From math to science: How weak math skills hurt students with Therese Markow (Ep 40)

In this episode, Anna Stokke welcomes Dr. Therese Markow, Professor Emeritus at the University of California, San Diego, and host of the Critically Speaking podcast. They discuss the critical intersection of math and science education. Therese shares her firsthand experiences as a geneticist and post-secondary educator, highlighting the alarming decline in basic numeracy among students and its impact on their success in fields like biology and genetics. The conversation covers fascinating studies linking math experience to logical reasoning and brain development.  Therese tackles the question of whether math skills have a genetic component. They also discuss societal and educational implications of weak math skills, including how some popular teaching philosophies might be failing students. Whether you're an educator, a math or science enthusiast scientist, or simply passionate about improving education, this episode offers something for everyone. NOTE: The resource page contains research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-40-resources TIMESTAMPS 00:00 Introduction 03:24 Math skills in science students 11:25 Impact on university curriculum standards 19:36 Links between math and logic skills 28:03 Are math abilities genetic? 28:40 Heritability studies: Twins and math abilities 38:06 Effective math teaching influences math ability 41:27 Gender and math: Debunking myths 42:48 Personal stories about math interest 50:56 Importance of basic math skills in life 52:58 Conclusion and final Thoughts RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 2. Evidence-based teaching strategies with Paul Kirschner https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-zgw6i-13b33df Ep 16. Applying cognitive science to education with Daniel Willingham https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-szugf-149dff1 Ep 22. Mindsets and educational misconceptions with Carl Hendrick https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-78zv9-15493b1 Ep 35. Preparation for university math with Darja Barr and Dan Wolczuk https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-b8ssx-171a631 EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-40-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-40-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Balti, Cases to Rest Podington Bear – No Squirrel Commotion, Kitten Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social    

Join Anna Stokke in conversation with Dr. Marcy Stein, professor emeritus from the University of Washington, Tacoma, about her firsthand experience with Direct Instruction (DI) and Project Follow Through—the world’s largest educational experiment. Despite showing DI’s effectiveness with at-risk students, the results were largely ignored. Marcy shares insights into the origins of DI, its instructional design, and emphasizes that it’s effective for all students, not just those struggling academically. She also addresses common misconceptions, walks through a typical DI math lesson, and gives advice on how to bridge skill gaps in the classroom. This episode unpacks the story of Project Follow Through and the ongoing fight for evidence-based education. NOTE: The resource page contains resources and research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-39-resources TIMESTAMPS [00:00:00] Introduction  [00:03:52] Marcy Stein’s background [00:07:11] Origins of Direct Instruction [00:11:26] Overview of Project Follow Through [00:14:40] Instructional models and results of Project Follow Through [00:23:30] What makes DI effective? [00:25:12] Why were the results of PFT ignored? [00:29:28] Difference between DI and di [00:31:52] Instructional design in DI [00:37:50] Pitfalls of multiple strategies [00:42:55] Understanding instructional delivery in DI [00:45:51] Managing varying abilities in the classroom [00:48:28] Addressing prerequisite skills in older students [00:52:40] Spiral vs. strand curriculum [00:55:12] A typical DI math lesson structure [00:59:34] List of DI math programs [01:01:17] Common misconceptions about DI [01:05:03] Challenges and resistance to DI [01:09:02] Role of leaders and faculty in DI implementation [01:13:51] Final thoughts  RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 34 Transforming education through behaviour science with Kimberly Berens https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-9tfz7-16f2e02 Ep 31 Exploring evidence for equitable education with Nidhi Sachdeva and Jim Hewitt https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-fjdnt-1685615 Ep 20 Reading and math: Parallels and pitfalls with Matthew Burns https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-8aj3f-1508af6 Ep 10 Maximizing learning through explicit instruction with Zach Groshell https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-px8h6-1443528 EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-39-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-39-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions –Tall Harvey, Little Poder, Momentary Ease, Betty Dear Podington Bear – Camp, Kitten Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social  

Join math professor, Anna Stokke, in conversation with Blake Harvard, a secondary teacher in Alabama.  They discuss insights from his new book, Do I Have Your Attention?, including how he incorporates cognitive psychology into his teaching. Their conversation explores topics like cognitive architecture, memory constraints, attention contagion and common learning pitfalls. Blake provides practical strategies for implementing retrieval practice and spaced practice, highlighting their benefits in reducing test anxiety and enhancing long term learning outcomes. The episode wraps up with a thought-provoking discussion on creativity, where Blake challenges the notion that traditional schooling stifles creativity—arguing instead that a strong knowledge foundation fosters it. Whether you’re an educator or simply curious about the science of learning, this episode offers valuable insights for teaching and learning in any subject. NOTE: The resource page contains resources and research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-38-resources TIMESTAMPS 00:00 Introduction 02:44 Blake's Teaching Journey 03:13 Discovering cognitive psychology 05:18 Understanding memory constraints 13:55 Attention contagion 21:54 Overcoming overconfidence in learning 25:32 The role of forgetting in learning 27:53 Maximizing learning with effective strategies 28:36 The power of retrieval and spaced practice 29:45 Retrieval practice in math 33:10 Diminishing cues retrieval practice 36:21 The Brain Book Buddy strategy 41:13 The importance of honest self-assessment 42:56 Reducing test anxiety with retrieval practice 45:48 The benefits of spaced practice 47:06 Last lesson, last week, last month strategy 49:38 Debunking myths about creativity in education 52:48 Final thoughts and advice for teachers RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep. 26 Cognitive load theory in math class with David Morkunas https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-znh5k-15f7937 Ep. 13 Powerful teaching with Patrice Bain https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-d77g4-14602e3 Ep 4 Cognitive load theory with Greg Ashman https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-thbad-13cea56 Ep. 2 Evidence-based teaching strategies with Paul Kirschner https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-zgw6i-13b33df EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-38-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-38-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – No Squirrel Connection, Thannoid, Momentary Ease, Betty Dear Podington Bear – Camp Scott Holmes – Happy Logo Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social

Join Anna Stokke as she chats with Dr. Jo Castelino, a secondary school teacher, to discuss her new book on homework.  They discuss the vital role of homework in education, exploring why it's important, how much should be assigned and what types of homework are most effective. Jo shares insights from research and her experiences, addressing common criticisms of homework, strategies for creating a school culture that supports homework, methods for leveraging feedback, and handling issues like cheating. They also discuss the cyclical relationship between homework and self-regulatory behaviours that contribute to higher academic achievement.  Jo gives valuable practical advice on how to design effective homework and how to get both students and parents on board.  This episode will be of interest to educators, parents and school administrators. NOTE: The resource page contains resources and research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-37-resources 00:00 Introduction 02:18 Background 03:30 Writing about homework 06:30 Research on homework 12:57 How much homework: Cooper 10-minute rule 15:26 Role of homework in how students learn 22:37 Designing Effective Homework 25:52 Discussing flipped classrooms 28:55 How often to give homework 36:10 Scaffolding homework for struggling students 36:56 Providing feedback 40:06 Homework challenge levels 43:23 Homework and disadvantaged students 47:17 Creating a school culture for homework 48:06 Rewards and consequences 54:39 Getting parents on board 57:55 Addressing cheating 01:03:25 Convincing administrators about homework 01:05:05 Conclusion RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep. 31 Exploring evidence for equitable education with Nidhi Sachdeva and Jim Hewitt https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-fjdnt-1685615 Ep. 14 Stress and learning with Dan Rosen https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-94vv4-147a254 Ep. 13 Powerful teaching with Patrice Bain https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-d77g4-14602e3 EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-37-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-37-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Little Poder, Momentary Ease, Betty Dear Podington Bear – Camp Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social

This solo episode, hosted by Anna Stokke, provides educators, parents, and students with practical, research-backed methods to develop math fact automaticity. These techniques have been shown to work with a wide range of students across age, skills and settings.  Key techniques discussed include flashcards, cover-copy-compare, taped problems, incremental rehearsal and explicit timing, with detailed instructions for how best to implement each technique.   Call to action: If you know someone who might benefit from this episode, please share it with them! NOTE: The resource page contains resources to help listeners implement the techniques discussed as well as supporting research: http://annastokke.com/ep-36-resources TIMESTAMPS 00:00 Introduction 01:19 The Importance of math fact automaticity 03:00 Understanding automaticity 06:17 Acquisition stage 06:50 Fluency stage 08:35 What basic facts? 09:06 When should students have math facts mastered? 09:49 Pairing the stimulus with the response 11:13 Using flashcards effectively 13:25 Incremental Rehearsal 15:13 Cover, Copy, Compare Method 17:49 Taped Problems: Beat the Computer 18:57 Should you use games? 20:52 Explicit timing for fluency building 21:14 Why timed practice is essential 22:31 When to introduce timed practice 24:28 Consistency and Daily Practice 25:01 Conclusion and Call to Action RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 30. Math fluency matters with Brian Poncy https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-pj6z6-166741e Ep 29. Math fact crisis with Brian Poncy https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-u9y84-165d773 Ep 20. Reading and math: parallels and pitfalls with Matthew Burns https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-8aj3f-1508af6 Ep 17. Do timed tests cause math anxiety? with Robin Codding https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-9qahp-14aed8a Ep 3. The Science of Math with Amanda VanDerHeyden https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-bksbz-13c732d EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-36-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-36-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Momentary Ease, Betty Dear Podington Bear – Camp Scott Holmes – Happy Logo 3 Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c

Join Anna Stokke in conversation with two university math instructors, Dr. Darja Barr from the University of Manitoba and Dan Wolczuk from the University of Waterloo. What does it take to succeed in university math? Which topics are most critical for success in university calculus? They cover these questions and more in this episode, which is a must-listen for educators, parents and aspiring university students.  They talk about the importance of algebraic fluency and other key concepts essential for success in calculus. They examine the gap between high school preparation and university expectations, touching on grade inflation, the role of diagnostic tests and the value of high school exams with a discussion on the testing effect along the way. They highlight the importance of effective study habits, perseverance, and the ability to self-assess and seek help when needed. NOTE: The resource page contains useful information regarding the transition from high school to university math: http://annastokke.com/ep-35-resources TIMESTAMPS [00:00:00] Introduction  [00:03:14] Description of university calculus class [00:04:55] Why preparation for calculus is important [00:07:47] Degrees requiring calculus [00:08:36] High school topics needed for success in calculus [00:11:11] Importance of algebraic fluency [00:14:29] Trigonometry and committing facts to memory [00:22:30] Diagnostic tests [00:26:14] Relationship between pre-calculus and university calculus grades [00:32:36] Physical invigilation vs remote diagnostic tests     [00:34:32] Challenges of high school to university transition [00:38:07] Grade inflation and the role of standardized testing [00:43:28] Importance of high school exams [00:45:29] The testing effect [00:50:33] Initiatives to support university students [00:57:06] Characteristics of a successful university math student [00:59:43] Advice for first-year university students [01:02:31] Closing remarks RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 15. Modern relevance in the math curriculum with Brian Conrad https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-gek66-148967a Ep 11. California’s math controversy with Jelani Nelson https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-d3bai-144ec76 Ep 7.  How to excel in math and other tough subjects with Barbara Oakley https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-bqs8p-14068f2 Ep 16. Applying cognitive science to education with Daniel Willingham https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-szugf-149dff1 Ep 2. Evidence-based teaching strategies with Paul Kirschner https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-zgw6i-13b33df EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-35-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-35-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Little Poder, Thannoid Podington Bear – Camp, Kitten Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c

Join Anna Stokke in conversation with Dr. Kimberly Berens in Episode 34 of Chalk & Talk. Kimberly is a behaviour scientist, an author, and the founder of FIT Learning.  They discuss the fundamentals of behaviour science, the importance of measurable outcomes, the role of reinforcement, and the application of behaviour science to effective instruction, particularly in math.  They also cover concepts like fluency, retention, and endurance in learning.  They discuss the effectiveness of Direct Instruction, precision teaching and curriculum-based measurement in bringing about significant improvements in student performance. Kimberly is a passionate advocate for systematic educational change based on scientific approaches.  This episode will be of interest to educators, parents, policy makers, and anyone with an interest in improving educational outcomes. NOTE: The resource page contains a list of research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-34-resources TIMESTAMPS: [00:00:00] Introduction   [00:02:25] Understanding behaviour science  [00:05:23] Behaviour science vs. cognitive science  [00:08:28] Defining fluency [00:12:40] Applying behaviour science to math instruction  [00:18:01] Do different students learn differently?  [00:22:43] How to measure learning  [00:28:47] Math anxiety, math trauma and the problem with labels  [00:34:56] Combining DI, precision teaching and curriculum-based measurement [00:38:40] The problem with hand raising [00:42:00] Flexible ability grouping  [00:47:20] Breaking ineffective traditions  [00:51:49] Measuring conceptual understanding [00:57:41] Project Follow Through  [01:00:20] The Great Falls Precision Teaching Project  [01:03:28] Fit Learning's practices and outcomes  [01:06:37] Final thoughts and call to action  RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 32.  Identifying and educating advanced students with Jonathan Plucker https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-y6cxs-16ad6f1 Ep 30.  Math fluency matters with Brian Poncy https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-pj6z6-166741e Ep 17. Do timed tests cause math anxiety? with Robin Codding https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-9qahp-14aed8a EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-34-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-34-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Little Poder, Tall Harvey Podington Bear – Camp, Kitten Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c      

Host Anna Stokke speaks with Scott Hill, Superintendent of Evergreen School Division. They discuss Evergreen's proactive approach to improving education, particularly focusing on mathematics and literacy.  Scott shares how his division tackled low math scores by interviewing students, addressing behaviour issues, employing structured instructional methods, and providing consistent common assessments. They also touch on broader pedagogical narratives, the role of schools in society, and the importance of setting higher expectations for students. Additionally, Scott highlights the critical strides made in early literacy instruction, with Evergreen School Division being recognized with a national award from Dyslexia Canada.  A key takeaway from this episode is that strong leadership, data-informed decision making, and a commitment to addressing weaknesses can significantly impact student learning.  TIMESTAMPS [00:00:00] Introduction [00:03:39] Evergreen School Division's math challenges and student feedback [00:08:43] Grade inflation and reporting to parents [00:11:24] Divisional changes to improve math scores [00:14:42] Higher expectations for students [00:20:05] The role of schools in society [00:26:02] Is inquiry-based pedagogy accomplishing the stated goals? [00:30:45] Instructional caricatures and foundational skills [00:37:09] Setting behavioural standards [00:40:02] Cell phones in schools [00:46:01] Common assessments and provincial exams [00:56:30] Award-winning literacy initiatives [01:01:08] Final thoughts RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 1 Math and the myth of ability with John Mighton https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-22c7a-139dc72 Ep 18 Education myth-busting with Daisy Christodoulou https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-z2q9q-14ce080 Ep 20 Reading and math: parallels and pitfalls with Matthew Burns https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-8aj3f-1508af6 Ep 27 Using evidence in education with Pamela Snow https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-jc9mq-161ecac Ep 30 Math fluency matters with Brian Poncy https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-pj6z6-166741e EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-33-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-33-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Cornicob Podington Bear – Camp Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c

Math professor Anna Stokke speaks with Dr. Jonathan Plucker, a professor and director of the Education Policy Program at Johns Hopkins University, about advanced education, acceleration and academic streaming. Jonathan discusses the flaws in traditional methods of identifying advanced students and advocates for universal screening to ensure equitable access to advanced programs. They cover various interventions, including acceleration, and discuss the drawbacks of de-streaming or anti-acceleration policies. They also discuss equity concerns. They talk about flexible ability grouping, the need to challenge stereotypes about advanced students, and more.  Jonathan emphasizes that education should meet the needs of every student, including students who excel academically, and he provides concrete advice for accomplishing that. A key takeaway from this episode is that offering advanced programs benefits all students and, ideally, every school should include advanced programming.  This episode is a must-listen for educators of any subject, parents and policymakers. NOTE: The resource page contains a list of research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-32-resources TIMESTAMPS [00:00:00] Introduction  [00:03:42] Terminology: gifted or advanced?  [00:07:58] Are labels a problem? [00:10:54] Identifying advanced students [00:21:13] Equity in advanced programs [00:25:28] Meeting the needs of advanced students [00:27:46] Effective interventions for advanced students [00:31:29] Enrichment vs. acceleration [00:34:59] Supporting learners beyond minimum competency [00:38:42] The case of San Francisco Unified School District [00:43:14] Problems with de-streaming and anti-acceleration programs [00:48:16] Flexible ability grouping: A solution? [00:53:18] Who benefits from flexible ability grouping? [00:54:53] The impact of de-streaming on teachers and students [00:58:42] What needs to change to support advanced students   RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 11. California’s math controversy with Jelani Nelson, Part I https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-d3bai-144ec76 Ep 12. California’s math controversy with Jelani Nelson, Part II https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-93gm5-144fc4c Ep 15. Modern relevance in the math curriculum with Brian Conrad https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-gek66-148967a Ep 19. The Calculus Project with Adrian Mims https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-fkbjk-14eb0a7 Ep 25. Understanding math reform ideology with Tom Loveless https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-7ih4c-15dbf9a EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-32-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-32-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – No Squirrel Connection, Cornicob, Balti Podington Bear – Camp Website: www.annastokke.com

Join math professor Anna Stokke in conversation with Dr. Nidhi Sachdeva and Dr. Jim Hewitt, educators and researchers at the Ontario Institute for Studies in Education (OISE) at the University of Toronto. They discuss their co-designed course on the science of learning and its impact on educational practice. The episode expands on their recent presentation on equitable instruction at ResearchEd Canada, covering instructional techniques effective in closing the achievement gap. Key topics include explicit instruction, the benefits of retrieval practice, formative assessments, and the importance of addressing educational myths. They also explore the implications of Project Follow Through and evaluate other educational approaches like collaborative learning, culturally responsive teaching, and social-emotional learning. The conversation emphasizes the need for evidence-based strategies to promote equity in education. This episode is essential listening for educators, parents, and anyone committed to narrowing education achievement gaps. NOTE: The resource page contains a list of research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-31-resources TIMESTAMPS [00:00:00] Introduction [00:03:33] Key topics in the Science of Learning course [00:09:38] Integrating microlessons into instruction [00:12:50] Debunking educational myths [00:17:17] Equitable instruction [00:21:21] Inclusive instruction [00:22:18] Reducing inequities 1:  Explicit instruction  [00:30:27] Project Follow Through [00:35:10] Reducing inequities 2: Retrieval practice [00:41:34] Reducing inequities 3: Formative assessment & feedback [00:46:55] Research on small-group learning [00:51:09] Culturally responsive teaching [00:54:14] Social-emotional learning [00:55:52] Strengths and limitations of differentiated instruction [00:58:41] Advocating for science of learning courses [01:00:12] Closing thoughts on equitable instruction RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES Ep 2. Evidence-based teaching strategies with Paul Kirschner https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-zgw6i-13b33df Ep 10. Maximizing learning through explicit instruction with Zach Groshell https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-px8h6-1443528 Ep 22.  Mindsets and misconceptions with Carl Hendrick https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-78zv9-15493b1 Ep 24. Raising student achievement with Dylan Wiliam https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-kduiw-15bba36 Ep 27. Using evidence in education with Pamela Snow https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-jc9mq-161ecac EPISODE TRANSCRIPT https://www.annastokke.com/ep-31-transcript EPISODE RESOURCES https://www.annastokke.com/ep-31-resources MUSIC Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it Blue Dot Sessions – Little Poder, Tall Harvey Podington Bear – Camp, Kitten Website: www.annastokke.com X: @rastokke LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c