Intentional Performers

Tanya Vogel has had quite a career in athletics and she’s kind of just getting started with her impact and influence in not just athletics, but beyond it as well. She’s been a distinguished leader in collegiate athletics for nearly 3 decades. Recently, she concluded her tenure as the Director of Athletics at George Washington University; she served in that position for 7 years. Her journey at GW began in 1992 as a student and All-American soccer player. She’s in GW’s hall of fame and she earned multiple degrees at GW including a BS, and MS, and an MBA. So, Tanya is a learner, which is going to be the core of today’s conversation; she loves to learn, she loves to grow. Additionally, she was recognized for her playing career becoming the first women’s soccer player to be inducted into the GW athletic hall of fame in 2002. She became their head coach at the age of 25. So, Tanya at GW is certainly an icon and somebody that the Athletic Department for a long time has looked to for leadership as a player, as a coach, and as an athletic director. In that athletic director capacity, she cultivated a culture of excellence resulting in 19 conference championships and a cumulative GPA of 3.62 among student athletes. One of the things that’s going to be abundantly clear in today’s conversation is that Tanya is a competitor; she loves to win, and she cares deeply about human beings and developing them and cultivating them and pouring into student athletes. She’s a recognized national figure; she’s served on key NCAA committees and chaired the Atlantic 10 Athletic Director’s Council. She’s also a graduate of the Georgetown Transformational Leadership Coaching Program and she’s an ICF certified coach. We’ll talk a little bit about her journey to becoming an executive coach, and I may have actually played a small part in that journey and maybe a spark to have her explore that journey. In addition to her coaching practice, she serves as a consultant for the Pictor Group, which helps her continue her commitment to leadership and organizational development, specifically within the athletic world. So, Tanya is a competitor, she’s a leader, she’s a coach, she’s been essentially the CEO of an athletic department (that’s what the role of an athletic director is), and she has seen just about everything when it comes to collegiate athletics. So, this is a conversation about culture, this is a conversation about leadership, this is a conversation about mindset, and most of all it’s a conversation of two friends chopping it up and chatting about what they’re passionate about, which is people. Tanya had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “I don’t make too many decisions without processing, without thinking through things” (8:05). “I felt like I took [George Washington athletics] about as far as I could take it” (10:00). “I feel like comfort and discomfort overlap” (12:35). “I’m comfortable in discomfort, and I can be uncomfortable in comfort” (13:35). “Our competitive advantage is going to be seen in how we treat one another” (14:55). “Culture is people” (22:30). “It can’t just be high fives and I love you” (25:30). “Confidence and motivation come from within” (27:30). “Just be insanely curious” (28:05). “I work really hard to gather the data and do the research” (32:10). “When you’re a head coach, you’re not going to be liked” (34:20). “Leadership is not about being liked” (34:40). “Every job I’ve gotten is by somebody that’s known me” (40:30). “Be great where you’re at” (42:05). “Mentors play a huge role in our growth and development, but advocates are key [too]” (47:15). “Genuinely, most people want to feel useful” (55:55). “I have this burning desire to go into the grave still learning; I just want to do that forever” (1:01:45). “94% of women in the C-Suite have competed in athletics” (1:08:55). Additionally, you can find the Ripple Impact website here and connect with Tanya on LinkedIn. Thank you so much to Tanya for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Joe Quitoni is the Founder and CEO of Unify Align. Unify Align collaborates with clients to reimagine the people and customer experience, delivering real-world solutions that supercharge business growth. Joe knows a thing or two about collaborating with clients, specifically around people and customer experience. Throughout his career, he has used his skills in organizational transformation to create game-changing advantages for some of the world’s biggest brands. Before starting Unify Align, he put in over 20 years at the Ritz Carlton hotel company, where he served as the Director of Human Resources before jumping over to the brand’s consulting firm, The Ritz Carlton Leadership Center, where he led the team as Global Head of Delivery. For those unfamiliar with what they do at The Ritz Carlton when it comes to the leadership center, think of it similarly to what Disney does; both of these organizations are known for customer service, so they actually train other businesses and other organizations on how they can serve. So, certainly if you’ve ever been to a Ritz Carlton, you have a sense of what the vibe is there. We’re going to talk about vibe quite a bit in today’s conversation. When he was working at Ritz Carlton, he transformed and evolved their approach and methodology, which created dramatic positive impact to the clients and businesses that they served. But Joe isn’t your typical corporate suit; he is someone who is unique in the way he thinks and how he delivers information. He brings a modern twist to the world of consulting; he’s armed with a Master of Science in Industrial/Organizational Psychology and applies an innovative methodology to his work, where he delivers successful outcomes for a diverse portfolio of companies and clients. We’ve talked offline about some of those; they are truly remarkable. He works with startups, he works with Fortune 500 giants, he’s even worked with sports organizations, and he is someone who cares deeply about leadership, connection, inspiration, motivation, and really thinks about how an environment, how a vibe, how a culture, can drive not just customer experience, but employee experience as well. He’s known for his keynote speeches, which is actually how I found him, and also working alongside all kinds of different leaders inside organizations to ultimately help them develop what he calls “a very intentional vibe.” Joe had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “This word culture has been around for decades, but we have evolved tremendously as a society” (6:55). “The simplest way you can define culture is it’s everything in the environment” (7:20). “This word ‘vibe’ is… the energy, the attitudes, the beliefs that influence shared motivation, productivity, and engagement in an environment” (8:15). “This feeling of empowerment certainly allows for that authenticity to come through” (12:20). “A purpose statement creates a sense of pride, it’s inspirational, it’s motivational, and it shifts the headspace of an employee” (13:55). “You can’t just have the words; you as an organization need to clearly define what your perspective is of that belief and then you have to take it one step further; you have to attach specific behaviors” (15:15). “I like to center the vibe around the employee” (17:10). “When we’re talking about the word experience, consistency is the most important word in that” (18:25). “Far too often, people mistake customer service and customer experience as the same thing” (18:50). “Every single interaction… should have a beginning, should have a middle, and should have an end” (19:25). “I don’t want people to fit the mold; I’m a huge fan of diversity of thought and challenging the status quo” (26:05). “Accountability is one of the biggest reasons as to why something sticks or why it doesn’t” (28:15). “When you’re practicing accountability, I think it’s a coaching moment” (31:45). “Any time we engage in work, it’s always a co-created process” (38:00). “No consulting job should have a one-size-fits-all” (38:30). “Reach far and then go one step further” (42:10). “I equate loyalty and being a brand ambassador as being very similar” (50:20). “Brand ambassador is what we should all be shooting for” (50:55). “Every day is a new challenge” (54:30). “I continue to learn every single day and I think that’s the thing I love most about what I’m doing today” (54:35). “Success is at the heart of everything that we do” (56:20). “I want to transform the headspace and the mindset of your employees” (56:30). Additionally, you can connect with Joe on LinkedIn and check out the Unify Align website here. Thank you so much to Joe for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Harris Fanaroff is the Founder of Linked Revenue. Linked Revenue is a company that helps Executives and sales and marketing teams utilize LinkedIn to generate new business. They focus on 3 areas: Helping executives generate thought leadership content Growing and nurturing their network Creating a business development strategy and executing on it Harris has over 28,000 followers on LinkedIn and has spent the last 4 years understanding how to best use the platform. He lives right outside Washington DC with his 1-year-old son and wife. He was a former MLB draft pick and Division 1 college baseball player. Harris had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “I had always wanted to be an entrepreneur” (7:35). “I didn’t know how to deal with those failures as an athlete” (15:45). “If one person will find value from what you’re going to share, it’s success” (18:50). “Getting laid off was the best thing that ever happened to me” (21:40). “Find out what they care about, and then do it for them” (23:15). “If AI can write it, then don’t put it on LinkedIn because nobody cares what AI says a leader should do” (25:10). “Give me the raw version, let me understand that person, because at the end of the day, people buy from people” (27:35). “I want your personality to come through in your content” (27:45). “I’m terrible at delegation, like most founders are” (29:00). “I have to be relatively relentless with what I spend my time on” (29:50). “When I leave this planet, I want to help give other people jobs” (33:35). “The more I can do to build relationships, for myself and for my clients, the higher probability for success when it comes to the game of business” (36:05). “You shouldn’t sell on LinkedIn” (40:15). “If you wouldn’t do it in person, don’t do it on LinkedIn” (40:45). “Sharing thoughtful content consistently increases your ability to get lucky from a business development perspective” (1:03:25). “If you have better, stronger relationships with more people, your business is going to be easier” (1:03:45). Additionally, you can connect with Harris on Twitter and LinkedIn. You can also subscribe to Harris’s newsletter here. Thank you so much to Harris for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Dr. Diane Hamilton is one of those people that came on my radar and just didn’t stay off of it. She is one of the leading experts when it comes to studying curiosity in the world. She’s written multiple books about curiosity, she’s the creator of the curiosity code index which tries to help us understand what actually gets in the way of our ability to stay curious, and for that I am extremely grateful. I took the curiosity code index, and actually the focus of a lot of our conversation today is us unpacking my scores and her explaining the different factors that cause us to perhaps retreat from curiosity. She’s a thought leader in other fields, including leadership, sales, marketing, management, engagement, personality, and, as I mentioned, curiosity. She has spent time with some of the best leaders in the world. So, today’s conversation certainly focuses on what she’s learned, what she’s studied, what she’s researched, and how we can apply it to our lives. She’s a keynote speaker that’s also been featured in a multitude of publications that you’ve heard of, such as Ink and Harvard Business Review. If you are someone who’s interested in curiosity, perhaps you’ve seen her speak at a company or at a conference or on other podcasts. Diane had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “I spent years researching and studying what happens to curiosity [over the lifespan].” “Both curiosity and creativity tend to peak at age 5 and then diminish.” “This fixed mindset is something that will shut you down completely.” “It’s challenging to meet everyone in the way they want to be met.” “You can’t teach all kids the same way.” “You rely on the foundational aspects of what you know, but you need to continue to grow.” “A lot of people are afraid of the ramifications of stepping outside of what’s comfortable.” “We don’t want to be the one not doing what everybody else is doing.” “There’s no better way to learn something than to teach it.” “For a culture to be curious, it has to come from the top down.” “[Personality assessments] bring up all of these ideas to think about.” “Each year, you meet people that open up new ideas for you.” “You just don’t know who you’re going to meet that might change your whole trajectory.” “You don’t know what you don’t know until you try something.” “Nobody wants to look like they didn’t prepare.” “If you’re the smartest person in the room, it’s a pretty boring room.” “With technology, information overload is a real thing for people.” “It’s easier to get along with the group.” Additionally, you can follow Diane across social media @drdianehamilton and purchase her books, Cracking the Curiosity Code and Curiosity Unleashed, anywhere books are sold. You can also find everything you need to know about Diane on her website. Thank you so much to Diane for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Jason LaRose has built quite a reputation for himself throughout his career in his desire to help companies scale and grow. He worked for companies like Under Armour, where he became their President of the North America Region. He then went onto Equinox Media, where he served as the CEO, helping them build out their technologies and their content. From there, he co-founded and became President of a company called The Post, which is actually how we got connected; The Post has created a community for former athletes, and some current athletes, to come together to learn together and support each other. It is an amazing networking group that continues to grow. Most recently, he became the President of Bombas. If you’re unfamiliar with Bombas, it is an incredible, mission-driven apparel company (and as I said to Jason, I am currently wearing their socks, their socks are really what put them on the map). They created a company that not just created comfortable and quality socks, but also with a mission behind it where they give away apparel for every apparel that’s bought, and they support homeless shelters all throughout the country. So, Jason is somebody who’s been at the ground level of companies, he’s helped companies scale and grow from $1 billion to $5 billion, and at his core he’s someone who considers himself to be an operator, he considers himself to be someone who can create strategy and execute by using amazing systems, and I think that’s going to come across in today’s conversation. And he’s someone who clearly values culture; he values mission, he values doing good while also doing well. I think he has great clarity and it’s going to come across in our conversation as far as what he sees a successful business is and his own growth as he’s developed himself through the years. Jason had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “The mission at Bombas is just too hard to pass up” (5:55). “The mission [at Bombas] is who we are; it’s why the company was founded in the first place” (7:25). “At Bombas, we give [the consumer] a way to be a part of the solution” (8:10). “Brand is a promise” (12:00). “At Bombas, we talk about three words all the time: comfort, quality, and mission” (12:25). “Everything contributes to mission” (13:35), “Mission only matters [at Bombas] if you sell” (14:00). “I probably hate to lose more than I love to win” (19:05). “I love to look out and see the potential conditions for success being there” (19:15). “More than anything, what I love is growth” (19:30). “I’m not very good at [being] content” (23:20). “Over time, I’ve learned to be more appreciative and take those moments to reflect” (26:55). “Founders are special people” (28:50). “I’m enamored with people who know things that I don’t know” (29:25). “Really great founders are maniacal about their brands” (32:15). “Scale doesn’t come just because you have a great idea” (33:40). “What athletes are most amazing at is watching the film” (39:35). “Great athletes and great coaches don’t only have one solution” (43:20). “Once you get people aligned around the mission, you can do almost anything” (44:15). Additionally, you can follow Bombas on all social media platforms and connect with Jason on LinkedIn. Thank you so much to Jason for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Mitch Warner is a managing partner of the Arbinger Institute, which is a global leadership development firm. He directs the development of Arbinger’s leadership development programs and highly customized large-scale organizational culture change initiatives. Mitch has been instrumental in Arbinger’s rapid growth, including its expanding international presence in over 20 countries. He’s also a heck of a writer; he’s the co-author of Arbinger’s bestselling books Leadership and Self Deception (which we get into at length in today’s conversation), The Anatomy of Peace (which we actually don’t really dive into in today’s conversation), and The Outward Mindset (which is really the precursor for a lot of our conversation today). Mitch is obsessed with mindset and how mindset can impact how we show up not just for ourselves, but for the people around us. Mitch has delivered training and consulting internationally to leaders and organizations across a broad range of industries. He’s a sought-after teacher, speaker, and advisor to leaders of corporations, governments, and organizations of all kinds around the world on the topics of leadership, collaboration, mindset, and culture change. He also is at the forefront of conflict resolution, alignment, and strategy. This conversation gets deeply into mindset, really into leadership, and we’re going to talk about how mindset impacts leadership at great length. Lastly, I bring myself into today’s conversation and I hope you appreciate it; I try to make these conversations as real as possible and bring in current challenges that I am dealing with, so I hope you find your own place and space in today’s conversation and think about how you can increase your own self-awareness and maybe some of the things you’re struggling with on a day-to-day basis, whether it’s personally or professionally. Mitch had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “Art is a communication between the artist and the viewer” (6:05). “The most interesting thing about art to me is that it’s not just self-expression” (7:05). “Everybody has the capacity for creativity” (10:45). “The purpose of art is not photography” (12:20). “The point is not to see the reality in the same way, the point is to realize we’re going to see that thing differently based on our experiences, based on what we’re bringing to it” (14:10). “When I approach a person with a lens of judgment, I fail to recognize that I’m seeing myself as already different than they are” (16:25). “No matter what form it takes, whatever I’m trying to project keeps me cut off from the people in my life” (25:10). “The challenge with a word like ‘authenticity’ is it’s so easily misunderstood” (28:45). “At the end of the day, all of us are the same in a key, fundamental way: we all know what’s underneath behavior, and what’s underneath behavior is how we see” (31:05). “It’s not like our experiences are neutral; they’re all charged, and we live in an environment that has all sorts of social expectations” (46:10). “The work is to become free of self-deception, of the lies that we tell ourselves that get in the way of us just being with other people” (52:30). “There’s different ways to go toward a problem” (54:45). “People have a broad spectrum of possibility” (55:40). “If I’m self-deceived, I can’t lead” (57:10). “People don’t respond to our behaviors… What people respond to is how they’re being seen” (58:05). “The problem with self-deception is the fact that not only can I not see that I’m the problem, but I resist the very possibility that I’m the problem” (1:05:50). Additionally, you can find the Arbinger Institute website here. I’d also highly encourage you to purchase Mitch’s books wherever books are sold. You can also connect with Mitch on LinkedIn and Instagram. Thank you so much to Mitch for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Doug Stitt most recently served as the Chief People Officer for the United States Army where he was the lead HR officer for the Army's 1 million uniform and civilian personnel. He graduated from Norwich University and served around the globe in a variety of formations. He is married to Beth and has two daughters, Laura and Anna. Doug had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “[Soldiers] all have a story and it’s unique to them” (7:40). “Connect with the people that are making the connections” (8:30). “[When I hear the word soldier] I think of service, I think of selflessness, I think of being a servant, I think of physical and emotional courage” (10:35). “I wish more people knew a soldier” (16:55). “Just because it’s a tradition doesn’t mean it’s good” (19:00). “Innovation for tomorrow is better than the tradition of today” (19:25). “Friction isn’t always bad” (22:00). “People want to be wanted” (24:10). “Culture is a long-term ebb and flow in an organization” (26:50). “What brought somebody into the army might not be why they’re sticking around” (40:20). “I see opportunities to go try and do something different” (41:45). “I became a better listener than when I first joined [the Army]” (42:35). “People don’t care about what you know until they know how much you care” (47:40). “Coaching trees are very evident within the military as well” (54:10). “Every soldier is a leader… that’s what it means to be in this organization” (1:01:35). “Leader development is hard, it takes time” (1:03:20). “I cared about [my soldiers] first and foremost as people” (1:10:30). Additionally, you can connect with Doug on LinkedIn. Thank you so much to Doug for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Ashley Zaslav is the founder of Integrative Complexity, which is a high-performance coaching firm that works with made career high achievers ready to bet on themselves and test their potential. She’s also on our coaching bench at Strong Skills, and I’ve been fortunate to refer some amazing people to Ashley and hear firsthand about the work that she does with them. Some of her clients include founders of investment firms, newly promoted partners, high potential investment professionals, search fund CEOs, first time CEOs, C-suite leaders, and executive directors. Ashley is an athlete, and she was a two-time captain of the Duke Women’s Soccer Team that was a national finalist in 2011. She was the number five recruit in the nation coming out of high school. So, Ashley is absolutely a competitor, but we talk about her mindset and how it’s shifted over the years from just competing and maximizing and being the best that she can be to blending that mindset with one of wisdom, one of slowing down, one of thinking and being a little more intentional with how she shows up, while still being her competitive self. She competed globally with the US Youth National Team until she finished her career due to injuries. Injuries are a big part of Ashley’s journey; she tore her ACL three times when she was in college, and she’ll talk about her resilient mind and how she thought about injuries, and I think it’s something for all of us to take away from today’s conversation. Her approach to coaching is informed by her experience and expertise in high performance that she developed competing as an elite athlete at the highest levels, as well as working within the finance world. She worked at places like Bridgewater (if you’re unfamiliar with Bridgewater, perhaps you’re familiar with their founder, Ray Dalio, who’s got a TedTalk and has written a bestselling book and is really at the forefront of people and culture as it relates to the finance world), TPG, Brooklyn’s Capital Strategies, and at Spencer Stewart where she worked with all kinds of different elements of people practices within organizations. She received her MBA from NYU Stern and she got her bachelor’s from Duke University. She’s also very proud of being the mother to 3 kids under 5. Ashley had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “On the outside someone can look one way and then have so many challenges on the inside” (8:45). “Everybody has a story” (9:00). “I do think that knowing I had faced these really hard things and gotten through them gave me this inner confidence when things would come my way” (14:20). “I have to learn how to be when things are good” (18:20). “I love making patterns of information” (22:45). “It’s harder to speak up when you don’t have conviction about what you’re saying” (25:35). “I’m very open and flexible about who I need to be to get better” (28:30). “For me, what’s felt more organic is to be fluid” (37:45). “There’s nothing more honest than sitting in a film room watching yourself blow a play that leads to the other team scoring. There’s no hiding from that” (41:40). “The best companies are always balancing short term and long term” (48:15). “One of my favorite things about succession planning is to do it well it requires almost going against all of the strong, natural impulses” (50:50). “That ability to integrate those two realities changed my world so much” (53:55). “[For me], success [looks] like doing work really well, doing work that I love, being present for the kids, having marriage and partnership, really enjoying life” (1:05:45). “I do think success 3 to 5 years from now is looking back on these last 3 years and feeling like I wasn’t just striving” (1:12:15). Additionally, you can connect with Ashley on LinkedIn. Thank you so much to Ashley for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.

Gretchen Rubin is one of today’s most influential and thought-provoking observers of happiness and human nature. We discuss happiness at length in today’s conversation, but we also discuss frameworks, and I think you’re going to find right off the bat that Gretchen sees things in terms of frameworks, in terms of theory. But she’s also known for her ability to convey complex ideas from science, to literature, to stories from her own life, with levity and clarity. So, we bring her into this conversation and we actually bring myself in to today’s conversation, and I think that will make it really come to life. She’s a writer, and she’s going to articulate how much she loves writing and how big of an impact writing has made on her life and how she sees the world. She’s the author of many bestselling books, such as The Happiness Project, Better than Before, and The Four Tendencies, which has sold millions of copies in more than 30 languages. Her most recent book, which we reference in today’s conversation, is Life in 5 Senses. She’s also the host of the popular podcast Happier with Gretchen Rubin and the founder of the award-winning “Happier” app, which helps people track their happiness-boosting habits. She’s been interviewed by Oprah, she’s spent time with Daniel Kahneman, she’s walked arm-in-arm with the Dalai Lama, and her work has been reported on in a medical journal (which eventually got written up in The New Yorker). So, she’s been in all kinds of interesting spaces; she’s also been an answer on Jeopardy, which is a claim to fame for her. I think this conversation will give you a sense of yourself, which is what I really appreciate about it; it’ll make you think about yourself and hopefully make you a little more aware of how you show up for you and for others. Gretchen had a number of amazing insights during our conversation. Some of them include: “If we want to make our lives happier, healthier, more productive, more creative, one of the things we need to figure out is how to make habits” (6:00). “Depending on whether we meet or resist outer and inner expectations, that’s what makes us an upholder, a questioner, an obliger, or a rebel” (7:50). “Upholders are people who readily meet both outer and inner expectations” (8:00). “Questioners question all expectations; they’ll do something if they think it makes sense” (10:25). “Obliger is the biggest tendency, for both men and women” (16:00). “Obligers are people who readily meet outer accountability, but they struggle to meet inner accountability” (16:10). “If you want to meet an inner expectation as an obliger, you need to create a system of outer accountability” (16:25). “The way to keep a promise to yourself is to make a promise to someone else” (16:55). “Rebels resist all expectations, outer and inner alike” (17:35). “From the practical comes the transcendent” (19:55). “My behavior follows from my identity” (22:10). “Allow rebel children to face the consequences of their actions; that is how a rebel learns” (23:20). “Sometimes these little adjustments in communication can have massive consequences in behavior” (25:05). “Once you understand the mechanism of what’s going on, it’s a lot easier to address it” (28:10). “For many people, there’s a sense that they kind of neglect” (30:50). “Whatever you want to achieve in your life, even if they’re contradictory, the five senses can help you” (35:50). “I really get tremendous satisfaction out of just being able to explore ideas in all these different ways and exercise my creativity in a lot of different ways” (40:40). “We want to accept ourselves and also expect more from ourselves” (44:25). “I think the word motivation is very complicated” (46:25). “You can’t expect to be motivated by motivation” (47:30). “I never define happiness” (1:04:45). “We all can decide for ourselves what it means to be happy” (1:05:00). “Negative emotions have a very important part to play” (1:06:05). “If you get interested in something, really try to become a minor expert” (1:15:30). “The more you know, the more questions you have” (1:16:05). Additionally, you can find everything you need to know about Gretchen and connect with her on her website, as well as following her on all social media platforms @GretchenRubin. I’d also highly encourage you to check out Gretchen’s podcast, Happier with Gretchen Rubin, wherever you consume your podcasts. Thank you so much to Gretchen for coming on the podcast! I wrote a book called “Shift Your Mind” that was released in October of 2020, and you can order it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Additionally, I have launched a company called Strong Skills, and I encourage you to check out our new website https://www.strongskills.co/. If you liked this episode and/or any others, please follow me on Twitter: @brianlevenson or Instagram: @Intentional_Performers. Thanks for listening.