326: Finding Common Ground in Politics, Running, and the Power of Curiosity

In this episode, AFB and Evil Becky dive deep into the madness and method behind prepping for their 48-hour showdown at Notch View. With ice towels, grilled quesadillas, and hallucination avoidance on the menu, the duo breaks down their pacing strategies, sleep plans, nutrition math, and mental game-while still finding time to argue over pee bottles and AI coaching. Art unveils his “douche canoe” plan to knock out 75 miles in the first 24 hours, relying on hydration tricks and skills gleaned from the Tour De France and Erie Canal Trail before sleeping, rinsing and repeating. Evil Becky brings the heat (or more accurately, plans to sleep through it), favoring strategic hill-walking, silence at the start, and keeping her sanity intact by avoiding Art as long as possible. They tackle the high-stakes game of ultra-fueling from Tailwind and Precision gels to grilled cheese and reflect on how runners tie self-worth to results (and why that’s dangerous). Bonus: Evil Becky shares her favorite comfort foods and confirms she will not be participating in any pee bottle experiments, thank you very much. Or is it all behind the "Pay Wall"?   Highlights & Segments: (Times Quoted are most likely B.S.) 00:03:10 – Art’s “75-Mile Day One” plan and Evil Becky’s eye-roll 00:10:45 – Cooling tactics: neck ice vs. strategic napping 00:17:00 – Nutrition: 100-cal vs. 300-cal per hour philosophies 00:24:30 – Pee bottles: creative solution or horrifying idea? 00:30:15 – Favorite race foods: ramen, grilled cheese, quesadillas, and more 00:37:40 – Sleep, silence, and social limits during ultras 00:46:55 – Evil Becky’s “start in silence” mindset 00:52:10 – Western States recap: self-worth, struggle, and grace 00:59:00 – Predictions for hallucinations, mileage, and midnight snacks   Quotable Moment: “Sometimes silence is my best pacer.” – Evil Becky   Deep Thoughts that most won’t discuss: Is sleep deprevation worth the cognitive impairment?  This may be the limiting factor… What is your limiting factor, Do you have one? Got a weird race food you swear by? Ever seen a shadow person at hour 41? Share your stories with us in the comments, tag @cultratrailrunning, or shout them at us when we’re too tired to respond. Or join our Facebook page. Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

We take a minute, minute and a half to say thank you to all of our patreons, and to see what some of them are up to.     Highlander Hustle Portland High Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

Phred is Back, BIGTIME and he finally reels in his “white whale” guest longtime friend and ultrarunning enigma Steven Tursi. Steven and Phred blab about running streaks, hashing adventures, body image, and a lifelong evolution of what it means to be a runner and a friend. Was Steve the original Johnny Appleseed for Cultra? Enjoy this fabulous Bootleg Cultra (Think Grateful Dead Barton Hall, Cornell University, May 8, 1977)    Episode Highlights: Running Streaks and Ultramarathons Steven shares insights into his nearly 15-year daily running streak (over 5,200 days!)—and the debates surrounding the “continuous mile” rule. Fred and Steven unpack the motivations, sunk cost psychology, and mental games behind long streaks. Recap of Steven’s recent race at altitude in the Great Divide 100, and how Colorado elevation humbled him despite living at 5,300 feet. Hashing Culture 101 What exactly is hashing? Steven breaks down the beer-fueled, trail-marked tradition of this global, irreverent running subculture. Stories about hash names (spoiler: “Hot Schweddy Balls”), flour trail controversies, beer stops, and inclusivity in the hashing world. On Body Image and Identity Steven gets candid about his weight, body perception, and running while heavier than most—highlighting his incredible feat of running a sub-24-hour 100-miler at ~275 lbs. Friendship in Adulthood A heartfelt and humorous discussion about how men form (and define) friendships as adults. Fred and Steven reflect on their 15+ year bond, running together at events like Ancient Oaks, TGNY, and Umstead, and how group chats now serve as lifelines for long-distance friendships. The Shift to Journey Runs Steven talks about moving away from racing for results and leaning into slower, more meaningful runs—including a planned 50-mile adventure on the Colorado Trail for his 50th birthday. Memories of the Four Pass Loop, the Manitou Incline “stunt hike,” and past multi-day efforts like Milwaukee to Chicago. Bonus Nuggets Why Steven ran a 24-hour race just to bail at 20 miles and watch football. How rocket launches, mistaken finishes, and sandbagging for friendship make ultra memories. Reflections on The Fair, Starbucks runs after Rocky’s, and the joy of repeat traditions.    Tune In If You Like: Not listening to AFB! The human side of ultra running Thoughtful conversations on consistency, identity, and connection A couple of old friends talking about life, beer, streaks, and everything in between   Referenced Events & Topics: Palmer Lake Ultra • Ancient Oaks • Umstead 100 • TGNY • Great Divide 100K • Manitou Incline • Colorado Trail • Hash House Harriers • Running Streaks • Journey Runs • Four Pass Loop • Sub-24 100-milers • Group chats & friendship Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

AFB welcomes El Niño a.k.a. the chosen one a.k.a. Tobias Tello a.k.a. Tobi and Abel Murphy, hosts of The Colder Boys podcast, to break down Western States 100. In This Episode: Meet The Colder Boys: Tobias and Abel share their backgrounds in trail and ultra running, how their podcast started, and the elite-level analysis East Coast scene. Beast Coast Trail Talk: A breakdown of favorite Connecticut trails like Sleeping Giant and West Rock, plus a plug for the underrated Blue to Blue Challenge. Western States 100 Men's Preview: Predictions, hot takes, and strategy talk. Killian? Roche? A young gun or a dark horse? The guys don’t hold back. (OK they did save a little for of the nuggets for their own upcoming preview show.) Fantasy Ultra Running: Deep dives into Free Trail Fantasy picks, including a sleeper Euro pick you probably haven’t heard of P**** F****. Women's Field Breakdown: International talent, breakout stars, and why this year’s WSER women's race might be the most exciting one yet. #TeamRiley Heat Training and Race Strategy: What really separates the elite runners when temperatures rise—and how social media is changing how we see athletes. Ultra Storytelling and Coverage: From golden hours to emotional cutoffs, the guys talk about what race broadcasts are getting righ and where they still fall short. Looking Ahead: Tobias is racing Manitou’s Revenge and QMT 135K, Abel is volunteering at an aid station, and both are dreaming of a Rim-to-Rim run this fall. Listen to The Colder Boys Manitous Revenge Western States Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

Ross Bielak from Littleton Colorado is Cultra #PodcastFamous and a dear friend of our community.  When he signed up for the #CUT112 in 2021 after doing his own Western CUT in 2020, he felt that he was a bit undertrained. So very logically, (WTF) he decided to attempt the never before completed Double #CUT112. Although this attempt resulted in a visit to the hospital, he tried it again, and then finally again in 2025.  We hear the story of the power of the trail running community as around 40 people came out, (in real life) to crew and pace him as he took on the grueling 224 mile double crossing of CT on the New England Trail. This is a story of love, endurance and porcupines that shows the power of Running Far, Eating Well, and Resting Easy.  Ba-Da-Ba-Ba-Ba, I'm Lovin it! Donate to Connecticut Forest and Parks Association Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

Whether its road running versus trail running, Garmin versus Coros, iPhone versus Android or Democrats versus Republicans, why does it sometimes feel so hard for us to actually listen to each other? We look at what it means to find common ground, and to be genuinely curious. And why it is sometimes so difficult to remain curious. We also take a look at our mental maps and try to figure out why it can be so difficult for us to change our perspective. This is a conversation that some would rather hide in the bottom of a portajohn to avoid. But you love this shit, and we love you right back.  Enjoy this warm cuppa Cultra Brew! So is Curiosity the antidote to binary thinking? Is Listening with empathy a superpower in both politics and trail running. So who is running the CUT112? Have a listen to The Hidden Brain Bimblers Bluff Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

When most of us think of “running blind”, we envision a state of panic where one must proceed without having a clear understanding of what lies ahead. Trail running can be challenging enough even when we can see the rocks and roots that can trip us up. John Robert Mckay, AKA The Blind Donkey Runner does not let that stop him. We hear the details of how he is able to avoid “rock in 3-2-1, ROCK” with the aid of guides. We hear about his journey to qualify and run The Boston Marathon, his racing on the track, trails and ultra events. John also shines the spotlight on local Georgia High School Track coaches and their athletes through his own podcast Southeastern High School Athletics and he is a subject matter expert! We spend a lot of time talking about making connections with others, and the courage required to stand on the starting line of a cross country race. We also enjoy Jackassing around with The Blind Donkey Runner. Don’t miss this! Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

Let’s talk about dropping. When we drop something it’s like we are forgetting to hold on. We sign up for the 100k and sometimes want to drop to a 50 mile. And some times we help each other pause for a moment and remember why we do what we do and we avoid dropping .(Now the tricky part) Sometimes we decide to pause and not drop any more and others remind us that perhaps it’s time to take a deeper look and drop a new episode of The Cultra Trail Running Podcast.  We are glad to be back! We talk about all the fun and crazy shit that happens on the trails and in our lives that most people don't care about or wont talk about. Lin shares his experience as a child growing up in Shanghai, and we touch on all aspects of life, love and the miracle of ultra running. Lake Waramaug Ultras Mount To Coast Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

Life is constantly changing and we are all very different people than we were 6 or 7 years ago, and right now it feels like its time to take a break, continue to seek professional help, and decide whats next. So for now, we are hitting pause (paws), but before we go, lets use this episode to take a look back, just in case this turns out to be our final episode. This podcast started as a wild idea among friends—a way to celebrate the absurdity, struggle, and joy of ultra running in a way that was raw and explicit like the trails we run on. What I didn’t expect was how deeply it would resonate, how it would grow into a community, and how much it would mean to me (and to all of us) over the years. The inside jokes, the live shows, the interviews, the ridiculous tangents and jackassing around that somehow always made sense in the end—it’s all been a blast. Phast Phred, Evil Becky, Jimmy Mac, and Celeste Fong-a-Ding-Dong—you’ve given me (AFB) so much, and I can’t thank you enough for that gift. Most of all, I want to thank you. Your support—whether financial or just by showing up and listening—has made this journey possible. You’ve fueled countless hours of storytelling, laughter, and the occasional moment of wisdom. We loved butchering your names and making you Podcast Famous. You’ve been the lifeblood of this weird, wonderful family that understands the beauty of suffering through 112 miles in the woods and somehow still wanting more. I don’t know what’s next. Maybe Cultra returns in some new form down the road, maybe not. But one thing is certain: the friendships and community we’ve built aren’t going anywhere. We’ll still be out there—running, crewing, racing, pacing, and laughing at the sheer madness of it all. And I hope to see you out there, too. So, for now, this is a pause—not necessarily a goodbye. Keep running, seek professional help, and we’ll see you all in a mile… mile and a half. Love you guys, AFB Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram If we start up again... Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112   

Former soldier Tim Hardy shares his approach to making his life choices. He has at times deliberately chosen a difficult path that includes some of the most arduous and hot multi-day races, like Vol State, and HOTS, and also cold races like the Arrowhead 135.  Tim has recently taken a look at what makes a great experience for him in terms of community, travel time, course, and cost. He gives us a lot to consider as we make our own life choices.  Get your official Cultra Clothes and other Cultra TRP PodSwag at our store! Outro music by Nick Byram Become a Cultra Crew Patreon Supporter  basic licker.  If you lick us, we will most likely lick you right back Cultra Facebook Fan Page Go here to talk shit and complain and give us advice that we wont follow Cultra Trail Running Instagram Don't watch this with your kids Sign up for a race at Live Loud Running and feel better Buy Fred's Book Running Home More Information on the #CUT112