233: Tyshawn Sorey

Kurt Elling returns for a wide-ranging conversation about vocation, gratitude, and what it means to be in service of the music. Elling first appeared on The Third Story nearly ten years ago, already one of the most celebrated singers of his generation and still deeply focused on what he calls "the work I haven't done yet." Since then, he has moved from New York back to his native Chicago, launched major projects like SuperBlue with Charlie Hunter and members of Butcher Brown, recorded intimate small-group albums in the Wildflowers series of recordings, started his Big Shoulders record label, and continued his "poetic practice" of adding new lyrics to instrumental works by artists such as Wayne Shorter and Jaco Pastorius. The immediate occasion for this reunion, however, is something entirely new: Elling is currently appearing on Broadway in Hadestown, playing the role of Hermes. Recorded in an apartment on the Upper West Side during his Broadway run, the conversation moves fluidly between jazz clubs and civic life. Elling speaks candidly about depression, aging, discipline, politics, and the moral responsibility of artists in unsettled times. Throughout, he returns to a central idea: the artist's job is not ego or display, but manifestation — to channel the song so something healing can happen in the room. www.third-story.com www.leosidran.substack.com www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story  

The Café Central, a jazz club located just off Madrid's Puerta del Sol — Spain's "Kilometer Zero" — has been going out of business for more than forty years. And now, it finally might. Opened in the early 1980s during Spain's cultural reopening after Franco's dictatorship, Café Central became a rare kind of space: part jazz club, part café, part public living room. Bands were booked for full weeks — seven nights at a time — a model that favored musical development over turnover, and community over efficiency. It was never a good business. But it was a great room. For nearly thirty years, my father, jazz musician Ben Sidran, and I returned every November to play there. Over time, the ritual turned into a tradition, and the tradition turned into a legacy — not just for us, but for audiences who marked their calendars around those weeks. Café Central also reflected the city around it. For years, Madrid felt quietly provincial — less touristy, more inward-facing than other European capitals. But that changed. Tourism surged. Rents rose. The economics shifted. In 2018, new owners took over the club. The booking model changed. Week-long residencies largely disappeared, replaced by shorter runs and double seatings. The future arrived, whether anyone wanted it or not. And yet, something endured. Café Central wasn't just a place where music happened. It was where relationships formed — between musicians and audiences, between locals and visitors, between generations. It taught us that culture survives not because it's profitable, but because people show up, night after night, year after year. As Café Central prepares to close — or possibly move — it raises a familiar question: when a place disappears, what actually goes with it? The answer, I think, is never just the room. It's the memory of how it felt to be there — and the responsibility to carry that feeling forward. Featuring conversations with my father, Ben Sidran and my mother, Judy Sidran, this episode explores music, memory, and the fragile ecosystems that keep culture alive. www.third-story.com www.leosidran.substack.com www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story

Guitarist, bassist, composer Phil Upchurch died on November 23, and with his passing the music world lost one of its true "musician's musicians." Upchurch played on more than a thousand recordings  — from Michael Jackson, Donny Hathaway, Chaka Khan, Curtis Mayfield, and George Benson to Jimmy Reed, the Staples Singers, and countless jazz, blues, and soul sessions. He belonged to the generation that didn't just shape popular music; they invented it. For my dad, Ben Sidran, Phil was also a friend for over 50 years. They recorded and toured together, shared studios, homes, families, and a deep creative kinship. Some of my earliest gigs as a drummer were with Phil, and those moments helped define my own musical path. When we heard that Phil had passed, I called my dad so we could remember him together — the sessions, the stories, the laughter, the generosity, and the unmistakable sound that made him both an insider's secret and a foundational figure in American music. This episode is a tribute — a conversation about a life lived fully in music, about reputation and legacy, and about the musicians who shaped the landscape from behind the scenes. Visit Third-Story.com for the full archive, and sign up for writing and updates at leosidran.substack.com. The Third Story is made in partnership with WBGO Studios. https://www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story

Madison Cunningham's new album Ace marks a striking and vulnerable chapter in the young songwriter's evolution. Not yet 30, Cunningham has already lived through a period of profound personal transformation. She married young, divorced young, and found herself rebuilding her identity in the wake of major change. Instead of retreating, she turned the experience into a meditation on the difference between happiness and contentment. Raised in a large religious family in Orange County, Cunningham began performing in her father's church band at twelve and was experimenting with alternate tunings before she fully understood them. Her breakthrough albums Who Are You Now (Grammy-nominated) and Revealer (Grammy winner for Best Folk Album) established her as one of the most distinctive voices of her generation. Here she reflects on her early musical formation, artistic growth, and the deeply personal experiences that shaped Ace—a record about honesty, resilience, and learning to stay present. www.third-story.com www.leosidran.substack.com www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story This episode is sponsored by Musication, offering in-home music lessons in Brooklyn and Manhattan for kids ages three and up. Visit https://musication.nyc and mention the podcast to receive two free trial lessons.

Singer and composer Theo Bleckmann has spent his career between categories - jazz and avant-garde, improvisation and composition, structure and discovery. Born in Germany, he began as a boy soprano and figure skater before discovering jazz and moving to New York to study with Sheila Jordan. Since then, he's built a singular life in music, collaborating with artists like Meredith Monk, Laurie Anderson, and Ben Monder. Here he talks about community, teaching, queerness, and the meaning of "a life in music" rather than "a career in jazz." He also talks about his new album Love & Anger, produced by Ulysses Owens Jr., which bridges Kate Bush and the Beatles, Frank Ocean and original compositions - all infused with curiosity, empathy, and mystery. This episode is supported by Musication, providing in-home music lessons in Brooklyn and Manhattan to children ages 3yrs old and up. Email [email protected] and mention "The Third Story" to receive two free trial lessons.  www.third-story.com https://leosidran.substack.com/ https://www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story

British singer-songwriter dodie has spent half her life in public. Long before algorithms and engagement metrics ruled the day, she began posting homemade songs and videos on YouTube as a teenager from Essex. Her soft voice, self-effacing humor, and unfiltered honesty drew millions of viewers who watched her grow up online—sharing heartbreaks, mental-health struggles, and moments of joy in real time. Fifteen years later, that same authenticity anchors her second album, Not For Lack of Trying (Decca / Verve), a project that finds her looking inward with more clarity and balance than ever. Produced with Joe Rubel, the record feels both intimate and expansive, blending hushed guitars, clarinets, and a subtle electronic pulse beneath lyrics about healing, boundaries, and learning to feel okay. Here she talks about what it means to grow up online, how she learned to protect her private life, and the long road to emotional equilibrium. She opens up about the strange feedback loop of being praised for her pain, the decision to step back from constant posting, and the discovery that medication, therapy, and time have finally helped her feel "a bit better." She discusses the making of Not For Lack of Trying, her collaboration with friends like Greta Isaac and producer Joe Rubel, and the sonic choices that define her sound - the low rumble of drop-tuned guitars and the warmth of analog synths supporting a voice that seems to hover just above the mix. "When I'm writing," she says, "I'm not aiming for how it sounds. I'm aiming for how it feels—I just want to get goosebumps." Along the way, dodie reflects on the evolution from being a "special girl" with a ukulele and a webcam to becoming a full-fledged artist with more than a billion streams, seven million followers, and a place on Forbes' 30 Under 30 list. Through it all, she's still trying, still curious, still kind, still chasing that feeling. www.third-story.com www.substack.leosidran.com www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story

The Köln Concert by Keith Jarrett is one of the most iconic recordings in jazz history — a completely improvised solo piano performance, recorded in 1975, that became both the best-selling solo album and the best-selling piano album of all time. And yet, the concert almost didn't happen. The new film Köln 75, directed by Brooklyn-based filmmaker Ido Fluk, tells the remarkable true story behind that night through the eyes of Vera Brandes, the 18-year-old German concert promoter whose persistence and intuition made it possible. Against all odds - and with only a broken, nearly unplayable piano to work with - Brandes helped turn what could have been a disaster into a historic moment that continues to resonate fifty years later. Here Vera Brandes shares her memories of that night and her reflections on the making of Köln 75, which captures not only a pivotal event in jazz but also a coming-of-age story set in a post-war Germany rebuilding its identity. The conversation explores how art, community, and chance intersect, how the myths, friendships, and behind-the-scenes stories give life to the music itself. Narrative films about jazz are notoriously difficult to make, but Köln 75 manages to do the almost unthinkable: it's funny, urgent, and even sexy — a movie about a concert promoter trying to put on a show that somehow feels thrilling and alive. www.third-story.com  leosidran.substack.com  wbgo.org/studios  

Pianist, songwriter, and performer Jacob Jeffries the morning after he played Madison Square Garden with Vulfpeck, reflecting on the surreal thrill of performing in the legendary arena with his close friends, while also grounding the experience in the everyday reality of being a working musician. The conversation traces his journey from South Florida (where his childhood was shaped by Beatles records, summer theater programs like Lovewell, and the absence of a bar mitzvah he later regretted) to his early career with the Jacob Jeffries Band and formative studio experiences with Grammy-winning producer Sebastian Krys and guitarist-producer Dan Warner. He describes being taken under their wing, signed to Warner Chappell at 18, and even meeting Rick Rubin as a teenager—moments that felt like he was "six inches from Madison Square Garden," only to discover it would take another 20 years of steady work to get there. Along the way, Jeffries talks about grief (losing both parents by his mid-20s), his bond with fellow Vulfpeck member Theo Katzman, the power of collaborative creativity, and the balance between sincerity and playfulness in his own music. He reflects on the intimacy of his new record You Got the Right Idea, the surreal humor of songs like This Is Not the Song I Wrote, and how he embodies a kind of singer, storyteller, and surrealist performer all at once. Jacob is on tour this month opening for the band Lawrence. www.third-story.com www.leosidran.substack.com www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story  

Born and raised in Madrid, Leonor Watling grew up between cultures, the daughter of a Spanish academic father and a British mother who had been raised in Africa. From an early age she was aware of both the fragility and the richness of life: her father was sick for much of her childhood and passed away when she a teenager, just as she began working steadily as an actress. That combination of otherness and awareness shaped her perspective, both on stage and in song. Best known internationally for her starring role in Pedro Almodóvar's Talk to Her, she is one of the most recognizable faces in Spanish cinema, constantly at work in new films and series. Watling has also built a parallel career as a musician. For nearly two decades she fronted the band Marlango, releasing seven albums and touring the world, first singing in English and later in Spanish. In this conversation, recorded in Madrid, Leonor reflects on her journey from early television fame to international cinema, from intimate songwriting to major-label tours, and from the demands of motherhood to the challenges of sustaining a creative life.  We also unpack our own collaboration, Leo & Leo, a new project that reimagines songs from the Leo Sidran song catalog alongside new originals, featuring guests Jorge Drexler, Kevin Johansen, Sol Sidran, Javi Peña, and the Paris based Groovy French Band. At its heart, this is both a portrait of an artist who has spent decades walking the line between acting and music, fame and privacy, English and Spanish—and a rare, intimate conversation between two close collaborators who are still discovering new ways to ask questions of each other. www.third-story.com www.leosidran.substack.com

Stella Cole went from nearly giving up singing in college to becoming one of the breakout stars of the pandemic era, thanks to her viral performances of American Songbook standards on TikTok. Now signed to Decca and releasing her second full length album It's Magic, she talks about following her instincts, finding her voice, and turning childhood obsessions into a career. www.third-story.com www.leosidran.substack.com www.wbgo.org/podcast/the-third-story