Bonus – Inside Mentalization-Based Treatment: Borderline & Narcissistic Personality Disorders (308)

Explore expanded states of consciousness with Patty Nagle's insights on breathwork and psychedelics for personal transformation.

Learn how attachment healing can improve your relationships and foster deeper connections within your community and beyond.

Discover how DBT can cultivate joy and self-acceptance, addressing the effects of chronic invalidation on queer identities.

Delve into Mentalization-Based Treatment to support those with Borderline Narcissistic traits and strengthen emotional intelligence.

Borderline and narcissism are often misunderstood—this episode separates myth from science. Robert Drozek explores the science behind borderline and narcissistic personality disorders, separating common myths from current research. Together, he and Sue discuss attachment, trauma, genetics, parenting, evidence-based treatments, and why understanding these often misunderstood conditions can bring greater compassion, hope, and healthier relationships. “Borderline is driven by a need to reconnect.” – Robert P. Drozek, LICSW Time Stamps for Challenging Personalities: Understanding Borderline & Narcissism with Robert Drozek (307) 04:14 Understanding Borderline Personality Disorder 09:25 Exploring narcissism: Definitions and types 13:29 Vulnerable vs. grandiose narcissism 18:56 The Role of Trauma in Personality Disorders 22:25 Parenting styles and their impact on narcissism 27:14 Identifying narcissism in relationships 33:34 Treatment approaches for Borderline Personality Disorder 36:45 Challenges in treating Narcissistic Personality Disorder 45:26 Navigating relationships with narcissistic individuals About our Guest – Robert P. Drozek, LICSW Robert P. Drozek, LICSW is the clinical director of the Mentalization-Based Treatment Clinic at McLean Hospital in Belmont, Massachusetts. He is a teaching associate in the Department of Psychiatry at Harvard Medical School, specializing in the treatment of borderline personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder, and post-traumatic stress disorder. He is author of the new book, Mentalization: Utilizing reflection to heal from borderline personality disorder—the first book for the general public about mentalization-based treatment.   Resources for Challenging Personalities: Understanding Borderline & Narcissism with Robert Drozek (307) Download page – Free worksheets and handouts from the book Mentalization Coach App – The first mobile app for mentalization and MBT, adapted from my new book Mentalization-based Treatment for Pathological Narcissism – Handbook Mentalization-based Treatment for Personality Disorders–  A practical guide Cambridge Guide to Mentalization-based Treatment Anna Freud Centre – The worldwide training hub for mentalization-based treatment (MBT) NPD Basic – A free guide to narcissistic personality disorder MBT Boston – An organization that Robert co-founded that offers training and supervision to clinicians across the world in MBT MBT USA – A consortium of MBT providers and organizations in the United Robert’s faculty page at McLean Hospital Instagram: @RobertDrozek Mentalization book – Facebook page Get your copy of Mentalization: Utilizing Reflection to Heal from Borderline Personality Disorder here! Please support our sponsors – they keep our podcast free and accessible to all!  SimplePractice is an all-in-one EHR that is HIPPA compliant, HITRUST certified and built specifically for therapists. If you are ready to simplify the business side of your practice, now is a great time to try SimplePractice. Start with a 7-day free trial, then get 50% off your first three months. Just go to SimplePractice.com to claim the offer. Beyond Attachment Styles – Deepening Security in Yourself and Fostering More Secure Relationships Course available NOW!   Everyone’s heard of attachment styles – but you likely don’t know how much the popular press gets wrong and what the science actually says about how to improve your relationships long term (including how we relate to ourselves).  This course is for anyone wanting to more deeply understand attachment (styles vs patterns), unconscious defense activation patterns, implicit scripts… and most importantly, what to do once you do get activated!  Online, Self-Paced, Asynchronous Learning with Quarterly Live Q&A’s! Earn 6 Continuing Education Credits – Available at Checkout. As a listener of this podcast, use code BAS15 for a limited-time discount. Or read Marriott & Kelley’s critically-acclaimed book, Secure Relating: Holding Your Own in an Insecure World (HarperCollins,2023) for the most in-depth experience of learning about Secure Relating. Therapists love it, but it’s accessible to everyone.  If you aren’t interested in the background science, just start at Part 2 and we will be talking directly to you – it’s fun!   You are invited!  OK for those of you who refer others to the pod, use it professionally or consider yourself nerdy and just love this stuff, hello, you are our people! Join our exclusive community to get exclusive bonus content, early access to training opportunities, and an ad-free, private podcast feed. It’s this warm community that allows us to donate half of all corportate profits to mental health access for marginalized peoples.  Sign up for our premium Neuronerd plan!! Click here!! 

What is responsible externalization? Learn how therapists can address systematic trauma and create space for grief and imagination in their practices. This episode brought to you by Simple Practice and www.therapistuncensored.com/join.

The leadership skill that changes everything Special guest Amy Holloway explores how trust shapes thriving communities, effective leadership, and long-term economic growth. Drawing from interviews with leaders across the United States, Amy shares the simple but powerful behaviors that build trust, strengthen collaboration, and create meaningful change – whether in organizations, neighborhoods, or entire cities. Together, Amy and Ann discuss the leadership traits that foster connection, the behaviors that erode trust, and why building community starts with intentional relationships. “Trust-building is within everyone’s power.” – Amy Holloway Time Stamps for Trust Builders: Leadership That Creates Change with Amy Holloway (305) 00:15 Importance of establishing trust in communities 07:32 Trust breakers vs. trust builders 14:18 Characteristics of effective community leaders 19:52 Insights from interviews with local leaders 25:33 Crisis management and community recovery About our Guest – Amy Holloway, President of Aha! Amy Holloway is the president of Aha!, an economic development consultancy specializing in strategic planning, and a practitioner-in-residence with Harvard Kennedy School’s Reimagining the Economy Project. Over a 30-year career, she has helped more than 200 places design strategies for long-term economic growth and community prosperity. A retired partner at Ernst & Young and leader of the firms national economic development practice, Amy previously founded and led Avalanche Consulting, one of the nation’s leading strategic planning firms. With her upbeat, welcoming style, she brings local leaders together through conversations that spark “aha!” moments and shared action. Her new #1 bestselling book, Trust Builders: The Key To Thriving Communities, is the culmination of Amy’s career-long belief that trust among local leaders is the single most powerful force shaping thriving communities. Amy lives in Asheville, North Carolina. In her free time, she enjoys hiking, painting, and teaching Pilates. Resources for Trust Builders: Leadership That Creates Change with Amy Holloway (305) Trust Builders: The Key to Thriving Communities – Get your copy of Amy’s book today!! Aha! Advisor – Aha! is where leaders unite to make a lasting impact, learn more Trust Strengths Assessment – Take your assessment here!! Reimagining the Economy Project, Harvard Kennedy School – Rohan Sandhu, Tony Ditta, Monserrat Magana Ocana The Social Capital Atlas – Raj Chetty, Matthew O. Jackson, Theresa Kuchler, Johannes Stroebel. Abigail Hiller, Sarah Oppenheimer * The Opportunity Insights Team Beyond Attachment Styles course is available NOW!   Learn how your nervous system, your mind, and your relationships work together in a fascinating dance, shaping who you are and how you connect with others. Online, Self-Paced, Asynchronous Learning with Quarterly Live Q&A’s! Earn 6 Continuing Education Credits – Available at Checkout As a listener of this podcast, use code BAS15 for a limited-time discount.     Get your copy of Secure Relating here!!

In the ongoing effort to expand perspectives, Sue Marriott talks with Dr. Sabrina N'Diaye.  Sister Sabrina as she calls herself shares incredible stories and surprising insights that help to widen our mental health perspective.  She focuses on a more holistic approach to healing that blends spirituality, therapy, ancestral wisdom, and community connection. Together, they explore the transformative power of writing, forgiveness, and intentional rituals, while discussing how self-love, collective healing, and honoring every emotion can help us reconnect with ourselves and move through trauma with greater compassion and resilience.

OCD isn’t just about managing symptoms—it’s about understanding the parts beneath them In the third and final part of our OCD series, expert Melissa Mose explores the complexities of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD), discussing evidence-based treatments like Exposure and Response Prevention (ERP) and how Internal Family Systems (IFS) therapy can complement traditional approaches. Drawing from both professional expertise and personal experience, Melissa shares practical strategies for navigating OCD, while highlighting the roles of self-leadership, compassion, and understanding the different “parts” that influence thoughts, fears, and behaviors. “ERP has been shown to be the most effective treatment. Exposures help the brain rewire and learn resilience.” – Melissa Mose  Time Stamps for The Hidden Parts of OCD: ERP, IFS, and Self-Leadership with Melissa Mose (303) 00:12 Introduction to OCD and treatment 02:58 Understanding exposure and response prevention (ERP) 08:13 The role of the therapist in ERP 10:45 Integrating internal family systems (IFS) with ERP 13:30 The impact of shame in OCD 16:09 Differentiating reassurance from compulsions 36:25 Understanding exiled parts in therapy 40:58 Obsessive and compulsive parts: A closer look 43:38 Navigating the helicopter parent dynamic 47:40 Differentiating between anxiety and OCD 55:45 The connection between attachment and OCD About our Guest – Melissa Mose, LMFT Melissa Mose is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist with a private practice in Los Angeles since 1995. She has specialized in the treatment of OCD and anxiety since 2011 and currently trains and supervises associates in her group practice. Melissa is also an Internal Family Systems therapist. She is Level 3 trained and Certified and an IFSI-approved clinical consultant. She has served on staff as a PA for multiple Level 1 and Level 2 experiential IFS trainings through the IFS Institute. Melissa’s experience as the parent of a child with OCD led her to specialize in the treatment of individuals with anxiety and OCD as well as their families. She is a graduate of the IOCDF’s general, pediatric and advanced Behavior Therapy Training Institutes (BTTI) as well as the Supportive Parenting for Anxious Childhood Emotions (SPACE) program and Cognitive-behavioral Intervention for Tics training (CBIT). Her fifteen years of experience prior to that specialization provided a broad foundation of skills and approaches that infuse her integrative approach. With a background in family systems and mindfulness practices, she became driven to find more compassionate and accessible treatment for OCD. Melissa has developed an integrative approach that utilizes an IFS framework to provide evidence-based exposure therapy for OCD. She is an international speaker and educator on obsessive compulsive disorder and its treatment, and she is currently the president of the board of directors of OCD Southern California, an affiliate of the International OCD Foundation. In her role on the board of OCD SoCal advocates for individuals with OCD, hosts speakers’ series, trainings, and one of largest virtual OCD conferences worldwide. It is her mission to raise awareness, improve early identification and greater treatment accessibility for individuals with OCD and their families. Resources for The Hidden Parts of OCD: ERP, IFS, and Self-Leadership with Melissa Mose (303) Melissa’s website – Resources & information IFS for OCD Clinician’s Guide – Melissa’s book – Internal Family Systems for OCD: A Clinician’s Guide  www.OCDSoCal.org – Melissa is president of OCD Southern California Beyond Attachment Styles course is available NOW!   Learn how your nervous system, your mind, and your relationships work together in a fascinating dance, shaping who you are and how you connect with others. Online, Self-Paced, Asynchronous Learning with Quarterly Live Q&A’s! Earn 6 Continuing Education Credits – Available at Checkout As a listener of this podcast, use code BAS15 for a limited-time discount.       You are invited!  Join our exclusive community to get early access and discounts to things we produce, plus an ad-free, private feed. In addition, receive exclusive episodes recorded just for you. Sign up for our premium Neuronerd plan!! Click here!!    Get your copy of Secure Relating here!! Please support our sponsors – they keep our podcast free and accessible to all!  A coffee alternative with 4 adaptogenic mushrooms and ayurvedic herbs. With only a fraction of caffeine as a cup of coffee, you get energy without the anxiety, jitters, or crash of coffee Go to mudwtr.com/tu to support the show and use code TU for 15% off

Patreon/Supercast Special Release – Bonus – Living Beyond the OCD Loop with Ally Kristan (302) This is a sneak peek of our episode with Ally Kristan, and part two of our three part series on OCD – available only on our Premium Supercast and Patreon platforms. For as little as $5/month you can have access to special releases like this one, first-to-know about upcoming events and discounts and an ad-free feed. Click here to join & finish the episode!! What is OCD really like beyond the stereotypes? In part two of our three part series on deepening the understanding OCD, Marine biologist and author Ally Kristan shares her lifelong experience living with OCD, challenging common misconceptions that reduce the disorder to cleanliness or organization. Ally discusses the intrusive thoughts, compulsions, shame, and relentless search for certainty that characterize OCD, as well as the relief of finally receiving a diagnosis and effective support. Together, Ally and Dr. Ann Kelley explore themes of control, uncertainty, mindfulness, relationships, self-compassion, and how healing can come from understanding—not fighting—the parts of ourselves that struggle. The episode offers an honest, hopeful look at living with OCD and finding ways to transform fear into meaning and connection. “We’re not out of touch with reality. We know that what we’re doing doesn’t make sense, but we just can’t help doing it anyway.” – Ally Kristan Time Stamps for Bonus – Living Beyond the OCD Loop with Ally Kristan (302) 06:34 Personal journey: Discovering my OCD 11:34 Therapeutic insights: The role of specialists 16:19 The OCD loop: Understanding the cycle 23:01 Transforming OCD: Finding positive outlets 31:03 Radical acceptance and its challenges 35:10 Finding Authenticity in Confrontation 42:23 Transforming compulsions into positive rituals 52:28 The balance of reassurance in relationships 55:59 The intersection of OCD and career choices 58:00 Lessons from penguins: Resilience and love 01:00:54 Conservation concerns: The krill catastrophe 01:07:28 Coping tools and resources for OCD About our Guest – Ally Kristan  Ally Kristan is a marine conservation biologist, Antarctic expert and OCD advocate originally from Raleigh, North Carolina. She holds a B.S. in Marine Biology from UNC Wilmington and an M.S. in Oceanography & Coastal Sciences from Louisiana State University. A salient voice for wildlife protection, Ally has appeared in National Public Radio (NPR), National Audubon Society and Hakai Magazine. Her work has brought her from a sea turtle hospital in North Carolina to whale watch boats in Maui to raucous seabird colonies in Florida, then from the U.S. National Science Foundation in Washington D.C. to McMurdo Station, Antarctica. Ally now resides on the North Carolina coast where, when not working in the lab, she can be found amongst animals.   Resources for Living Beyond the OCD Loop with Ally Kristan (302) Ally Kristan’s website – Additional resources & information Get your copy of her book, “Braving the Waves” here!! Looking for our Upcoming Events? Click here!! Our Beyond Attachment Styles course is available NOW! Learn how your nervous system, your mind, and your relationships work together in a fascinating dance, shaping who you are and how you connect with others. Earn 6 Continuing Education Credits – Available at Checkout Online, Self-Paced, Asynchronous Learning with Quarterly Live Q&A’s