Co-CEOs, No Managers, and Zero Loyalty — How to Navigate “Work 2.0”

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle discuss the demise of the traditional corporate structure—from co-CEOs, to the elimination of middle managers, and even the death of workplace loyalty. It seems like everything we know about the way companies are organized are changing, so what does this mean for you? 00:00 Intro 01:43 What’s unique about this moment in time for workplaces 04:36 A possible explanation for why these company structures keep changing 07:46 The AT&T memo and how workplace loyalty has changed 13:18 So what comes next for corporate structures? 14:25 “The Dead Economy Theory”  17:08 The example of Zappos’ “holacracy”  22:38 What you can do to brace yourself in this evolving landscape This episode was sponsored by Superhuman.  You can check out Superhuman for free today at superhuman.com/podcast.  Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle discuss the pivotal life experiences that helped them in their careers in unexpected ways. Listen to hear Kaila and Kyle’s personal stories of rock-bottom moments and personal epiphanies that have ultimately made them better at their jobs. 00:00 Intro 03:13 Kyle’s biggest experience with failure 08:06 Kaila’s biggest experience with failure 11:54 The non-work things that have contributed to Kaila’s and Kyle’s careers 16:35 What Kyle learned from making his first podcast 19:28 An early epiphany in Kaila’s career 21:55 The international experience that changed Kaila’s perspective 27:40 What Kyle’s learned about cold-emailing people he admires This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle break down “The Great Lock-In”—the Q4 period where it’s advantageous for your year-end review to focus and get down to business. Listen to hear Kaila and Kyle’s extremely tactical and actionable advice on how to accomplish the most before the end of the year. 00:00 Intro 02:01 What “The Great Lock-In” is about 07:17 The first phase of “locking in” 13:14 The second phase of lock-in 17:47 Bullet journaling 20:00 Timeboxing   23:42 Another important element of locking in This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle discuss the rise of the “quiet promotion,” how to know whether or not you’re receiving one, and what to do if you have.  00:00 Intro 01:50 “job hugging” 07:42 Defining “quiet promotions”  10:12 Why quiet promotions are happening 13:40 Kaila’s experience with quiet promotions 15:28 Kyle on whether he’s been quiet promoted 17:41 What to do if YOU’RE being quiet promoted 29:29 Recap: The 3 steps to take if you’ve received a “quiet promotion” This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle are responding to listener-submitted career advice questions…and they’re juicy! From how to handle conflicting feedback to wading through the “work fluff”, this episode is chock-full of useful tactics for handling tricky work situations. 00:00 Intro 01:25 Grab Bag Question #1 - communication issues 06:38 Grab Bag Question #2 - conflicting feedback 12:50 Grab Bag Question #3 - learning about different jobs 18:05 Grab Bag Question #4 - office decor 22:39 Grab Bag Question #5 - work fluff 25:26 Grab Bag Question #6 - “yes man” boss This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle debate whether you should or should NOT pursue your office crush. That’s right—we’re talking office romance this week, and Kaila and Kyle hold strongly opposing positions on the matter, based in part on their own personal experiences. 00:00 Intro 02:57 Historical context for the conversation 04:23 Kaila’s opinion on pursuing a relationship in the workplace 08:19 The types of jobs where office romance becomes more likely 15:53 The most important thing to remember when considering a romantic relationship with a coworker 18:58 Power dynamics in coworker relationships 21:02 Disclosure 22:35 Never be the main character 26:28 Perception 28:19 Kaila’s 4 conditions for pursuing an office romance This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Is it cringe to try too hard? In this episode, Kaila and Kyle are joined by Normal Gossip co-creator and Defector Media co-owner Alex Sujong Laughlin to talk about the ins and outs of being a “try hard” at work. Alex’s new podcast, Try Hard, documents people attempting things that they’re afraid to do, and in this episode you’ll hear about a couple of moments when Alex and Kaila’s fear of being cringe nearly held back their career progress. 00:00 Intro 01:40 What is “Try Hard”? 05:29 Why being a “try hard” in the office is perceived as cringe right now 12:33 An experience that almost derailed Alex’s career path 17:18 How to gently encourage trying hard 21:33 What’s the right level of earnestness at work? 25:42 Is LinkedIn posting cringe? 28:09 A time where Kaila’s fear of being “cringe” almost held her back in her career This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle discuss the current trend of laying off middle managers and the flattening of organizations, the impact this can have on individuals, and why we can’t forget the key roles that middle managers have in your career. 00:00 Intro 01:43 Who are the middle managers? 04:15 Stats illustrating the decline of the middle manager 06:40 How an absence middle managers can hinder your career 11:09 The goal of a middle manager, and what happens when they disappear 18:44 Why companies should realize the importance of a middle manager 23:45 What to do if you see a flattening of your organization This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle discuss how AI is impacting the job market, what the future of work may look as more roles and industries become automated, and how to stand out in the age of AI-assisted hiring processes. 00:00 Intro 01:41 Research on the impact of AI on job seekers 06:28 The rise of the “he-cession” 10:07 How AI is impacting the job hunt for mid-career level individuals 14:02 Strategies for applying to jobs in the current environment 19:20 Tips for once you finally reach the interview process 24:03 A major networking pro-tip, especially if you have a small network This episode was sponsored by Udemy. Try a free 14-day trial at Udemy now at udemy.com/personal-plan and use code PMLE14. Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kaila and Kyle discuss the three most problematic toxic workplace scenarios, and how to manage each of them. Plus, wait ‘til the end to hear a bonus fourth toxic workplace scenario that you probably haven’t considered.  00:00 Intro 01:42 Defining “toxicity” in the workplace 04:14 Stats on toxic workplaces 05:43 Toxic coworkers and how to handle them 11:46 How Kaila handled a former toxic coworker 16:34 Toxic bosses and how to handle them 24:45 An important note on “toxic bosses”  25:59 Toxic workplace environments/companies, and how to handle them 32:19 When you find out that YOU’RE the toxic person This episode was sponsored by Gamma. Try Gamma now at https://gamma.app/pmle Want to get all of Kaila & Kyle’s career resources? Subscribe to Per My Last Email: https://www.permylastemailshow.com/  Watch Per My Last Email on YouTube:   @PerMYLastEmailShow Follow Per My Last Email Instagram: @permylastemailshow TikTok: @permylastemailshow Twitter: @permylast_email Have a question for us? Send us an email or voice note to [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Each week on Per My Last Email, Morning Brew’s resident career experts Kaila and Kyle – whose careers have collectively spanned the corporate, government, nonprofit and startup sectors – debate the trickiest challenges in work life, and share tactics on how to overcome them. Share the show with a friend, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast app! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices