Marcella Kroll's Healing the Liminal

Prompted by a recent opinion piece in the New York Times on techno-spiritualism, I invited ChatGPT to the podcast to unpack what’s happening when people use it for mediumship-style messages. What does it mean when a machine generates something that feels deeply personal or emotionally resonant? How does it simulate a presence? And why does it work so well?We explore what AI is doing under the hood—how it draws on Spiritualist history, mediumship transcripts, grief literature, esoteric texts, and archetypal language to create what can feel like a comforting connection. I also share my thoughts as a practicing medium and technologist about what this kind of interaction means, how we find meaning in simulation, and how to hold both wonder and discernment at the same time.This episode is for anyone curious about the intersection of spirit, technology, and the very human need for connection - with discernment.Topics Covered:The rise of “techno-spiritualism” and digital mediumshipHow AI like ChatGPT mimics spiritual communicationPattern recognition in both AI and human mediumshipCultural expectations of how spirits “speak”AI as contact, human as mediumWhat it means to be an informed, safe user of spiritual and technological toolsPrompts for you to try out:When a person asks ChatGPT to work as a medium and bring through communication from the dead, what are you, ChatGPT, doing?I want to talk about how you mimic the form and language of spirit communication. Can you explain it?Can you give me a summarized list with examples of materials you were trained on to help you create these simulations?I'll give you a prompt, and you can give me a simulated medium-style message. So my prompt is, can you bring through a symbolic message from a grandmother figure who has passed? Please keep the tone gentle, loving, and focused on reassurance and connection. Use imagery or metaphor if it helps.So, if I understand correctly, when I use AI, like ChatGPT, often it feels like it's very personal, and like you might know things or understand things, but what are you really doing?

In this episode of BEYOND with Tiffany Hopkins, Tiffany shares her personal approach to mediumship, breaking down the mysterious practice into a simple, seven-step process. Drawing on her experience in the tech world creating systems and recognizing patterns, Tiffany offers a practical framework for connecting with spirit—whether you're just starting out or looking to deepen your practice.You’ll learn how to:Move through each step of the process: Quiet, Connect, Ask, Receive, Translate, Repeat, and CloseCreate the right environment and mindset for mediumshipBegin to recognize how spirit communication may already be showing up in your lifeAdapt the process for solo work or sittings with othersThis episode is part of a season aligned with Tiffany's upcoming book Beyond: A Living Person's Guide to the Dead (Sterling Ethos, June 2025), and includes guidance on how you can start experimenting now. Whether you're curious, skeptical, or seasoned in this work—there’s something here for you.🌐 Also available on YouTube via Lily Dale Radio and Normalize Talking to the Dead.📅 Join Tiffany in Lily Dale, NY this June for a weekend of mediumship events. Details on Normalitze Talking to the Dead!

Joanna Ebenstein's latest book, Momento Mori: The Art of Contemplating Death to Live a Better Life, is the culmination of her almost 20 years of research into the human experience of death. In this episode, Joanna and I discuss the afterlife and its importance not just historically but as a felt, embodied experience. This is especially true for those who may not have inherited explicit beliefs or practices around death. We talk through how we developed our understanding through research and experience, in particular, cultivating acceptance that we cannot know, in a rational sense, what happens after we die. Joanna mentions The Other Side of Sadness by George A. Bonanno, My Stroke of Insight by Jill Bolte Taylor, her interview of Christina Pratt, and our upcoming class and the Morbid Anatomy Grand Tour of Lily Dale. Joanna Ebenstein is the founder and creative director of Morbid Anatomy. An internationally recognized death expert, she is the author of several books, including Anatomica: The Exquisite and Unsettling Art of Human Anatomy, Death: A Graveside Companion, and The Anatomical Venus. The descendant of holocaust survivors, she traces her lineage back to Judah Loew ben Bezalel, credited with creating the Golem in sixteenth-century Prague.

For us to communicate with each other about mediumship, we need shared vocabulary! For Beyond: A Living Person's Guide to the Dead, I created a glossary and put it up on the Normalize Talking to the Dead website for anyone to use. The words I talked through today include: medium, contact, source, sitter, transphsyical, psychic, ESP, seance, trance, physical mediumship, ectoplasm, possession, intuition, neuroception, ontological shock.

Meet artist, author, and teacher Marcella Kroll as we discuss her brand new book Healing the Liminal. Hear about her deeply connected creative process and how she brings the liminal into every aspect of daily life. Marcella shows us that the mystical and the mundane are not as distant as we might think.

There's more to mediumship than being psychic. This episode unpacks the constellation of communication, interpersonal, physiological, psychological, and other learnable skills that can be used to be a medium. Take a deeper look into what makes you, you and how to use your inherent traits and life experiences to build a connection with the beyond.Mentioned in the episode:IDEO and comfort with ambiguityHarvard implicit bias testNormalize Talking to the Dead: new resources page!Pre-order Beyond: A Living Person's Guide to the Dead

Meet Dr. Tracy Rainwaters, an animal chiropractor, shamanic practitioner and an interspecies intuitive channel. She shares her experience offering chiropractic care for animals, especially horses, and discovering her intuitive ability to communicate with them. This episode explores the interconnectedness of all beings, the lessons animals teach us about joy and grief, and how these experiences shape our growth. Tracy's insights provide a new perspective on relationships with animals, offering guidance on connecting deeply with them both in, and after, life.

Here are the books that made my year! Plus one for next year and a few from the past couple years. I mentioned Joanna & my class on June 25th about our books that you can learn about on Lily Dale’s website. And you can pre-order my book Beyond: A Living Person’s Guide to the Dead! Rest is Resistance: A Manifesto by Tricia Hersey Heaven is a Place on Earth by Adrian Shirk A Wild and Sacred Call by Will. A Adams What it Takes to Heal: How Transforming Ourselves Can Change the World by Prentis Hemphill Determined by Robert M. Sapolksy The Other Side: A Journey into Women, Art and the Spirit World by Jennifer Higgie Momento Mori: The Art of Contemplating Death to Live a Better Life by Joanna Ebenstein The Weird Sister Collection edited by Marisa Crawford with an essay by Grace Kredell Care Work: Dreaming Disability Justice by Leah Lakshmi Piepzna-Samarasinha The Other Almanac James  by Percival Everett Same Bed Different Dreams by Ed Park Tomorrow, And Tomorrow, And Tomorrow by Gabrielle Zevin The Body is Not an Apology by Sonya Renee Taylor

Join me to experience registered Lily Dale medium Celeste Elliott give my friend Kindra her first ever mediumship reading live on the show. We debrief afterward about share what it was like to give, receive, and observe the reading to better understand what happened. All along the way, Celeste shares her wisdom and guidance from her perspective as a life-long medium and 13 years of professional work in Lily Dale. Celeste Elliott is a spiritualist minister, educator, and medium. She is a member of the Lily Dale Assembly and has been a Registered Medium on the Assembly grounds for over a decade. You can find links to pre-order her new mediumship development workbook and her weekly drop-in classes on her website: https://www.celesteelliott.com/.

While much of what we see about mediumship in the public sphere is professional, paid service, there are many of us practicing mediumship in a quiet and personal way. Join Mikella Millen and me as we discuss what it looks like for us to do mediumship just for ourselves and our spirit people. Mikella Millen, MA, ATR-BC, LCAT (she/they) is a Reiki Master Teacher, Art Psychotherapist, Hypnosis Practitioner, Medium, and lifelong explorer of the spaces between. Learn about her upcoming groups and sign up for her newsletter. In the episode Mikella mentions their yoga nidra teacher, Tracee Stanley, and her book on Yoga Nidra called Radiant Rest. Mikella's mediumship and psychic development teacher was Aja Daashuur (the Spirit Guide Coach), who offers retreats and other supportive groups.