200. Why Do We Drink?

Today, we announce that we are entering our endgame for the podcast. We have all felt it in our bones. Perhaps you have too, with our slower and slower release cadence. Simply, it is time. So in Josh's last episode leading our discussion on Ravel, we explore the idea of theology really being a dialogue and maybe a democracy. We additionally circle the idea of the theological influencer really forwarding the wisdom tradition. Mentioned in the episode:Video: Johnny Harris - I don't get democracyBook: The Great Emergence by Phyllis TickleBook: Foundation by Isaac AsimovTapes: Out of Your Mind by Alan WattsRavel ep: 8. The Elephant in the RoomRavel ep: 17. Don't Put God In a BoxHost RecommendationsEmily: Portillos, and travelStephen: Spitz Mediterranean, and make prayer beads with your own handsJosh: Always choose the local sandwich spot, and Small ProphetsHost DE-RecommendationsEmily: Don't participate in racismStephen: Sometimes you don't need to critique anythingJosh: Homunculus the movieJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode (recorded in the dead heat of last summer), we explore why church buildings can feel so creepy, considering how architecture, history, spirituality, and our own experiences shape the way we inhabit these spaces. We reflect on the tension between the sacred and the ordinary, examining how empty sanctuaries, hidden staircases, supernatural associations, and buildings that have outgrown their original purpose can leave us feeling unsettled. Our conversation turns toward how church design communicates belonging and intention, asking whether our buildings are built to welcome people, inspire awe, and adapt to the changing needs of a community. Ultimately, we consider how to create spaces that feel more life-giving and welcoming, from reimagining church architecture to remembering that perhaps the church is less about a building and more about the people who gather together.Host RecommendationsEmily: Feng Shui one roomStephen: Be a formal student againJosh: Take a classHost DE-RecommendationsEmily: Don't neglect sunscreenStephen: Alcohol in summerJosh: Disclosure DayJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In our 200th episode, we explore the many ways beverages shape our cultures, relationships, spiritual practices, and everyday lives, reflecting on how sharing a drink brings us together. We consider the histories and traditions surrounding beer, wine, tea, and coffee, and the ways our drinks reflect both our practical needs and our deeper desires. We also reflect on the personal rituals and memories attached to particular beverages, from marking seasons and milestones to creating opportunities for conversation, comfort, and connection. Ultimately, we celebrate beverages as so much more than what fills our cups, recognizing them as enduring invitations to gather, share, and savor the experience of being together.Mentioned in the Episode:Book: A History of the World Through Six Glasses by Tom StandageRavel ep: 12. Another Gospel According To LukeHost RecommendationsEmily: Drink more waterStephen: Listen to more classical musicJosh: Try natural wineHost DE-RecommendationsEmily: Don't drink raw milkStephen: Don't keep expired foods in your fridge and pantryJosh: Don't drink whiskeyJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Hi, it's Stephen. I will not let AI write a summary of this episode, but I'll be honest, we recorded this a while ago and I don't remember everything we talked about. So, get into it, I guess. There are cold and hot takes. And I know for me in particular, what I said in this conversation isn't very reflective of how I think even a month or two later. It's complicated out there, y'all.Host RecommendationsEmily: One-pan mealsStephen: Pass books along to friends before donating them to the library; share books that have shaped youJosh: Build a writing habit without relying on AI (Mug Too Full)Host DE-RecommendationsEmily: Don't dominate conversationsStephen: Don't let AI do any of your writingJosh: Tony RobbinsJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode of Ravel, we unpack the idea of “religious big dick energy” as a way of describing the swagger, certainty, and supremacy often embedded in modern evangelical and political culture. We explore how manifest destiny, Christian nationalism, masculinity, power, and influencer culture all intertwine to create environments where people feel justified forcing their beliefs onto others. Along the way, we wrestle with our own experiences of certainty, deconstruction, disgust, grief, and the difficulty of extending grace to people whose ideologies feel harmful. By the end, we arrive at a conversation about supremacy versus intimacy, and whether forgiveness, humility, and genuine listening might be the only way out of the cycle. Host RecommendationsEmily: Practice feng shui by rearranging your physical space, priorities, and energy to create a healthier environmentStephen: Find ways to gamify your life and work to reduce overwhelm and stay centeredJosh: Watch The Testament of Ann LeeHost DE-RecommendationsEmily: Giving every podcast five stars… except Ravel 😄Stephen: Giving every book five stars on Goodreads because ratings lose meaning when everything is rated the sameJosh: Giving every movie five stars on Letterboxd because five stars should actually mean something Join us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, we return to the classic “How is it with your soul?” format and end up exploring identity, awareness, embodiment, spirituality, and community through a deeply personal and philosophical conversation. We reflect on how the self is shaped by memory, relationships, language, perception, and even the ways we are seen by others, while also grounding the discussion in ordinary life updates like health changes, therapy milestones, meditation, new pets, and rediscovering joy in simple rhythms. Beneath all the humor and tangents, the episode becomes a conversation about healing, mystery, and learning how to live more peacefully and presently within ourselves and with one another.Host RecommendationsEmily: Accept praise when people give it to you.Stephen: Paint your nails.Josh: Celebrate healing outcomes more openly and enthusiastically to help people reconnect with trust in medicine and recovery.Host DE-RecommendationsEmily: Do not consume nonstop news.Stephen: Do not let too much time pass without reaching out to friends.Josh: Stop using AI.Join us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, we explore abuse of power in church leadership, accountability structures across denominations, and the ways grace and forgiveness can be distorted to protect harmful behavior instead of vulnerable people. We each reflect on personal experiences with church hypocrisy, charismatic celebrity culture, and the tension between repentance, justice, and institutional self-protection. The conversation moves through stories of denominational failures, queer exclusion, public scandals, and the social contracts churches break when trust is betrayed. We arrive at the idea that meaningful accountability requires transparency, transformation, and small everyday acts of compassion rather than power, image, or platform. Host RecommendationsEmily: Follow the Wesleyan “three simple rules”Stephen: Rediscover and lean into your favorite color as an adultJosh: Replace furniture you no longer love or use wellHost DE-RecommendationsEmily: Do not excuse harmful behavior or abuse under the guise of grace, forgiveness, or religious authorityStephen: Do not make judgment calls about other people’s spiritual or philosophical practices when you do not understand their story or needsJosh: Do not hold onto furniture you dislike simply because you already own itJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, Josh and Stephen explore a noticed growing anti-city sentiment within American Christianity, unpacking how politics, economics, fear, and cultural identity shape a rural-versus-urban divide. We contrast this with the deeply city-centered theology of the New Testament, noting the irony in modern Christian attitudes toward urban spaces. We weave through media narratives, food culture, and even biblical imagery, suggesting that American Christianity may be drifting toward Old Testament “outsider” and conquest frameworks rather than Jesus’ embodied presence among diverse city populations.Host Recommendations Stephen: Eat “vitamin carrots”Josh: Make homemade Chipotle-style bowlsHost DE-RecommendationsStephen: Neglecting dryer vent cleaningJosh: Leaving phone text notification sounds onJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

We explore angels in the Bible and in Christian imagination, asking what role they actually play in the stories that shaped the tradition. Moving through familiar passages and odd details alike, we consider whether angels are supernatural beings, literary devices, or something closer to a storytelling signal that a narrative turn is about to happen. The conversation wanders through ancient mythology, modern interpretations, guardian angels, and the human impulse to find meaning in unexpected moments. Along the way we land on a curious possibility: whenever angels show up, the story may be about to go unorthodox.Host RecommendationsEmily: Updated healthy eating food pyramidStephen: Meaningful desk trinketsJosh: Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir, specifically the audiobook versionHost DE-RecommendationsEmily: Junk political mailersStephen: Sticking with an internet providerJosh: Forgetting routine car maintenanceJoin us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

We explore what optimism actually is and is not, moving beyond half full versus half empty toward peace, joy, acceptance, and responsible action. Drawing on psychology, Buddhism, and our own religious upbringings, we consider whether optimism is innate, learned, or a practice that shapes how we meet uncertainty and tragedy. We wrestle with how optimism can slide into apathy in politics and church culture, and close with small rituals and a Tao Te Ching passage that frames hope as spacious presence rather than certainty.Host RecommendationsEmily: Do the thing you’ve been afraid to do. Stop hovering and just jump in.Stephen: Be the person who gently puts bugs outside (or befriends them).Josh: Get on a simple “kick” — a small, playful obsession you look forward to.Host DE-RecommendationsEmily: Smoking (take care of your lungs).Stephen: Mindless social-media scrolling — unfollow ~20 clutter accounts.Josh: Fruit Loops (if it looks like a rainbow, it should taste like one).Join us:Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits:Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★