Ep.57 | Rethinking Poverty, Power, and Social Protection: a Conversation with Olivier De Schutter, UN Special Rapporteur

In this special episode with Olivier De Schutter, UN Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, we explore where global efforts stand today to combat poverty and how international actors can strengthen their support, particularly through a human-rights lens. The discussion brings what an effective path forward might look like in today’s complex global context, and how poverty, as a deeply transversal issue, is interlinked with a myriad of other major themes requiring international and national attention. Our regular podcast episodes will take a short break in January 2026, but we will be back in February with exciting guests and new social protection topics. In the meantime, we leave you with our special TRANSFORM podcast series, which will feature two more episodes: one to be released later this month and the other in January. Stay tuned!   Meet our guests: Olivier De Schutter, UN Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights For our Quick Wins segment, we have Marco Knowles, Senior Social Protection Officer at FAO, talking about the latest publication on social protection for rural populations within green climate fund projects. We also discuss the latest development on COP30 in Belém and the advocacy efforts that have been made so far. Publication: Weathering the storm: poverty, climate change and social protection Publication| Breaking the cycle: ending the criminalization of homelessness: Report of the Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, Olivier De Schutter Publication | The Poverty of Growth Publication | Eradicating poverty beyond growth: Report of the Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, Olivier De Schutter Publication | Non-take-up of rights in the context of social protection: Report of the Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, Olivier De Schutter Publication | Social protection and inclusive climate action – A review of social protection for rural populations within Green Climate Fund projects    

 Do cash transfers drive inflation? Is social protection a cost to the economy, or an investment in its future? And who should these systems ultimately serve? In this second and final episode on social protection myths and misperceptions, we turn to the economic and systemic dimensions — how social protection interacts with markets, fiscal policy, and national development. Drawing on global evidence and practice, we examine whether cash transfers distort prices, how they influence local economies, and what the data tell us about affordability and return on investment. We also explore the broader role of social protection beyond poverty reduction: as a foundation for inclusive and resilient societies. While not all answers are clear-cut, the discussion highlights how context, programme design, and policy choices shape outcomes, and why understanding these nuances is critical for effective, sustainable systems. Meet our guests: Davide Rasella, ICREA Research Professor and Head of the Global Health Impact Assessment and Evaluation Group, ISGlobal and ISC. Dennis Egger, Associate Professor of Economics, University of Oxford. Laura Carvalho, Associate Professor of Economics, University of São Paulo. For our Quick Wins segment, we spoke with Konstantinos Papadakis, Principal Social Affairs Officer at the UN Department of Economic and Social Affairs, who shared insights on the outcomes of Second World Summit for Social Development.   Resources: Podcast | Ep.54 | Social Protection Myths and Misperceptions Part 1 Publication | Do cash transfers cause inflation? Publication | The multiplier effects of government expenditures on social protection Publication | Social protection systems, redistribution and growth in Latin America Publication | Impact of social protection on child malnutrition and mortality across 46 LMICs: a longitudinal study over two decades with insights from the COVID-19 pandemic Publication | Effects of conditional cash transfers on tuberculosis incidence and mortality according to race, ethnicity and socioeconomic factors in the 100 Million Brazilian Cohort Publication | Effect of a conditional cash transfer programme on AIDS incidence, hospitalisations, and mortality in Brazil: a longitudinal ecological study Publication | Evaluation and Forecasting Analysis of the Association of Conditional Cash Transfer With Child Mortality in Latin America, 2000-2030

This episode introduces listeners to the origins and essence of the TRANSFORM initiative—an innovative, leading capacity-building program designed to strengthen social protection systems in Africa. It explores what sets TRANSFORM apart from other training programs and how it was designed as a uniquely African initiative, tailored to the continent’s context and adaptable to the needs of its countries and communities.  The episode is the first of a three-part TRANSFORM Podcast Series, which will present the initiative's achievements 10 years since its inception through conversations with guests from the continent. The series explores the impact of TRANSFORM on the social protection in the region, showcasing achievements in building culture and its integration into institutions.  Hosted by Abidemi Coker, a passionate TRANSFORM Master Trainer.  Meet our guests for episode 1:  Emmy Tony Ameny, Assistant Commissioner of Programmes, Office of the Prime Minister of Uganda   Kate Blaine, Instructional Designer and Facilitator, Learn to Lead  Vincent van Halsema, Global Social Protection Advisor, WFP, and former TRANSFORM Hub Coordinator  For our testimonial segment, we welcome Aly Cisse, Social Protection and Labour Migration Specialist and a TRANSFORM Master Trainer from Senegal.     To learn more and explore how TRANSFORM can be tailored to your own context and how you can get involved with the initiative, go to https://transformsp.org and contact [email protected].

Thirty years after the landmark World Summit for Social Development in Copenhagen, the world reconvenes in Doha for the second edition of the Summit — a defining moment to assess global progress in poverty eradication, employment, and social inclusion. As nations prepare to renew their commitments to the Copenhagen Declaration, the Summit offers a crucial opportunity to reflect on the evolving role of social protection in advancing the social development agenda.  In this episode, we look back at the forces that shaped the first Summit and explore how the Copenhagen Declaration helped elevate social protection in global discourse. We trace the evolution of social development and consider what progress has been made, what gaps remain, and how today’s challenges, from conflict and fiscal pressures to climate and geopolitical change, are redefining the global agenda. We also examine the potential impact of the upcoming Summit for universal social protection, sustainable financing, and multilateral cooperation in an era of mounting headwinds.  Meet our guests:  Ms. Iffath Sharif, Global Director for Social Protection and Labour, World Bank  Ms. Shahra Razavi, Director of the Social Protection Department, International Labour Organization (ILO)  For our Quick Wins segment, we are joined by Marta Pedrajas, Deputy Assistant Director for Multilateral Development Policies at the Spanish Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Cooperation, to delve into a special side event at the WSSD 2025: the First Leaders’ Meeting of the Global Alliance against Hunger and Poverty She also explores what this new global initiative to eradicate poverty and hunger could mean in practice.  References:  Publication | Copenhagen Declaration on Social Development  Publication | World Social Protection Report 2024-26: Universal social protection for climate action and just transition  Publication | Sevilla Commitment: Fourth International Conference on Financing for Development  Publication | Elements paper for the outcome document of the Fourth International Conference on Financing for Development  Event |  First Leaders’ Meeting of the Global Alliance Against Hunger and Poverty  Event | Universal Social Protection for Equitable Growth and Equitable Societies 

In this bonus episode, we explore the critical role of social protection in Gaza. Our guest expert unpacks how humanitarian community has found creative ways to deliver and scale up cash assistance through particular digital systems amid extreme adversity. How can social protection systems adapt in the face of prolonged instability? How can data be better managed in crisis situations? Where do fundings for these programmes come from? Tune in for a vital conversation on the ongoing humanitarian support and the resilience of systems supporting people in Gaza.   Meet our guests: Carla Lacerda, Social Protection Cash and Voucher Thematic Working Group, STAAR Facility   Disclaimer: This episode was recorded on September 22, 2025. While we recognize that there have been further developments in Gaza since then, the discussions in this episode remain relevant and important to highlight.  

Is social protection just a handout? Does it discourage work? Or are the systems plagued by fraud? In this episode, we unpack some of the biggest myths surrounding social protection systems and explore the real data behind the rhetoric. Despite the strong evidence base available and data which overwhelmingly proves the strengths of social protection in combating poverty and vulnerability, social protection practitioners are often faced by questions or doubts about mechanisms which have been, at some level, settled by evidence, practice and experience. Whether you're a sceptic or a supporter, this conversation might challenge your assumptions and bring greater clarity to the debate. Meet our guests: Rema Hanna, Jeffrey Cheah Professor of Southeast-Asia Studies, Harvard Kennedy School Tia Palermo, President at Policy Research Solutions (PRESTO) On this episode we do not have a Quick Wins guest, as there will be a Bonus episode coming out mid-October. But our host, Jo, has highlighted a couple of resources (shared below) from Rema and Tia for you to enjoy in the meantime. References: Publication | Dispelling myths on gender and cash transfers: Evidence Summary Publication | Social Protection: Policymaker Beliefs and Empirical Evidence Additional references: Publication | Conditional, unconditional and everything in between: a systematic review of the effects of cash transfer programmes on schooling outcomes. Publication | The effects of cash transfers on adult labor market outcomes Publication | Debunking the stereotype of the lazy welfare recipient: Evidence from cash transfer programs Publication | Theoretical underpinnings and meta-analysis of the effects of cash transfers on intimate partner violence in low-and middle-income countries Publication | The impact of cash transfers: a review of the evidence from low-and middle-income countries Publication | A mixed-method review of cash transfers and intimate partner violence in low- and middle-income countries Publication | Myth-busting? Confronting six common perceptions about unconditional cash transfers as a poverty reduction strategy in Africa Publication | The Effectiveness of Cash and Cash Plus Interventions on Livelihoods Outcomes: Evidence from a systematic review and meta-analysis Publication | Social safety nets, women’s economic achievements and agency: A systematic review and meta-analysis Publication | Do cash transfers alleviate common mental disorders in low-and middle-income countries? A systematic review and meta-analysis    

This year, 2025, marks the 10th anniversary of the socialprotection.org platform—a milestone that offers the perfect opportunity to reflect on how far social protection has come over the past decade, and where it is headed next.   Since 2015, when social protection was anchored in the Sustainable Development Goals (mainly under SDG 1 as a pillar of poverty reduction), the field has expanded and evolved in response to new global challenges. In this episode, we look back at key turning points: from the unprecedented expansion of programmes during COVID-19, to the growing recognition of social protection as a driver of women’s empowerment, and its emerging role in climate adaptation, mitigation, and crisis response.   But we don’t stop there. We also look ahead, asking what the next years may hold for social protection in the face of constrained financing, political pushback on climate and gender agendas, and shifting global priorities.   Meet our guests: Fabio Veras Soares, Researcher at the International Policy Centre for Inclusive Growth (IPC-IG) Edward Archibald, Senior Technical Advisor at STAAR (Social Protection, Technical Assistance, Advice and Resources) Zehra Rizvi, Social Policy Specialist, UNICEF   For our Quick Wins segment, we are joined by Mariana Balboni, Coordinator of the socialprotection.org platform. Having been part of the platform’s story almost from the very beginning, Mariana reflects on its major achievements of the past 10 years in building and growing this global knowledge-sharing community. She also looks ahead to the next decade sharing the platform’s priorities for supporting the global community of practice, elaborating on how socialprotection.org will continue to evolve to meet emerging challenges in  the field, and her hopes for what the platform can achieve in the years to come.

In face of the climate emergency, integrating social protection into countries’ nationally determined contributions (NDCs) is essential for supporting vulnerable communities, advancing low-carbon transitions, and unlocking climate finance to expand adaptive social protection systems. With many countries set to update these critical climate instruments under the scope of the Paris Agreement, this is a critical moment to explore the topic.  In this episode, we examine how social protection is being woven into national climate policies, with a spotlight on Cambodia’s pioneering approach—not only mentioning social protection but recognising it as a distinct sector in its new NDC 3.0. We delve deeper to discuss what it takes to bridge climate action and social protection, from building resilience and inclusive adaptation, to unlocking climate finance and coordinating across ministries.  Meet our guest:   Dr. Matthew Walsham, Social Protection Specialist (Climate), Food and Agriculture Organisation of the United Nations (FAO).  Mr. Sophornreaksmey Sreng, Deputy Secretary General, General Secretariat for the National Social Protection Council, Kingdom of Cambodia.  For our Quick Wins segment, we are joined by Sayanti Sengupta, Technical Advisor for Social Protection & Climate at the Red Cross Red Crescent Climate Centre, expanding on concrete steps countries can take to advance the critical agenda of integrating social protection into NDCs.   References:  Publication | Integration social protection in Nationally Determined Contributions (NDCs)  Publication | Weathering the storm: poverty, climate change and social protection: Report of the Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights  Database |  Nationally Determined Contributions (NDC) Registry | UNFCCC 

As the world prepares for the 4th International Conference on Financing for Development (FfD4), the need to rethink how we fund social protection has never been more urgent. Debt burdens, shrinking official development assistance (ODA), and growing global inequalities are squeezing fiscal space, especially for low- and middle-income countries, putting the goal of Universal Social Protection by 2030 increasingly out of reach. In this episode, we explore the bold reforms needed to unlock sustainable financing for social protection and a just transition. In the first part, we discuss how the global financial architecture must evolve to meet the needs of low- and lower-middle income countries—and how innovative tools like special drawing rights (SDRs) could offer solutions. Then, we reflect on what financing for social protection should look like in today’s crisis-prone world, unpacking the political choices behind budget constraints, the role of domestic resource mobilization, and how international solidarity can help turn political commitments into meaningful and measurable outcomes. Meet our guests: Hassatou Diop N’Sele, Vice President for Finance and CFO, African Development Bank Group Celine Julia Felix, Social Protection Specialist for Social Protection System Strengthening, UNICEF Lena Simet, Senior Researcher and Advocate, Human Rights Watch For Quick Wins, Jamele Rigolini, Senior Advisor for Social Protection and Labor at the World Bank, joins us to discuss the State of Social Protection Report 2025 and why expanding not just coverage, but adequacy is key in today’s uncertain world. Resources: Event | 4th International Conference on Financing for Development (FfD4) Publication | African Union Agenda 2063: The Africa We Want Publication | A Call for Action on Financing Social Protection Publication | State of Social Protection Report 2025: The 2-Billion-Person Challenge Publication | World Social Protection Report 2024-26: Universal social protection for climate action and a just transition  

Health is a human right, as well as a cornerstone of social protection systems. Yet globally, millions remain excluded from essential care, with financial hardship and systemic gaps still standing in the way of universal health coverage. In this episode, numbered as the 50th of the Social Protection Podcast, we take a close look at Zambia’s National Health Insurance Scheme as a case study for how countries are working to expand social health protection, and what the social protection and health sectors can learn from each other to achieve the shared goal of universal coverage. Meet our guests:  Herryman Moono, Director of Research, Planning & Strategy at the National Health Insurance Management Authority of Zambia  Lou Tessier, Health Protection Specialist at the International Labour Organization (ILO) For our Quick Wins segment, we speak with Peter Ombasa, Senior Social Protection Specialist and Assistant Director of Children's Services of the Government of Kenya, about the USP2030 Joint Statement: Key messages on Social Protection for the World Social Summit 2025. Resources: Blog post | Social Protection for Health and Wellbeing Publication | Towards Universal Health Coverage: Social Health Protection Principles Publication | World Social Protection Report 2024-26: Universal social protection for climate action and a just transition Publication | Financing gap for universal social protection: Global, regional and national estimates and strategies for creating fiscal space Publication | Universal social security is feasible in low-income countries: a critical review of the ILO’s calculations on the cost of bridging the gap Podcast | Think Change episode 70: how can development financing be reformed? The road to Seville