Real Talk - White Ribbon of Life - with Chad Otterstrom & Mark Sullivan
We are back with a new episode of Real Talk with Chad Otterstrom and Mark Sullivan. In this episode we talk about the preseason as well as the beginning of the new snowboarding season. Then we discuss the question, "What is wrong with snowboarding?" Support independent snowboarding media at http://patreon.com/thesnowboardproject Send us feedback at [email protected] Here is a transcription of the show: Mark (00:20.844) Today we have another episode of Real Talk on the Snowboard Project. I'm joined by Chad Otterstrom. Chad is a contender for greatest of all time status in the sport of snowboarding. He would never claim that for himself, so I'll just claim it for him. How you doing today, Chad? Chad (00:27.892) Yeah. Chad (00:47.722) I'm good, just, you know, I just moved out of Breckenridge for the season. I'll be back and forth. But I've been living in my truck for the last 16.5 months. Mark (00:57.756) 16.5, okay. You were counting the days, I see. Chad (00:59.963) the Yeah, now I'm back. I'm back and I got a place and you know, for my dogs, I live by a river. It's awesome. I'm doing good. Mark (01:09.464) Okay, well maybe you can explain this. It's like you were living in your truck for 16 and a half months. Why? Chad (01:16.978) Um, because I'm trying to crack the code, uh, of passive income. I was trying to Airbnb my condo and see how that went. And instead of renting a place, I just put a topper on my truck and just went rogue. And, and, uh, that, you know, six months to a year turned into 16 months, which is longer than expected, but, uh, now I've cracked the code and, uh, yeah, I was just going to, yeah, I got a place to sleep. I have a bed. Mark (01:19.535) Mm-hmm. Mark (01:36.22) Mm-hmm. Mark (01:41.772) You cracked the code and you're back in the house? Chad (01:46.186) outside of the back of my truck. Mark (01:47.82) Okay, so you were on the road for 16 and a half months. What's like the coolest thing that you saw while you were on the road? Chad (01:53.274) Um, I saw way too many whole foods parking lots. Uh, I did get hit by a semi and Edwards. I was parked at a rest area and the semi clipped me and then took off. And that cost me thousands of dollars because the insurance didn't cover that because they took off. Um, that wasn't the coolest thing. That was for sure. But, uh, I did, I went to Japan. I went to Canada. I went to Alaska. I went to Mount Hood. I did all these things that didn't require my own home. So, uh. Mark (01:56.684) Okay. Oh. Mark (02:17.372) That's right. Mark (02:21.509) Mm-hmm. Chad (02:22.742) I did all the, yeah, like last year, the only thing I didn't do last year was go to Rick's Grants. And I wanted to put that in the May category. No, it's Colorado, Canada, or Colorado, Japan, Canada, Alaska, Rick's Grants, and then Mount Hood. That would be the ultimate year. Mark (02:29.735) Mm-hmm. Mark (02:40.804) You pretty much like spent the whole year riding. Chad (02:44.49) Yeah, for sure. Mark (02:46.38) Now, is it hard to do works? I know you also are an owner of Academy Snowboards. Was it hard to work for the road or find wifi or whatever? Are we able to pull that off pretty effectively? Chad (02:56.446) Uh, I, you know, what I wasn't able to do was like demos and clinics and things like that. I'd had to do kind of a little more communicating online, but no, I mean, I basically do a lot of the social and organize that. So I, um, I was able to do that wherever I had wifi, which I had everywhere. Mark (03:01.96) Mm-hmm. Mark (03:14.636) Okay cool so it sounds like you were able to maximize your 16 and a half months for your bank account sake. Chad (03:22.546) Yeah, no, I cracked the code. I'm hoping and fingers are crossed, you know the next couple years. We'll see what happens Mark (03:28.216) Okay, so now you've had a couple of months off. I mean, have you been getting ready for this season? What have you been up to? Chad (03:33.858) Um, I mean, I haven't been living in LA going to art shows, but, uh, Mark (03:38.08) Yeah, that's what I've been doing. So, I mean. Ha ha. Chad (03:43.222) No, I, yeah, I mean, what do you do early season? This is the time in the year, like, if you ride till, if you're like really into like riding every day for like meditation is kind of why I do it, but then that ends in July. And you have from July till now to like keep your sanity. So I just find other forms of like, you know, kind of getting out there and doing things. So yeah, I've been, you know, staying in shape. I do, I've gotten into jumping into rivers. It's trending, cold plunging and. Mark (03:59.474) Mm-hmm. Mark (04:12.616) Cold plunging, yes. What's the coldest river you've jumped in? Chad (04:13.974) and it's turning. Oh, it's as close to ice as I can get is what I'm looking for. I want it to be like an ice cube. And I can do like up to five minutes and yeah. And then you do this thing called grounding where you walk around on the ground and then you do, you know, I, yeah, yeah. And then when I do the Wim Hof scene, it's funny cause I listen to a lot of podcasts and then they're telling me what I've already been doing, which is I feel like I'm on the right track, but. Mark (04:21.14) Okay. Mark (04:30.188) like barefooted or something, you're barefoot on the ground. Chad (04:42.878) Yeah, do that and then work out a little bit. Once you're able to hike up hills though, we'll start split boarding just to stay in shape. I'm not a fan of going to the gym, but you're gonna have to a little bit, I guess. Mark (04:54.692) Well, the world is your gym when you're a split-boarder. Ha ha ha. Chad (05:00.696) Yes, this is true. Mark (05:02.816) Yeah, okay. So you're in shape. You're ready for the season. I know resorts are opening, you know, all over the country, but especially in Colorado. I mean, what are you like looking to like get done this season? Do you like goals for this season? Do you like have a list of things that you want to accomplish? Or like, how do you kind of like approach a new season? And like, how do you kind of set yourself up to accomplish things and keep pushing that ball downfield? Chad (05:28.106) Um, pushing the ball down the field. I, uh, well, first of all, I set myself up for a place to live. That's a hard thing to do now in mountain towns because there's, they call it a housing crisis and I think everybody likes to use the word crisis and everything they do these days. We started a production company, you know, with our movies called midlife crisis. So first thing you got to do is find a place to live and then get your season pass. And then, um, yeah, I don't know. Mark (05:46.696) Mm-hmm. Mark (05:56.488) Okay. Chad (05:56.578) just kind of move forward, get the ball rolling. Get your boots broken in, your sticker job done, if you're into getting a good sticker job. Yeah, yeah. Mark (06:02.748) Right? That's all preseason stuff though. I mean, how about for goals for riding? Like, are you like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna do 122 foot, you know, 50, 50. What kind of like riding goals? Chad (06:11.278) Oh. Chad (06:15.214) Oh yeah, yeah. Goals. I have, it's just kind of funny, I guess the more aged you become, you get more into like, I wanna ride that mountain as opposed to I wanna do that trick. I think kids are more into I wanna do that trick or I wanna do that challenge rail or I wanna do this and that. But yeah, for me, I have a list of mountains around where I live right now that I wanna go hike and just ride down and enjoy it. I wanna... Mark (06:25.992) Mm-hmm. Chad (06:44.79) Do some more drone filming this year as opposed to GoPro filming. I'm trying to work on figuring out how to make a drone, do a little more follow than, as opposed to your head cam, you know what I mean? And then that, and then yeah, do a lot more split boarding just cause it keeps me in shape and outside and exercising more. Mark (06:48.356) Mm-hmm. Mark (06:58.408) Totally. Mark (07:06.636) Indeed, indeed. And so, you know, I know a lot of people, you're in Colorado, and a lot of people are like, I want to do all the 14ers. Is that kind of your goal? Or is it is it just like, wow, that's a beautiful mountain or that that's got a great line on I want to ride that. Chad (07:21.066) Yeah, I'm more of the aesthetically fun looking line as opposed to the 14ers. There's a lot of 14ers that are not that fun. They're just high mountains and they're far away. It would be cool to kind of go, I do enjoy like kind of go just tacking certain zones off, not exactly every 14er, but just so I could kind of get a lay of the land of Colorado. I went down to this place called Lake City this summer and hiked a 14 year called Uncompatible Peak. Mark (07:43.67) Mm. Chad (07:49.57) And I've never been there. It's kind of like the Eastern San Juans. And that was kind of cool just to go there and see, you could see Telluride from there and you could see a couple of other things. So it's fun, but I'm not into the ticking off teeners lifestyle. I'm more into like, they're fun looking, ripping lines. You know what I mean? Mark (08:07.596) Yeah, totally, totally. Okay. So hopefully, I know you went to Alaska this year. Do you think you're going to make it back this year? Chad (08:15.114) If I do, it will be for fun. Yes, I did go to the natural selection. I stood on top of some of those peaks and you know if I do go back, I'll be going to where you're at the Valdez era area and I'll probably split board and go hike to the top of a you know an area or I'll hitchhike with a snowmobile, you know, something like that. Mark (08:18.353) Okay. Mark (08:30.982) Yeah. Mark (08:40.716) Yeah, yeah, I mean, that's all good. And you know, there's snowmobile rentals, there's other ways to get there. And people are pretty, you know, helpful as far as like helping you bump yourself out to different zones. So hopefully you do make it back. Chad (08:51.722) Yeah. So yeah, no, it was cool. I went there this last winter. I've been there, you know, before, but this last winter, I stood on one of the peaks that you're supposed to ride down as opposed to a blue-green run. And I got to look down. It looked like, you know, you go left and right, maybe backwards and a 2,000-foot run. Looks like a good time, you know? Mark (09:13.128) Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think that the, there's a lot of like challenging type of peaks in Alaska. There's, there's mellow ones too, but you know, I think the thing that Alaska is known for these kind of like high consequence or things that kind of require your focus and attention to the best of your ability. And so that's something that I think sets it apart a little bit compared to a lot of other areas, I think in Colorado you get that too, but sometimes. Maybe you're more worried about like the avalanche conditions and other things than just like the treachery of the mountain face. Chad (09:47.654) Yeah, I mean, you know, Trollhagen's pretty intense too, you know, like, uh, Yeah. Mark (09:53.036) Yeah, but that's like the lift lines and like the line and like the rail, you know, runouts from the rails, that kind of thing. It's a different kind of, you know, gripping type of emotion that you feel in Trollhagen. But, but, you know, it doesn't matter really, like what you find enjoyment in snowboarding. It's like, as long as you're enjoying yourself and you're kind of like. Chad (10:02.876) Yeah, no for sure. Mark (10:14.54) you know, pushing yourself and being in that moment, I think that you can do that in Alaska, you can do it in Trollhagen. And like the same feelings I got, you know, riding on the East Coast as a kid or some of the same feelings I got as I kept progressing kind of the mountains and terrain that I was able to ride. So. Chad (10:30.999) Yeah, it's like catching the feeling, but like you say, everybody says it, the Super Bowl of freeride and freestyle freeriding is in Alaska at the top level. You can catch that feeling anywhere, but if you're looking for it, you can go up there. Mark (10:45.094) Yeah. Mark (10:51.288) We just got, by the way, Chad, we got at my cabin in Alaska, I have a cabin up there as you know, but maybe not everyone knows. Anyhow, we got six. Yeah, yeah, that's true. We got we got six feet of snow this week in Alaska, literally one storm. We got six feet. There's a base now. Chad (10:58.742) I mean if they watch the show you definitely know. Chad (11:09.726) at your cabin so that means probably like 12 feet up where you're at, you know? Mark (11:12.544) Oh more. Yeah, yeah. I mean people are starting to head out. So it's like game on in Alaska right now, which is pretty cool. Pretty early, but yeah, it's going. Chad (11:22.032) Nice, yeah. It's the same with here. Like that's early. If we had a six foot storm here, I've actually ridden a hundred inches at Wolf Creek on Halloween before. Still kind of bony always, even with a hundred inches here, we need 20 feet here to have that boniness go away. But we got blue green groomers. You know, we were, I think it was two weeks ago now that we got first share at A Basin. And... Mark (11:31.217) Yeah. Mark (11:45.632) Okay, let's talk about that real quick. So I know like Nate Dogg, Taylor Tom, yourself, you guys have pretty much gotten first chair in the country, maybe the world, like every year in the last like, I don't even know how many years, how long has it been going on? Chad (12:00.551) Um, Nate likes to claim 31 years. I, uh, yeah, it's interesting though, because I, I mean, trailer Tom has had 31 years. I don't know if they've been consecutive, but you know, he's on, on the page, but I think 31 years would put you at 1992, right? Mark (12:03.036) 31 years of first chairs. Wow. Mark (12:18.941) Yeah, I think so. Chad (12:20.15) And I think Maydog moved to Colorado in 1998. So I'm just saying, I don't know, but I still believe him. I don't know. I mean, I wasn't here, so I can't say that, but I know. No, I think I actually do think that he might've driven out here those years. I'm not sure, so. Mark (12:24.096) Oh. Mark (12:27.628) That sounds like a call out. Mark (12:33.2) You better be careful what you say, because Nate Dogg is your property manager. Ha ha ha. Mark (12:42.982) I don't know Chad, a pipe burst. Chad (12:46.07) So it's great, you know, I think last year it was 25 years. I don't know how that six years popped up on him, but either way, it's a great, um, you know. Mark (12:53.911) So what was that scene like? Like what time did you guys get there? I'm sure you got there like the day before or something. Like what does it take to like get first chair? Chad (13:00.362) Yeah, so these are the rules. Nate's really good at articulating it. I'm going to do my best. So you know, you kind of like go to the resorts, you'll see them, there's no other blowing snow, you go talk to the mountain ops in the parking lots, you know, a couple weeks before, kind of get a feel. And then usually on a Monday or a Tuesday, they like to announce that they're going to open. They usually open on weekends just for crowds, so it's usually a Friday. So if they announce on a Tuesday, Mark (13:25.33) Mm-hmm. Chad (13:27.37) You gotta gun it and go lock down Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday night. Three days. Mark (13:31.452) Three days. Like when does the second person show up? Like if you're there for three days, when does like chair number two show up? Chad (13:39.434) Oh, that usually happens like within, you know, the last day. So then chair number two usually hangs for a good 24, 36 hours. And then, but usually we, this dude Ant has been kind of a fourth member of the crew, but it's trailer Tom, myself, Nate, and this dude Ant. And I did two days and I slipped straight on the ground this time right out in front of the lot or the lift. I have a baby and a mat, but it's a... Mark (13:42.82) Okay. Mark (13:46.335) Okay. Chad (14:07.69) It's just kind of something entertaining to do. It's like a, you know, when you get, like I said, when you need something to do with your life this time of year and you just want something exciting and people to talk to, people are constantly coming through all day long. So you're hanging out with people for like two days, which is fun. Except for, you know, that period from 10 at night till about 10 the next day is freezing cold. If not even six, cause it gets dark. But otherwise, I do negative 40. Mark (14:28.453) Mm-hmm. Mark (14:31.844) So is it like a negative 20 bag that you have to like stay warm in this negative 20? Okay. Negative 40. Okay. Chad (14:37.406) Actually, yeah, I won it at the love games from the satellite board shop love games. I really pushed hard for that because I knew I'd need it. But yeah, I don't know, it's something to do. And then now they're all opening, like resorts are opening. I think Breck opened today, Veil opened today, Keystone's open, Copper opens Monday. So the groomer lifestyle is on, you know what I mean? Mark (14:42.056) Cool. Mark (14:47.662) And that was at. Mark (14:58.796) Right now are they setting up parks or like little rail features? Like what kind of stuff do they have besides like a white ribbon of death? You know. Chad (15:06.206) Um, yeah, white ribbon of life is what we called it. We did. Mark (15:10.429) Oh, that's because you had first chair. If you were on like the 140th chair, you would have been like right ribbon of death. Oh really? Chad (15:17.19) And it was pretty fun. Actually, it snowed like a foot. So it was like kind of slasher pal on the side with groom slasher pal. But they have I think, Keystone has a little hike park, a base and probably has a couple slide bars. And then I don't really know I do know that Breck was on the verge of like kind of ending their park lifestyle. And now I hear they have a four speed, four pack high speed trailer for the five chair was and they're putting a park in with a half pipe this year. I heard. Mark (15:45.916) Really. Chad (15:46.634) I don't know. I'm not going to be around this year to find out really, but we'll see. You know, I think. Mark (15:50.552) Okay. Yeah. And it's not just Colorado, by the way, Chad, like Mammoth opens today. Wild Mountain is open in Minnesota. Killington, I think, is open right now as well. They may have been the first open. I'm not sure if they beat Colorado this year. Okay. And then also in Canada, you got Lake Louise, Mountain Workway. Chad (15:56.359) Oh yeah yeah. Yeah, troll Ogden as well. Chad (16:09.046) I think Abason was the, I think Abason. Mark (16:17.333) Sunshine Village is going to open this weekend and then you got Sommet Saint-Solvier in Quebec is open as well. So I guess there's riding all over America and Canada right now. Chad (16:29.514) Yeah, it's awesome. Everybody's gonna check out for the next five to six months. You know, it's that kind of a life. Mark (16:34.228) Yup. Yeah, well it seems like it's shaping up. I know we have like a Super El Nino coming this year. What does that mean for Colorado? Chad (16:45.29) Um, well last year La Niña was supposed to end, you know, mid late winter. And then El Niño is going to kick in and El Niño is better than La Niña. I don't really know what it means. It has to do with the weather pattern, I think. But, uh, I, uh, yeah, it's, uh, it just means, yeah, more fresh blue green groomer, you know, for Colorado. Mark (16:59.6) Yeah. Mark (17:03.565) More powder. Mark (17:08.909) Okay, right on. Well, it sounds like you're ready though. It sounds like you've gotten prepared as far as, you know, traveling and working out and your sticker job is done. Your board has probably been waxed a couple of times already. And yeah, it sounds like you're ready to get things going here. Chad (17:29.406) Yeah, I mean, if I was in Valdez, I'd be like potato sacking off cliffs, but I'm here. So it's just going to be groomer. I'm excited. Mark (17:38.404) Yeah, well, it should be fun. So have you been checking out any of the snowboard movies this fall? I know there've been, you know, obviously every year, there's like this time of year, there's movies that have been coming out for a couple of months now. Anything standing out to you so far this year? Chad (17:54.538) Um, uh, there's a few there's, I'm, uh, I went to the, I was back in Minnesota a couple of weeks ago and I went to the ride premiere and that was cool because it was kind of an industry event. Uh, and I was going to say the last time I went to a premiere in Minnesota was with Gillian Yoder and I went and saw a fear of a flat planet and the movie never showed up, so we just hung out on like Hannappin or something and he didn't know who I was, but I knew who he was. He would have randomly was back in Minnesota. Mark (18:02.248) Mm-hmm. Mark (18:14.257) Heh. Chad (18:22.934) That was like 1994. And then I went to this premiere in Minnesota this last time, the ride premiere was really good. Jed Anderson, I mean the movie was a great, it was a jib movie. Jed Anderson's awesome and he ended up hitting this rail at the end of his part that my dad is an usher for at the church. It's the cathedral in St. Paul and he had this double line and I was always telling my dad, if you ever see kids hitting the rails out of it on those stairs, don't kick them out. So my dad wasn't there the day they were doing it, but. Mark (18:24.729) Yep. Chad (18:52.886) So that was a good one. And then I see that you wrote East bump up. Mark (18:56.752) That was my favorite like video that I saw just because it had a different approach. It was like somehow fresh and it was like one dude, three shovels, one tripod. That's how I made this. And it was just cool. And like all the shots were steady, no shaky cam because it was on a tripod for all of it. But for me, it was just different. And I guess, you know, I'm less into. a lot of the tricks, you know, I watch a lot of these movies and there's like people doing pillow lines, you know, in BC or whatever. And I love powder riding. But then it's like, wow, Jonathan Moore did that in like 1998. You know, and it was just as good then as it is now. But it's not really that much different now than it was then. And so to me, it's kind of like a little bit of repetition when you see all these people just riding powder or doing basic tricks into powder. It's fairly consistent with the kind of footage we've seen over the last 20 years. And so to me, East Bumfuck was something new. Chad (20:01.166) 100% hold on. I agree with you. I think I really enjoy like he didn't talk in his video but he was kind of telling a story the whole way through. And I love watching that dude ride. He's like pigeon-toed. It seems like he's riding negative three, negative three. And for snowboard movies, I think I was looking earlier the Quicksilver movies up to 1.7 million views. Mark (20:13.126) Yep. Mark (20:19.865) Yeah. Mark (20:29.544) That's a lot of views. Chad (20:30.73) And I think those guys are great, but it was just like you just talked about it. It was like, cool, we saw the same movie last year and the year before and the year before and the year before. But I think that they have the outlet to put it out there. So it got that many views. But I mean, these kids from Michigan, I know this kid, Derek Lemke, Brent Bann and Drake Warner put together a movie that's going to come out in the next couple of weeks. I'm really excited to see it's probably going to be a lot of challenge rails and a lot of dangerous kinks and things like that. But I really enjoy like local movies or people I know or, you know, movies that are gonna have a feel as opposed to like a kind of a been there done that. We owned two movies from here last night and we're like, cool. And that was happened at Buck Hill 30 years ago. You know? Mark (21:15.692) Yeah, but you know you guys actually made a movie this year called Midlife Crisis. What did you do for that one to make it stand out? Chad (21:24.315) Um, we... Um... Chad (21:30.814) We just, you know, we filmed and edited and put it up on slush to make it stand out, I guess. But it's more of an, I would always open it or end it and Blaze would open it and end it as well. And then we would put people in the middle of it, if that makes sense. And it was more about midlife crisis, like vintage snowboarders. And then we would put like the up and coming kids in the middle, you know? So we weren't just like all vintage. Mark (21:59.524) You guys aren't vintage, you guys are like, you know, seasoned. I would say seasoned. Like you're like a fine wine. You've gotten better with age. Yeah. Chad (22:03.166) Season, yeah, Season's a good name, yeah. Yeah, aged, all right. Aged, classic, you know, kind of classic. But yeah, I mean, what did we do to make it stand out? Nothing besides edit, and we made three movies this year called, the first one is Rock Bottom, the second one is Spring Chickens, and then the third one is the full meltdown, a play on MacDog Productions, The Meltdown Project. Mark (22:13.061) Yeah. Mark (22:22.78) Mm-hmm. Chad (22:31.67) and that was in Mount Hood. And then, so we did that and yeah, you know, just pushing forward, we're actually making another one this year. We're gonna do a couple other things. I could ramble on, Blaze is way better at rambling on about it than I am. But, yeah, I am the editor of all the things. I'm the editor, Blaze is the talker. We're trying to make a brand. We're selling T-shirts and hoodies and hats. Mark (22:31.783) Right. Mark (22:51.432) But you're the co-host of this show, so damn it, it's up to you to ramble on. Chad (23:01.434) And we're going to sell t-shirts to the kids and just say, life crisis with the mid crossed out. So we can kind of include everybody. Mark (23:08.473) Okay. Mark (23:11.881) life crisis of living in mountain towns. Chad (23:14.118) Yeah, and then, so we're doing that. But yeah, I mean, it's just something to keep the dream alive, you know what I mean? Something to take away at life as opposed to sit there on the couch. Mark (23:22.669) Yeah. Mark (23:28.104) Well, that's cool. I'm glad you're doing stuff and it sounds like for this year, you're going to try to film yourself with a drone, which seems like it could add like a layer of complexity, but also, you know, just get a whole new kind of, you know, different kinds of shots for the films you're making. Chad (23:44.926) Yeah, no, it should be exciting. I feel like I can sell film or whatever other friends to any kind of a 1500 foot line, uh, the way I'm going to approach it. We'll see if it works. I'm ordering the drone here in a week. So I'm waiting for black Friday so I can get a discount on one, but, uh, yeah, but no midlife crisis is, yeah, we we're actually coming out with a Mark (23:58.442) Okay. Right? That's the time to buy your drones, folks. Clock is ticking. Chad (24:11.81) Blaise and I have full video parts coming out the next week on Slush. It's called Yearbook, where we put some old shots of Friends that didn't make it in like the other movies, not because they weren't good shots, but because they didn't really fit in the narrative of the movie. And then Blaise is going to have a full part. So he's got a 50-year-old full video part, like amazing part. Like I don't think anybody's ever really done that well anyways. Once you get to 50, a lot of people just start turning and give up. So he's got... Mark (24:16.677) Okay. Mark (24:40.956) So like who else is in that category? You got Todd Richards, film and video parts. You got... Chad (24:45.874) Yeah, I don't know. He's not filming video parts, is he? He's filming clips. Mark (24:49.496) I don't know. I mean he had a part in the in the. In the what's called Quicksilver movie. He was in that so. Chad (24:57.218) Oh yeah yeah, I mean what kind of clip was it Parkshots? Mark (25:01.744) I'm not sure I just remember him talking on the chairlift. I think he does a couple of shots. He always does like a switch McTwist. I'm not sure if it was a full part. I kind of like, I kind of fast forwarded through some of that to watch Powder and to watch Travis Rice and then when I was watching Travis Rice, I was actually just watching the mountains that he was riding. So I definitely agree with you on the, on the, you know, getting old and looking at mountains instead of like tricks and riding. So. Chad (25:04.17) Yeah, he's got a couple. Um, he's got a full part though. Thank you very much. Chad (25:26.483) And I mean, Todd does have a part in my, a couple clips in my part that I'm dropping this week. But Blaze has a full part is what I'm saying. Like back country, park jumps, rails. You know what I mean? Like this is like a full four minute, like single part. Full song, yeah, full everything. And yeah, that's what I'm saying. But I mean, I wrote Richard's is. Mark (25:33.319) Okay. Mark (25:40.402) Yeah. Mark (25:45.064) full song. Chad (25:52.634) older than all of us. He's like 53, 54, maybe he's your age, maybe you're older than him. Yeah, so he's, you know, he's in that, you know, probably Tony Hawk era of snowboarders and I like, I rode with him at Woodward this May and he actually, just for, you know, showing up and riding, he warmed up pretty quick and he's pretty good. I think surfing might keep him in shape, you know. Mark (25:57.592) I'm younger than him by a few years. Mark (26:04.637) Yep, completely. Mark (26:18.528) Yeah, yeah, for sure. I know he lives down in Carlsbad, so he's close to the beach, gets to go out any day of the surf. So that's probably pretty good. But you know, right now, aside from all these video parts, it's kind of coming to the end of video season, and we're kind of getting into the beginning of event season. And so I know that coming up in like a week or so, they have that event in, I think it's Innsbruck called Do It Yourself Extreme. Chad (26:25.029) Yeah. Mark (26:47.328) Or Dix, if you will, DIYX. Um, and it sounds like that'll be a pretty good one. Uh, you know, what do you know about the Dix event, Chad? Chad (26:51.34) Yeah. Chad (27:01.335) I mean, yeah, I know that there'll be a lot of dicks there and a lot of not-dicks there. And I hung out with a lot of the kids that went to it last year when I was in Minnesota right before they went and they said it's not really even a contest. They just set up spots in cities. And you know, there's a group of 20 kids that get invited to come up and... Mark (27:18.502) Yep. Mark (27:23.212) Yep, and it looks like Max Warbbington, Benny Malam, Dusty Hendrickson, Zeb, Jib Girl. So it sounds like a lot of the Americans will be there. I'm sure there's a full card of Europeans as well. Chad (27:26.94) Bye bye. Chad (27:36.262) Yeah. It's kind of like an Aaron style, but for jibbing and way more public. If that makes sense, not more as much of an arena style, but if you go and you see the video of it, there's hundreds of people surrounding like a rail or a flaming circle with Dylan Henderson back flip through that circle last year. Um, and they're all just hanging out and, you know, sipping on beverages and having a good time. It looks like a fun early season. Mark (27:46.28) Mm-hmm. Mark (27:56.377) Yeah. Chad (28:06.102) You know, I wouldn't say warm up, because everything they do is pretty aggressive. But the early season, you know, kind of a raw, natural street contest, you could call it. Mark (28:18.548) Yeah, it should be a pretty cool event. It's coming up 16th, the 20th of this month here in November. And then, you know, they also, I saw that they just recently announced the natural selection. And I know that last year you were a judge, so you got to go to BC and Alaska. What can you tell us about this year's natural selection? Chad (28:39.027) Um, the only thing I can tell you is what has been gone on. Spoken to anybody just yet about anything there, but I know there are three stops in Colorado. One down by Durango and two in Crested Butte. So yeah, yeah. Mark (28:54.544) And I think those are for like the duels segment where they have like the riders face off. It says they're going to do it in Switzerland around Crested Butte and the, the what the Irwin Lake Lodge, Red Mountain BC and Purgatory Adventures in Durango. And somewhere in Japan sounds like they're going to be able to do as well. Chad (29:06.623) Yeah. Chad (29:13.262) Yeah, that'll be interesting. And then it looks like two stops in Revy, one at Selkirk's and then one off of the resort where I think they might've built some stuff, but I don't know. And then that's gonna be middle of March. Mark (29:23.201) Mm. Mark (29:27.284) Yeah, that's the 10th to the 17th of March. We'll look forward to that. But I was actually pretty disappointed that there wasn't a Alaska stop because to me it's like Alaska represents the pinnacle of free riding. It's where people can test themselves on like a higher level. And so, you know, and I thought that, you know, they were kind of able to do that last year and then no Alaska stopped this year kind of has me scratching my head because it's like, well, How can it be the absolute pinnacle of free riding if you're not in the pinnacle place for free riding? Chad (30:02.622) Yeah, that's a point. It's, I think they are trying to hone it in and figure things out, I would imagine. I mean, I would imagine that one day they wanna go back to Alaska, you know? For now, I think it's a little bit on hold. I know that the natural selection did have almost a 10-year break anyways, right? So I think that it's just kind of like a wave. It's like life, you know? Like... Mark (30:15.212) Yep. Well... Mark (30:24.432) That's true. That is true. Chad (30:30.398) Some years, it might not be this five feet dropping in Jackson Hole or those pillows like last year at Rebel Stoke, where some years it might be kind of crusty Jackson Hole and Tomahawk King down ball face. So that's kind of how I see it. I think they have the same sights that you do. I think that they're just trying to work out the kinks and make it happen. Mark (30:45.217) Yeah. Mark (30:56.16) Yeah, I mean, I think the thing with Alaska, which they found out probably the hard way this year is that it is crazy expensive and, and there's a lot of curveballs in Alaska and so you can't, you know, you can't really plan things out to the day or the minute nature has the final say on everything in Alaska. And, uh, and so it, it can, it can lead to cost overruns if you're running an event. Chad (31:22.014) Yeah, we were out there, we did a scope day hoping that we, riders would drop. Everybody went up and it just ended up being a rehearsal day that costs like in the fives of thousands, you know, the five figures of thousands of dollars just to go hang out and come back. So yeah, they're figuring it out. You know, they gotta, you gotta get those non endemic snowboard sponsors like, like Red Bull and, and donkey juice and whatever else there is, you know. Mark (31:39.276) Yeah, yeah, so anyhow, but I... Mark (31:50.516) Right. I mean, that's the thing is like a natural selection could bring that kind of free riding and what a lot of the athletes consider kind of like the, the most desirable part of riding, you know, to a larger audience. And so to me, that's like kind of the promise of natural selection. So I hope they can deliver on that this year from Revelstoke and from the dual series, and hopefully they can come back to Alaska soon. Chad (32:06.391) Yeah. Chad (32:19.31) Yeah, we'll see. I mean, there's a whole nother element too of the Olympics kind of buying the scene that they're probably gonna try to get their feet wet in a interesting way that we're gonna be able to watch. I'm more like kind of into sitting in the backgrounds and watching it unfold and enjoying myself snowboarding. These days. Mark (32:40.681) It's crazy that you were in Alaska for like, I think about two weeks last year. And I was there the whole time you were there, we didn't see each other even though we were both hanging out in Valdez. So, but anyhow, well, hopefully you can make it back this year because I definitely know that's a place for you and I think you know it too. Chad (32:50.286) Yeah, for sure. Chad (32:57.873) Yeah, yeah. Honestly, the reason I took that job at Natural Selection was to go stand on a peak and kind of be involved. And now that that's been done, we'll see where it goes, you know? Mark (33:09.132) Yeah, well, I mean, I think that you're one of the most qualified judges they could have. So let's hope they get you back. Chad (33:16.81) Yeah, I kind of like snowboarding, so we'll see. I'd rather, I'd rather ride than judge, but I'm not going to say anything about that. Mark (33:20.569) Okay. Mark (33:26.164) Right, sometimes you gotta judge to ride. Okay. That's true, that's true. Sometimes you gotta not compete to ride as well. Otherwise, they're going to be standing around the top of a, uh, of a half pipe for half your life. Chad (33:28.822) Yeah, no, not really. Sometimes you've got to not judge to ride. Chad (33:37.503) Yeah, yeah, true. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was the hard part about trying to go to the Olympics those years. It was like, wow, you have been complete riding half pipe from, you know, beginning of the year all the way till end of February. And you're like, but now that we've become more of a, you know, expert at figuring out the terrain and where to go and how to ride, you don't really start riding good stuff till after February anyways unless, you know, depending on where you're at. Mark (34:06.38) Yeah, I mean you can in Japan, but that's just like for the powder. Chad (34:10.921) And motorboat and power in Japan is the best. Mark (34:13.076) Yeah. So, you know, I went to dinner last night with Scott Zergabel, who started holding with LeBlanc. You know, Scott? Yeah, he's yeah, he's a really cool dude. And he was telling me last night that ISPO, the European trade show, is going to be November 28th to 30th this year. And I was like, what? Chad (34:20.346) Oh wow. I know Scott, yeah M3 remember? Yeah, M3 I see. Mark (34:36.924) they've moved it now out of January. I remember when it was in March, when I first got involved in the snowboard industry, it was like the beginning of March every year in Vegas and they moved it to Colorado, I wanna say, and then they moved it up to like January or I guess before they moved to Colorado, they moved it up to the end of January. And now in Europe, they've decided to put it in November. Now, it's... Kind of interesting because to me trade shows are kind of dead in America. I went to the outdoor retailer maybe three years ago, maybe four years ago. And it was like the endemic snowboard brands had pretty much given up on, on going to trade shows to kind of, to, to approach shops and to get new orders or try to increase their distribution. And, you know, it occurs to me that like moving the trade shows up to November makes it harder. on small brands, I think it plays to people like Burton who want to run production all year long, or you know, a capita who has their own factory, they want to keep those people employed and not have to like ramp up seasonal laborers and then let them, you know, and lay them off at the end of production season for like six months or whatever. So it makes sense for these like big brands. How does it affect a brand like Academy though, that's what I'm curious about, because it doesn't make sense to me for this like You know, just for like the organic grassroots aspect of the industry, it seems like that really plays into the hands of these like large major brands. Chad (36:06.642) Yeah, I think even Never Summer quit doing, or Burton definitely quit doing trade shows a long time ago. Remember they had their own like, Denver, they had their own showroom there. And I mean, the one in Denver is gone, from what I understand. And I didn't even know Ispo was really still going. It's just, it's more of a, yeah, it's more of an event for people, brands that make a lot of money. Mark (36:13.282) Yeah. Mark (36:27.174) What? Chad (36:34.054) non-independent snowboard brands, I guess you could call it. Like, you know, your Solomons and K2s and Arc'teryx and Smartwools and, you know, North Faces, these brands that, like, that's just kind of part of their program and they do it. But for us, it doesn't really affect us because we just call shops and, you know, we have our reps and we have our, we're pretty self-sustainable. as opposed to these bigger brands kind of have to show face, I guess. Where I mean, it'd be great for us to be there if there was still a Denver trade show, it would be super fun to do because you get to see everybody. But every year, like the shops less and less would show up because it would cost them, you know, $5,000 or whatever to get four of their employees out there to go do loops and get hotel rooms for four days. And food and things would be... Mark (37:29.272) No, it used to be like a family reunion at the trade show. Like every year you'd see people you haven't seen in a year. And then I went like three years ago to the last one I went to in Denver. And it was like, nobody was there. And so it wasn't a family reunion. I was just sitting there. I saw maybe five or seven people that I knew, but literally, I mean, the snowboard industry was absent almost completely. Chad (37:50.174) Yeah, I think that's just e-commerce or whatever you want to call it. Everything kind of went to the internet and your computer and kind of how we are now as opposed to social interaction. Mark (37:56.828) Yeah, it's kind of interesting because even ispo, they used to have 18 trade show halls. And so each trade show hall at ispo was about, I don't know, half the size of the entire si a trade show or outdoor retailer trade show, and they had 18 halls of this and they had also beyond skiing and snowboarding, they would also have like the outdoor industry. And then also even stuff like gym equipment would be at that trade show. But I saw that they have a map and now Um, there are only 11 halls being filled in seven of the halls. They used to fill up with brands and, and people and, you know, and the industry are now empty and they don't even put anything in those halls. And so to me, that's like kind of a sign of the times, you know, between the internet and kind of how the retail environment has changed and, you know, the kind of direct consumer and these kind of macro big box. online retailers, like your back countries or EVOs or whatever. It seems like it's really kind of changed the face of snowboarding as far as like the ability for people to get FaceTime with each other, you know? And to me as a kid, it was like, I would get that FaceTime in a snowboard shop and the sales reps would drop by and we get to hang out with them and understand all the different lines. And then we'd go and hang out after school at the shop. And, and we would have this kind of like. you know, connection with the sport of snowboarding, even in the off season, like five days a week, we'd go hang out at a shop. And to me, it's like, now you get to hang out on Instagram and it's not quite the same thing. Chad (39:39.226) Yup, it definitely is not the same thing. No, splitboarding is the answer, hanging out with your friends is the answer. It's the business. I feel like it's not just snowboarding. I would imagine it's like in every business, right? Mark (39:43.727) Yeah. Mark (39:51.688) Yeah, I mean, I would say every business has faced that, but snowboarding, especially, I mean, I just did some simple math earlier today. And so when I started Snowboard Magazine, there were about 800 snowboard shops that we would distribute to. And then I just looked on Slush the Magazine's website, and currently there's about 216 shops in the country. That's a 74% Percent reduction in the amount of doors, right? That people can walk into to like interact with the culture of snowboarding. And so that's a negative thing. I mean, obviously people are getting it in other ways and other places, but. You know, to have that ability to just walk in and feel that culture of snowboarding. I think that's affected, you know, the. The overall size and scope of the industry and case in point is like. At that time, the overall winter sports business between skiing and snowboarding was about $10.7 billion a year. And now it's about $4.28 billion a year. So despite the fact that 74% of shops have closed in the last 20 years, there's also a 60% reduction in overall revenue. And I would attribute that, and this is me, there's no science behind this or anything, but I would attribute that to... just the lack of people being able to just like make snowboarding like a part of their identity by being able to walk into a snowboard shop five days a week or whatever as a 16 year old kid. That was my identity. I was a snowboarder first and foremost and today you know you do a lot of different things but snowboarding is kind of something you do in your own private time you know when you're sitting in front of your computer something like that. Chad (41:42.426) Yeah, it's, it's true. You got to really, really search for it. I went to actually underground snowboards in Breckener's through their locals appreciation party last night. And there was a few hundred people at the Riverwalk center in Breck and we watched movie premieres and they gave away stuff and you know, but it's still, it's still, you know, it was still the, your, your 200 people as opposed to the thousands of people that live in Summit County. If you think about it. Mark (42:00.173) Old times. Mark (42:10.606) Yeah. Chad (42:11.102) And it is interesting too, like things like lift lines and traffic and things like that have become more centralized or however you want to say it. Like if you look at I-70 coming up to Summit County, if you look at the canyons in Utah or I-80 coming up from San Francisco, they're just packed with vehicles and the parking lots are full and lift lines are crazy and resorts are tracked at, you know, before they even open if you're talking Jackson Hole. Like what is that compared to like what it was when those billions of dollars were being made compared to what they are now? Mark (42:47.416) And it's kind of crazy because it's like, there's less money involved, but there's also this other thing that's going on, like the Lyft Pass products where like, it used to be like to get a season pass at Sun Valley, it was like $3,500, some ridiculous amount of money. And now you can get like one of these kind of group season, epic icon, mountain collective passes, and, and they're affordable for pretty much anywhere. And, and To me, at least it's affected the traffic on the 70, the 80, like all these like road corridors to the mountains, but it hasn't resulted in more money being spent in the sport overall. And so my question to you is, are these past products a good thing? Like, is this good for the industry or is this just a way for the resort companies to make more money in the short term? Is it... Chad (43:24.238) True, they just smart cheeseburgers in real estate. Mark (43:38.224) benefiting in the short term at the expense of the long term longevity and health of the sports. Chad (43:44.614) Um, that's interesting. It's like a wonder where the, if there is, if you could do the comparison on board sales compared to like, you know, resort traffic. Mark (43:55.328) Yeah, we'll look into that further as time goes on. That just occurred to me as we were sitting here talking, but it is kind of a question that I have is like, what's happening to snowboarding? We'll get a little bit more into that. One more piece of news, Slush the Magazine is about to launch Slush the App. And so you can actually download it right now. They haven't promoted it yet, but it's out there. And yeah, and so they have like copies of their stories and magazines online through the app that you can download through the App Store. Chad (43:57.943) Yeah. Mark (44:25.768) So that's kind of cool. Yeah. Chad (44:27.018) That's awesome. I'm gonna be interested to have a Slush the Magazine app on my phone. It'll be my first kind of like snowboard app. What other app? Yeah, yeah, it's like Instagram or Slush. Which one are you gonna click? Facebook. What apps have I been using lately? I've been doing YouTube a lot. Just cause it's, I don't know, whatever. I'm trying to just load everything on my hard drives on YouTube just for fun for some reason. Mark (44:32.824) Yep, just another icon on your phone to make you a snowboarder. Mark (44:56.088) Mm-hmm. You get to like a point of like, you know, where you have enough videos that are getting plays here and there where it really adds up, you know, so the more videos the merrier, I guess. Chad (44:57.462) and I'll... Chad (45:05.097) Hmm. we'll see what happens. But speaking of app, I would imagine this is gonna be on the app, the 2160 by Hirota Ogawara. Yeah. Mark (45:19.188) Yeah, man, I'm kind of torn on the 2160, I gotta say, Chad, because, you know, yes, it is progression. No one's done a 2160 before, and I know you have thoughts on the 2160, but to me, it's like they've added a 180, you know, to what happened before, you know, and I don't know, I mean, Chad (45:23.401) Yeah. Mark (45:46.104) According to you Chad, you're like the matrix is complete now you can stop bullets with your teeth. Is that is that how it goes? Chad (45:52.498) Yes, this is the truth 100% like I thought it was at five, but apparently 2160 is six pins. So this is another 360 pass bullet catching bullets. So that's pretty cool. When I was a coach, I always like to say I would always tell the kids that your trick doesn't count unless you did it on something never touched by a human or modified by human. So how many tricks do you got the kids to be like? Mark (46:11.068) Mm-hmm. Chad (46:16.99) If you went to, you know. and it was like, how many tricks do you got? I bet he might not have any tricks either, but he does have a 2160 and a park jump, but technically somebody else built that kicker for him. So it doesn't really count. He doesn't own that trick, but I do enjoy the more spins, you know, like it's just entertaining. I don't think it's marketable or something that people wanna do, but I like to see. The possibility is pushed in every direction. I wouldn't say it's necessarily good for the sport or for sales, but it's like, why not? I don't know. Mark (46:59.656) I mean, you could definitely define it as progression. It's never been done before. Now it's been done. So that is progression, right? By maybe definition. But to me, it's like there's something missing from that. Right? It's like, when you watch that 2160, I mean, he is whipping around and it's getting closer and closer to helicopter status with each like added 180, but. Chad (47:05.952) Right. Chad (47:20.314) He might, if he put a little tweak on his board, he might like be able to just kind of levitate. You know what I mean? If you think about it, if he puts his board at the right angle, he might actually be able to helicopter and just kind of hang out up there. Mark (47:26.607) Yeah. Mark (47:33.716) Yeah, I mean, that's true. That might be the next level beyond stopping bullets with your teeth, it's just levitating. So we'll have to wait and see where this goes. But to me though, it's like, it's still missing like this essential creative element. It's like back in the day, let's go back to like the early 90s. It's like you watch Jamie Lynn do a method, you watch Chris Roach do a method, you watch Dave Alden do a method, and they were all different tricks, but they were the same trick. And it's like the way that each person Chad (47:38.663) Man. Yeah. Mark (48:03.736) made that trick their own was part of the essence of like, of the creativity of snowboarding. It's like you would put your own mark on every trick you did. And once we got into like nine hundreds and beyond, that's when you kind of stopped making tricks your own. You just had to get it around to the landing, but. I kind of miss the days where it was like your creative approach and how you did it. And I guess that's what I identified with like East bum fuck is like the way that he like just approached making a movie differently. Um, but to me, it's like that creative element doesn't exist when it's just a matter of adding rotations. Chad (48:44.274) 100%. Yeah. I mean, Sean, like, like they like the claims that he was inventing tricks, but like you said, it was it's just not in our eyes is not really the progression we want to see. It's just more rotations. Mark (48:56.344) Yeah, and I do see that there is some progression in the sport. I don't think progression is dead. And by the way, it's like, I don't consider like a 50-50 on a challenge rail necessarily progression, even if you go 20 feet longer than the last guy or whatever that to me isn't necessarily progression, but I do see progression in like the pullback tricks that you see guys, you know, like Marcus Cleveland and Ted Powell doing a little bit and, and I, so I see that as something cool, obviously like natural selection, they're bringing you know, kind of like just back country kind of filming and then making it into full lines where you have to like really do multiple tricks on one face. And so that to me is a kind of progression. And then this other thing to me, where really I see the progression of free riding is in what I consider like adventure free riding, where people are going out and like discovering new areas or exploring to get to these areas and then riding them and then making it back out in one piece. And to me, that's kind of like this. very potentially dangerous, but also rewarding part of freeriding that, that has kind of like really been progressing in the last like, like five or 10 years as far as like people going really to like further lengths. I know people have been using snowmobiles to access areas for about 20 years, but really I've seen like this progression in the last 10 years of crews going out to like new areas and going to places that literally have never been gotten to before. And so to me, that's like a whole new level of exploration and therefore progression to me anyway. Chad (50:31.334) I agree with you. I enjoy watching those movies as more documentary style and in-depth and what's going on. Like I didn't like watching Jeremy Jones's video parts ever. The big mountain, Jeremy Jones until he started telling his story. And then you're like, Whoa, that's pretty cool. Like what you're doing besides that. It was just kind of like, you know, turning down a hill or a steep hill, you know? And, uh, once you hear the story and you hear what's going on behind, it's great. Mark (50:54.285) Yeah, we get- Mark (50:58.968) Yeah, it's like I took it for granted when all those TV movies were coming out in the 90s. You just see Tom Burt on a mountain face a fly on the wall making his way down a mountain. And you didn't really appreciate all the thought and calculation and you know, figuring out what would go into like a big mountain line. And then when Jeremy Jones started talking about that's when I think the regular viewer kind of started to gain an appreciation of what goes on in like big mountains and And really just how a risky it is, but B then how much more calculation you put into each line you're doing. Chad (51:36.11) Yeah, like the story behind it is the progression I feel like. I did notice and I paid attention. I saw a lot of movies come out in the last couple of years, a lot of big brands, like big outdoor brands are sponsoring expeditions. And they do a lot of sponsoring expeditions to a lot of skiers and snowboarders. It might not be the best skiers and snowboarders. So they just go out and struggle and come back and tell their story. That's kind of degression to me. Like a lot of these adventure movies that have come out that Travis and Jeremy put out over the last couple of years have kind of spawned a lot of people trying to go make their own and they don't have the talent that Jeremy and Travis do so it's kind of a boring... Yeah. I see a lot of those on YouTube. I'm like, oh, but they're still interesting to watch. And if they go to cool places, you know. Mark (52:17.037) It's like a watered down version of that progression, you know? Mark (52:25.204) Is it progression if you struggle more? Is that progression? It's like the bigger the struggle, the more the progression. I don't think so. Yeah. Chad (52:31.71) Yeah, like DMX says to live is to struggle, to die is to feel good. You know, but anyways, yeah, yeah. So, but I do, I really love enjoy like, you know, all those climbing adventure movies, as opposed to your standard trick movie that happened here before. But like I said, unless it's very unique, like used bumfuck, or if I personally know them, then I'm excited to watch it. Like I just saw Jed at that. Mark (52:38.504) Yup. Chad (53:00.086) you know, premiere in Minneapolis. And I was like, what's up, Jed? I'm like, we're here for you. We heard you got a two song part. I wanna watch it, you know what I mean? And then my dad was at the usher at the rail at the end of his part. So there was like a little connection there, but otherwise it's just another challenge rail to me when I'm watching it. Mark (53:08.124) Yeah. Mark (53:18.788) Yeah, interesting. Well, you know, we I had another subject that I was going to talk about here, but I think we'll save it for our next episode. I think it's a pretty juicy subject that we could get really into. And so maybe we'll save that for the next time around. But I think we've kind of covered a lot of bases here for the preseason. Is there anything else that you want to talk about? I mean, I think that we got an open mic, we got, you know, an open platform for you to speak your mind, Chad. Chad (53:33.111) Yeah. Chad (53:47.502) Speak my mind, I'm like the more and more I'm involved in the snowboarding industry, the more and more I want to be more involved in just snowboarding, not outside of it, which a lot of brands are these days and I notice it. So I'm really excited at what we're doing with Academy and I hope on the next episode, I plan on this next November, December, I want to go ride Minnesota and then go surf the North Shore of Lake Superior. Mark (54:17.58) Interesting. Chad (54:18.674) And with a wetsuit because I guess it's really good in the winter and my buddy Mark (54:22.5) I got a guy who's like a big Chicago surfer. Now I know that's like kind of an oxymoron to some people, but he's the guy for Great Lakes surfing apparently. It's snowboard or two. So he might be able to show you some spots, some secret spots on the Great Lakes. Chad (54:26.09) none. Chad (54:33.267) Yeah. Chad (54:40.002) Oh, for sure. Yeah, yeah. Like a, well, damaged Duluth. I'm gonna, there's a shop up in Duluth and that's kind of where we're going. We're going to go east of there, but I mean, there are secrets, but they're not because it's so cold up there that no one does it. You know what I mean? Mark (54:42.084) I think they're all kind of secret. Mark (54:57.144) Right. It's not like you're fighting for waves. Chad (55:01.002) Yeah, my buddy Matt that I'm going to do it go surf with he lived in San Diego for 15 years and he's like a you know He's got a sailboat in Mexico and he's like the best place to surf is You know the great lace because no one's there Yeah, you just got to be able to deal with the cold Mark (55:12.856) Really? Interesting. Okay, well, I guess now with all your cold plunge training, you should be ready. Chad (55:18.051) We'll see. Chad (55:21.523) I'm going that's kind of the goal. Yeah. Mark (55:23.596) You know, if you really want to impress me, you're going to trunk it. Right on. Well, thank you for taking the time to jump onto this real talk. This has been real Chad, and I enjoy talking to you, uh, snowboarding. And, you know, I, I've, um, been progressing my, my interest in snowboarding and, and part of that progression though, is, is. Chad (55:27.142) I'll die, are you? Yeah, we'll see. Chad (55:37.642) It has, it's been a couple years. Mark (55:50.132) as you have, I'm less interested in the snowboard industry and, and more interested in kind of what snowboarding can do for the individual, you know, and how that can impact your life and what it can contribute to your peace and happiness in your life. And so I think that snowboarding can still bring that to you. It's just I'm not looking at it through the same lens as I used to, as far as the industry and you know, then this kind of daily in and out of, you know, Instagram posts or whatever. Chad (56:21.002) Yup, you know, there's only one person made for Instagram that's Zeb Powell, you know? Mark (56:25.9) Exactly. It's like you just have to watch what Zeb does and it's like, what are you going to do? What? You know, you can watch Marcus Cleveland too, you know, yeah, there's a there's a handful, but you can get your full fill pretty quick. Just saying. Time to figure out some new ways to sell yourself through Instagram, maybe. Chad (56:33.978) Yeah, yeah, true. For sure. Five. Chad (56:40.846) For sure. Chad (56:45.43) Mm-hmm. Yeah, I mean Who knows of my plan this winter is to go snowboarding every day I can and I live in an area where once I leave my house with my cell phone Mark (56:55.076) That's, that's why you're a real contender for goat status is because your passion for snowboarding is like real. And you know, there's a lot of people who like just being around snowboarding for 30 years, there's like a lot of people who like became pros and like, we're all about it, had video parts and all this stuff. And then they lost their sponsor deal or whatever and haven't been seen from since. And to me, that was always disappointing. It's like, were you after the, you know, the accolades or were you after kind of the joy of snowboarding? You know, and for me, I have no question in my mind about you, Chad. You love snowboarding more than anyone else. I know. I think so. Chad (57:32.45) Thank you, I appreciate that. You are correct, snowboarding's not really that hard. So, well it is and it isn't, but some people are really naturally talented and then their passion doesn't really go along with their scene. So once they're done, they're done. And I love it, it's gonna be a good time. It's just a great way to get outside. Mark (57:45.853) Yeah. Mark (57:49.844) Well, apparently we're not done yet with the snowboard project. We're going to keep doing it. And we're not doing it with sponsors anymore because we just want to keep the talk as real as possible. So I think that's a good thing. And I want to thank you all for tuning into our first episode in about nine months. And you got to take a break from time to time. I mean, I literally worked in the snowboard industry from the 19, I think 1991. is when I first got involved and I just, I worked a ridiculous amount of time in it for all these years and it was time for a break, you know, so. Chad (58:28.49) Yeah, I'm down to get back on once we come up with another good list of awesome things to talk about. Mark (58:34.228) I think it won't take long because we didn't even get to the juiciest part of this list this week. So we'll be back soon. I talked to Bjorn, by the way, he wants to jump back on as well. So we'll get, we'll get both of you guys back on here. I'm not counting Bjorn out, but he was busy with Cardiff business today. So he was doing that. There's some kind of snow safety kind of deal in Utah right now. And, you know, he's, he's involved with that. So more power to him. Chad (58:40.138) Oh yeah, yeah. All right. Chad (58:45.65) Nice. Chad (58:52.238) Ah, that's it. Mark (59:01.972) And more power to you, Chad. And I'm glad that you've got a roof over your head, some photos on the wall that you shot and a couple of Vordivox bags behind you. Chad (59:11.462) Those aren't my photos, those are Jeff's. But yeah, a couple of order box bags, so you know. Pretty good gear. Speaking of, well, yeah, thank you. They do have a, I'm not sponsored by them, but they do have a beacon that his voice talks to you while you're searching. It says, go left, go right, start digging. Things like that, I believe so, yeah. It's pretty advanced, you know. Hopefully you never have to have that happen, but. Mark (59:13.904) Okay. Yep, you're ready for any kind of mishap. Mark (59:30.604) Like what, go left, go right, five meters? Really? That is pretty cool. Chad (59:40.706) They do that. Mark (59:41.144) Maybe, maybe for our next episode, we can kind of do a review because it seems like, you know, like all this backcountry technology is still evolving as far as the airbag backpacks, you know, there's the canister ones, the electric ones. There's beacons seem to evolve every year. Now radios are part of the game. Um, they always have been, but they kind of have been refined a little bit by the industry. So maybe we could talk about some of the backcountry tools next time around as well. Cool. Chad (01:00:07.362) That sounds awesome. I'm way into that. Mark (01:00:10.284) Well, thank you everyone for tuning in and yeah, we will be back with some more snowboard projects soon. Chad (01:00:18.539) Thank you. Mark (01:00:19.592) And, uh, Chad, just hold on a minute. Let me just stop the recording and let me just
