Episode 259: Designing Services vs Products with Justin Zalewski

Today we have another episode of Better Done Than Perfect. Listen in as we talk to Asia Orangio, founder and CEO of DemandMaven. You'll learn about the five growth levers you can pull, why you might be doing OKRs wrong, how to know which marketing programs to double down on, and more.Please head over to the episode page for the detailed recap and key takeaways.Show notesDemandMavenIn Demand Episode 26: What is the SaaS Black Hole?Managing SaaS Growth with Asia OrangioUserlist’s email examples postsSignWell – example of a good SEO programAmplitude, Google Analytics 4, SegMetrics – marketing attribution toolsMetabase – business intelligence toolDovetail, Cognism, Balsamiq, Drift – good marketing program examplesMagicLibrary – ideas for adsProfitWell’s hot sauce campaignFollow Asia on Bluesky and LinkedInThe Work by DemandMaven on SubstackThanks for listening! If you found the episode useful, please spread the word about this new show on Twitter mentioning @userlist, or leave us a review on iTunes.SponsorThis show is brought to you by Userlist — an email automation platform for SaaS companies. It matches the complexity of your customer data, including many-to-many relationships between users and companies. Book your demo call today at userlist.com.Interested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

How can tokens help your design and development teams become more efficient? Our guest today is Jan Six, staff product designer at GitHub and co-creator of Tokens Studio. You’ll learn how design components and tokens correlate on a technical level, why adoption is the biggest challenge in design systems, how you can get started with creating your own systems, and more.Podcast feed: subscribe to https://feeds.simplecast.com/4MvgQ73R in your favorite podcast app, and follow us on iTunes, Stitcher, or Google Podcasts.Show NotesTokens StudioNaming Tokens in Design Systems – an article by Nathan CurtisThe Many Faces of Themeable Design Systems – an article by Brad FrostPrimer – GitHub’s design systemVisit Jan’s websiteFollow Jan on BlueskyThis episode is brought to you by Wix Studio — the new web platform for agencies and enterprises. The magic of Wix Studio is its advanced design capabilities which makes website creation efficient and intuitive. Here are a few things you can do:Work in sync with your team on one canvasReuse templates, widgets and sections across sitesCreate a client kit for seamless handoversAnd leverage best-in-class SEO defaults across all your Wix sitesStep into Wix Studio to see more at wix.com/studioInterested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

Today we have another episode of Better Done Than Perfect. Listen in as we talk to Connor Joyce, senior user researcher at Microsoft and author of Bridging Intention to Impact. You'll learn why you need to ask if your product is really working, the five success metrics for products, some approaches to collecting behavioral data, and more.Please head over to the episode page for the detailed recap and key takeaways.Show notesBridging Intention to ImpactDesired Outcome LabsFollow Connor on LinkedInThanks for listening! If you found the episode useful, please spread the word about this new show on Twitter mentioning @userlist, or leave us a review on iTunes.SponsorThis show is brought to you by Userlist — an email automation platform for SaaS companies. Onboard, engage, and nurture your customers, as well as marketing leads. To follow the best practices, download our free printable email planning worksheets at userlist.com/worksheets.Interested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

Is research still a great investment? Our guest today is Alice Lee, Strategy Director at Work & Co. You’ll learn about their shippable user research process, how to ask the right questions about things you don’t know, how they helped GoFundMe with their charity action page, and more.Podcast feed: subscribe to https://feeds.simplecast.com/4MvgQ73R in your favorite podcast app, and follow us on iTunes, Stitcher, or Google Podcasts.Show NotesWork & CoJust Enough Research – a book by Erika HallUX Collective – a great blog on designCheck out Alice’s websiteFollow Alice on LinkedInThis episode is brought to you by Wix Studio — the new web platform for agencies and enterprises. The magic of Wix Studio is its advanced design capabilities which makes website creation efficient and intuitive. Here are a few things you can do:Work in sync with your team on one canvasReuse templates, widgets and sections across sitesCreate a client kit for seamless handoversAnd leverage best-in-class SEO defaults across all your Wix sitesStep into Wix Studio to see more at wix.com/studioInterested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

Today we have another episode of Better Done Than Perfect. Listen in as we talk to Michael Margolis, UX Research Partner at Google Ventures. You'll learn about their bullseye customer sprint, the difference between an ideal customer profile and the bullseye customer, how to apply prototypes, and more.Please head over to the episode page for the detailed recap and key takeaways.Show notesLearn More Faster – Michael’s bookFollow Michael on LinkedInThanks for listening! If you found the episode useful, please spread the word about this new show on Twitter mentioning @userlist, or leave us a review on iTunes.SponsorThis show is brought to you by Userlist — an email automation platform for SaaS companies. It matches the complexity of your customer data, including many-to-many relationships between users and companies. Book your demo call today at userlist.com.Interested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

Can creativity become your competitive advantage? Our guest today is John Roescher, founder of Raw Materials. You’ll learn about their framework for client projects, how they helped Volta scale and get acquired, why differentiating yourself is a difficult journey, and more.Podcast feed: subscribe to https://feeds.simplecast.com/4MvgQ73R in your favorite podcast app, and follow us on iTunes, Stitcher, or Google Podcasts.Show NotesRaw MaterialsStart With Why – a book by Simon SinekFollow John on LinkedInThis episode is brought to you by Wix Studio — the new web platform for agencies and enterprises. The magic of Wix Studio is its advanced design capabilities which makes website creation efficient and intuitive. Here are a few things you can do:Work in sync with your team on one canvasReuse templates, widgets and sections across sitesCreate a client kit for seamless handoversAnd leverage best-in-class SEO defaults across all your Wix sitesStep into Wix Studio to see more at wix.com/studioInterested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

Today we have another episode of Better Done Than Perfect. Listen in as we talk to David Pasztor, founder of UX studio and Ranking Raccoon. You'll learn why they built a platform for link collaboration, how to target transactional keywords, how they’re doing SEO for their own product, and more.Please head over to the episode page for the detailed recap and key takeaways.Show notesUX studio – David’s companyUXfolio, Copyfolio, Archifolio, Ranking Raccoon – their productsRanking Raccoon email exampleBuilding Two-sided Marketplaces with John DohertyCheck out Ranking RaccoonFollow David on LinkedInThanks for listening! If you found the episode useful, please spread the word about this new show on Twitter mentioning @userlist, or leave us a review on iTunes.SponsorThis show is brought to you by Userlist — an email automation platform for SaaS companies. Onboard, engage, and nurture your customers, as well as marketing leads. To follow the best practices, download our free printable email planning worksheets at userlist.com/worksheets.Interested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

How do you make your OKRs truly customer-centric? Our guest today is Jeff Gothelf, a coach, trainer, speaker, and author of five books. You’ll learn how to identify and drive results, why cross-functional collaboration is important in determining OKRs, how to get started with OKRs, and more.Podcast feed: subscribe to https://feeds.simplecast.com/4MvgQ73R in your favorite podcast app, and follow us on iTunes, Stitcher, or Google Podcasts.Show NotesWho Does What By How Much – Jeff’s latest bookEpisode 137: Lean, Agile & Design Thinking with Jeff GothelfEpisode 273: Publishing Options for Design Books with Louis RosenfeldMeasure What Matters – a book by John Doerr2022 Cleveland Clinic OKRsGet a copy of Jeff’s latest bookFollow Jeff of LinkedInVisit Jeff’s websiteThis episode is brought to you by Wix Studio — the new web platform for agencies and enterprises. The magic of Wix Studio is its advanced design capabilities which makes website creation efficient and intuitive. Here are a few things you can do:Work in sync with your team on one canvasReuse templates, widgets and sections across sitesCreate a client kit for seamless handoversAnd leverage best-in-class SEO defaults across all your Wix sitesStep into Wix Studio to see more at wix.com/studioInterested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

Today we have another episode of Better Done Than Perfect. Listen in as we talk to Stephen Steers, sales coach, consultant, and storyteller. You'll learn about why you should sell the outcome, how to choose the right story to tell, how to apply storytelling in your sales calls, and more.Please head over to the episode page for the detailed recap and key takeaways.Show notesSuperpower Storytelling – Stephen’s bookPR Strategies for Founders with Sneha SaigalGet Stephen’s resources for podcast listenersFollow Stephen on LinkedInThanks for listening! If you found the episode useful, please spread the word about this new show on Twitter mentioning @userlist, or leave us a review on iTunes.SponsorThis show is brought to you by Userlist — an email automation platform for SaaS companies. It matches the complexity of your customer data, including many-to-many relationships between users and companies. Book your demo call today at userlist.com.Interested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.

How do you make truly informed product decisions? Our guest today is Jason Giles, VP of Product Design at UserTesting. You’ll learn how to choose the right research method, how to develop a customer-informed intuition, the elements of a research program, and more. Podcast feed: subscribe to https://feeds.simplecast.com/4MvgQ73R in your favorite podcast app, and follow us on iTunes, Stitcher, or Google Podcasts.Show NotesUserTestingConnect with Jason on LinkedInThis episode is brought to you by Wix Studio — the new web platform for agencies and enterprises. The magic of Wix Studio is its advanced design capabilities which makes website creation efficient and intuitive. Here are a few things you can do:Work in sync with your team on one canvasReuse templates, widgets and sections across sitesCreate a client kit for seamless handoversAnd leverage best-in-class SEO defaults across all your Wix sitesStep into Wix Studio to see more at wix.com/studioInterested in sponsoring an episode? Learn more here.Leave a ReviewReviews are hugely important because they help new people discover this podcast. If you enjoyed listening to this episode, please leave a review on iTunes. Here’s how.