Water, Wildlife, and Climate’s Hidden Trade-Offs

The climate crisis is not one problem. It is a crisis of water, food, energy, language, justice and power - all colliding at once. So how do we respond when climate solutions create new trade-offs of their own? And are we even using the right words to describe what is happening?In this episode, Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson take on some of the knottiest questions in climate. From water stress and biodiversity loss, to geoengineering, public understanding, and the language of urgency itself. What gets overlooked? What gets simplified? And how do we navigate increasing complexity in the middle of a worsening crisis?We don’t have all the answers. But as our choices grow harder, these are some of the questions that demand our attention.Learn More:💧 Dive into Why Water Matters from the UNFCCC🦅 Explore how solar and wind energy producers can mitigate impacts on biodiversity🎧 Listen back to last year’s episode unpacking some of climate’s most common acronyms☁️ … or return to our most recent episode on geoengineering with Politico’s Karl Mathiesen🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation:Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form.Producer: Ben Weaver-Hincks Edited by: Miles Martignoni Planning: Caitlin Hanrahan Exec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week we acknowledge the US strikes on Iran and the escalation that has followed. The immediate human cost is what matters most right now. But this crisis is unfolding within a global system still shaped by oil markets and fossil fuel dependence - a dependence that amplifies regional instability and turns into global vulnerability.The same structural tensions sit at the heart of this week’s conversation, recorded before these events. Indonesia is the world's fourth most populous country, one of its largest coal exporters, and a nation with every natural resource it needs to transition to clean energy. The problem isn't will, it’s money. Who it's available to, and on what terms.Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson are joined by Sri Mulyani Indrawati - Indonesia's former Finance Minister under three different presidents, former Managing Director of the World Bank, and one of the most credible voices in the world on exactly this set of challenges. She walks through what it actually costs to retire a single coal plant years ahead of schedule, why developing countries find themselves trapped by contracts they signed in good faith, and why the international finance system is making the transition harder, not easier.Countries like Indonesia borrow at far higher rates than wealthier economies, even as they face greater exposure to climate impacts. When that exposure feeds into credit ratings, the cost of capital rises, making clean energy investment more expensive precisely where it is needed most.In a system that makes decarbonisation harder for the countries most vulnerable to climate impacts, who pays?Learn More:🏭 Explore Global Energy Monitor's coal plant tracker for Indonesia's existing and planned capacity🎧 Listen to our interview with Mia Mottley, Prime Minister of Barbados.🏦 Learn about the Bridgetown Agenda and its proposals to reform international development finance🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation:Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form.Producer: Ben Weaver-Hincks Edited by: Miles Martignoni Planning: Caitlin Hanrahan Exec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Climate concern is not the problem. Most people have it. What's missing is everything that turns concern into action - and understanding that gap turns out to be a lot more complicated than it looks.This week, Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson sit down with Lorraine Whitmarsh, Professor of Environmental Psychology and Director of the Centre for Climate Change and Social Transformations at the University of Bath. Together they dig into the psychology behind catastrophe apathy: why understanding an existential threat doesn't always lead to action, and what the research says actually moves people.Lorraine shares real-world evidence - including renewable energy tariffs that shifted 90% of customers onto green power simply by making it the default - and explains why trusted everyday messengers, from hairdressers to taxi drivers, employers to community figures, often have more influence than expert voices in reshaping what feels normal.The conversation also revisits an uncomfortable history: how the personal carbon footprint, popularised by BP in the early 2000s, reframed climate responsibility around individual choices rather than systemic change. A framing so powerful that even environmental organisations adopted it. Who benefited most from that shift is a question the movement is still grappling with.If systemic change requires public consent, and public consent requires political will, and political will requires behaviour change - how do you break the climate Catch-22?With thanks to the University of Bath.Learn More:🧠 Explore Lorraine Whitmarsh's research at the Centre for Climate Change and Social Transformations, University of Bath🔌 Read about the Swiss renewable energy default study — the experiment that moved 90% of customers to green energy by changing a default setting🗳️ Learn more about citizens' assemblies on climate and deliberative democracy in practice🌍 Read the IPCC's work on demand-side solutions and behavioural change in its Sixth Assessment Report🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation:Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form.Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksEdited by Miles MartignoniPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

The Trump administration last week announced the repeal of the ‘endangerment finding’ - the 2009 determination that climate change threatens public health and welfare. It may sound arcane, but this piece of legislation empowered the US federal government to regulate greenhouse gas emissions. This decision weakens the regulatory backbone of American climate policy, and may reshape the country’s emissions trajectory for years to come.So what happens next?This week, Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson consider the politics, the economics and the climate reality of this move. And Tom calls friend of the show Manish Bapna, President and CEO of the Natural Resources Defense Council, whose organisation is preparing to challenge the rollback in court. Speaking to us just as the case was filed, Manish explains why the endangerment finding has long been the legal bedrock of federal climate action, and how the case could climb all the way to the Supreme Court.Until then, uncertainty reins: is this a temporary political detour - or a structural turning point for US climate leadership? And if federal authority falters, will states, businesses and markets keep the transition moving anyway?Learn More:🌿 Learn how the EPA’s 2009 Endangerment Finding established the legal basis for regulating greenhouse gases📊 Understand the ‘Social Cost of Carbon’ - and why putting a price on climate damage matters⚖️ Read the statement from NRDC and its partners outlining their legal challenge to the rollback 🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form.Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Who shapes climate action when old systems begin to strain? And where does power really sit - with governments, financial institutions, communities, or individuals?Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson explore climate leadership in a more fragmented geopolitical moment. Picking up the threads from last week’s episode, they ask what happens when multilateralism is threatened - and whether smaller coalitions, subnational actors and civic movements are already stepping in to fill the gap.Because with great challenges, come new opportunities. What might we gain from faster, more focused alliances? Might Indigenous wisdom provide lessons for building fairer, greener economic models? And how can we use the resources we have to support Brazil’s vision for a global mutirão?Learn More:💡 Watch Mark Carney’s speech at the World Economic Forum in Davos🍩 Dive into the concept of Doughnut Economics🏙️ Explore what C40 Cities members are doing across the world📈 Find out more about ShareAction’s work to build a fairer and more sustainable financial system🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form. Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanAssistant Producer: Caillin McDaidExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Who really holds power in the climate transition? And how do money, politics, and influence shape the pace of change?In this episode, Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson use some of your most probing questions on the political economy of climate action to unpack what happens behind closed doors and to challenge some of the assumptions that often dominate public debate. What does lobbying actually look like - and is it always a bad thing? What are we talking about when we refer to ‘fossil fuel subsidies’? And in an age of populist politics and shrinking attention spans, can complex climate solutions still cut through? Or are we drifting toward simpler narratives that are easier to sell, but harder to govern?From negotiation rooms to national politics, and the economic systems beneath them, these are the forces both loudly and quietly shaping climate progress. And if we want to accelerate action, we first have to understand where power truly sits.🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form. Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanAssistant Producer: Caillin McDaidExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

World leaders are flocking to Beijing. In the first weeks of 2026, Canada’s Mark Carney, the UK’s Sir Keir Starmer and South Korea’s Lee Jae-myung have all made high-profile visits - an unmistakable signal of global power recalibrating.China’s dominance in clean energy manufacturing is already well established: from solar panels and batteries to wind turbines. The question now is whether this transition remains merely made in China, or whether it is increasingly being shaped and led from Beijing.Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson consider what this shift may mean for the future of climate leadership - and for the institutions, alliances and norms that have shaped global climate cooperation for decades. They’re joined by scholar of China’s political economy and climate governance Yixian Sun, who has recently advised the UK government on their engagement with China. He unpacks the country’s own vision of leadership, its evolving role in the Global South, and the risks and opportunities of an increasingly multipolar climate order.As the world recalibrates around China’s growing role, how does Beijing see itself? And what are other governments actually seeking as they turn towards it? We spoke to the man advising the UK government ahead of Keir Starmer’s arrival in Beijing.  🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimismLinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form. Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanAssistant Producer: Caillin McDaidExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

How dependent are we - economically, politically and socially - on fossil fuels? And how do we begin to loosen that grip?As the world reels from geopolitical shocks, multilateral institutions under strain, and the United States’ withdrawal from key climate bodies, Ana Toni - CEO of COP30 - joins the show to discuss what comes next. Both for Brazil’s presidency in this crucial year, and for the wider system of climate cooperation at a moment when the old rules feel increasingly fragile.Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson ask Ana what was achieved in Belém, what fell short, and why the year after the COP may matter more than the summit itself.Are we entering an era where progress is driven not by universal agreement, but by those willing to move first and bring others with them? And could reframing the transition around ending dependence, rather than negotiating targets, change the politics of climate action? 🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form. Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanAssistant Producer: Caillin McDaidExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

What happens when the world’s most powerful country walks away from the system it helped to build?This week, we examine the United States’ decision to withdraw not only from the Paris Agreement, but from the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change itself - alongside dozens of other international bodies. Headlines declared the end of multilateral climate cooperation. But is that really what this moment represents?Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson unpack what has actually been announced - and what it does (and doesn’t) change in practice.They are joined by Sue Biniaz, former US Deputy Special Envoy for Climate Change and one of the quiet architects of decades of climate diplomacy. Sue brings rare insight into whether a US president can legally withdraw from a Senate-ratified treaty, the surprising pathways by which a future administration could rejoin, and what influence the US may still wield as a non-party.Could the absence of the US voice, paradoxically, unlock progress elsewhere? And in a fractured world, where does collective climate leadership now come from?Learn more:🎥 Watch our hosts’ immediate response to the US UNFCCC withdrawal announcement, recorded the day after news broke📰 Read the New York Times profile of Sue Biniaz by Lisa Friedman: Meet the Closer Who Finds the Right Words When Climate Talks Hit a Wall📄 Dive into the Just Security article penned by Sue Biniaz and Jean Galbraith on treaty withdrawal and re-entry 🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form.Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanAssistant Producer: Caillin McDaidExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

The year has barely begun, and already the fault lines of global power are on full display.Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson take stock of a moment that feels both shocking and revealing. The US abduction of Venezuela’s president raises urgent questions about sovereignty, international law, and the enduring grip of fossil fuels on geopolitics - even as the energy transition accelerates. But what’s really driving events in Venezuela? And how can we tease apart the political theatre from the realities of oil markets, military power, and domestic US politics.Later, we ask: what are the big themes, underlying trends and climate stories already shaping the new year? From the possible rise of left-wing populism, to the intensifying battle over who will become the next UN Secretary-General.As 2026 begins, the question is not just what kind of year lies ahead for climate action, but what kind of global order will shape it.Learn more:🛢️ Deep dive into the stats from the US Energy Information Administration on Venezuelan oil production🌐 Read more about the appointment process of the UN Secretary-General.🎧 Listen back to our holiday episodes, Why Beauty Matters in the Climate Crisis and Beginning the Year with Ancestral Wisdom 🎤 Leave us your voice notes and questions for upcoming episodes on SpeakPipeJoin the conversation: Instagram @outrageoptimism LinkedIn @outrageoptimismOr get in touch with us via this form.Producer: Ben Weaver-HincksPlanning: Caitlin HanrahanExec Producer: Ellie CliffordThis is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.