Voyager x Wet Feet Foil Race- Blue Planet Show Episode #28

Young Ripper Makani Andrews on Racing, Foiling & Olympic Dreams | The Blue Planet Show   Join Robert Stehlik in another exciting episode of the Blue Planet Show featuring 17-year-old Makani Andrews, a rising star in the world of competitive foiling and windsurfing on Oahu, Hawaii. Despite only having three years of experience in both sports, Makani has already made significant strides, traveling and competing in multiple events, including the Olympic trials in Miami, the Youth Worlds in Italy, and the World Champs in Spain. His notable achievements include clinching first place in C19 and 5th or 6th overall at the Nationals in San Francisco. Makani discusses his ambitions for the 2028 Long Beach Olympics and the rigorous qualifications required. He elaborates on the similarities and differences between windsurf foiling and wing foiling, emphasizing the advanced equipment needed for competitive racing. Makani also shares insights into his training routines at Kaneohe Bay and highlights the benefits of various gear setups, including the difference between single and double canopy wings. The discussion extends to detailed technical aspects of foils, including the importance of shimming for performance optimization. Makani's partnership with PPC and Sobfoils is also explored, showcasing the latest innovations in wing and foil design. The episode concludes with a look at the high-quality construction and customizable features of Sobfoils' products, making them suitable for both everyday use and high-stakes competitive racing. Follow Makani Andrews on Instagram (@makani.andrews) to stay updated on his latest sessions and achievements. 00:00 Introduction and Guest Welcome 00:33 Makani's Journey in Foiling and Windsurfing 01:46 Olympic Campaign and Competitions 03:31 Comparing Windsurf Foiling and Wing Foiling 07:18 Growing Up in Kaneohe and Early Sailing Days 11:39 Wing Foil Racing Equipment and Innovations 17:01 Sponsorships and Future Prospects 18:37 Exciting New Gear from Sobfoil 18:57 Exclusive Dealer in Hawaii 19:06 Exploring the Medusa Pro 19:25 Introducing the Leviathan 1350 19:58 Pump Foiling Insights 21:08 Convenient Mast System 22:43 Customizing Your Foil Setup 30:02 Razor Pro for Surf Foiling 32:33 Red Devil vs. Other Foils 34:48 Final Thoughts and Social Media  

The interview documents an in-depth conversation between Rob Stehlik and Paul Martin, the CEO and Co-founder of Foil Drive, at the AWSI show in Hood River 2024. The discussion starts with observations of Foil Drive at the hatchery, covering downwinders and the challenges of riding into the wind. Paul explains techniques for easier foiling by keeping the board flat and utilizing the wind and waves effectively. He elaborates on achieving the primary goal of Foil Drive: to assist riders in getting on foil quickly, then allowing them to enjoy pure foiling without motor assistance. Paul then discusses equipment innovations in the Gen 2 system, including a high gain antenna for better connectivity even when submerged. He highlights collaborations with brands to integrate the motor system into boards and masts more aerodynamically. He explains the design of carbon and aluminum masts, emphasizing their benefits in terms of stiffness and drag reduction. He also notes that while integrated systems create dedicated foil setups, they offer unparalleled hydrodynamic performance. The conversation covers Foil Drive's user-friendly features like easy battery replacement, tool-less assembly, and flexibility in mounting on various boards. Paul details improvements in travel compatibility with new split-design travel batteries adhering to airline regulations. He discusses the battery life variability dependent on usage and weight and mentions enhancements in handling and control through the handheld remote and the upcoming hands-free remote system. On technique tips, Paul advises beginners on maintaining board flatness and gradually increasing speed for smooth lift-off. He highlights the significance of position and subtle movements. He also explains how to transition from motor power to pure foiling seamlessly. Finally, Paul talks about the pricing of Foil Drive systems, emphasizing the popularity and recommendation of the Max Power system due to its runtime, range, and power benefits. He describes additional accessories like the propeller guard for safety and the various equipment improvements aimed at reducing drag and increasing performance.

In a special episode of the Blue Planet Show, guest host Tyler Landon interviews Rob Stehlik, the founder of Blue Planet. The discussion focuses on Rob’s extensive experience in the watersports industry, his journey from windsurfing to paddleboarding to foiling, and the release of his new book, 'Stand Up Paddleboarding for Dummies.' Rob reflects on his 30-year journey, starting with his passion for windsurfing in Germany and moving to Maui. He shares insights into his role as an early adopter and promoter of standup paddleboarding and discusses the challenges he faced in writing his first book. The conversation delves into the operational and logistical challenges of running Blue Planet, including early struggles with suppliers, the expansion of product lines, and the importance of branding and consistent quality. Rob also talks about his YouTube channel, which has become a vital marketing tool for the brand. Highlights from his global travels, engagements in competitive standup paddling, and his thoughts on balancing business with personal passions add depth to the narrative. Additionally, Rob discusses the diversification of Blue Planet into rental services and commercial real estate, showcasing the brand's growth and adaptation over the years. Tyler, who has a history of working with Rob, adds personal anecdotes about their business relationship and the impact Rob’s mentorship has had on his own career.

Aidan Nicholas was at the Armstrong booth at the 2024 AWSI show in Hood River and I had the opportunity to interview him.  We talk about the 2024 M2O race he won by a big margin,  the Armstrong equipment he uses for racing and freestyle, wings, boards, foils, and riding in the Gorge the days before the show.   In an interview at the AWSI 2024 show, Aidan Nicholas, fresh off his victory in the Molokai to Oahu race, discussed his race strategy, equipment choices, and lessons learned from competing. He described how tricky the race was due to variable wind conditions, requiring tactical decisions to maintain speed. Aidan highlighted his use of a 580 foil for improved glide and the importance of multiple jibes to gain ground during the race. He also emphasized the role of his 7-meter wing in maintaining power during lighter winds, allowing him to bear off and keep momentum. Aidan talked about his setup, including using a small 48-liter board during the race, though he mentioned a larger 65-liter board would have been more suitable in light wind sections. He also discussed the critical role of foils, noting his preference for the MA625 foil in everyday conditions and the 580 foil for races. The interview covered various technical aspects of wing design, board volume, and foil dynamics, with Aidan stressing the importance of a balanced setup for maximizing performance in racing and downwind conditions. He also gave insight into Armstrong's new alloy rig, designed for a more affordable entry into high-performance setups without sacrificing durability, thanks to features like titanium fittings. This new alloy rig is a more budget-friendly option compared to traditional carbon setups, but with slightly lower performance. Transcript of the interview: Aloha, it's Robert with Blue Planet. We're here at the AWSI show 2024. I'm here with Aidan Nicholas. You just won the Molokai to Oahu race. And then we got a bunch of footage of you at the hatchery the last few days, like right before the show started. We had some really fun conditions. Yeah, we did. The gorge turned on and It does what it does best and we're in some fun conditions close to the, close to Hood, which was nice. Yeah, so  let's talk a little bit about the race first. So the Molokai to Oahu race, you were like, I think you finished like miles ahead of everybody else, right? Like a couple miles probably, something like that? Yeah, I hit it. It was a tricky race, that's for sure. Yeah, it got really light in the middle, right? Very light. It was what do we have in the middle there? It was probably 6 to 10 knots. And it was a tactical, the cloud came through in the middle. The start was nuking. Middle was super light and the end started to pick back up again. But, it was a few tactical decisions in the middle to decide whether I hit, go to Oahu or just keep playing down the bumps that I was in the middle. Which, a big improvement. So you can make downwind ground faster, but when I couldn't, when I didn't have the wind strength, it was hard to do that. So I was like, okay, I'm going to race out from this cloud cover.  I crossed to closer to Oahu, got out from the clouds and the wind started to pick up a little bit more and then played all the way down and had a pretty good race all the way through. So you actually stayed a little bit northerly of the run line. I definitely did. Yeah. Okay. There was a lot of jibes and I looked at my track this year in comparison to last year and last year. I could probably count on that.  Maybe six or seven jibes. That's when I think was in the vicinity of 80 to 90. So it's like really playing swell lines and in the middle there, when you get your speed, if you can jive on it, jive back again and gain another a hundred meters downwind, it makes a big difference. So you use the jibes to actually make.  When you didn't have those gusts and the swells lined up you could really soak on some fast rollers and just soak down there. And that's why I changed last year I rode the 65 MA, and this year I was on the 580, and it was just for the fact that I could actually glide on the waves when needed. If it did die off, I could just cruise down and make sure that I could stay on the faces. It says pump over a little bit and connect some, so  yeah. I found a lot of times the hardest part where, like if you came off a bump and then you in the trough and there's no wind or whatever, and you're just like, Oh,  and then you just don't want to come off well. Cause you know, you can't get back up on foot. It is super tricky out there. It was a tricky race for sure. I rode a pretty small board which I think going forward again I'd probably ride a little bit more volume. Something in the, I I'm 82kg so 175,  180, 180 pounds. And I ride,  I rode a 48 litre but a 75 would have been a much better, safer option in that middle there if you did come down like a little bit. You could actually get back up again. So you were able to go all the way without coming off foil though, or? I had one fall in the early section. I made a mishap and switching my feet in a jibe. Had a crash, came down there and then I had one other time with a wing clipped a wave top and got ripped down my hands. But, and by the time I got it back in, I was on the water, but I still managed to get straight back up again. Now they're both pretty quick recoveries. Cool. And so let's talk about these wings. You used that, the seven meter, right? I did, yeah.  So let's talk a little bit about that. I think last year you only had the smaller sizes in these wings, right? We did. 6. 1 was the biggest and there's something I chatted to the guys about that we discussed and we're going, Okay, what wing size do we need for this race? What's the best sort of size? And VMG is the massive ball player in this whole thing. Downwind racing is you can have the fastest gear, but if you can't soak and 10 degrees difference makes a massive  Speed difference you've got to be going for that 10 degrees is huge, right? So  The seven meter just allowed me it was a definitely overpowered at the top But I could get a lot of depth off the start line and then as it lightened off in the middle, I got back to my normal angles I run but I just had a bit more power in the hands and Over that course of that race, a lot of people tend to get pretty tired as it gets near the end. So to have a wing that's got a little bit more power, it just allows you to, instead of going Oh, it's a bit lighter. I'll just come up. It's I've still got power. I can just bear away and actually soak more than coming up on it. And that's always a better option in a downwind race. Definitely. I was using a seven meter as well, which at the start you were, it was Oh, it's really windy. Maybe I don't need a big wing, but then yeah, I'm glad.  I'm glad they did use it. It's cool how you have this is to keep the center straight a little bit shorter. You have that square end here. It's also to keep the wingtips a little bit shorter proportionally. So we can add a bit more area without going as wide. So if you look at our 6 1, a small difference there between actual wingspan. And allowing that there allows the working section, which is the section closest to the frame to be a little bit wider and actually gain some power through there. So  these have been super efficient and they just get you up in those super light conditions and get you racing. Okay. Yeah, so I guess just more power in the middle by making it exactly. So if you think about it, like that's your, on average, your longest part of a wing. So if you can expand that a little bit wider,  and you can get the power through this section, and here you can get more square area. In that main section of the wings, you don't have to push out the tips and you don't have to add another strut out here to give the  extra support because you've got it in the middle there.  And then we're using it with these handles, these same handles. I guess that's standard. That's our standard handles. Yeah, so cool. So and then what would you say, in terms of what's the most important, I, in my opinion, it's For the foil is the most important because that's what determines your top speed you're like What's a comfortable speed you can ride but then obviously the wing  provides the power so You need a power good powerful wing, but I would say that's probably come second to the foiler What would you say and then the board is probably third Yeah, it's I think they all play a part together Like it's a combination of things put together if you have the wrong board and you can't get up you're not right yeah there's a whole lot of strategical decisions and things Yeah, different. Different setup feel feels nicer in the geometry and the difference between the foil and the trap and the deck Angle makes a massive difference. So having those and all combined together  Can make a big difference on your riding experience foil and mask  I was up to a 103. 5 mast is what I raced across my channel on. And it was just so that gave me that extra, when you're coming down those cranking swells, you've just got that little bit extra to play. Yeah. Height. Gives you a little bit of reaction time to keep you from breaching it. A hundred percent. Yeah. And then, so would you  like, and that's another question I have the closer you are to the surface of the water with the foil, the more efficient it is. Yeah. But then with a longer mass. Just like a lot of times when I'm out there, even though I have a pretty long mask, I'm still pretty low to the surfaces for the safety, like safety surfing it a lot of times, especially when you're going fast. Is that kind of what you do, or do you always try to be as high as you can on the mask kind of thing? I try to get as high as I can.  I get to a certain point, there's a risk versus reward. It's like anything, any foil you ride, any mast you ride, it's always that risk versus reward of like how high top speed versus how comfortable am I at that speed. If you can ride a faster speed, but you're losing control every couple of minutes, like a crash is a minute of your time. If you think about it your speed can drop off a few if you can actually have a setup that you can ride and it can make you a cross in that, in a cleaner run. Yeah. We didn't have a nuking one, but if it is nuking out there, you do get faces that are completely vertical. Coming out the back of them, it's like coming through a surf break. You come through and you can completely breach out the front of them as they're crashing or as they're cresting at the top. Yeah, I find that if you're overtaking a bump, it's like you have to almost push your nose down and stay really low and not cause, yeah.  And that's where good boards are important because as you touch down, if that board touches down and just hits the lip and keeps riding off, you're fine. But if it sticks or if it grabs, when you're just trying to stay low coming through that bump, it makes a big difference. The wing for sure. Especially in downwind races, these bigger wings is you've always got that power. Like you want that power. It's one of those things any down window, you're going for a down window from Vito down to here, or even doing a down window on Maui. If the wind dies or the wind ladens off, you wanna be able to get home. So going that one size, extra bigger than you would for a regular back and forth session for a down window is. Yeah, another reason is to that once you bear off the wind you have less effective wind in your wing, right? So you actually need more power to have that angle, so yeah makes sense So yeah, let's talk a little bit about the board like what board we're using in the Molokai race I was using my 48 liter wing board  You have one of those here? Oh wow, so yeah, that's a pretty small board for for racing, eh? Exactly. Would you say, yeah? That was much smaller than I probably should have been using. It was what I had and what I was traveling with. I definitely, looking at it, it's probably now, from what I know, I'd probably be on a 65 Midland. This guy here. And this is what I probably should have ridden just a little bit extra a few like a few more litres It's gonna get me up a little bit easier middle of the channel. It's got a little bit more length in it So it's gonna glide and get up a little bit quicker. So this would have been my board of choice  For the crossing. Yeah, you just didn't have it on the day of the race. Exactly. Yeah, that's one of those things It's what you travel with and I travel with this and I ride this all the time. So I am quite dialed in Yeah, and then you can use it in anything, like waves racing. And that's what I was doing, I did some wave stuff. Even if you really have to, you can prone it too, as a board. If you've gone, if you've come there and you're like, Oh sweet, okay, I've got this board, at least I can still get out on the water. Yeah. No matter what.  And then, when you were riding at the hatchery last before the show, were you using this board or you had to using that board. This board, yeah. So that's your go to, huh? Yep.  And that one's 48 liters. How many liters is that one? 65. Okay, so we've got about 17 liters difference So yeah, and that makes a big difference if the wind is light and you don't have to get to the surface first Exactly.  Especially those sort of wings, like once you get them moving with this sort of board You can go down pretty light and still be able to get up. Pretty crucial And also just less drag and yeah, and I made that big real, I made that big realization when I was You know  I had a GoPro on my board and I came down and it knocked the GoPro and I fix the GoPro and I was just outside the harbour in Maui and what happens is I fix the GoPro,  went sweet, went to go back up again but didn't realise I was running fully on apparent and there was no wind to get back up again so I swam from the outside of the harbour. Oh. All the way into the inside there and it was like a 40 minute paddle and that was when I was like,  This is where that mid length would be really nice right now. This is where I could have got up in this light of breeze. Yeah, was that like the day before the Molokai race? The Maui to Molokai race? Yeah. Yeah, that same thing happened to me. I fell like right outside the harbor and then I couldn't get going again for a while. It was really light right there, huh? Yeah. And that's what makes it a bit light. Yeah, that's where it's nice to have a bigger board. Yeah. Let's talk about the foils, like the foils you were using, and the, Yeah, so I was using a Wanna go up to the, check out the different foils?  Okay, so we're gonna talk a little bit about the foils I guess your, what you're usually using in the, in at the hatchery, what you would use on a race, and so on. Yeah, sounds good. That's my normal mast length, an 8. 65.  And I was riding a 103. 5 for the race. Yeah. A big difference in height. It doesn't look like that much but it makes a huge difference. Exactly. The feel is totally different, yeah. It's amazing that sort of, you from here down, that's your real height because you're almost running at maximum at that height all the time. And especially when you've got some extra waves that just makes a big difference. It also makes a big difference in recovery. Because you drop, you get enough time to bring it back up again. When it's a real short mast, unless it's super short under 60 centimeters, sort of 50, in the 50s, then you can recover. Because the board, the nose never drops far enough, but anything where the pitch angle can be big enough, like what you get on these 865s and even the 103. 5, it's nice to have that extra height to just, out of it and compensate, yeah.  Yeah, that's my truth. It's, a lot of times when you crash, it's not from, like you, sometimes you, it's like when you come back up again, like you hit the water, and then as you come back up, you can't recover back and the longer matches give you that much play. A hundred percent. So I always ride a TC60 Fuse with this  here's our fuses here I run a 60 Fuse, the guys behind the boat run a 50 Fuse, and and there's sometimes for Some of the disciplines or learning you get into a 70 fuse, but it's more 70 fuse Just gives you a little bit more pitch stability and front to back And sometimes you can run smaller tails, which allows you to carve a little quicker But still have that like forward to back pitch control But I rode the 60 fuse and that's pretty much the standard for Everything I do is on this thing. Yeah. That's that. 60 fuselage, okay. And then, when we come to foils, we come over this to the side.  MA625. Is the,  Is what I ride on a daily basis. When I was at the hatch the other day, That was what I was on. Yeah. And that's the one that Cash was using at J Bay to ride these huge waves to. Which is So the potential and what it can do in the different days, And,  Yeah, it's interesting too because it's Actually a fairly simple design. There's nothing super fancy about it. Not super high aspect Not yeah, it's just a but it just does everything we want to do It allows us to rip it allows us to go fast. It keeps control You've got you got a nice roll. So there's a lot of potential that it has So yeah, and then this here is so last year I raced m2o on this. Okay, so I did that and then this year You  I did this, so I got a slightly wider span. And this. , which is gonna gimme a bit more, glide a little bit more there. And it's a five 80 and that's a 6 2 5 . So just more high aspect, just a bit more high aspect. These are like, the top end isn't as incredible on these, like you can't push them as fast. But  the glide and the potential for this downwind racing is what I needed and that's why running, I've even down winded this in the gorge, so I sub paddled it up and Oh wow. Had a, on a good day out here where it's real fun to rip the turns on. It's super playful.  So you think this one actually has a higher top end speed, but this one is the kind of more comfortable at high speeds? This one is more comfortable at high speed. This one can be pushed at high speed, but isn't as comfortable at pushed. But it gives me glide when that wind dies. And that's what I was like last year. A big lesson of like how I can glide the angle I can take and I got Rolled pretty hard from behind just down to leward by fin in the second half of the race and I was Like I really need something that I can actually just glide on my swells and actually capitalize on that so this is the kind of style we're in for there. Cool  All right  So and then what are the other foils in the range you want to go over? Yes, sweet different foils, I just A speed 180 tail. That's my pretty standard option for any winging discipline in a sense. Unless I'm really cranking in the surf just because of the turning ability. But, I put this with a red shim and I get my maximum speed potential. And it's super quick to ride. So the red shim is one degree. And that basically, it flattens out the angle. Exactly. You lose a little bit of pump, but you get a little bit more speed. So basically the angle between the front wing and the back wing is a little bit less, so it has less drag. Yeah, it's even not between that, but even on this, the section flattens out. So then you can get more speed off that 180 tail. It just adds a little bit, it does, you do get a little bit less stability in a sense, on a small degree. And you lose a little bit of pumping when you shim it. Okay. But, you get that extra speed potential, and that's what I love to ride when I wing and do freestyle and Wave ride. It's this. If I'm purely wave riding, and it's solid swell, or I'm towing or anything like that, it's the 180. Or the 140, sorry. It's still the speed one, yeah? Oh, the dart. The dart. The dart, and I put a blue shim on this one for me. That's my preference. Just cause I like a little bit more speed potential, but it's already a fast enough tail. I want the control and I don't want to lose all my pump out of the tail. And then sometimes having, a little bit more angle also makes it easier to turn, right? Yeah.  Okay. So we go, the surf is still what the guys are all using behind the boat  glides really good for flat water paddle ups.  Pump 202 gives you that stability when you're jumping off the dock. So it gives you a little bit extra time to get onto the foil, get over the top of it and get pumping. And it's amazing. It might only give you a small fraction of a second, but it's enough to make a big difference. Then we've got the 300, which is just super stable getting into it, going to provide that stability through learning new tacks, learning new jibes. Or your progression, and then a flow 2 3 5 as you're transitioning down from the S1 300 into your next other tail options. Yeah. Yeah, and for those, the kind of beginner guys out there, don't start on one of these. There's more tails, yeah. There's definitely more advanced stuff, yeah. Okay. L. O. Rig.  So ARMY  came up with this and when I first heard about it I was like,  Alloy, we've done carbon all this time, what are we doing? And it wasn't until I saw the product and had a conversation with ARMY that I was like, Wow, this, he didn't come to corners. Like making alloy rigs with titanium fittings. Corrosion exactly and giving like everything that it comes with when you arrive in a box It's got all the washers that you could need for if you take this apart and replace it You can put a new washer on each time  And it just allows you to get into the system into the Armstrong system at a better price point Yeah, much less expensive. Exactly carbon mass and fuselage exactly and it's gonna have its difficulties because it's not your carbon setup It's not as the section is a Your 17 mil in thickness here in comparison to a performance mask where you are 14. So there's a big difference there. It's lower. But and you have your corrosion there. I could sit my  carbon mask together for years and it's still boom, take it off. This over time Army's done an incredible job with  all the fittings, everything like that. How you can take it apart you can keep this whole setup together. It is. Advised to take off the front wing. I wanted to ask you about the wings too, because you were on a three meter wing when a lot of guys were on like two fives or two tiny wings, yeah? Yes, we can chat about that, so yeah, so at the hatchery I was filming you and I think most of the Armstrong team was on the three meter wing when it was blowing super hard and a lot of the, a lot of the locals were on like two meter or two and a half meter wings, really tiny wings. So I just was wondering like, what's and you do have a 2. 6. So what's the difference and why were you using the three meters? I like a little bit more power on average. I love the hang time it gives me here and coming down a little bit softer. The smaller wings, I love to switch with those guys when we're out there and actually freestyle becomes a lot easier when we go to smaller wings. But, I love a little bit extra power. It's gotta be, when I jump, I'm not gonna come down a lot. It's a weight difference, when those guys come down with their weight, it's a lot lighter, so they can just come down softly. Whereas this here, is they've got so much power in their hands that they can just  I have to go up and then coming down. If I come down to smaller wing, I just dropped too fast. Okay. Thanks, Aiden. Thanks so much. Appreciate your time and your knowledge, sharing the knowledge. So good luck and probably see you again next year at the Molokai race. Yeah, no, it'd be great. I'm looking forward to another year and see what happens. All right. Thanks for watching.  

Robert Stehlik introduces Dave Kalama as a pioneer in various water sports, including windsurfing, surfing, towing, and foiling. Dave’s innovations have significantly influenced these sports, making them more accessible to the masses. He is currently at the forefront of designing advanced foiling boards widely used by athletes worldwide.   The Essence of Design and Innovation   Dave shares his perspective on designing foiling boards. For him, the goal has always been to create the best boards possible, focusing on the challenge of innovation rather than mass adoption. He reflects on the joy of seeing people use his designs but emphasizes that his primary motivation has been to refine and improve the boards in the shaping room.   Evolution of Stand-Up Foiling   Dave discusses the rapid growth of stand-up foiling, particularly in downwind racing, and his role in designing the long, narrow boards that have become standard. He recounts the initial challenges and iterative process of developing these boards, initially aimed at prone foilers but eventually proving successful for stand-up paddling. This evolution has made the sport more accessible and enjoyable for a broader audience.   Challenges and Learning Curves   The development of these boards wasn’t straightforward. Dave describes the numerous iterations and frustrations along the way. It took years to perfect the design, with moments of doubt and pauses in the project. However, the persistence paid off as he eventually found the right combination of length and width to make the boards efficient and stable.   Importance of Paddle Technique   Dave highlights the importance of paddle technique in stand-up foiling. He explains that as boards became narrower, the paddle became the primary source of stability. This shift in mindset allowed paddlers to handle narrower boards effectively. He advises those new to the sport to focus on learning proper paddle techniques, possibly by taking classes like those offered by Jeremy Riggs.   The Future of Foiling and Equipment Evolution   Dave reflects on how the foiling sport has evolved, particularly with the introduction of high-aspect wings that prioritize speed over ease of use. He notes that while these wings have made the sport more competitive, they have also reduced the number of prone foilers due to the physical demands required to use them effectively.   Personal Connection to Traditional Stand-Up Paddling   Despite his focus on foiling, Dave still enjoys traditional stand-up paddling and longboarding. He talks about the simplicity and fun of these activities, which provide a contrast to the intensity of foiling. He also reminisces about the early days of stand-up paddling, appreciating how much easier and more fun foiling has made these activities.   Competition and the Changing Landscape   Dave acknowledges the competitive nature of foiling races today, noting how the level of competition has increased dramatically. While he still enjoys racing, his work commitments have made it difficult to train adequately. He discusses the challenges of competing against younger, fitter athletes who are using increasingly advanced equipment.   Balancing Work and Passion   Dave’s current focus is on his work, which often requires travel and limits his ability to compete. He mentions how he still finds ways to support others in the sport, sharing his knowledge and experience. While he would like to race again, he recognizes the importance of balancing work and personal passions.   Legacy and Family Influence   Dave shares his family background, explaining how his Hawaiian heritage and his father’s surfing accomplishments influenced his path. Growing up in Southern California, he developed a love for the ocean and water sports, eventually leading him to Maui, where his passion for windsurfing and later foiling flourished.   The Early Days of Windsurfing   Dave recounts his early days in windsurfing, describing how his parents’ gift of a windsurfer for his high school graduation sparked his interest. Moving to Maui at 20, he was initially a beginner but quickly advanced by surrounding himself with skilled windsurfers. This environment allowed him to excel in the sport and eventually turn professional.   Conclusion   Dave Kalama’s journey is one of relentless innovation, passion, and dedication to water sports. From his early days in California to becoming a leading figure in foiling design, his contributions have significantly shaped the sports he loves. While his focus may have shifted towards work and family in recent years, his influence on the sport continues through his designs and the athletes who use them.   This summary captures the essence of Dave Kalama’s insights, experiences, and contributions to water sports, particularly in the field of foiling.

In this video our wing foil crew consisting of Derek, Matt, Kevin and Robert talk about our experience crossing the Ka'iwi channel between Molokai and Oahu in the 2024 M2O Foil edition race.   Summary of our conversation: The Blue Planet Show hosts Derek, Kevin, and Matt discuss their experiences in the Molokai to Oahu (M2O) race. They also touch on their participation in the Maui to Molokai and Molokai Holokai races that took place prior. The conversation delves into various aspects of the M2O race, from the preparation, strategy, and execution, to personal anecdotes and lessons learned from the experience.   Pre-Race Preparation   • Arrival and Setup: Upon arriving in Maui, the team loaded their equipment onto a U-Haul and participated in the Maui to Molokai and Molokai Holokai races before gearing up for the M2O race on Sunday. • Starting Point Decision: The team made strategic decisions about where to start the race, choosing Iliopoint on the north side of Molokai over the previous year’s starting point at Kalua Koi. This decision was driven by the desire to find better wind conditions and a more challenging start.   The Race Begins   • Derek’s Perspective: Derek describes flying around and capturing footage of the race participants as they prepared for the start. He highlights the SUP racers waiting with their escort boats and the wingers readying themselves with safety equipment like VHF radios and EPIRBs. The race began with strong winds and favorable conditions. • Matt’s Take: Matt appreciated the choice of starting at Iliopoint, finding the wind conditions stronger than the previous year’s practice crossing. He was pleased with his performance in the beginning, feeling adequately powered up.   In-Race Challenges and Experiences   • Kevin’s Journey: Kevin shared a vivid account of his race, including his partnership with Pilot John. Initially, they stuck together, but as the race progressed, John insisted Kevin leave him behind. Kevin eventually pushed ahead, feeling both guilty and exhilarated as he completed the race without falling. He reflected on the difficulty of staying together as a team in such challenging conditions. • Team Dynamics: The team aspect added a unique challenge, as staying together meant one person had to wait every time the other fell. This increased the likelihood of both participants falling, making it a tricky balance to maintain. • Winning the Unofficial Team Competition: Matt and his partner Reza, along with Kevin and Pilot John, managed to win the unofficial team competition. Matt enjoyed sharing the experience with Reza, despite the difficulties in navigation and staying together.   Navigational Strategies and Weather Conditions   • Derek and Matt’s Routes: Derek and Matt both took different routes, with Matt opting to go further south in search of more wind. Derek noted that he had to zigzag due to the presence of escort boats, which affected his progress. • Light Winds and Tactical Decisions: The race saw varying wind conditions, with some parts of the course experiencing light winds. This forced the participants to make strategic decisions, like going south or tacking upwind to stay on foil. Both Derek and Matt emphasized the importance of these decisions, especially in the light-wind conditions in the middle of the race. • Boat Interference: Derek mentioned how escort boats, paddlers, and other traffic made it difficult to stick to the ideal line, as the boat wakes created additional challenges.   The Final Stretch and Finish Line   • Approaching Diamond Head: Matt recounted how, after a long stretch of not seeing anyone, he finally saw Derek near Diamond Head. Both were navigating through the final challenges of the race, with Derek having to deal with boat wakes and Matt focusing on maintaining his speed and avoiding falls. • Post-Race Reflections: The race finished with an awards ceremony, where winners like Nani in the women’s division were celebrated. The team reflected on their different approaches, routes, and the challenges they faced, like dealing with light winds and the psychological aspect of seeing the finish line but still having a long way to go.   Lessons Learned and Future Plans   • Kevin’s Takeaways: Kevin reflected on his gear choices, suggesting that he would choose a different foil and wing if he were to race again. He emphasized the importance of being better prepared and more competitive in the future. • Matt’s Reflections: Matt shared similar insights, noting that he should have chosen a bigger wing and a smaller foil. He also discussed the strategic aspect of choosing the southern route and his plans to compete solo next year. • The Unique Experience of Racing Without an Escort: The participants highlighted the unique and thrilling experience of racing without an escort boat. The feeling of being alone in the vast ocean, relying solely on their instincts and skills, added a profound dimension to the race.   Closing Thoughts   The conversation ended with a discussion about the mileage covered, with Rob noting that his route totaled 48 miles, which was longer than expected. The participants reiterated the challenges they faced, the strategies that worked, and the excitement of finishing such a demanding race.   Conclusion   The M2O race was a significant and memorable event for all participants. It tested their skills, endurance, and decision-making abilities in a challenging environment. The race not only provided a platform for competition but also offered valuable lessons and experiences that the participants will carry with them into future races.  

Welcome to the Blue Planet Show, where we’re recapping the 25th edition of the Molokai to Oahu race. This episode features Robert Stehlik, who recently won the 14-foot stock stand-up paddleboard (SUP) division. Robert is excited about his accomplishment, sharing insights into his experience during the challenging race. Robert starts by discussing his back-to-back participation in the Molokai crossing, having raced on wingfoil boards the previous weekend. He highlights the challenging conditions, emphasizing the grind to get into the wind line and catch bumps to start moving forward. This year’s race had all divisions starting together, making it more interesting and competitive. Robert reflects on the evolution of the sport, noting the fluctuating popularity of stand-up paddling and prone foiling. He mentions the international competitors, especially from New Zealand and Australia, who take the sport seriously from a young age. The start was at 8 a.m., earlier than the previous weekend’s foil start. Despite being the last paddler off the beach, Robert managed to catch up and enjoy the race. Throughout the interview, Robert details his strategic approach to the race. He talks about the advantage of starting together with other divisions, making it more engaging to have competitors around. He recounts the early part of the race, where a Brazilian paddler on an unlimited board took an early lead, but Robert maintained his pace. The conditions were tough, with minimal waves and challenging winds. Robert chose to stay in the wind shadow, which, despite being a longer route, proved advantageous against the headwinds. He mentions his training partners, Jimmy Marshdale and Roland, who also opted for the wind shadow and performed well. Robert discusses his equipment, highlighting his 14-foot bump rider board and Kaizen V3 paddle. The board’s stability and the paddle’s design contributed to his success. He also shares his nutrition strategy, emphasizing the importance of hydration and calorie intake during the race. He used a combination of Tailwind (a nutrition mix) and regular water, supplemented with pickle juice shots to prevent cramping. Reflecting on past races, Robert notes his previous experiences with cramping and how pickle juice has become a reliable remedy. For nutrition, he found that baby food squeeze packs worked well, providing easy-to-digest calories. This year, he skipped his usual Poi mix due to availability issues and found the baby food to be an excellent alternative. Robert expresses surprise at being the only participant to compete in both the foil and stand-up paddle divisions. He expected more competitors to take on both challenges but acknowledges the significant time and financial commitment involved. He mentions notable athletes like James Casey and Kai Lenny, who might have been strong contenders in both categories. Concluding the interview, Robert reflects on the demanding nature of stand-up paddling training compared to wing foiling. He appreciates the conditioning benefits from his long paddles, which also helped improve his wing foiling performance. Despite the sport’s fluctuating popularity, Robert remains passionate about stand-up paddling and its unique challenges. Congratulations to Robert Stehlik for his impressive achievements in both divisions of the Molokai to Oahu race. Stay tuned for more exciting interviews and race recaps on the Blue Planet Show. Aloha! Related SEO Search Terms: Molokai to Oahu race 2024, Robert Stehlik SUP race, stand-up paddleboard division winner, Molokai to Oahu crossing, 14-foot stock SUP, Blue Planet Show Molokai recap, SUP race conditions, prone foiling comeback, international SUP competitors, stand-up paddling tips, race nutrition strategies, pickle juice for cramping, SUP race equipment, Kaizen V3 paddle, endurance training for SUP, wing foiling vs stand-up paddling, Molokai race training, SUP race strategy, Robert Stehlik interview, Molokai to Oahu race highlights.

Most of the video footage featured in the YouTube video was shot by Derek Hama while he was wing foil racing. We talk about the experience of foil racing from Maui to Molokai and the Molokai Molokai race the following day. The previous weekend we competed in the Paddle Imua race, which was the first race of the Koa Kai triple crown race series. The M2M race had a big turnout with 120 SUP foil racers and over 40 wing foilers. The conditions were beautiful and unlike last year, the wind was blowing all the way to the finish, with the exception of a wind shadow behind the pier. Derek, Kevin, Matt and I discuss the race, the equipment we used, the conditions, and things we learned for next year. We hope you enjoy it, we will cover the Molokai to Oahu Foil race in next weeks video, so stay tuned for the M2O foil edition video! Find complete M2M race results here: https://www.pseresults.com/post/molokai-holokai-m2m-2024 Here is a recap of this video written by Chat GPT, not bad! :) Epic Maui to Molokai Wing Foiling Adventure! In this exciting episode from Blue Planet, Robert Stehlik and his friends from the O’ahu wing foiling crew share their incredible journey from Maui to Molokai and the subsequent Molokai Holokai race. The video captures stunning footage and provides insights into the experiences of the participants, making it a must-watch for foiling enthusiasts. The adventure begins with Derek, Kevin, and Matt, who join Robert for a long weekend in Maui. They kick off the trip with a Maliko run on Thursday, amidst light winds that soon pick up, setting a promising tone for the upcoming races. Derek captures captivating footage, while Kevin and Matt share their first-time experiences and the camaraderie that binds the group. Race day arrives with excitement and anticipation. The team dons pink shirts, fuels up, and heads to the starting line. The video showcases the impressive turnout, with 120 standup paddle foilers ready to race. Despite expecting lighter winds, the conditions turn out to be perfect, adding to the thrill of the race. Matt recounts his navigational challenges and the beauty of the surroundings, highlighting the unique aspects of the race. Derek, ever the team player, stops to help a fellow racer in distress, showcasing the spirit of sportsmanship that defines the event. This act of kindness, however, doesn’t deter his performance as he continues to capture amazing footage and finishes the race strong. The video transitions to the next day, featuring the Kamalo run along the Molokai coast. The smaller race allows the crew to enjoy a fast, exhilarating sprint. Robert and Matt discuss their equipment choices and strategies, emphasizing the importance of having the right gear for varying conditions. The camaraderie and shared experiences create a sense of unity and joy among the participants. One standout moment is Eli’s perseverance as he completes the race with a ripped center strut on his wing, demonstrating resilience and determination. The crew reflects on the challenges and learnings, with Matt humorously earning the nickname “Matt Hotfoot Tarini” for his barefoot escapades on Molokai’s hot asphalt. The video captures not just the competitive spirit but also the fun and enjoyment of the sport. Kevin’s reflections on the breathtaking views and the overall experience underline the essence of wing foiling – it’s not just about winning but also about the joy of being on the water and sharing moments with friends. SEO Search Terms: Maui to Molokai wing foiling, Molokai Holokai race, Wing foiling adventure, Blue Planet wing foiling, O’ahu wing foiling crew, Maliko run foiling, Standup paddle foiling race, Wing foiling race tips, Maui foiling trip, Molokai race highlights, Wing foiling equipment, Foiling race strategy, Maui wing foiling conditions, Molokai coastline foiling, Wing foiling camaraderie, Robert Stehlik Blue Planet, Derek Hama wing foiling footage, Kevin first-time foiling race, Matt foiling race experience, Eli resilient foiler Watch the video to relive the excitement, learn from the experiences of seasoned foilers, and get inspired for your next wing foiling adventure!

 What an honor to have Robby Naish on the show!  He really needs no introduction: 27 times windsurfing world champion and a pioneer in kite surfing, Stand Up Paddle boarding, foiling and wing foiling. The first time he became a windsurfing world champion was at only 13 years old, traveling by himself to the Bahamas. This interview gives you insight of how Robbie Naish grew up and how he lives his life today. Show transcript: Aloha friends! It's Robert Stehlik. Welcome to another episode of the Blue Planet Show. Today's show is extra special. I know it's been a while since the last episode, but I ran into Robbie Naish a few weeks ago at a race in Kailua and he agreed to come onto the show. So I'm super stoked to have him as a guest. Really interesting stories. Robby Naish really needs no introduction. 27 times windsurfing world champion,  pioneer. First time he became a windsurfing world champion was when he was 13 years old, traveling by himself to the Bahamas. Great stories. I found a few new things about him. For example, He was going to study art at UC Santa Cruz if he hadn't become a professional wind surfer. And he also designed the first Naish logo when his dad started making boards under the Naish label. So I think this interview gives you a really nice insight of how Robbie Naish He lives his life today and hope to get some more time with him soon. As I always like to ask a lot of questions. So he had to go to a photo shoot. I didn't get to ask all the questions I wanted. So hopefully I can get Robbie back again. But for now without further ado, please enjoy this interview with Robbie Naish. All right, Robbie Naish. So good to have you on the Blue Planet show. Welcome.  Right on. Thanks, Robert. Good to be here. Yeah. So a couple of weeks ago I just ran into you and Kailua. They had the  race over there and that was super fun. And then I saw you were on a wing foil board with a seven meter wing, even though it was like a really windy day. So just let's talk a little bit about that. How was that experience?  It was fun. I was over there anyway and Dez and the crew were like, Oh, you should join this fun race they're doing. I didn't want to actually enter,  but figured I'd go over and, chase people around. So I did the course sorta. And, I'm not  really into racing, so to speak, but obviously, I'm old school, like I'm not doing loops and fricking spins and everything on the foil. My body's not as forgiving as it used to be. And I know I'll hurt myself. An injury at this point is something I'm really trying to avoid. So I'm blasting around. I'm trying to go as fast as I can. I'm jumping high, but just not doing rotations, really enjoying winging  and pushing the envelope of what I would call free ride gear. So You know, not full on speed or race gear, but taking gear that I can use for anything and trying to make it go as fast as it can go.  And in terms of wing size  is that pretty much always means like windsurfing. If you're really going fast,  you're going to use as big.  a wing as possible even to the point where most guys are out on fours and you'll be on a seven. It's just the way that, aerodynamics work in power and efficiency of foils. So  you ride pretty lit when you're trying, especially upwind, you can handle a really big wing. Feathering upwind at a real high angle of attack. There's a point at which you just can't keep the thing in the water anymore reaching, and you've got to scale down the size of your foil at least. But I tend to ride pretty big wings here.  Yeah, even back in the days of wing wind surfing I remember you were always more on a bigger sail than most of the other guys, right?  Yeah  Wave sailing is different even here. It's the same like most guys would be out at he'll keep on like a 4.0 or 3.0. And I'll be  historically on a five, Oh, four, seven, that's changed. I've scaled down to where I'm writing smaller sales than I used to. Like my average sale now over here is a four or five. I'll hardly ever even go on a four, seven, just cause the way the equipment has evolved, it's changed. The boards are shorter, they're easily overpowered. You ride a bigger sale.  And you'll tend to stuff the nose a lot. They just balance better with a smaller sail.  But it's more the difference between, say, wave sailing and slalom racing or course racing, where even today on the really short, really wide slalom boards,  The guys are using  seven meters when you'd be on a five, a wave sail,  four or five way. They're carrying giant rigs and then most of the guys are a hundred kilos as well to hold them down. So it's really different when you're trying to go fast, you'll use a. A flatter, bigger  sail and then just get up on the fin or as it may be up on the foil.  All right. Cool. Yeah, like my interviews can tend to go pretty long, but you just told me that you have a photo shoot today. I guess this week you're doing some photo shoots for Naish. I'll try to respect. I'll try to respect that. Keep it to an hour or so.  But, I always like to start at the very beginning. Talk a little bit, and for me, I grew up in Germany and I'm, I guess about five years younger than you. And and you were like my idol, so cool for me to be able to just have a conversation with you and all that. But in, and it's a big reason why I got, came to Maui to windsurf and ended up living here too. So thanks for that. But yeah, so talk a little bit about growing up in Kailua and, like you had, you won your first world title at 13 years old. And talk a little bit about that time, like growing up and how you got into windsurfing and or you actually your very first earliest memories of just like enjoying water sports or getting into the ocean and that you remember.  Yeah it was about a five hour story. I'll try to give you the consultative version. I got plenty of time.  My whole life has been a series of right place, right time.  I've just been blessed and lucky. Very lucky many times over. So my dad, both my parents are from California. My dad grew up in La Jolla  and he was a surfer lifeguard at wind and sea. Started coming to Hawaii in the fifties to surf, was one of the first guys to surf Waimea, Makaha, places like that. He's actually in the first surfer magazine ever published dropping in at Waimea. And so he was an ocean guy  and  moved to Hawaii,  three kids already. My brother, Randy, who's a year and a half older than I am, myself and my sister when they moved to Hawaii,  when I was, I think almost four years old,  fortunately.  Basically, he took a teaching job at Roosevelt High School.  And was a science teacher  and packed up the family, moved to Hawaii so he could surf.  So I don't really remember, much as a kid in California, my whole childhood memories. I've got a strange mind too, like my parents remember everything from their whole life. My brother remembers everything. And I've got this strange selective memory where, there's all periods. I don't remember anything at all. But I certainly remember growing up in Kailua. Which was  the world's best place for a kid to grow up. My dad surfed, so we grew up at the beach. He got one of the first Hobie cats in Hawaii when Hobies were launched. So he had a Hobie 14 and was racing Hobies for years and years. He was.  He's a state champion in the Hobie 14 like five times. And when they launched the Hobie 16, started racing 16s. And I don't know how many times on that he was national champion on the Hobie 16 in 1972.  And  it was really a good Hobie sailor.  And so we were pretty much at the beach all the time. We lived up right up from Lani Kai boat ramp in Kailua next to Lani Kai elementary school. My parents still live there  and so I could walk to the beach and surf Kailua shore break.  My dad let us surf Flat Island. Once we, Could show that we could swim from the boat ramp to flat and back. Then we were allowed to surf the flat. And that was when I was in, I don't know, third grade, fourth grade.  And it was the only time flat was ever really good was when it was super windy trade. So then you paddle out and back then it was before leashes. You lose your board. And by the time you swimming in your board, it's halfway to the boat ramp. But just love growing up in Kailua. I didn't even own a pair of slippers until I was in like the third grade. It was barefoot, everything, barefoot, flag football,  barefoot basketball, barefoot track, barefoot to school.  Didn't have a lot of money. My dad had. Three kids pretty quickly after four kids, on a high school public school teacher's job. But you would never know it, as a kid and in Hawaii, at least at that point,  you didn't need a lot of money to have an amazing life. A lot of high water pants, that kind of thing where you have to wear your pants and you're still wearing them to school and you got all your ankles showing. But growing up in Kailua at that point was amazing best place in the world that I think the best time in the world.  So really lucky. And then got into windsurfing. Fortunately,  when I was in the sixth grade, 1974, discovered it, my brother and I had a little Hobie 12, that little semi catamaran monohull. thing that Hobie made.  We had it down at Kailua one day and there were a few windsurfers in Hawaii at the time. Mike Corgan, Larry Stanley, Ken Clyde, a few other guys and they set some buoys and they were doing little triangle races and asked if  Randy, my brother, and I wanted to race with them on our Hobie. And that's how we met.  And so I was 11 years old at the time  and we became friends.  I asked if I could try the windsurfer. I couldn't even pull the sail out of the water. It wasn't tall enough. There's a whole leverage thing in the beginning. Cause at that point there was only one wind surfer. There was the 12 foot plastic board, one size sail, one boom, one dagger board. It wasn't an industry yet. Yeah. It was hard to pull that sail out of the water, right? Yeah. 72 pounds or whatever. But I just loved it. I went with Thor and Stan, they'd sail with me inside of them and let go and I could, ride along for a bit. Got that, that feel of gliding on the water. And I was absolutely hooked, it's everything I loved. It was surfing, skimboarding, sailing, just that first feeling of being able to grab the wind and go and make it all work was  just absolutely addicting. And from that point forward.  I was just on a mission. I'd go down to the beach after school. I go down on weekends and those guys were like teaching windsurfing.  And so guys would of course drift down the beach  and then I'd spend my day walking down and so they didn't have to drag their gear back up the beach upwind. I'd go down and say, Hey, I'm going to sail your board back up for you. And so I'd take their board, I'd sail it back up, wait for the next guy, sail it back out, go, Hey, can I borrow your windsurfer for a bit? So I was that pestery little kid who was just. At the beach all the time, honing my skills and trying to get as much time on the water as I could. And then, of course, still surfing a lot  at the same time and shore break and whatnot.  Paddling canoe, paddled from Lonnie Kipe Canoe Club to Steersman in the, I don't know what the youngest bracket was, 10, 11, 12 years old.  And Started saving my money. I made paper shell necklaces. I airbrushed t shirts. I babysat whatever to make money to buy my own board. And in late 74 bought my own windsurfer for 340, which was a lot of money back then, but for a complete rig.  And that was the beginning won the Hawai'i regional championships in 76 that  got me an air ticket from windsurfer international to the national championships in Berkeley, California.  And a group of guys from Hawai'i went to that.  I think Thor, Larry Stanley, Dennis Davidson, Pat Love, some of the local Kailua guys.  And so I traveled with them  and I got second in Berkeley to Mike Waltz  and he already had a ticket to the world somehow from the year before, and I ended up getting his ticket, so that's what got me to the Bahamas in 1976  to the world championship.  And, as conditions was that would have it, I was really fast when the wind was light because I was small and light  had a real advantage over the heavy guys.  And I won in the Bahamas  and  that got me an airfare to the next year's world championship  in Sardinia in 77 went to Sardinia, I won there, which gave me a ticket to Cancun in 78. I won there and it gave me a ticket to the next year. And so I went from free airfare to free airfare.  Until I graduated from Punahou, I was public school, went to Lanikai Elementary, Kailua Intermediate, Kalaheo in freshman year, and then luckily I somehow got into Punahou for my last three years. So 10, 11, 12th grade, I went to Punahou, graduated in 81. Okay.  Sorry to interrupt you, but let's go. I just want to go back to you going to, to the Bahamas when you're 13 year old. I guess your parents didn't come with you. You were just on, on your own as a 13 year old. Just talk a little bit about that experience. That just seems. So far removed from what most 13 year olds get to experience. Yeah. In hindsight, I don't know how my parents let me do that. I think the world was a different place, man,  cell phones, no internet. It was like, you're fricking gone  the world, but they let me go. I Wilkings, who was a local photographer from Honolulu, who was a surf photographer, windsurf photographer in the early days. And he went to be the staff photographer for Windsurfer International in the Bahamas.  And so I flew with him  and slept on his floor. You got a free hotel room there.  So I slept on his floor and did the event and yeah, I just can't believe my parents let me go there. I was a pretty responsible kid,  but yeah, I was still 13. And everyone else is older than you and you just showed up and got to the start and just took off where, what happened, how was it? How was the racing? It was, it was a regatta, sailing regatta. So triangle races, you usually did. Three,  three to four races a day,  right? You do a morning race and then you'd go and do a back to back race after that Olympic triangle racing. So upwind reach upward, downwind upwind finish.  And in those days they had weight classes and an overall, so they'd race the different weight race weight classes against each other. And I was a lightweight, obviously.  And Conditions were pretty light in the Bahamas, fortunately. And I was really fast and technically pretty good. My dad taught me, a lot of tactics, how to start, different rules and back then that was a big part of it was quite tactical, especially light wind course racing.  And so yeah, I won after that, they stopped doing weight classes cause the heavy guys were like, forget it. I don't want to race against the light guys like that anymore. And then from then on, it was just divisional weight class titles.  Yeah, it was an amazing experience cruising around. I hung out with Mike Waltz and Matt Schweitzer and guys like that. There were, a few years older than me, but at the time, if you're 13 and you're hanging out with a 16 year old, it's like, Oh, the guy's so old, guys in their twenties are like ancient when you're a little kid.  So it was quite an experience. Really enjoyed it. And again, just incredibly lucky to have even had the opportunity, one, to have got the free air ticket there because I couldn't have gone otherwise. And the fact that my parents somehow let me go as well.  Yeah, so that's awesome. And then you were able to just parlay that into more and more tickets to more and more events and just kept going from there. But what would you say did you have a secret to your success? Like, How did you just keep winning and stay on top of the game? Like what was your special sauce that you, is there something you can share? At that point as an amateur racing windsurfer glass, I think luck was a big part of it that I often had conditions that just perfectly suited My weight, cause I was really light compared to most guys, even in the classes,  but I also had a pretty unfair advantage of  training in Hawaii, where we've got, a pretty short period of time between 74 and 76. I probably had  twice as much water time as almost everybody else in the event who came from places where it's seasonal, or cold and, not very much wind, in Hawaii, you've got that trade wind.  At least enough for a,  an old Winster where you could sell every day. And so then the hours that I had under my belt, even as a little kid.  I think really helped and then  I'm just pretty focused as well. I wasn't there for the fun. I wasn't there for the social aspect. I was there to  do the best I could do. And I hated losing even as a little kid. And so I was pretty driven to try to succeed, to avoid that feeling of losing. It wasn't the thrill of winning. It was really that the fear of losing that was a big driver for me. But again just lucky good conditions. I was really good at picking up boards. Like you show up at the event and there's this huge pile of boards cause it's a one design, right? Everybody's racing with, here's a sail, here's a dagger board, here's a mast, a boom. Base and go pick up a board out of the pile.  And it wasn't really super technological. Then they had a plastic shell. They'd stick a big metal rod in the back of the board and pump it full of expanding foam, pull the rod out and the board blows up into the mold. And so  some boards would weigh 40 pounds. Some boards would weigh like 45 pounds. The rockers were different. And most people didn't even have a clue. And I'd spend a half an hour in the board area, picking it up, every board, looking at the rockers and trying to find the lightest board that I could. Usually the lightest boards were underblown and also then had the flattest rails and flatter rocker as they're overblown, they'd get round.  And I was just amazed that, all these adults running around hadn't a clue. No idea that was the case, but I'd go around and look for that magic board. And go, Oh, this is the one. And then  I refoiled my dagger boards. The dagger boards were made out of wood and they were just like super Mickey mouse. And so I'd refoil my dagger board. I'd travel with a rasp and a file and sandpaper and make my dagger board, like a really nice foil.  So yeah, just, I don't know, maybe took it more seriously than a lot of the guys that were there to just have fun. I just listened to another podcast of and you talked about. That you actually learned German at Punahou school when you're at school. I always assumed that you learned it from your parents or something like that. Growing up, but you actually learned in school. And I guess that's because you could speak German that like Germans always loved you and you're like a big sports star in Germany. When I was growing up, like everybody knew Robbie Naish, yeah, again, it was lucky to be, to have those three years at Punahou. And then  I was saying earlier, windsurfing turned pro through all those years on winds class I was in amateur. And in those days,  amateur professional was this absolute  black line. If you earned $1 as an athlete, you were a pro and you couldn't go to the Olympics. And the wind went in the Olympics in 1984, so I graduated in 81.  And it happened to be the year that the sport turned professional. There are all these manufacturers now there was money, there were pro events, and I had to make that decision. Do I stay an amateur, go to college  and then try to get to the Olympics in 84  on the wind glider, which was a piece of crap. Different brand at Windsor, or do I turn pro and see where that takes me? So I deferred admissions to college for a year and went pro,  but yeah, again, it was luck I went to Punahou and it's you had Japanese, Chinese, Spanish, German, French, and all these options for foreign language. And I'm like I knew some Germans, through windsurfing, I had some like pen pals some German friends that started writing me early on. But the 1770s were all taking German  and everyone was like, oh you're crazy German's so hard. I don't know. It made sense and again it was luck. I had this teacher, Frau Nehler at Puno Frau Nehler's so hard. She's so mean and I thought she was just awesome and I actually learned, from her, I, or  so much. And so I use that, through the eighties,  windsurfing just boomed in Europe, as Germany was,  and then still is always the world's biggest market for these sports. And so it really gave me an advantage, promotionally connecting with fans and going to the German events, going to ISPO, going to Dusseldorf Messe.  And And I had fun with it as well, like I'd sit around and listen and people didn't, in the beginning, know, even realize that I knew what they were saying. And then slowly started speaking, get to go on German TV shows and slowly, speak more and more. And now I'm, I wouldn't say I'm fluent, but I'm pretty much conversationally at least  fluent. And it's helped my career again, just right place, right time, lucky decision.  And yeah.  Yeah, I guess it's funny because my our kid goes to Puno, they're going to graduate this year and Puno always brags about how high their percentage of kids are that go to go on to college. So you're probably one of those failures that didn't make it to college.  Never made it, fortunately.  But yeah, I wouldn't say that you're a failure though in life. So I can't see that. Yeah, sometimes going to college is not necessarily the best thing for everybody, right? Yeah, I certainly wouldn't be where I am today if I had gone to college. Okay. So let's talk a little bit about starting your professional career. So I guess you were torn between becoming professional, going to the Olympics and then what, when did you start making money with windsurfing? Like when did that become your job?  Yeah, pretty much before I graduated from high school, even we had our first pro prize money events. So I wasn't taking any sponsor money, but we had two events,  the Maui speed crossing, which Arnaud Derozenay put together, which was a race from Fleming Beach on Maui over to Molokai around that little, rock island on the east coast. Yeah. Coast of Molokai, a little bit like I don't know, a little Mokomanu, and then back to Maui.  It was a full on open channel race and he thought he was going to smoke everybody. A bunch of us flew over from Oahu  and I won that and it was a thousand dollars prize money.  And so I'm like, Oh, I didn't know what to do. So I donated  half of it to the U. S. Olympic Committee and half of it to the U. S. Olympic I can't remember, but I donated all the prize money so that I could retain my amateur status because I was still trying to figure out what to do. And then it,  almost immediately there were announcements of other pro windsurfing events with prize money around the world.  And I had at that point, again, luckily at the same time sponsors offering me contracts. My first paid sponsor was O'Neill Wetsuits.  And  then Mistral  and then Gastrin had just, everything started to fall into place where I said, okay, forget it. I was going to go to University of Santa Cruz, UC Santa Cruz.  And deferred. Said, okay, I'll give it a year, see where this takes me.  And fortunately, I'm still giving it a year. Every year and seeing where it takes me. Did you did you have an idea of what you wanted to study if you went to UC Santa Cruz?  Yeah, I was really into art and did a lot of art through school, sculpture, glassblowing. I've been airbrush painting since I was a little kid,  but I knew I couldn't major in art. So I was going to major in child psychology. I really like little kids. I like to babysit. I was like that weird boy that did the babysitting in the neighborhood because the girls were all irresponsible and I was responsible. That's  I was going to, at least the idea was I was going to major in child psychology and minor in art.  Wow. Okay.  Yeah, that's cool. Okay. So then you got sponsored and then I guess then also Quicksilver  became a big sponsor, right? Like how did that come about? , same thing. I  got connected with Quicksilver because some of the first big events in the sport were in Australia. We had the Rip Curl Quicksilver Classic in Torquay. And that started in about 82, 83, 84. We ran for several years. In Torquay, Australia, which was this tiny little surf town. If you go there now, you don't even recognize it compared to what it was in the early eighties, it's just giant, like everything else in the world. But Rip Curl and Quicksilver were right next to each other. Rip Curl only did wetsuits. Quicksilver only did board shorts and t shirts. I met the guys and at that point, obviously you could be. O'Neill and Quicksilver because O'Neill only made wetsuits. That was it. No t shirts, no clothing, no nothing. And Quicksilver only made clothing. So I was O'Neill Quicksilver for many years until they both grew and both started, Quicksilver started doing wetsuits, O'Neill started doing clothing. And after, several years of being sponsored by both, I had to make a decision  to go with one or the other and yeah. Was really good friends with the O'Neill family, Jack O'Neill, Pat O'Neill. It was tough to leave those guys, but made sense economically because at that point I had become an initial investment partner in the license for Quicksilver Europe. Four friends. And myself brought Quicksilver to Europe and formed a company in France called Napoli.  And we had the license for Quicksilver Europe.  And so I was one of the founding partners in that. And that grew and grew. We were the first Quicksilver in the world to really start doing non surf clothing. There was a short summer, so we started doing jackets and we started doing ski stuff. And I remember the neon clothing and all that. Yeah, the war paint overalls and all that stuff. That was a fun time. And we grew that company, to a pretty big company before we finally sold it to Quicksilver Inc, Quicksilver USA in 1981.  And Yeah,  again, nice.  Yeah. Okay. We don't really have time to talk about everything, but let's go into I guess the sponsorship thing, and actually when did your parents start that actual Naish brand? Because I know you didn't actually start Naish, the Naish brand, but like, how did that come about? Get started. Like, how did your parents get into making boards and all that? Yeah my, my dad started making boards in the garage, not even a garage, carport,  at our house in Kailua,  almost right away. He started windsurfing maybe,  I don't know,  eight or nine months after I did.  He he took sabbatical from teaching,  which is where, a teacher takes the year off and goes and gets further education and does stuff.  And so he took my windsurfer every day that I was at school and was down at Kailua learning how,  and he got really into it. And at that point there was a lot of room for improvement, especially in Hawaiian conditions on that big plastic windsurfer. So he started making boards in the garage.  In 77 already  and experimenting and playing around. And it was  not long thereafter 79.  He started, shaping more, doing more boards. And he did the Minstrel Naish board and the Minstrel Kailua which were put into production by Minstrel in Switzerland. It was a Swiss company at that point.  And then in 1980, quit teaching and started working for them full time.  And it was, I think they moved out of the garage and into the little warehouse on Hikili street in Kailua  in 79, and that's when Naish forwarded it. Was formerly started doing custom boards for other people and the custom board market grew and grew and grew and  ended up making a factory on Hikili street, full on custom board, every single one by hand, really different than today. But at one point where they were doing a thousand boards a year out of that little factory in Kailua and shipping them all over the world was, an amazing period in windsurfing during that boom through the  late 80s early 90s and everyone hand airbrushed and  It's a cool period. So they definitely started the brand and I was lucky to have, through my entire  pro career, the days of the Pan Am cup days into the world cup days.  Always the best boards in the world from Harold Leakey, who started working with my dad and my dad as a team.  And it wasn't until  the winter of  95, 96, that I started Naish sales Hawaii and started doing my own windsurfing sales. And the logo that you're still using today is basically the original logo. I mean that from the very beginning, right? That kind of that Naish. No, the script, the scripty Naish with the sail. I did for my parents. Oh, that was your artwork.  And then  the new one is different. It's not a script. But yeah, that was actually a little complicated because we had the awesome local, custom board business. And then I started that international sale business and called it the same thing. And there were trademark issues and whatnot in the beginning, but it eventually all worked itself out and became. One, one entity, one brand.  Yeah, I've got a sticker drawer right here. Let me grab one. So these are some of the current, currently used logos, but Robbie's gonna pull out an old sticker of his original logo.  That's awesome. So yeah, these are the  Remember the rice papers?  Yeah.  Oh, it's backwards for you guys, no? No, I can see it. Yeah. That's so cool.  So you actually drew this when you were probably an art student at Punahou school.  Yeah. Yeah, good  days.  Yeah. Really lucky. Okay, so you were a professional windsurfer traveling around the world and,  Sponsored by you got plenty sponsorship money coming in. So what made you decide, okay, I'm going to just start making my own sales or start my own business. Like how did that happen?  I was certainly not because  I ever want to do.  It was more of a necessity. The sales sponsor that I had been with my entire pro career, Gastra, at that time had been bought and sold and bought and sold several times.  And. It got to the point where it got sold again and the new owners were just taking it in a direction that I  wasn't comfortable with  and  we had a team of guys, myself, Pete Cabrini, Don Montague Pat Correll, an administrative guy. And we were all doing the work for gastro based here on Maui  and these new owners were going to just dismantle it and move everything to Hong Kong  and do all the development there, basically, get rid of the team guys. And I just was like, wow, this is,  it sounds super lame. I don't want to do that.  And  I didn't, it would have been weird to go to Neil pride, for example. After, years and years of one sponsor to switch. I wasn't that kind of guy. I never switched sponsors.  And  so I just said, fuck it. Let's do our own thing.  And I'll  just  bite the bullet, keep the team together, continue making stuff the way we want to do it.  And sorry to interrupt, but so Pete Cabrinha was part of that team and then he started his own brand later or like how?  Yeah several years later, once we started doing kites,  So Pete was marketing, it was obviously still involved with R and D and whatnot. So Don Montague was the main sale designer. Pete did marketing, graphics. He was always really I would say a gifted artist. He still is, now he's pretty much out of the industry and just pursuing his art and doing really well, but he's always been really creative.  And yeah, for the first several years, we, we started Naish Sales Hawaii  basically in, in 96  and it wasn't until 99 that we started doing kites and that's where everything really exploded for the 2000 season.  And it was just after that, that Pete got approached by Neil Pride to start doing Cabrini cause they wanted to do kiting, but they didn't want to do it with the Neil Pride brand. Because it was like this at that point between windsurfers and, oh, kiting's bad. And  like in the first couple of years, we were the only ones in the industry, and  of course they all came in after the fact, but for a while they were all pissed at me for doing kites because they thought it was bad for the windsurfing industry. So yeah. And Pete Cabrino was basically grew up with you in Kailua. Like you guys were always winging and working together in Kailua and stuff, right? Yeah. Yeah, he's a  couple of years older than me. You're like my brother's age, which when you're little is a lot, but of course, as we grew up, grew older, we became partners in crime,  did the tour together. He did the it was not the PWA tour. It started out as WSMA tour. And then  the WBA tour had a lot of name changes over the years. But in the first several years of professional windsurfing, Pete was, you The  Mistral gastro team with me, we traveled around and had lots of fun together. And then I guess most of your boards in the beginning were shaped by your dad, right? And then I think, when did Harold Iggy start making Naish boards? And I think Jerry Lopez made some boards too, right? Yeah Jerry was later on when we were doing stand up. And so  2000, after 2008, once we got into stand up, we worked together for several years. Still really good for friends,  but you have Harold that you started working with my dad quite early on. Early eighties  and, they were an unbelievable team, they kind of shape and come up with concepts and whatnot together. And then Harold would do the shapes and Rick would do everything after that, all the sandwich and laminations and  sanding and whatnot, and then they were literally  amazing, the two of them worked so well together, personality wise, craftsmanship wise, it was It was amazing.  And then Harold, unfortunately passed in 2012.  Yeah.  So who who does the board design now? Do you, are you directly involved or like how closely are you involved with design and so on? Yeah. Since I sold the operating companies a little over a year ago,  I'm less hands on every single thing that happens as there was before,  but Mickey Schweiger and I have been doing pretty much all the board designs for anything directional. Like I was doing all the directional kite boards and then Mickey and I were doing all the standups and all the windsurf boards the last several years. Different guys do the twin tips, Des Walsh and some of the engineers do the twin tip stuff.  And, Mickey's gotten to the point where he's  really good and doesn't really need me overseeing what he does. We've got such an incredible template of stuff, a legacy of shapes that we're building from.  And the way everything is digital now, there's no more hand shaping foam. There hasn't been, for really a long time, well over a decade. Yeah. So when you say that you designed the directional boards, like you actually sit in front of the computer and design the shapes and everything. Yeah. Cause yeah, really your design. I did every directional kite board for years. And, after Harold passed, we've pretty much been doing the boards.  Digitally ever since. And even a little bit before that, there was a transition from hand shape as technology improved. And we were able to duplicate things a lot more accurately doing it. On a shaping machine and sending digital files rather than sending plugs to the factory, having to digitize the plugs and then hope that the molds afterwards come out something like the plug that you had sent. And so it's much more precise now. And add a little bit of rocker or change the rocker line slightly or being able to do stuff like that. You can't really do that. Hand shaping it, obviously. Yeah. You can,  especially on bigger boards, it's a bit harder, when you're doing a five, one kite board, things are compact enough that you can make micro changes pretty easily without affecting other stuff, but we were doing it now. You can make incremental changes. You can make three prototypes. They're exactly the same except for one specific change on each one.  And know that you're not throwing in a bunch of other variables where you're like was it that was different or that was different? Then that kind of accuracy is.  Yeah, it is amazing to have  and,  yeah, so Mickey's handling the majority of the designs now and he just sends them to me and I check them over and we'll tweak them. But he's the one that's sitting, in front of the computer the vast majority of the time and I'm just giving him some checks going, yeah, you should have bought that tail or I think we should, carry that rocker a little further.  Whatever. And I still really enjoy that aspect of it. The design aspect has always been fun. As long as it doesn't become work.  Yeah. So let's talk a little bit about business. You were obviously very hands on and the running the business. You're basically the CEO. And then you said you sold a lot of it a year ago. So what's your involvement now? And are you still a part owner? Do you like, yeah. So what is your role in the business now? Yeah it's complicated. I just, I got to the point, cause we grew and grew over the years and it was always fun. It was never my priority. I was always in my head, a pro athlete, and I also had this business. And I wasn't living and dying from the business. I was living and dying from my pro athlete income.  And  I don't know if it was age or just time. You start to look at things differently as you get older, risk starts to become different, stress you handle differently.  We were always successful. We always made money, but I was just getting really worn down with the pressure of the business side of the business. I'm the only shareholder. I was self financed. I had no bank LC. I had no investment partners. So I was floating millions of dollars. Of risk capital in an industry where your margins are pretty fine. You're living and dying by a couple of percent. We're always successful and it didn't matter, but life changed. I got divorced. It changed my whole outlook on life and my financial situation as well getting older and looking at how much risk you're willing to take, and I just said, God, I've worked my whole life to get here. Liability risks becomes a factor that you worry about where you don't really worry about that when you're younger.  And the stress became unhealthy and, importers owing you money and dealing with factories and, just having that much money in  limbo all the time. The employees I love, but at some point you start to worry about your employees too and their livelihood. And if you make a mistake, it affects them and their whole families. And it just became this vicious circle of stress. And I became I think too conservative in my approach, my outlook, I became really protectionary, operating through fear rather than through through enjoyment on the financial side and on the risk assessment side  and just decided it was time to pull the plug on that aspect of it. I love design. I love working with the guys. I love the sports. I love riding. I love testing,  but It started to become real work and real stress. And  so I found a way out where I basically sold the operating companies. I sold Nalukai Incorporated, Pacific Border Sports. So I sold my US distribution company and I sold the  main international business. I still own the Naish trademarks I still own the brand  and can do, clothing and whatnot. And I'm looking at doing some different things there that seem fun. And working with the new owners under license. Kubis Sports out of the Netherlands, out of Holland, now runs the operating companies. And they work under license and I work with them, just helping them in any way that I can, trying to guide them,  especially in these first few years to keep what I hope is the right trajectory and keep the team stoked. And obviously they're changing a lot of things administratively and whatnot, but I think we'll be good in the end.  So yeah, it left all the fun stuff. I get to work with Mickey and Des and Noah and the crew. I get to, enjoy all the fun stuff. Testing and writing and doing photo shoots. But somebody else has the headache of financing the business and dealing with the importers and dealing with the deadlines and dealing with all the  tech sheets and all that stuff that was dragging me down. That sounds like a great great solution. And you probably still get the percentage for the licensing fee, right? So like you said, the real profit margin is only like a few percent anyway. So if you can make that same percentage without doing, having all the risk and the work, then that sounds great. Yeah. Good, good for you. So you enjoying life a little bit more. I just watched a YouTube video yesterday where you were super charging your engine on your VW bus and took a couple of days. It looked like of tinkering in your garage. To be able to have time to do stuff like that, that stuff you enjoy and you're passionate about, that's super important too. Yeah. Yeah, the quality of life for me personally,  it just, it was literally like popping the cork.  On a bottle that was about to explode.  And so I'm really enjoying riding again, everything. I'm kiting a lot, windsurfing a lot. I'm still, I'm doing standup a lot. I'm the only guy out there on standup sometimes, winging, winging all the time, foiling so really enjoying the sporting side. I'm way healthier. I'm more fit. I'm certainly mentally more fit. by not having to carry around the stress 24 hours a day that I was carrying around.  Spending, a lot of time with the family, flying to Kailua a lot, spending time with my parents who are both still around and doing great. My daughter Nani and my granddaughters live in Kailua, my brothers are still in Kailua. So going back and forth to Oahu a lot again.  So yeah, in general, knock on wood, again, it was the right decision at the right time. Really lucky to have been able to do it.  While I'm still young enough and healthy enough to do it. To be able to continue to love what I do and have the passion for the sports that are driving me through my whole life and so yeah, i'm Super blessed super stoked  and having a lot of fun at the moment. Yeah, that's awesome And it's so cool to when I look at your facebook page. You just still Actively involved in everything, windsurfing, kiting, stand up paddling, foiling, it's like you do it all and still doing it really well. So it's just a good, you're a good role model for a lot of older guys like, like myself too, but just like to be able to do all of that. And I think also, obviously a lot of the people that, the older windsurfers that kind of.  Participating a lot now are getting into wing foiling. And and this is supposed to be a wing full podcast, so we haven't really talked about wing foiling at all yet, but let's talk a little bit about that. How did you get into it? And then where do you think it's going? I was just thinking, the, that whole progression of wind surfing from the wind surfer to like foot straps and going shorter and riding waves. And that, and then doing the first four loop or something like that, it took like decades. And now in wing foiling, it's not even one season, they're going from like single rotation to now they're doing like triple rotation jumps and stuff like that. It's The progression is like so much faster. It's like on steroids. Yeah, so And then I guess wind surfing a lot of people said that it became too high performance for the average person, you know Where early on it was just like people just enjoyed cruising on a lake back going back and forth and light wind or whatever now That's not really cool anymore and so it that whole side of the sport died off and there's no easy entry into the sport Do you see the same thing happening in wing foiling or like how? Yeah. So where do you see when wing fulling going?  Yeah. It's doing energy yesterday and it was the same thing where, you know, windsurfing grew up  in  the time of magazines and trade shows and  development was nice and methodical and slow. You'd start working on something and you'd finish it, implement it into production and six months. It would be. At a trade show a few months later, it'd be in the magazines. The first time someone would see it when they'd get the magazine and, open it up and check it out.  Kiting was a transition from that into the beginnings of the internet. Stand up pretty much same thing. Most of the people in the beginning got their news and their information from magazines and.  Wing foiling is the only one that's from start to finish.  Sorry. Photo shoot guys. Does that mean we're running into our deadline here,  ? I know, I was just calling wing foiling  from the very beginning like that, that first shot of me riding up wind at Kaha on our first four six original wing surfer.  went  around the entire world that night, right? And that's what started it all. And every single progression is instant now. It's like you test something new, it's on the internet that night, the guys around the world are already, trying to do it the next day, both in terms of the gear and in terms of the writing. So the progression is so fast and we've got an entire information packet from a construction standpoint, from a development standpoint of all the other sports behind us, technically that are helping to advance the wing foiling equipment too. So the  experimentation is starting with a really high knowledge base. And I was hoping it would say simple, stupid for a long time because the longer a support stays like basic one model, slow changes, the healthier it grows, right?  But man, within I used to be the only guy at Kanawha. I'd be Mickey and I down there testing and trying stuff. There was nobody winging. It was like just us.  And within a year, there were like  20 guys. And now you go down there, there's a hundred guys. It's everybody's wing foiling. It's amazing how fast it's grown. And if you look at the progression, like you said, of the moves, what the kids are doing.  You see a kid who started winging five months ago and he's already doing back loops and trying all the rotations and  it's super awesome.  But it is unfortunately with 60 brands already worldwide, everyone's stand up in the beginning where it was like, Oh yeah, here, I'm going to get into this business. It's already so flooded and so crazy.  That, it is what it is, and it's helping to grow it even faster.  It's a shit show at the moment in this race to advance and make it higher tech and higher performance and more expensive and more complicated and more technical.  And I'm like, Oh, slow it down. But you can't, once that genie's out of the bottle, it's gone. And the stuff is getting higher and higher tech, more and more complicated, more and more expensive, higher and higher performance.  But of course, there's still the basic, most people are going to get on a board. They're going to get a simple wing and they're. They're going to mow the lawn back and forth and that essence of just gliding on the water using the wind and especially how accessible winging is that you can do it with almost no wind. You can have really good fun in dead flat water. You don't need any waves at all. Like kiting in the beginning, but even more accessible, I think, because you don't need. 30 meters of area. You don't have this, arc of death with your kite. You don't have trees and buildings and power lines that are an issue. Winging is just so easy and accessible that aspect of it, I freaking love the fact that it's getting people on the water, like you said, older guys, it's the only sport at the moment where you see 70 year old guys getting into it and seven year old kids getting into it and everything in between and all of them stoked  and. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, unlike standup paddling, that was like never really a cool thing with young kids or whatever, but it's like wing foiling, like surfers are getting into foiling and then that gets them into wing foiling and just like the, yeah, wing foiling just seems to have a much broader appeal to everybody. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just so much more. I think also just having the wing not attached to the board. It's just so much more freedom to do things and do new moves that you can't even think about doing on a windsurfer, right? Yeah, it's really opened up the playing field. Racing is unbelievable. So high performance. It's the most accessible foil. Sailboat  in the world by far, and even in racing stuff is cheap compared to if you're going to go, look at the price of a moth or something like that, and the complexity of most foil sailing craft,  so super fast, super high performance, easy to learn, quick to learn. And then just what you can do with it, from racing and speed to the wave stuff is absolutely insane. When you see what Cash and these guys are doing on actual breaking waves I want to stay the fuck away from white water. It scared the hell out of me on a foil, foil surfing. I want to be out on the shoulder on a nice flowing bump,  but I don't think foil should be in the surf with surfers. I think that's freaking crazy. And even on a wing, I want to stay as far away from surfers as I can because even the good guys are going to eventually make a mistake and surfing with Ginsu knives is a bit scary. But just that realm of options that you have with this sport of just going out on a lake and. I love just going out on a big wing of 556070 and almost no wind at all. And just cruising around and exploring. That's still super fun. And you can do that anywhere, any little lake, Bay, whatever.  So yeah it's an awesome sport. Yeah. Yeah, no. And it's interesting to how stand up paddling blew up during the financial crisis, like 2008, 2009 and stuff. And then wing foiling blew up during the pandemic and became super big, really fast, probably faster than any other sport. The growth rate, but it seems like also this the whole cycle is accelerating. Like you said now It's like kind of everybody has like piles of inventory and the in the market has Seemed like it plateaued really quickly. And and now it's like it's a it just changed so much in the last two years that how is that I guess you, you don't have to worry about it too much business wise, but but we've seen it, at our shop we went from having 50 percent of our sales being foil equipment. Now it's maybe 10 percent and we're doing more standup again, which is interesting, like it seems like that's making a comeback. Is that the same for you guys or?  Yeah, ours has been pretty balanced and, we're, we were the first in  winging, so we were doing a lot of wings from the very beginning and  I anticipated the glut  that was coming after COVID, you could tell that everybody was bumping up production at the factories.  And you could see that there was going to be way too much inventory. Because when everybody was home  with free time and free money from the government, not just in America, but all over the world, they're sitting around. They weren't allowed to travel. They weren't allowed to spend money on other things. They had to do something close to home. Getting, Like here's some free time and some free money. So everybody bought, new tires for their truck and a lift kit and, wing stuff and foil stuff. And of course that had to end at some point, people have to work again. They don't have the free time anymore. So a lot of people that wanted to buy those toys had already bought them. But how many, you're not going to buy a new oil every single year.  And yet all these companies were just pumping as much as they could to, you get it on the ground.  I think there was, by about, eight, nine months ago, there was like a three year supply of wings on the ground around the world, right? All the major brands, three for nine 99, like  crazy, close out stuff, cause they just needed to turn up the inventory into cash. Naish wasn't so bad because there was an anticipation that it was coming. It was still not great. There was still, of course, when everybody else goes on closeout, You're expecting to go on and close out as well, regardless of how much stock you have. And that's already healing itself. Some of the bigger brands are having real hard times now because they thought that trajectory was going to continue. And of course it doesn't. I was always really pessimistic in business. I'd always  plan for the worst and hope for the best. And a lot of other people just go, yeah, we're all in. And  that's not a healthy way to run things, so there's some unhealthy brands out there at the moment even some pretty big ones. So  it's not going to be this way forever. It's like snowboarding and being everybody gets in, stand up at the beginning, everybody gets in and they do a couple of containers of stuff and then they realize, wow, business isn't as easy as I thought it was going to be. And it settles back down.  But yeah, stand up, like I love stand up, I don't understand how all these guys that used to go stand up aren't doing it anymore. It's just as much fun now as it was in 2010.  It's just less crowded. All good. And like you were saying how accessible wing foiling is, but in comparison to that, stand up is 10 times easier. Like any, but any overweight old American  tourist on the stand of paddleboard and paddle in flat water. If the board's wide enough and big enough. So it's not like foiling is definitely a little bit more take some skills and some water.  knowledge or you have to be a little bit into it,  terms of accessibility, I think stand up is still probably the most accessible sport for almost anybody, right? Yeah. It's a recreational activity more than a sport at this point. So about 90 percent of the boards being sold in the world are inflatable. If you go to Europe, it's all inflatable. I was in Austria last Last summer  there were like a thousand standups out on this one tiny lake that I was doing a thing on and it's awesome It's getting people on the water and a certain percentage of those people stay with it end up buying a composite board or you know they're  Associated then with board riding water sports and they get into other things whether it be kiting or winging or whatever So whatever is getting people out on the water is a good thing  It's a good thing. But I also, I hate  having people associate an inflatable water toy with standup paddling to me. It's just not the same thing, but yeah, I guess I just get people out on the water and just putz it around on the lake. Yeah. You might as well, there's no reason for it to have a 3, 000. Carbon race boards might as well take an inflatable. It's going to do 90 percent the same thing out in the waves, like what we have, totally different story. Yeah. And then it sits in the garage for the rest of the year. After, I use it one or two weekends in the summer. So yeah, for that, I guess it does make sense. Can see that.  Yeah. Do you feel like when wing foiling has already plateaued or what where's it going? Is it growing?  It's still growing. It's not growing at the pace. There's always that explosion in the beginning where you get that people coming in from other sports. That the crossover guys like, like me that are coming from kiting or windsurfing or whatever, and they're always the first in. And then you get that boom of the next guys and  we've had that. And now it's slowed down to what's I think a more constant flow. But the fact that the demographic is so proud is it's going to continue. The fact that kids want to do it.  Middle aged people want to do it, older guys want to do it,  girls want to do it, women want to do it. I mean it's absolutely appealing to the broadest group of people that any of the sports that I've ever done has.  And that  lends itself  to a pretty healthy future. You're not going to tap out your demographic quickly. It's not all 60 year old guys with money. It's not all  the fact that so many young people want to do it shows really good promise for a healthy future. Yeah, and it's such a great way to get into foiling too. People that are curious about foiling, I always tell 'em like, obviously maybe going toying behind a boat or jet ski and maybe e foiling is a little bit easier for total beginners, but then wing foiling is really the next natural choice to, to figure out how to use a foil, right? Yes, I, to me, it's the easiest way to learn. I've gotten people up on a foil in  half an hour, a few times back and forth on a stand up paddle board, telling them the right things, getting them on the foil board and they're up and riding, in that first day. But yeah, we have some recommendations.  Prone or stand up is so much harder than winging. Yeah. Yeah. So what are some recommendations like for total beginners in terms of equipment and some tips that you give people when, like you said, first, learn the wing handling on a standup  and with a dagger board ideally. Yeah. You even not just, most people just  want to jump on the water and jump on the board too quick.  You spend a lot of time with the wing on the beach until you really understand the dynamic in both directions. When the tip starts coming down, how do you get it back up? Just learning that feel of the wing and the wind. And then getting on a board and combining it without the foil. So you're doing two things at once, not three. And then once you've got it where you can go in and out, both directions comfortably, and you're not fumbling with the wing all the time, then you move on to the foil. And then remember to keep, keeping that pressure straight down on the foil. I was trying to tell people, you're not trying to take off like an airplane. You're trying to pressurize the foil. And that's really different about getting that, that wing loaded under your feet. So any lateral pressure, like windsurfing is bad. You don't want to pull to the side, you want all your pressure straight up and you're just trying to load the foil and not power it up and take off like that. That's where people just, crash and you'll see him doing the same mistakes for days and days. Or if you just. Dial them into what the feeling is that you're looking for.  It can come really quick. And so just the main mistakes people are making is trying to go too small, too quick. Don't learn the wing yet and try and get on the board. And then using too small a board, too small a foil too quickly, let it, come to you and  you'll outgrow your stuff  relatively quickly, but there's always a friend that wants to learn. That'll take your bigger, older stuff. Especially having a big stable board that you can stand on comfortably without having to like water start underwater or whatever. That's You've been on this prone foil board or something like that. It's yeah, a lot of guys say, Oh, I gotta be on a little board. It's way more cool. I'm still writing a floater. Most of the time, obviously I can write a 30 or 40, a 50, a 60. I've got whatever I want. And the vast majority of the time I'm on a 72 liter. Cause I want to get up. If I fall between waves, I want to get up before the next wave. I don't want to be up to my chest, bouncing my wing off the reef, trying to get going. And so there's,  yeah, I mean to each their own, but there's definitely that, that oh yeah, smaller is better, which isn't necessarily the case unless you're doing rotations. And of course you want as little board as possible. And then, yeah I watched that video where you're riding the South Shore I think La Perouse Bay, and you said, look, you like to have the foil really far forward using actually a fairly bigger size foil, so you can pump back out and and then you, and your back foot's way behind the mast and stuff like that. So talk a little bit about how you like to set up your gear that's different from how other people use it, yeah, it's really hard to generalize because with so many brands of foils back there in the market there's really a difference in lift. I can say, oh yeah, I ride an 840 most of the time, but my 840 and that 840 might be really different. Where the wing lines up on the fuselage, where the lift point is in comparison to the mast is really different from brand to brand. Yeah.  But in general, I like to have I want to have my feet. and my weight on that pendulum point, like a teeter totter,  right? You can put a sandbag way over here on the teeter totter and stand here  and balance it,  right? But you're not gonna be able to do it too quickly. You're putting your weight here to balance that weight out that's here. And you can do it. And that's how most people are falling. Or you can put it here.  And have really quick  control of your fore and aft movement to follow the chop to catch things, when you're, and it's not just Whoa, leaning back and then it's going to come up. And then  I just like to be behind the mask with my foot so I can really quickly make those lift adjustments. I've noticed that a lot of beginners ride with too much, like where they have to put too much pressure on their back foot. Where as you get better, you realize you want to have just equal pressure on both feet. You don't want to have to lean on your back foot all the time. You get to get tired and you're not balanced, right? Exactly. It's just trim, just having that comfortable between the feet balance so you can carve. You're not using the rail, but, so to speak, you can. you can control that pitch fore and aft side to side really easily when you find that balance point like standing on a ball and if you can stand right on the middle of the ball and have quick  access control in every direction for me at least it makes it way more fun than being back here And having it fast in one direction, but slow in the other. And then foils, I still ride a pretty big foil. Most of the time, my guys will be out on five 50, 600. And I'm most of the time on an eight 49, 14, even lighter winds, a 10 40. If I'm going on a lake and cruising around, I'm not trying to race anyone, it's flat water, there's little bumps, I'm going to catch that little bump and have more fun on it with a 10 40 than I am on a 700.  Yeah, again it's not that race to be as small as possible, but bragging range. Oh, I'm on a 450 and a 30 liter board. All right. You're just going back and forth the same as I am. It depends on your weight, depending on your conditions, depends on the wind, depends on what you're trying to accomplish.  The good thing is it's all good. It all works, so another thing I wanted to ask you is right now it seems like the hottest thing in foiling is down, downwind foiling, like everyone's getting into that, buying the long boards and bigger foils, that kind of stuff. And what's your take on that? What, how do you feel about downwind foiling? Do you do it at all? Or  not really? I'd rather.  poke myself in the eye with this, but that's just me. I never understood the appeal. Obviously, I could do it. I'll go and I'll go with Mickey. I'll test,  but I've never been a downwind guy, even in the days of stand up. I'd go, I'd test boards, I'd write a 14, I'd get on an unlimited and just not understand the appeal. I've just never been.  And even now with foiling, you're flying. Guys are coming down the coast. It looks like they're  getting pulled by a spaceship. They're going so fast. Then when you go and do it, to me, you're still just trying to keep up with the ocean  and the ocean's like trying to pass me. It just doesn't feel fast. It looks fast watching other guys do it, but then I'll go and do it and we'll do a full on downwinder on a 40 knot day. And it still just doesn't feel. I don't know. I'm too spoiled of being powered by the wind, I think. And  it's too much work, not enough reward. The whole drop the car there, drop the car there thing. It's too much time. I get it. I understand the appeal. It's awesome. That's so many people are doing it. Maui is just a constant flow of guys. I know when I went to Oahu, Diamondhead all day long, guys are coming down from Black Point around to Tongs. It's fricking cool. But I personally, yeah, maybe I'm just not old enough yet when I get older, I'll get into downwinding another, when I'm 70 I'll embrace it. But right now I'm having too much fun just blasting around.  Yeah. And I think a lot of people don't realize how difficult it is. They're like all gung ho about it. And then they end up buying the longer board and the bigger foil because they can't do it on the. The equipment they got first and then they realize, Oh, and then, it's, it can be so frustrating if you can't get up on foil and you're just like paddling this tippy foil board all the way down when it's like, Oh yeah, talk about a heart attack. Yeah. So it's not as easy as it looks, I would say to people that  wing foiling is definitely the The easier way to have fun more, more quickly.  A lot less work. And then you can do downwinders winging, and then at least if you come off the foil, you're right back up.  Yeah, it's still cool. Thanks so much. I know you have to go, but I guess just give let's talk a little bit about your time management. Like we talked earlier, like you make time to fix your car for two days and, do things like that. So how do you Yeah. How do you make time to, to have a conversation like this and with your busy schedule and and how do you prioritize things and right now, just, trying to put as little  on the calendar  in the future as possible, I used to have just commitments all year long, like I, okay. September, I'm there in October, I'm there in November, I'm there. And I'm being a lot more selective to what I commit to so that I can be flexible.  I love being able to wake up in the morning and  not even look at the forecast. I'm not fucking hunting wind grew and looking for this. Going back to how it was before. See what the day brings. And then make the most of it to a certain degree. Be on the computer as little as possible. And everyone's Oh, you see that swell coming Monday? No, I haven't looked.  So how's it look? Awesome. Just trying to be more stoked and fluid and be flexible. Which I'm really enjoying, okay, let's go to a while. Oh, my daughter's doing a volleyball game there. I'm going to go to that.  Yeah just try to be organic, flexible, make time for not just bringing relentless testing, testing all the time. But no, I'm not going to work on my car today. Like I've got one of my cars semi taken apart right now. And that's be my next project. A lot of work in the yard, enjoying working around here. Got a little orchard, watching the fruit grow. Watch our first harvest of avocados on the way. Just, yeah, trying to enjoy life. Try and be a good friend. Good boyfriend, good dad, good son,  good grandpa. All those things that you can lose track of. And, knock on wood, I'm in the luxurious position where I can do that. A lot of people can't, they're, they have to just fucking work  two jobs all day, every day and have a hard time getting their head above water. And I appreciate that. And I know how lucky I am to be in the position that I'm in that I can enjoy those other aspects of life.  And in my head, like I said, I'm still a pro athlete. I'm 61 years old. I  do a lot for Red Bull. I love working with them. It's like a family at this point. I've been with them for so long.  And I love I, I heard in another interview that you actually got into Red Bull because it benefited like the vitamin D or something like that. And then I just wanted some free products to start with. Yeah. So that's that's where it started. I drink it every single day. I've drank more Red Bull in the last 30 years. And it's I absolutely love it. But I love everything the company is all about as well. And so I do a lot of sharing it like internally speaking to athletes around the world, doing athlete summits and whatnot, sharing about the functionality of the product and how to use it to your benefit.  And just the legacy and the history and where we came from. Yeah, it's an amazing story with an amazing founder. Yeah. Enjoying being an athlete and still being able to do what I love. My mind and body are allowing me to keep basically playing and having fun. So I'm sharing it with other people. Sharing with Stoke is important to me now too. Sending positive messages. I don't drink, I don't smoke, don't do drugs,  try and live clean. Live life honorably. And that, that seems to be difficult for a lot of people these days, I know it sounds like you have a really good balance between, your professional life, your work life, and then also personal  family and enjoying, enjoying things. So when you go out in the water, is it more for fun or you feel like you're also, like you say, pro athlete and marketing and all that kind of stuff? A lot of fun because I don't really put pressure on myself. I don't have to do anything. I don't have to post on youtube. I don't have to so like you'll see periods of time where I don't do anything at all And i'll get into it and post a bunch of stuff and it's fun Okay, I don't want to do that anymore. I don't want I don't want to be part of that whole  Freaking me, it can Become unhealthy. I don't think it's a positive thing personality wise. Going, Oh, how many legs do I have? And I just, it brings out the worst in us. Arrogance is not a positive trait. Self promotion is not a positive trait. Humility is a positive trait. Humility doesn't get you very far in the world of social media. So if you want to sponsor it, like that's the thing that a lot of sponsors want to see how many followers do you have and whatever. That's what athletes today have to be on social media and stuff like that. Yeah. And I heard you talking about that too, like how you dislike social media and so one of the kind of sometimes disconnect from your cell phone and stuff like that. And I think that's such a big thing now for the young people, especially during the pandemic, everybody got hooked on their devices and it's a huge social issue, I think. But yeah. And back in the day when you first went. As a 13 year old went to Bahamas, there's like I remember those days when you traveling, you can't be like, Oh yeah, just text me or call me when you get there. It's you don't know, like you have to have a place and a time to meet. And if the person's not there, then you're like, okay, maybe I can send a letter or call, call someone somewhere else.  Yeah. It was really different. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of benefits to it, but there's some disadvantages to it as well. It's certainly in many ways, not healthy. The amount of communication and yeah, but it is what it is. Got to deal with it. Make the best, navigate that path in as healthy a way as possible. Yeah, so I know we're going over time already. So what's your plan today? What are you  doing? I'm heading down right now to cool out and go shoot. Wing foiling actually we're doing some video over The last week into this next week for next year's stuff and it's it's sunny and windy and flat because here on Oahu, it seems like there's no wind at all right now. So I guess, yeah,  it's always windy here. Yeah. Maui always gets windy. So cool. Yeah. Thanks so much for your time and really enjoy the conversation. And maybe we can do it again one day.  A lot more questions.  Maybe when I come over to Oahu, we can do some of the beach. This is. You sitting in your office?  In my office?  Yeah. I started the podcast during the pandemic, so Zoom was like, great way to talk to people, but don't really have to do that anymore. So yeah. Let's do it in person next time. Yeah I was even gonna say in, I'll just come over to M and  come along in the photo shoot and check it out and take some pictures or whatever, but yeah. There you go. Yeah.  Next time.  Right on. Okay. Have a great rest of your day. Thanks so much.  I appreciate it. All right. Any, any last met last minute message to the weight and folders out there or the water sports world you want to say to everyone?  No every day on the water is a good day. So Yeah, get out there. Don't be a wave hog,  but yeah, have fun and hopefully we'll see you out there  Yeah, share and enjoy Right on. Thank you, Robbie. Yeah, stoked. I gotta go get it. Right on.  Alright, so as always, I really appreciate everyone that watches the show all the way to the end on YouTube, or listens to it as a podcast. I really appreciate you guys and girls out there, all the wing foilers and water sports enthusiasts. I hope I'm keeping the stoke alive for you and I'm hoping to do more in person interviews as well in the future. I've been super busy doing stuff so not as much time for the shows but I do have some people I still want to interview. Some of the big names in the sport,  so I'm not done with this show yet. I'm going to keep it coming. I was super stoked to get Robbie Naish on the show. I'm going to try to meet up with him again, hopefully in person next time. So yeah, just keeping the information flowing and the stoke going. And this summer is going to be super exciting for me. I'm doing the I'm going to do Maui to Molokai to Oahu races on a wing foil board. And then the following week, I'm also going to do the Molokai to Oahu on a regular stand up paddle stock race board. Stay tuned. Busy training right now. Also working on a book, stand up paddling for dummies. So that's going to come out in the future. And I have a little bit less time for the show, but just trying to do everything and live life to the fullest and get out on the water as much as I can. Hope you stay stoked out there. Thanks so much again for watching. See you on the water. Aloha. 

Aloha friends, it's Robert Stehlik. Thanks so much for tuning in to the Blue Planet Show. Today's show is extra special. I got to meet with Jimmy Lewis. Derek and Lucas and I visited his workshop in Haiku in Maui,  where We, he showed us his whole workshop, gave us a full tour, showed us his house as well. He even gave us t shirts and signed them. This is the t shirt he gave me.  So that was a super fun trip and I highly recommend watching this one on YouTube.  I'll post it as a podcast as well if you're doing other things. But the visuals are great. He shows us the full tour of his factory, his dust collection system, how to shape a board from basically hot cutting it with a hot wire cutting the blanks installing inserts foil tracks his philosophy on shaping and how he was inspired by sea planes when he developed some of the early foil boards. and showed us a hydrodynamic plate mount that he developed for the air chair and then how to get sharp edges when you're glassing, how to shape a twisted V tail. So he's not holding back, sharing whatever he knows. So cool  of Jimmy to give us all the details.  And at the end of the interview, I'll also make some special announcements about the Molokai race, a couple other things. Stay tuned to the very end. Thanks so much for watching, and without further ado, here is Jimmy Lewis.  Tell me again about the design and how you came up with that kind of, the, this guy, Vitor Marcal, he's a lifeguard captain on the North Shore now, right? And he's been a lifeguard for as long as I've known him. I've known him for a little over 20 years. And he was one of the first guys foiling  when Laird first started foiling and using the boots, to bolt themselves onto the board and those air chair foils. They had like snowboard bindings, right? Yeah. So they just And so Vitor was pretty progressive on it, to know  that he needed to adjust his foot straps sometimes or his bindings. So he had me put these tracks on. And, Vitor was really good. He could do jumps and backflips on a wave with that air chair, and he'd said, Yeah, when I jump up, jump, and I come down for a landing, my board would always stick. And he asked me what kind of  shape could I do so it wouldn't stick so much.  And the first thing I thought of was a seaplane, because they're made to  land on water.