The Hero's podcast

We had the pleasure of a deep conversation on boards and governance with Mauro da Cunha, one of the most experienced independent directors in Brazil. After a career as an equity investor, he spent seven years running AMEC (the Brazilian association of institutional investors) before building a deep and high profile portfolio of independent-director positions at major listed Brazilian companies: Petrobras, Vale, Eletrobras, Totvs, Klabin, BR Malls, Embraer and Hypera, among others past and present.At Petrobras he was the first independent director, voted alone against the financial statements, and helped trigger disclosure of ~R$88bn in asset overstatement during the Lava Jato crisis.In this conversation, Mauro covers how independent directors actually build influence, why opacity is the foundational problem in governance, why openly registered dissent is "governance at its best," Board culture, the S-curve of director tenure, why CEO and chairman roles must be split, and why AI conversations in boardrooms are still at "1 out of 10."A masterclass in board craft from someone who has dedicated well over a decade to the practice. (00:00) Introduction (03:52) "What you'll get from me is commitment" (13:03) Boards are too opaque and why open dissent is governance at its best (19:21) Board culture, reading the room, and the best board he ever served on (22:59) Director tenure as an S-curve (31:51) AI in the boardroom: the "science fair" and a maturity of 1 out of 10 (39:37) Why the CEO and chairman roles must be split (42:41) AI's first real board issue: talent, hiring and career paths for future leaders (45:32) Right-sizing businesses for AI: the question of incentives(46:46) Why it goes wrong when boards try to make executive decisions (47:57) Controlled vs widely-held boards and why control raises risk-aversion (48:55) The Petrobras Lava Jato story: R$88bn of overstated assets (52:16) Never compromise on your red lines

Fabián Kon spent a decade transforming Banco Galicia from a traditional, functionally structured institution into one of the most digitally advanced banks in Latin America. In this episode, he traces an unconventional path: from military school, through consulting at Accenture, running a port operation, leading an insurance business, and eventually overhauling the retail bank that he would go on to lead as CEO.At the heart of the conversation is the question of how large, established organisations actually change, and what it takes to make that change stick. Fabian speaks candidly about the decision to restructure the bank around autonomous tribes, the internal cultural shift required to make that work, and the critical role played by a controlling shareholder group willing to back risk-taking over the long term. He also discusses the $500 million acquisition of HSBC Argentina, completed under significant macroeconomic pressure, and what drove the logic of consolidation.Looking ahead, the conversation turns to the implications of Argentina's ongoing economic transformation for the banking sector, the competitive pressure from fintechs and players like Mercado Pago, and what agentic AI may mean for the organisational structures that banks like Galicia have only recently put in place. 

Maria Helena Santana has enjoyed a long and storied career in the Brazilian capital markets. She was deeply involved in the development of the higher-governance Novo Mercado in the early 2000s, seeking a market solution to the lack of confidence in Brazilian equities at the time. She subsequently led the CVM during the global financial crisis - despite which, the CVM managed to pass a number of key shareholder rights and transparency reforms, some of which Maria Helena now believes went too far. For the last decade, Maria Helena has served on the boards of some of Brazil's most high profile companies, including Itaú Unibanco, CINT, Oi, Totvs, GPA and XP. As a practitioner of governance she shares what she looks for in a board, how board culture has evolved in Brazil, and compares her experience of controlled and dispersed ownership structures and their different challenges. We take the opportunity to learn from her vast experience, share war stories - and return to the recurring themes of the importance of values, culture and long term owner orientation.

Gianfranco has been CEO of Credicorp since 2022, after a successful career leading the retail bank within the group. He shares how his unconventional experiences as a young man in the fishing industry influenced his curiosity and empathy for those around him, and how this informs his leadership style today.Of particular interest in this episode is the detailed discussion around Yape, Credicorp's internally developed digital bank. Gianfranco shares how this highly successful but initially scrappy initiative was made possible within such a large institution, and how the lessons learned are transforming the wider group. Lots of anecdotes here that will be of interest to anyone undergoing similar challenges, or trying to read the tea leaves from the outside.Thank you Gianfranco!

With heartfelt thanks to our guests so far - looking back on some of the lessons, and forward to the upcoming conversations with a particular focus on financial services, starting with Gianfranco Ferrari, CEO of Credicorp, Maria Helena Santana, on the board of Itau (amongst many other things), and Juan Carlos Mora, CEO of Bancolombia.

Eugenio de Zagottis is well known to the market by virtue of his long tenure as an executive at Raia Drogasil, the largest drugstore chain in Brazil. But by virtue of his unique position in the fourth generation of one of the founding families, he is able to put the evolution of the governance of the company into full context for us. We learn how a succession crisis in the 1970s shaped the way the family still approaches succession today, and explore how governance alone is not sufficient and needs to be married with the right culture to overcome the inevitable bumps in the road. Eugenio has recently transitioned to the board of the company and speaks to the difference between executive and non-executive director efficacy. He shares some of his thesis regarding Enjoei, where he is also on the board. We also return to the theme of share price influencing decisions - in this case, given the success of Raia Drogasil, how to avoid hubris after a period of strong performance. Eugenio doesn't hold back - this is a frank and educational conversation. With thanks to Daniel Gargioulo for reconnecting us.

Peter Furukawa is the CEO of Lojas Quero Quero, a Brazilian retail chain specializing in home improvement and construction materials in small cities in rural areas. Peter previously held leadership roles in Submarino, Pernambucanas and IMC. In this wide ranging conversation, Peter shares his insights from a long career into what it takes to lead, and have others want to follow. We also discuss the experience of Quero Quero as a listed company, with shares down significantly since the IPO in 2020. Any executives or directors of listed companies in Brazil are probably grappling with similar issues right now - how to maintain morale, focus on the fundamentals and avoid pessimism influencing capital allocation decisions.

Irlau Machado was the CEO of Intermedica from its acquisition by Bain Capital, through eventual IPO until the merger with Hapvida in 2022. We discuss his personal transformation after receiving a cancer diagnosis in his 30s, the career changes that resulted and insights from his subsequent experience running one of the largest healthcare businesses in Brazil. He explains the logic behind the transformation in Brazilian healthcare over the last decade and teaches us about leadership in a service industry where balancing costs and quality can be easily misconstrued.

Dennis is the CEO of Totvs, the leading ERP software provider in Brazil. As you will hear, this is someone with incredible drive and ambition who has been involved in over 50 M&A transactions in his career. He shares his personal journey, from entrepreneur to executive, and his motivation to keep pushing forward. Despite his profile, this is not a well known aspect of his story. We also have the privilege of learning from his vast M&A experience. I would go as far as to say that you can't fully understand the future of Totvs under his leadership without listening to this conversation.

Carlos is the CEO of Rotoplas, a family-controlled Mexican water products and services company with operations across the Americas. This is at its core a conversation about managing a Family business; the long arc of preparing the next generation to lead, and knowing when to step aside. Recognising when perpetuating a business for the long term requires a new skillset. In this episode Carlos talks in depth about his focus on embedding innovation processes across the company. We also cover his evolution as a leader, how through personal trauma he discovered the concept of servant leadership and how it allows him to find balance and continue to push forward personally and professionally. There is a lot to take away here. We hope you enjoy it as much as we did.