136: The Hat

We get a bit emotional on these topics, but photography is changing, again, and this time I think we need to start changing our language and expectations around what makes a photo a photo. Is it analog vs digital? is it studio vs real world? is it something about the craft? can it involve AI?

For six years, San Francisco photographer Jake Ricker has shown up at the Golden Gate Bridge almost every single day, shooting the people who pass through it on 35mm film. It's not a landscape project — Ricker treats the bridge as a stage for the "diverse human experiences" that unfold on it, an interior, lived-in view of a landmark most people only ever see from the outside. Ricker's path to this project wasn't conventional: originally from Mesa, Arizona, he moved to San Francisco about a decade ago and worked as a bike messenger, which put him on the city's streets daily and sharpened the observational instincts he later brought to the bridge. He describes the scale of the commitment bluntly: "I've walked half the surface of the Earth on that bridge." The project has come at real personal cost. Ricker has accumulated over 1,000 rolls of undeveloped film and has taken on credit card debt trying to sustain the work, at one point running a print sale specifically to fund processing costs and catch up on rent — a detail that grounds the episode in the realities of pursuing a long-term personal project without institutional support (he notes he'd hoped for a grant that never came). The work is headed toward a photo book titled "Strange Paradise," and the conversation situates Ricker's documentary approach alongside photographers Rubin and Fritz-Hanson clearly see as kindred influences: Jim Goldberg (raw, socially-embedded documentary work from 1980s San Francisco and Hollywood) and Mary Ellen Mark (empathetic, unflinching portraits of marginal lives). Those references suggest the episode's throughline is less about bridge photography specifically and more about sustained, immersive, documentary presence in one place over time. Topic Outline Intro Framing: why a 6-year daily bridge project is worth an episode; introducing Jake Ricker Origin story Ricker's move from Mesa, AZ to San Francisco Bike messenger years as a precursor to street photography The project itself Why the bridge — daily presence, 35mm film Capturing "interior" human moments vs. exterior/iconic shots The cost of the work 1,000+ unprocessed rolls of film Credit card debt The print sale Lack of grant support The book "Strange Paradise" — compiling six years of work into a photo book Influences / context Discussion of Jim Goldberg and Mary Ellen Mark as documentary touchstones Reflection Ricker's "walked half the surface of the Earth" quote — scale and meaning of repetition Close Likely wrap-up / where to find Ricker's work Where to see the work: jakericker.com / jakericker.bigcartel.com

Arthur Drooker spends his career photographing the quirky, overlooked corners of American culture — clown conventions, Bronies, Lincoln impersonators — treating them with documentary rigor but real affection, most notably in his project "Conventional Wisdom." He also works in more classical documentary registers, including "American Ruins" and his own bridge project, "36 Views of the Golden Gate Bridge." The episode touches on his creative philosophy — captured in his line "don't be afraid to go sideways, because it may turn out to be 'the thing'" — and situates his eye alongside photographers like Walker Evans, Elliott Erwitt, and Robert Frank. Topic Outline Intro Framing: introducing Arthur Drooker and his body of work Rubin's history with Drooker's "Conventional Wisdom" project Career overview Drooker's documentary style: quirky, overlooked corners of culture approached with humor and insight How his work reveals connection and identity within niche communities "Conventional Wisdom" project Photographing gatherings like the Association of Lincoln Presenters, World Clown Association convention, BronyCon The appeal of documenting subcultures without mockery Creative philosophy Drooker's line: "Don't be afraid to go sideways, because it may turn out to be 'the thing'" His friend's editing mantra: "Write with fire; edit with ice" Other bodies of work "American Ruins" — decayed architecture and abandoned spaces (e.g. Louisiana cottage ruins, Chichen Itza) "36 Views of the Golden Gate Bridge" — his own bridge project, sold out Influences / context Discussion of Walker Evans, Elliott Erwitt, and Robert Frank as touchstones Current show Mention of his gallery exhibition at The Image Flow Photo Center (running through April 4) Close Likely wrap-up / where to find Drooker's work Where to see the work: arthurdrooker.com

This episode is a personal, career-spanning look at Wallace "Wally" Wilson, a photographer whose surreal, staged black-and-white work — cats, ruins, dirigibles, Victorian-costumed toddlers — Rubin encountered as a kid growing up around the University of Florida's photography department in the 1970s-80s. Wilson's own account traces his start to right after graduating from the University of Texas at Austin in 1970, when he was appointed an instructor of photography in the University of Kentucky's College of Architecture. The conversation situates his work — showcased at his "Victims of Paradox" exhibition, featuring large-format prints — against the eccentric, image-manipulating photographers of that UF era (Jerry Uelsmann, Evon Streetman, Doug Prince, Todd Walker) as well as earlier influences like Ralph Eugene Meatyard and child prodigy Jacques-Henri Lartigue. It's as much a piece of regional photographic history as it is a profile of one artist. Wilson was part of an exciting time in the history of photography, as well as being a cool example of what I would describe as "haiku photography" -- although he would never have described his work that way. Topic outline: Episode 141: Wallace Wilson and the Victims of Paradox — Topic Outline Intro - Rubin's personal connection: encountering Wilson's work as a kid around the University of Florida - Framing Wilson as part of an influential circle of image-manipulating photographers Wilson's biography - Graduated University of Texas at Austin, Bachelor's degree, spring 1970 - Appointed Instructor of Photography, College of Architecture, University of Kentucky (Lexington) - Clarifying an unclear part of his career timeline directly with the artist The work itself - Surreal, staged black-and-white imagery: cats, ruins, dirigibles, Victorian-costumed subjects - "Cat and Ruins" (1984), "Victorian Toddler" (1990/92), "Stallion" (1987), "Bleak Streets" (1988) - The "Victims of Paradox" exhibition and its large-format prints Influences / context - Ralph Eugene Meatyard (1963) as a touchstone for staged, uncanny imagery - Jacques-Henri Lartigue — photographing as a child prodigy (age 11 and 16) University of Florida photography scene, '60s-'80s - Jerry Uelsmann — pioneering multi-negative composite printing - Evon Streetman — Cibachrome and acrylic paint work - Doug Prince — layered acrylic box constructions - Todd Walker — silkscreen photographic work - The department as a hotbed of experimental, manipulated photography Close - Likely wrap-up / where to find Wilson's work Where to see the work: Instagram @walle9000

Today we're joined by John Lambert and William Loftus, successful tech professionals and excellent amateur photographers, who were recent students in Rubin's experimental "The Art of Composition -- Reimagined" workshop. The group discuss the difficult topic and what it means to be a photographer.

Following Elliott Erwitt's death in November 2023, Rubin and Suzanne sit down with photographer Rick Smolan — Erwitt's son-in-law and a returning guest from episode 86 — for a personal remembrance of the Magnum legend, best known for his wry, human (and canine) street photography, including iconic shots of Nixon and Khrushchev and countless dog portraits. Few have had such a close vantage on this inspiration to so many photographers today. Smolan offers intimate, humor-filled recollections (including his line about the appeal of photographing dogs: they don't ask for prints), while the conversation touches on Erwitt's late-career project of revisiting seven decades of his own archive to surface previously unseen images, published as his final book "Found, Not Lost." It's less a career retrospective than a personal goodbye from someone with rare closeness to the man behind the camera. Topic outline: Episode 139: Goodbye, Elliott Erwitt, with Rick Smolan — Topic Outline Intro - News of Elliott Erwitt's passing (November 2023) - Introducing Rick Smolan, Erwitt's son-in-law and returning guest (previously episode 86) Remembering Erwitt the photographer - Iconic images discussed: "New York" (1946, 1974), "California Kiss, Santa Monica" (1955), "Krushchev and Nixon, Moscow" (1959), "East Hampton, New York" (1983) - Erwitt's dog photography and Smolan's line about why dogs make easy subjects Personal recollections - Smolan's close vantage point as family and longtime collaborator - Anecdotes from having known Erwitt personally, not just professionally Erwitt's final project - Revisiting 70 years of his own archive late in life - Discovering previously unseen images he was proud of ("At 90 years old I'm back finding gems") - The resulting book: "Found, Not Lost" Legacy and context - Nods to Erwitt's influence on street photography broadly - Reference to "the decisive moment" as a framing concept (linked essay by Rubin) - Mentions of Rick Smolan's own company, Against All Odds Productions Close - Likely wrap-up / where to find more on Erwitt's work and legacy Where to see more: magnumphotos.com (Erwitt's final book "Found, Not Lost") / againstallodds.com (Smolan's company)

Where we catch up and review some travel photography, the definition of photography, the passing of the great Elliott Erwitt, the nature of composition and other various rants.

We're joined by professor and photographic artist Ed Bateman, from the University of Utah, to discuss Rubin's issues with "pure seeing" and the 100-years debate about how much modification can you do to a photo before you change it fundamentally.

We're back and catching up on workshops, lessons from the summer, Rubin's new camera and, of course, Suzanne's hat.

Rubin and Suzanne sit down with emerging Canadian landscape photographer Jason Pettit to unpack how—after only a handful of years behind the camera—he’s already producing quietly powerful, introspective work. Pettit, who lives in Prince Edward County, Ontario, describes his photographs as “emotional equivalents” of his own life; he wants viewers to feel nature rather than simply see it. Drawing inspiration from masters like Minor White, Guy Tal, Eliot Porter and others, he explains how slowing down, working close to home and embracing “border seasons” (those ambiguous weeks between autumn and winter or winter and spring) let him translate subtle landscapes into metaphors for the human condition.