562: The Deadly Cost of Bad Leadership. Lessons From Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan. With Bing West

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< Marine combat veteran, author, and former senior defense official Bing West joins Jocko to discuss the brutal realities of war, the strategic failures of military and political leadership, and the lessons America continues to overlook. Drawing on firsthand experiences from Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan, West reveals how flawed decisions at the highest levels can have devastating consequences on the battlefield.00:00:00 – The Brutal Reality of Combat in Vietnam00:04:17 – Bing West's Early Life and Marine Corps Career00:08:42 – The Strategic Failures of the Vietnam War00:14:49 – Winning the Trust of the Local Population00:21:56 – The Deadly Cost of Search and Destroy00:33:41 – The CIA, RAND Corporation, and Origins of Navy SEAL Operations00:44:45 – Iraq, General Mattis, and the Importance of Decentralized Command00:52:29 – Fallujah, Ramadi, and the Consequences of Emotional Decisions01:07:00 – Political Leadership and the War in Iraq01:25:00 – Afghanistan: Repeating the Mistakes of Vietnam01:44:50 – The Jupiter Complex: The Danger of American Arrogance01:57:45 – America's Military Readiness and the Future of Warfare02:12:35 – Leadership, Accountability, and America's FutureSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< 00:00:00 – When You're Ready For a New Chapter?00:06:33 – Struggling with chronic fatigue syndrome?00:13:32 – Are leaders born with natural leadership abilities, or can leadership be learned?00:24:00 – How do I choose between multiple job offers, and what advice do you have for starting my career?00:43:28 – How do I recognize that I'm not good enough and need to improve without constantly beating myself up?Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< Breaking down General Melvin Zais’s 1977 speech Leadership and the Art of Command, exploring action, initiative, delegation, discipline, judgment, and the realities of leading people. After a lifetime of combat and command, Zais ultimately reduces effective leadership to one essential principle: you must care about your people. 00:00 – General Melvin Zais: A Lifetime of Leadership02:16 – Leadership Defies Definition08:24 – Stop Talking. Take Action.17:36 – The Basics of Good Leadership24:59 – The “It Factor,” Luck, and Creating Opportunity32:30 – Leadership Is Getting Others to Perform44:40 – Be FOR Something, Not Against Everything50:02 – You Must Care52:40 – What Caring Actually Looks Like59:30 – You Have to Actually Like Your People1:03:21 – Discipline Without Breaking People1:05:46 – Finding the Line1:08:12 – Caring Is in Your Own Best Interest1:09:34 – Taking Care of Your People Means Pushing ThemSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< 00:01:06 — Do combat veterans view conscientious objectors/noncombatant medics as honorable?00:05:34 — My 3-year-old may have autism and kids are starting to make fun of him. How do I help him—and myself—handle it?00:24:30 — I got sober and used harsh self-criticism to stay disciplined. How do I shift toward self-compassion without losing discipline?00:33:03 — After several devastating life events, I’ve fallen into drinking, weed, and avoiding my goals. How do I get my head right and attack life again?00:40:00 — I’m a high-school strength coach burned out by an unsupportive administration. How do I stay committed to the kids while deciding whether to fight or build an exit plan?Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< Jamie Cochran breaks down real-world leadership lessons from Echelon Front clients and organizations. They discuss overcoming resistance, merging cultures, developing leaders, taking ownership without doing everything yourself, and why leadership is a skill that must be continuously practiced. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< 00:40 — How do I respect a leader I don’t respect or trust?15:21 — How do I solve problems aggressively without being out of control?27:22 — Should I keep pursuing more responsibility if it’s making work stressful?38:55 — How do I stay calm when my kids are melting down?54:38 — How important is competing in Jiu-Jitsu, and is it worth the injury risk?Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< Twenty years after Navy SEAL Marc Lee was killed in Ramadi, his mother Debbie “Mama Lee” Lee joins Jocko and Echo to reflect on grief, faith, brotherhood, and the legacy Marc left behind. They discuss the work of America’s Mighty Warriors, helping veterans heal from the invisible wounds of war, supporting Gold Star families, and turning unimaginable loss into a mission to help others.00:00 – 20 Years Since Mark Lee’s DeathMama Lee reflects on losing Mark, faith, grief, and the extraordinary legacy that has grown from his sacrifice.14:40 – Mama Lee ReturnsDebbie Lee joins Jocko and Echo to reflect on the Task Unit Bruiser reunion and seeing Mark’s teammates together again after 20 years.25:12 – Brotherhood Forged in RamadiRemembering fallen teammates, reconnecting with old friends, and why staying connected to the people who shared the experience matters.35:22 – Random Acts of KindnessHow Mark’s final message inspired America’s Mighty Warriors to provide immediate help to veterans, military families, and others in crisis.39:30 – Choosing to Keep Fighting Through GriefMama Lee describes the devastation of losing a child and the decision to turn that pain into purpose and service.45:28 – You Won’t Feel Like This ForeverJocko and Mama Lee discuss the overwhelming nature of grief, losing control of your emotions, and learning to ride the wave until you can move forward.1:00:35 – Get It Out of Your HeadWhy talking, writing, sharing stories, and connecting with others can help process pain instead of allowing it to grow darker inside.1:12:40 – Healing the Invisible Wounds of WarMama Lee explains Helping Heroes Heal, traumatic brain injuries, blast exposure, sleep problems, suicide, and the veterans whose lives have been changed through treatment.1:26:00 – Helping Veterans and Gold Star Families HealThe retreats, treatment programs, and plans for a dedicated facility designed to bring veterans and families together while supporting their recovery.1:31:14 – Gold Star Families and the Power of Helping OthersMama Lee discusses retreats for Gold Star parents and families, while Jocko reflects on how even a small act of kindness can completely change someone’s outlook.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< Urban warfare expert and retired Army officer John Spencer returns to share stories from 20 Times I Almost Died, from Ranger School and Iraq to Ukraine, Gaza, and some incredibly close calls. Along the way, John and Jocko break down leadership, intuition, modern warfare, resilience, and the importance of developing a personal code to live by.00:00 – John Spencer: 20 Times I Almost Died02:53 – Kashmir: India, Pakistan & Modern Warfare05:10 – Lebanon, Hezbollah & the Changing Battlefield11:17 – Ukraine, Drones & the Future of War15:54 – Inside a Hamas Tunnel Under Gaza24:43 – Iraq: Common Sense, Orders & Leadership39:08 – The IED Trap: Trusting Your Intuition45:28 – “Pepper”: The Fight That Cost John His Ear1:08:27 – The “Sopranos of Baghdad” & Humility1:29:02 – Ukraine, Bucha & the Will to Resist1:38:00 – Ranger School: “You Can Always Quit Tomorrow”1:44:03 – The Best Ranger Competition & a 40-Foot Fall1:55:48 – Iraq: A Deadly Humvee Crash & Duty2:01:31 – Azerbaijan’s Special Forces & the Battle of Shusha2:11:08 – Going Full Rambo as an OPFOR Soldier2:16:01 – The Mission to Capture Saddam Hussein2:27:05 – The Current Situation in Gaza2:42:38 – Who Are You? Building a Code to Live By2:53:21 – Closing Thoughts With John Spencer2:54:19 – Jocko & Echo Closing / SupportersSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< How to be a dependable warrior.At what point does being ultra competitive become a weakness?How to mentally get back on track in life.How to kick the remaining vices in your life.How to guide a 3 year old in life.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

>Join Jocko Underground Full Episodes< Every decision has consequences—and the small decisions made repeatedly can eventually shape your entire life. Jocko and Echo break down how to make better decisions under uncertainty, when to trust experience and intuition, how to avoid paralysis through analysis, and why effective leaders take action, learn, and adapt.00:00 — Decisions: The Choices That Shape Your Life03:33 — How the Marine Corps Teaches Decision-Making11:50 — Take the Initiative: Keep Them on Their Heels18:14 — Logic, Intuition, and Emotion24:57 — Analytical vs. Instinctive Decision-Making26:28 — Stop Overthinking. Take a Small Action.34:26 — Detachment: The Decision-Making Superpower41:34 — The 70% Solution: Stop Waiting for Perfect46:07 — The OODA Loop: Observe, Orient, Decide, Act58:46 — Adapt Faster Than the Situation Changes1:01:23 — Failure, Fear, and Learning Through Action1:06:13 — Small Decisions, Fast Feedback, Constant Adjustment1:15:37 — When Being Too Adaptable Becomes a Problem1:17:59 — Wargaming: Prepare for What Could Go Wrong1:20:38 — Jocko’s Extreme Ownership Leadership Loop1:22:29 — Don’t Get Stuck. Make the Decision. Act.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content