Metrology Today Podcast

Thermal EMF can remain almost invisible during ordinary electrical measurements—and then become a significant error as the required resolution and uncertainty improve. Ryan Egbert and Henry Zambrano are joined by longtime electrical calibration expert Jack Somppi to explain how dissimilar metals, temperature gradients, worn connections, stabilization, and measurement technique can affect low-level voltage and resistance results. The conversation covers connector selection and condition, ohmic versus thermal effects, two-wire and four-wire resistance, environmental stability, reversal techniques, and why technicians should watch a measurement’s behavior instead of recording the first apparently acceptable indication. Referenced reading: Martin L. Kidd, “Watch Out for Those Thermoelectric Voltages!” https://www.callabmag.com/watch-out-for-those-thermoelectric-voltages/

Season 5, Episode 1: AI, Metrology, and the Limits of Automation Metrology Today returns for Season 5 with guest Stephen Puryear joining Ryan and Henry for a practical discussion about artificial intelligence and its growing role in metrology, calibration, technical education, and laboratory operations. The conversation examines both the value and the risks of AI. The group discusses inaccurate AI-generated metrology content, the importance of subject-matter expertise, and why technical professionals must verify anything produced by an AI system before using it for training, decision-making, procedures, or published material. They also explore useful applications of AI, including uncertainty-budget development, spreadsheet review, document standardization, procedure analysis, technical writing, image generation, data trending, and equipment troubleshooting. The discussion expands into the need for formal AI-use policies, validation of AI-assisted measurement systems, protection of sensitive information, and appropriate management oversight before new tools are implemented. The central message is straightforward: AI can be an exceptionally powerful companion tool, but it does not replace technical knowledge, professional judgment, or accountability. Topics include: AI-generated misinformation in metrology Using AI to support uncertainty analysis and spreadsheets The difference between assistance and reliance AI policies for laboratories, educators, and students Validation of AI-assisted measurement systems Data analysis, procedures, and technical documentation Artificial general intelligence and the work of Alan Turing and David Deutsch Why training, peer review, and professional networking remain essential This episode offers a balanced look at how metrology professionals can use AI to work more efficiently without compromising technical integrity.

In this season finale of Metrology Today, Ryan and Henry wrap up Season 4 with a look back at the conversations, guests, and themes that defined the year — and a preview of what’s coming next. This season featured consultants, assessors, industry leaders, and practitioners from across metrology, testing, manufacturing, and quality, covering topics including: Accreditation and assessment realities Decision rules and uncertainty Buying the wrong equipment — and the real cost of rework and false decisions Testing, production, and measurement beyond the lab Why metrology education needs to meet people where they are The episode also previews Season 5, which will introduce topic-focused educational podcasts and bonus episodes designed to support technicians, managers, and organizations making real measurement decisions. Whether you’re deep in metrology or responsible for measurement outcomes at a higher level, this episode ties the season together and sets the stage for what’s ahead.

In this episode, Ryan and Henry welcome Paul Depmore for an in-depth discussion tracing his path from the U.S. Marine Corps into commercial and national-level calibration work. Paul shares how his experience evolved through Southwest Research Institute, Transcat, Morehouse, and Applied Technical Services, leading to later support of U.S. Navy calibration programs. Key discussion points include: Transitioning from military to civilian metrology roles Early mentorship and lab culture Piston-gauge and dead-weight tester practices Differences between ASTM E4 / E74 and ISO 376 / 7500 calibrations Managing primary-pressure standards and effective-area verification Collaboration among commercial labs, NIST, and Navy facilities Communication, documentation, and supporting new technicians 🎧 Explore how decades of experience—from force frames to primary-pressure systems—connect across the military, commercial, and standards communities. Timestamps 00:00 – Introductions and background 05:00 – Marine Corps calibration and mentorship 20:00 – Pressure-metrology discussion 35:00 – Force calibration: ASTM E74 vs ISO 376 50:00 – Primary standards and uncertainty chains 01:00 – Industry collaboration and continual learning

Jane Weitzel has been working in analytical chemistry for over 40 years for pharmaceutical and mining companies.  She was elected to the United States Pharmacopeia Council of Experts as chair of the 2020-2025 General Chapters–Measurement and Data Quality Expert Committee and is a member of the 2025-2030 EC Pharmaceutical Analysis Lifecycle and Data Science. She was a member of the USP 2015-2020 Statistics Expert Committee. She has been Director of pharmaceutical Quality Control laboratories. She has experience with many different regulatory environments.   She is currently a consultant specializing in laboratory management systems, GMP testing, and ISO/IEC 17025. She is an auditor and an educator. Jane has applied Quality Systems and statistical techniques, including the evaluation and use of measurement uncertainty, in a wide variety of technical and scientific businesses. Recently she is focusing on the implementation of the new USP General Chapter 1220 Analytical Procedures Life Cycle. 

In this episode of Metrology Today Podcast, we sit down with Ryan “The Assessor” Kelly - a Marine Corps trained metrologist, seasoned assessor, and detail-driven industry professional. Ryan shares his journey from military calibration labs to private industry and assessment work, and explains why his no-nonsense approach to auditing is both feared and respected. We discuss: The transition from military calibration training to civilian labs The challenges of incomplete training and rigid procedures Why some labs pass years of audits with “no findings” until someone like Ryan digs deeper Common nonconformities - from firmware documentation to risk in PT plans (per ILAC P9 updates) The tension between customer demands, simplified certificates, and full compliance How real uncertainty budgets should be built (and why “marketing” low numbers is dangerous) If you want to hear what it’s really like to have a tough assessor in your lab - and why that’s ultimately a good thing, this episode is for you.

On this episode of Metrology Today, we go global with Sandeep Nair, founder and CEO of Metquay, whose software is helping commercial calibration labs around the world break out of the Excel rut. Sandeep’s story is unlike any other: He started as a computer scientist in India, found his way into calibration by chance, and wound up building a platform that empowers labs to create their own uncertainty calculations, templates, and workflows—no “black box” required. Sandeep shares: His journey from services in India to running a tech company for metrology labs across Asia, Australia, the Middle East, and the U.S. Why most labs are still stuck in spreadsheets—and what it takes to break free How true software customization is changing the calibration business model The importance of data sharing, open APIs, and industry collaboration (and why holding your data too tightly might actually be a red flag!) How AI and modern software can help labs with quality, documentation, and even workforce training in a rapidly changing industry His vision for Metquay’s unified measurement platform and what’s coming next If you care about the intersection of technology, quality, and business—or just want a fresh perspective on the calibration world—this conversation will get you thinking. Listen now and connect with Sandeep on LinkedIn or at metquay.com.

On this episode of Metrology Today, we’re joined by Greg Cenker—industry veteran, educator, and now a driving force at IndySoft—for a deep dive into the business and technical realities of running a calibration lab. Greg shares his path from the Marine Corps to aerospace, power, Fluke, SpaceX, and beyond, illustrating just how small (and interconnected) the metrology world really is. We discuss: How buying the wrong equipment can quietly cost millions—and how to actually model those costs The reality of probability of false reject/false accept, and why most labs underestimate their true risk Justifying equipment and software investments to management (with real ROI examples) The limitations and frustrations of industry standards and why committees move so slowly Cross-checks, continuous improvement, and what every lab manager should know What’s coming next from IndySoft, including force and balance modules and smarter calibration workflows Greg’s upcoming article and free cost modeling spreadsheet in Quality Magazine: https://www.qualitymag.com/articles/98705-how-much-does-that-calibration-test-really-cost Whether you’re a bench tech, a lab manager, or just metrology-curious, this episode will open your eyes to what’s really at stake in calibration—and how small decisions add up to big dollars. Listen now, and let us know: Can you think of a single product that isn’t affected by measurement?

Rob Knake is a professional specializing in quality systems, metrology, and standards development. He is actively employed with the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) and involved with NCSL International, where he contributes to training, technical exchanges, and the advancement of measurement science. With expertise in ISO/IEC 17025, measurement traceability, and laboratory accreditation, Rob frequently leads seminars and workshops aimed at enhancing metrology practices. His roles encompass coaching, public speaking, and organizational leadership, focusing on improving quality systems and fostering collaboration within the metrology community. Rob's professional endeavors are highlighted through his active participation in events like the NCSL International Technical Exchange and the MSC Annual Training Symposium. His contributions have been recognized in various capacities, including hosting sessions and delivering presentations on metrology and digitalization topics. For more detailed information about Rob Knake's professional background and contributions, you can visit his LinkedIn profile.

Galen Liao is department manager of Engineering Asset Management for Northrop Grumman Corporation, a leader in global security.    Experience: Galen leads the company’s Engineering Asset Management (EAM) organization which supports program execution through the reuse of company resources via the test equipment pool and by providing top of the line calibrations.  EAM is recognized as an industry leader and runs the largest calibration laboratory in the company, arguably the largest cal lab west of the Mississippi, and is the 3rd largest general purpose electronic rental pool agency.  EAM leads and manages the NGC metrology & equipment rental organizations by providing an affordable comprehensive solution for managing the measurement and test equipment life cycle.    Experience: After earning his bachelor’s degree in chemical engineering from the University of California at Berkeley (Go Bears!) Galen joined Northrop Grumman in 2003 as a Test Engineer for the Experimental Test Facility, He then went on to work Airborne Laser Test bed project and was responsible for managing the operation of the high energy laser.  In 2010, he joined the Metrology Services organization as a Physical Dimensional Discipline Engineer.     Prior to NG, Galen has notably worked on testing a novel drug delivery system at Johnson and Johnson (Pharmaceuticals), finding and mapping oil well levels at Breitburn Energy(Oil and Gas), setting up computer networks at the California Science Center (IT), and developing next gen shuttle tile at NASA (Aerospace).     Education:  Bachelor’s degree in Chemical Engineering from the University of California at Berkeley and half-way through a masters in Management Science and Engineering at Stanford University    Background:  Born and raised on the hard streets of Torrance, CA. Galen was a latchkey kid and has gone to public school all his life.  His premier achievements include skipping kindergarten and setting the CAMS (California Academy of Math and Science) waterpolo team record (8) steals for a single game.  In the BC (Before Child) era he enjoyed running marathons, surfing, snow boarding, and dragon boat racing.  Now he spends his weekends coaching his son’s AYSO soccer team, teaching him how to swim, or cheering him on in his local YMCA basketball league.  Galen has completed several leadership-development programs and volunteer organizations, serving as an officer for Connect1NG, Space Dragons Dragon Boat team, and is currently the President and on the Board of Directors for the Measurement Science Conference.