/ Resources Sköna: www.skona.com The Agile Brand podcast is brought to you by TEKsystems. Learn more here: https://aglbrnd.co/r/2868abd8085a9703 Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658Reach your customers with Reddit. Spend $500 in ad spend, get $500 back in ad credit! Learn more: https://advertalize.com/r/491818c79fb1873f Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

I would like to recommend a new podcast called The Interface from the BBC. It's the BBC's fiercly informed, fast and funny take on how technology is impacting all of us. I have become regular listeners and hope you enjoy it too!

What if your most visible, most exciting product wasn't your real product at all, but was actually a Trojan horse for building a much deeper, stickier customer relationship? Agility requires more than just a willingness to change; it demands a deep understanding of what truly motivates your customer, allowing you to evolve your model in service of their emotional outcomes, not just their transactional needs. Today, we're going to talk about how a brand can embody the very principle it sells, turning a core service into a flywheel for customer retention, emotional engagement, and scalable business growth. To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, Mark Van Wye, CEO at Zoom Room. About Mark Van Wye Mark Van Wye is the CEO of Zoom Room, the nation’s premier dog training franchise, and the author of the #1 bestselling Puppy Training in 7 Easy Steps. He’s a systems architect who saw white space in the $100 billion pet industry and positioned dog training as behavioral infrastructure for modern life. A lifelong builder of scalable learning environments, he taught adults to code at eleven, developed a national learning platform for the Boys & Girls Clubs of America, and has spent his career designing environments – physical and digital – that scale without losing their human edge. Mark Van Wye on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zoomroom/ Resources Zoom Room: https://www.zoomroom.com The Agile Brand podcast is brought to you by TEKsystems. Learn more here: https://aglbrnd.co/r/2868abd8085a9703 Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658 Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company

What if the key to customer loyalty isn't about creating memorable, delightful moments, but about being utterly forgettable in the best possible way? Agility requires more than just rapid campaign execution; it demands a deep-seated ability to re-evaluate and re-engineer core processes in response to shifting customer expectations.Today, we're going to talk about the powerful, and perhaps counterintuitive, idea that the greatest predictor of customer loyalty isn't satisfaction or delight, but simply how easy you are to do business with. We'll explore why reducing customer effort is a critical competitive advantage and how enterprise brands can identify and eliminate the points of friction that drive customers away.To help me discuss this topic, I'd like to welcome, David Avrin, CX Keynote Speaker and Author at Ridiculously Easy International, and keynote speaker at CRMC, taking place June 1-3 in Frisco Texas. About David Avrin One of the most in-demand Customer Experience speakers and consultants in the world today, David Avrin, CSP, Global Speaking Fellow, has shared his content-rich, entertaining and actionable presentations with enthusiastic audiences across North America and in 28 countries around the world. David helps organizations better understand and connect with their changing customers and clients to help future-proof their businesses.  David's insights have been featured on thousands of media outlets around the world. He is also the author of seven books including the acclaimed: It's Not Who You Know, It's Who Knows You!, Why Customers Leave (and How to Win Them Back), The Morning Huddle, and his newest book, Ridiculously Easy to Do Business With.  David Avrin on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidavrin/ Resources Ridiculously Easy International: https://www.davidavrin.com/ This episode is brought to by CRMC. Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://www.thecrmc.com Drive your customers to new horizons at the premier retail event of the year for Retail and Brand marketers. Learn more at CRMC 2026, June 1-3. https://aglbrnd.co/r/d15ec37a537c0d74 We’re proud to be a media partner for #MAICON26 - Oct. 13-15! Learn how AI can power your marketing and business and help you grow smarter. Use code AGILE150 to save! https://aglbrnd.co/r/7fe458ced0f04658 Get the book: Ridiculously Easy to Do Business With by David Avrin: https://share.google/iwUGAonakI63ZU2vR Ridiculously Easy Intl. website: https://www.ridiculouslyeasy.com/ Get the new research report David mentioned: The Frequency of Customer Friction: https://www.ridiculouslyeasy.com/research Enjoyed the show? Tell us more at and give us a rating so others can find the show at: https://aglbrnd.co/r/faaed112fc9887f3 Connect with Greg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregkihlstromDon't miss a thing: get the latest episodes, sign up for our newsletter and more: https://aglbrnd.co/r/35ded3ccfb6716ba Check out The Agile Brand Guide website with articles, insights, and Martechipedia, the wiki for marketing technology: https://www.agilebrandguide.com The Agile Brand is produced by Missing Link—a Latina-owned strategy-driven, creatively fueled production co-op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. https://www.missinglink.company