Ep 36: Peter Watts in Conversation with Justin Gregg - Part 1

This is our fourth and final episode on the theme of Sci-Fi Fungi, where we dig a little deeper into the current science and future science of mycology with Dr. Alex Moskaluk, a mycologist and professor of biology at the University of Guelph.  She specializes in zoonotic fungi, fungal pathogens that can jump from animals to humans and vice versa.  We discuss how fungi are evolving resistance to antifungal treatments in much the same way as bacteria are developing antibiotic resistance, developing mechanisms for evading the human immune system, and learning to specialize in human infection. So basically continuing along our apocalyptic sci-fi themes… did you know that some fungi can kill you by growing abscesses into your brain!?  But on the brighter side, we also talk about some cool science fictional possibilities these organisms may offer us in the future: some fungi can absorb radiation and could be used to shield space ships and extraterrestrial colonies from space radiation!  They can break down moon regolith or rock on other planets to make soil and building materials.  And it seems we are just scratching the surface of even more amazing capabilities – like actually reducing the radioactivity of disaster sites like Chernobyl by… well, you can’t do that with plain old chemistry so, are they somehow capable of inducing nuclear reactions?  Can we create future super-materials one day, like fungal Kevlar or a fungal cable for space elevators?  Just a few of the crazy ideas that came out of this conversation, in the finest tradition of digging deeper into the science in the fiction.https://ovc.uoguelph.ca/pathobiology/people/faculty/alex-moskaluk/Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

Marty speaks with Kaitlyn Kuehn (KK), creator and host of the Flora Funga Podcast, discussing recent developments in real world applications of fungi, and speculating about the possible roles fungi may play in our science fictional future.  We discuss their use as recreational drugs, and the current regulatory and legalization landscape.  We talk about creating new materials from fungi, from making bricks in space to creating new green materials for packaging, hats and shoes on earth.  We consider fungi in water efficient vertical farming, using yeasts and molds as pesticides, and if they might be helpful in farming insects for as a source of protein. And finally, we do a bit of science fictional thinking about Fungi as a possible agent of panspermia for seeding life on new worlds, creating ecological footholds on dead planets, and as a catalyst for biodiversity.  https://www.florafungapodcast.com/We touch on a couple FF episodes in this interview:Ep 135 with Chris Pauli from Tryptomics:https://www.florafungapodcast.com/florafungapodcast/135Ep 77 with Adam Cobb from the Soil Food Web Schoolhttps://www.florafungapodcast.com/florafungapodcast/77Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

We speak with M. R. Carey about his book 'The Girl With All The Gifts', where the zombie fungus Cordyceps plays a central role in bringing about the end of civilization. We talk about the appeal of a post-apocalyptic story and discuss some of the science in Merlin Sheldrake’s book 'Entangled Life': scientific revolutions and evolutions, gestalt shifts, the ancient evolutionary history of fungi, how they can be both parasitic and symbiotic, and how all of life is like a lichen.  Mike tells us  how he came to be a writer, and about his experience of benevolent presences on psilocybin – and the ineffability of the psychedelic experience.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Carey_(writer)https://www.littlebrown.co.uk/contributor/m-r-carey-2/https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17235026-the-girl-with-all-the-giftshttps://www.imdb.com/title/tt4547056/Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

Beginning our highly anticipated new topic of Sci-Fi Fungi, we talk to science fiction author Benjamin Percy about the second book of his Comet Cycle, 'The Unfamiliar Garden'.  We discuss Ben's writing career in comic books and novels and soon TV and film, the literary treatment that space fungus gets in this book, as well as the human and emotional stakes that make it a really good story.  We discuss the goodies and the baddies of the fungal world, lichenification, symbiosis, collective intelligence, creating wonder and seeing the world with fresh eyes. https://benjaminpercy.com/https://benjaminpercy.com/novels/the-unfamiliar-garden/Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

Marty and Holly discuss our upcoming theme of Sci-Fi Fungi with interviews of science fiction authors Benjamin Percy and Mike Carey, along with mycologists Dr. Alex Moskaluk from the University of Guelph and Kaitlyn Kuehn (KK) from the Flora Funga Podcast.  We'll be discussing space fungi from cometary debris in Ben Percy's book 'The Unfamiliar Garden', the zombie fungus Codyceps in Mike Percy's book 'The Girl With All The Gifts'.  And we'll be structuring our conversations around Merlin Sheldrake's popular science book 'Entangled Life', which delves into the apparent motor-controlling abilities of the zombie fungus Cordyceps, the mind-altering effects of Psilocybin, as well as the genesis of land-based ecosystems from the symbiosis of fungi with algae in lichen.  Along the way we also introduce an upcoming interview with returning science fiction author and friend of the show Robert J. Sawyer about his books 'Quantum Night' and 'The Downloaded'.  Then we go on to introduce our next theme of the Multiverse, in Mike Carey's Pandominion duology - 'Infinity Gate' and 'Echo of Worlds', and Micaiah Johnson's 'The Space Between Worlds' and 'Those Beyond the Wall'.  Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

We talk to a returning guest and friend of the show, science fiction author Edward M. Lerner, about his latest book 'On The Shoals of Space-Time', on the topic of First Contact.  Ed is a fount of scientific insight and information on space science and the possibilities for extraterrestrial encounters, having written 25 books – 5 of them with the legendary author Larry Niven, of Ringworld fame – many of which explore themes First Contact with extraterrestrials, as well as future scientific advancement that would be necessary for interstellar travel.  In this interview we discuss a number of his books, we talk about fusion and anti-matter, electromagnetic bottles, the Albercurrie drive for warping space-time to get around the speed limit of light, and neutrino communications.  We also discuss the Prime Directive, the Drake equation, the Fermi Paradox, scientific revolutions and evolutions, stealth technologies, and alien monitoring stations keeping an eye on Earth in the Kuiper belt and the Oort cloud.  That’s quite a lot!  So if you like to dig deeper into the real science and big ideas in your science fiction, this conversation is a veritable treasury of insights and learning that will help you get more out of the science fiction you read and watch.Edward M. Lerner -- official website (edwardmlerner.com)Books, short fiction, and essays by SF author Edward M. Lerner | Edward M. Lerner (edwardmlerner.com)Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

In this episode we talk to Mark Milne as a follow-up on our interviews with science fiction author Kim Stanley Robinson and glaciologist Heidi Sevestre in episodes 21 and 22, on the topic of Geoengineering as portrayed in Kim Stanley Robinson’s book 'The Ministry for the Future'.  Mark speaks about a number of strategies for mitigating climate change by cooling the planet through increasing its albedo, or reflectivity.  The overarching strategy that we discuss is Solar Radiation Management (SRM), and we tackle a number of different possibilities under this umbrella: stratospheric aerosol injection (SAI), marine cloud brightening, high albedo crops, reforestation, white paint, terrestrial mirrors and the Goliath that everyone likes to slay - space mirrors.  Mark makes the case that terrestrial mirrors are our best hope for immediate implementation, with little or no dangerous side effects, especially in the context of canopies over agricultural land which can be created with current materials from landfill; if 10% of all agricultural land were covered with these semi-transparent mirrors it would provide enough global reflectivity to adequately offset our warming trend and avoid climate disaster.  Marty proposes a sci-fi idea about adding engineered enzymes to create the materials we need, and Mark claims that if we don’t solve the climate crisis within a few decades it won’t be the heat that kills us, it’ll be people – due to the degradation of our social and economic systems.  We also talk about governance and consent, what motivates scientists and determines the science we pursue, termination shock, carbon sequestration, engineering efficiency and economic policy initiatives related to modern monetary theory.  Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

We continue the conversation between science fiction author Peter Watts and scientist Justin Gregg, and now they get down to the tricky business of discussing the nature of consciousness.  We discuss Peter's premise of 'Blindsight – that consciousness is an illusory, unnecessary and possibly parasitic phenomenon that will get us all killed when we encounter more efficient, unconscious extra-terrestrial intelligence.  Then very quickly agree that nobody knows what the hell they’re talking about when they try to understand consciousness: the pan-psychics may even be right that it’s a fundamental property of matter like mass, spin and charge.  We discuss examples of unconscious but intelligent behaviour like sleepwalking killers and painters, we talk about acid trips, and the possible evolutionary advantages of consciousness in connection to memory. Peter suggests humans may not actually possess general intelligence and that we may be even dumber than large language models and the current incarnation of AI (as evidenced by flat earthers, anti-vaxxers and religious fundamentalists). And Justin promises to jello-wrestle an AI next time we get together!Echopraxia (rifters.com)https://www.rifters.com/Blindsight (Watts novel) - Wikipediahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blindsight_(Watts_novel)Justin Gregghttps://www.justingregg.com/If Nietzsche Were a Narwhal — Justin Gregghttps://www.justingregg.com/narwhalBuzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

In this episode we present a conversation between science fiction author Peter Watts and scientist Justin Gregg, following up on our individual interviews with each of them on the general theme of intelligence and consciousness.  Justin Gregg is the author of ‘If Nietzsche were a Narwhal - What Animal Intelligence Reveals About Human Stupidity’, the book we spoke to him about in episode 23.  Peter Watts is the science fiction author of 'Blindsight', 'Echopraxia', 'Starfish', 'Maelstrom', 'Behemoth' and many amazing short stories.  We spoke to Peter in episodes 24 and 25 about his book ‘Blindsight’ and also about Justin Gregg’s book, and now we’ve put them in a room together for a very animated conversation with lots of banter and laughter.  Peter discusses Justin’s book and Justin discusses Peter’s book, and they discover that they are pretty much twins separated at birth! We discuss AI, biology and evolution, the sweet spot for writing successful science fiction, Aphantasia, the secret of effective bullshit, manufactured memories and the extremely entertaining "yellow sponge hypothesis".  So fasten your seatbelts kids, and get ready for two spectacularly interesting and intelligent people to light the house on fire.  Buzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463

Marty and Holly talk to George Paxinos - neuroscientist, environmental activist and author of 'A River Divided', a book that explores neurological determinism - the claim that we have no free will and that our actions are entirely determined by our genetics and the neurological consequences imposed on us by the environment which shapes our brain.  His book comes with a very interesting twist: the modern day cloning of Jesus of Nazareth! And not only that, but the cloning of two identical copies, twins who are raised in different places and cultures. This is a bold and fascinating vehicle to explore the theme of nature vs nurture, genetic endowment vs environmental influence, and free will vs determinism.  Our conversation covers a lot of ground - from atheism and reverent agnosticism, to finding the goldilocks zone for the size of our brains, the new rise of fascism and the waning of democracy, brain uploads and the transfer of consciousness.  NeuRA | George Paxinos | Neuroscience Research Australiahttps://neura.edu.au/researchers/scientia-professor-george-paxinos-aoBuzzsprout (podcast host):https://thescienceinthefiction.buzzsprout.comEmail: [email protected]: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/Twitter:https://twitter.com/MartyK5463