#49 - Eric Dietel: Good Conversation High Intertextuality

You are chasing the elusive high score–the ability to carve your initials (or some other inappropriate word or abbreviation) digitally into your favorite machine. The perfect combination of greasy, sticky, and fast fingers has you hitting the best in-game combos necessary to achieve your best score yet…shoot…just one more quarter.Writer and game designer Eric Dietel joins Intertextual Experience for its 49th episode. Centering the discussion and format on Good Game High Score, a game Eric co-designed with his wife Bree, this conversation is able to flow as smoothly as a card game between a group of friends at the table. Whether Eric is reflecting on connections between screenwriting and game design or creating new stories within the context of old experiences, this episode winds up being an exploration that taps into the beauty of creating and “loving the wrinkles” that will inevitably form when we do create.In some very fun timing, my copy of Good Game High Score was just delivered!Check out the rules video that my early interrupting edit recommends you to watch (when you can) to provide some good context for the interview (it’s also just really good, so watching it is worth it regardless):From there, go get yourself a copy of the game if you don’t have it already!Cool and Normal Productions on InstagramEric on BlueskyGames Mentioned in this Episode SlideIntro (0:00)RIP Bonsai 🙁Television Writing and Game Design #1 (11:28)Television Writing and Game Design #2 (21:04)Approaching climbing games with a narrative focus.Co-design (37:53)Learning Moments from this First Project (46:54)Arcades (59:26)What’s next (1:08:38)Hypothetical TV Show Writing Opportunity (1:14:08)A Text on Eric’s Mind (1:17:13)And a little bit of an intertextual experience…Wrap-up Questions (1:27:23)-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

From the slight burn of a slide that’s gotten too hot in the late afternoon sun to the sense of ecstasy (mixed with a slight tinge of panic) from getting a little higher on the swing than you’d ever gotten before–and everything in between–it’s clear that you’ve had an awesome day at the playground.This episode’s conversation with artist and designer David Masnato taps into a similar wonder, exploring the joys of creating and being human. There’s so much that sticks out in this episode, but David’s reflections on art that inspires him, the power of various board game communities, and breaking paradigms regarding different genres and ways we play creates extremely welcoming and optimistic thoughts to consider as the board gaming hobby constantly changes. Then there’s some of my nonsense, of course. Come for a guided trip around the playground and stay for the poignant reflections provided by David (and don’t forget to sign up for the Intertextual Experience Playground Google Drawing subscription services).Anyway, David’s game, Pax Playground is being released through the Indie Game Night Market at PAX Unplugged. With that, the reworking of his award winning Roux Mates, and more designs and contributions to other board games such as Pax Penning, there’s a lot to look forward to from him!Check out David’s work and social media!WebsiteBoard Game Geek PageBlueskyHere is a slides presentation created by the various snapshots of our playground journey. This will serve as the rest of the show notes (for now)! Listen to the show, and then come back to see the journey unfold again with visual context. The slides presentation also has the games mentioned on one slide and then all of the other awesome work I said I’d link in the show notes as well.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

As fate and coincidence would have it, designer Jeff Grisenthwaite and I had actually met and played games together once and then played games at different tables of a smaller meetup just months after that. It wasn’t until our shared interest in Board Game Arena and Jeff’s great games led me to reach out before we were able to piece that together (and those games weren’t out when we’d first met or had just been released in a limited capacity). Anyway, the Wheel of Fortune timed out well, and Jeff was able to add a ton of insight into a topic that’s frequently on my mind due to how much time I spend there, and that is the aforementioned board game playing website, Board Game Arena. Several months back, Jeff wrote an article about his experience of developing his own games for the site—which is extremely cool—and this episode dives a little further into some of those thoughts. Additionally/obviously, there is some of the show’s typical antics, funky formatting, and fun discussions about playing games based on vibes, nerd beach reads, Jeff’s history of tarot reading, and more.Based on the conversation, check out the following:Jeff’s BGA Article (linked in previous paragraph as well)Jeff’s Designer PageJeff on BlueskyBreak My GameProtospiel ChicagoIntro (0:00)Talking tarot and the barren days of BGA.Cursed Soothsayers (17:44)This is the majority of the conversation. Based on the actions/cards that Jeff selected, the conversation encompasses a lot of his blog post and more. “BGA is weird.”This is the perfect place to dive into some of the “why” behind that.Speaking of weird, here is the slideshow that guided our conversation.Wrap-up Questions (1:15:28)A text on Jeff’s mind and things to look out for from him in the future!-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

Back like it never left, Intertextual Experience welcomes Amabel Holland—designer, video essayist, author, and co-owner of Hollandspiele—for its forty-sixth episode. Amabel has been making my favorite board game media through her video essays, so this conversation is in conversation with those videos. While the title of the episode is “Episode of Six Video Essays,” technically only four wind up being explicitly chosen through this installment’s game. With that being said, Amabel’s nuanced responses connect to more than the selected six, weaving in various other essays (future ones as well), games, movies, and more media to explore the ways in which art can impact us, why preservation is important, and how being unique and filling different niches will push boundaries of what games can do or be even if it might not be the most commercially viable strategy. Additionally, there is discussion of immersive sims and the correct way to eat skittles, some very impressive word game play, and much more. This is not an episode to miss.Speaking of things you don’t want to miss, check out following things from Amabel:Video EssaysHollandspiele WebsitePatreonBlueskyHere are the documents used in this episode: the reference document (serves as the games mentioned in this episode as well) and the word game itself. In order to not spoil too much, the sections of the episode are going to not have too many extra notes. Technically, you could cross reference the show notes, episode cover image, and the reference document to figure out what’s being talked about within each section; it’s a mini-puzzle in a sense. Regardless, each section is basically just the title of each video essay.Intro and State of the Video Essays (0:00)Should Board Games Be Frustrating (24:32)The general frame of the word game is described right at the beginning, and then it moves to frustration in some various games.Boxes: Selling, Framing, Meaning (44:42)[There is a small, fun, post-credit audio bit that was originally in this section.]Replay Value: Repetition, Ritual, and Improvement (57:07)Expanding Board Games (1:09:27)Wrap-up Questions (1:19:31)A text on Amabel’s mind and things to look forward to from her!-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

Taylor Reiner. The Quiz 2.Since Taylor was on the show in September 2023, he’s been busy with designing, developing, making videos, and more. We get to explore some of the things Taylor has been working on through the lens of sequels, other media, and just general chaos by the way of The Return of the Quiz.Check out Taylor’s Trick Taking TableSee Taylor’s designs and developments.Follow Taylor’s Bluesky. Games Mentioned in this EpisodeIntro (0:00)Reflecting on my butchered introduction, the time that’s passed, and the extreme success of The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring — Trick-Taking Game. Then we set up the quiz.The Quiz 2 (8:14)Can’t spoil the contents of the newest quiz, but there’s a new fun section called “The Tricky Minute.”Also, the question on everyone’s mind is if SSX Tricky makes a return.Home Alone 2The Crew 2Renaissance - Enlightenment - Romanticism 2Mini-Director’s Commentary (55:45) Keeping the quiz short and then doing a full Director’s Commentary as a later episode that paired with this was an initial thought of mine. Fortunately that didn’t work out, especially as that will allow more breath and rumination for The Quiz 3. Taylor reflects on sequels in general, Slay the Spire 2, and Oreos here.Wrap-up Questions (1:05:32)A non-StS2 text on Taylor’s mind and what to look out for from him.There’s a 250 character limit for the titles, in case you’re wondering.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

Shut Up & Sit Down’s Tom Brewster joins Intertextual Experience for our 44th episode, perhaps with the show’s most adventurous format yet (so adventurous that time stamps honestly wouldn’t make much sense–and that’s not just me trying to get out of doing the time stamps).In a roguelite/like/who the heck knows the difference (& don’t go barking at me; I’ve watched all the videos that try to differentiate them and then see everyone else still arguing in the comments) structure, we fight the Western canon, make bean wine, create and remix the game we’re playing in real time, converse about wanting to share the beautiful parts of our hobbies with others, and just have so many other great moments sprinkled within a pretty wild time. This “roguelike” winds up being “4X” in a sense; it explores exploration, experience, expectations, and extermination–poor bat.If none of that makes sense, you’ll just have to listen.If all of that makes sense, you’re in the right spot.You know where to find Shut Up & Sit Down, but here’s their YouTube channel & here’s Tom on Bluesky.In lieu of the various time-stamped sections, attached below is a comprehensive slides presentation that includes the slides for Chip Cat Breach, images of the games within the game, the character creation page, the games mentioned in this episode, and more? Tom does an excellent job of bringing the visual elements of this audio-only show to life. I suggest waiting until after a listen to check out these slides to see how everything matches up in your head, but you’re your own person.Click here for slides.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

Intertextual Experience is ecstatic to bring in the New Year with Alex Hague, the CEO of board game company CMYK. For a show that likes to explore ideas and stories through different lenses, CMYK provides a perfect color model for us to create these different colored lenses. Through a twisted version of the game Figment, Alex is subjected to a slew of challenges and questions while coming out victorious. Come explore CMYK’s vision, the Hot Streak that was 2025 for the company, an alternate reality where CMYK is a war game publisher, and so much more. As an audio only podcast, you might feel as if you’re missing out on some of the fun, but do not anguish! Here is the slide show presented for Alex (and for the sake of saving links, the games mentioned in the episode will get their own slide after the main images of “the game”).Check out CMYK’s games here.Sign up for their newsletter at the bottom.Follow Alex on Bluesky“Oh, it's like the tip-off of a basketball game.” (0:00)Story, beginning, and a tale told through colors.“We're looking at, like, a… is that an axial view?” (17:07)Vibing. A throughline of sorts for CMYK games.Noted in this section!Recently, Alex was interviewed for one of Amabel Holland’s amazing video essay series. The most recent video titled “Boxes: Selling, Framing, Meaning” is linked. Check that out and then check out the rest of Amabel’s videos if you haven’t. “A series of concentric circles with some stars inside of it.” (38:44)Gaps/lines/connections were all possible topics for this one; based on Alex’s selection, the line of questioning was mostly focused on the first option, gaps.. Lacuna.“Anthropomorphic hot dog mascot with, you know, some, like, sort of soulless eye holes.” (49:52)All versions of this question focused on CMYK’s 2025 in some way (outside of one really out of pocket option).Wrap-up Questions (1:03:04)A text on Alex’s mind and things to look out for from CMYK in 2026 (don’t be greedy—wasn’t their 2025 output enough?!)!-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

Happy New Year! In a couple weeks, the show returns with an awesome guest. If you hang around here with me for just a little bit though, you'll get to hear about the state of the show (changes were made this year, and things have been a little slower than desired anticipated—all good though), some video and board games I rank quite highly in my end of year thoughts, and a potential giveaway.My logged plays from this year (a bit wonky—explained in episode).The Steam link mentioned.Board Game Giveaway Bohnanza!-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

Ray Billings, Digital Content Specialist for The Op, joins the show to share her expertise in all things related to marketing and creating media for board games. Don’t let my lack of knowledge on the subject make you Tapple out of this conversation, as Ray’s wit and wisdom will provide many Hues and Cues as to how you too can authentically create for the things you are passionate about.Cheesiness aside, this episode is amazing. Being able to look at board games through this lens provides a ton of insight not just for the sake of how we might pitch games as products, but also as to how we can create and talk in ways that make games a more welcoming space. Additionally, there’s talk about Katamari, email factories, live streaming, lingo, and so much more.Check out Ray’s work on The Op’s TikTok page, her own Bluesky account, the R&R Show, and the BoardGameWire feature discussed in the episode!Games Mentioned in this Episode⚀ Intro (0:00) The moment where Ray’s skills and interests intersected. Also, job titles.⚁ Hats (10:23) The aforementioned “Email Factory” is just a part of Ray’s day to day. Furthermore, the day to day will vary with all sorts of different days at the office, conventions, and everything else that can pop up. Ray also talks about being on the R&R Show, live streaming, and other fun work stories.⚂ “How board game maker The Op got 8 million TikTok views last month” (31:19)Early in her position at The Op, Ray wrote a feature for BoardGameWire based on some wild success she achieved. This section discusses the article, both from how that core vision holds and how things have changed with time/changes in media/experience.⚃ Hypotheticals (40:26) “How would you approach digital media and marketing if you were the Digital Content Specialist of …?” That’s this section.⚄ Wrap-up Questions (59:12) A big shout out for the fact that Ray was recently recognized as a finalist for the Wonder Woman Award for Women in Toys nonprofit organization! Per usual, we’re talking about some texts on her mind and looking forward to some things in Ray’s future.-----------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree

2025 World Series Game One Release DateIntertextual Experiences enthusiastically welcomes back the once 16th guest of the show, Ruel Gaviola. Ruel’s passion for baseball was made known to me through our first episode, seeing his social media posts (check out Ruel’s Bluesky), and running into Ruel in his vibrant Dodger blue hat at Gen Con. So when “my” Brewers (attempted to) face his Dodgers, I knew I had to reach out. In this episode, we chat about baseball, a couple baseball related games, seventh-inning stretches, what a “seventh-inning stretch” type of game could be, baseball movies, and so much more. Come for the baseball, stay for a delightful conversation with insights about how constantly refocusing in the midst of creating media that brings people joy so that things are well-balanced while one (Ruel in this instance) is making so ——rewordIn addition to his Bluesky, check out Ruel’s YouTube channel, Good Morning Society, and The R&R Show (on Rahdo’s Runthrough–just linked an episode here.Much like a seventh inning stretch, where you’re trying to cram in a bathroom break, vending trips for a hot dog, maybe some nachos, beers (?), and, of course, singing, “Take Me Out to the Ball Game,” this episode tries to pack a lot into a short period of time. The chapters will just be the three “outs” of an inning because the sections in this episode are a little less concrete than normal (which is saying something), which kind of makes sense within the context of an inning’s structure.First Out (0:00)Welcoming back Ruel to the showRuel’s love of the gameGoing to the ballpark Baseball moviesTed Lasso?MoreSecond Out (19:57)Seventh-inning stretch board games?Seventh-inning stretch in generalMascot racesBaseball scorekeepingBaseball board gamesMoreFinal Out (46:03)Usual wrap-up questions:A text on Ruel’s mind & where to check out Ruel and his work!Games mentioned in this episode document.Episode Image Credits:Image by Books Sun from Pixabay-----------------------------------------------------------------If you like this show, liking it on whatever platform you listen to and writing a review would mean so much! Furthermore, it's as independent as it gets, so any financial support would help with the subscriptions that make this project go smoothly.That can be done by "buying me a coffee" and/or buying a copy of my board game (I like it).All of my socials and support information can be found here: Intertextual Experience Linktree