Coach Sam Butler: Inside Gazelle Elite and Building OTQ Athletes from the Ground Up

Rebecca Schmitt joins Road to the Trials after a breakout performance at the California International Marathon, where she placed sixth overall and ran 2:28 to secure her Olympic Trials qualifier. Balancing a full-time career as an engineer with high-level training, Rebecca’s path to this moment has been anything but linear.In this episode, Rebecca shares her progression from a 2:55 marathoner running 40 miles per week to competing at the front of a national championship field. She reflects on stepping away from the sport due to disordered eating, finding her way back in her late 20s, and learning how to pursue big goals without letting running define her identity.The conversation dives into her CIM race, where a collaborative pack of women worked together through halfway before turning it into a true competition over the final miles. Rebecca talks about the mental shift from running by pace to racing with others, and how that helped unlock her 2:28 performance.She also shares insight into her training, including moderate mileage, key workouts, and the role of data in her approach. With new goals on the horizon, including a potential 10K Olympic Trials qualifier and continued growth in the marathon, Rebecca is just getting started.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error. Use code "Trials26" for 15% off at precisionhydration.com.Wahoo continues to redefine indoor training with the KICKR RUN treadmill, designed to respond dynamically to how athletes actually run. With features like automatic pace control, terrain simulation, lateral tilt, and seamless connectivity to platforms like Zwift and Strava, it delivers a more realistic and engaging training experience. Trusted by world-class runners and triathletes alike, Wahoo builds tools that keep athletes training smarter, not just harder. Use code "Trials28" for a free heart rate strap at wahoofitness.com.

Head coach Sam Butler joins Road to the Trials to share how he’s building one of the most exciting emerging marathon groups in the U.S. through Gazelle Elite. Based in Michigan and supported by Gazelle Sports and adidas, the team has quickly gained momentum with multiple athletes qualifying for the Olympic Trials and many more knocking on the door.Sam walks through the origins of Gazelle Elite, from a local idea to support West Michigan runners to a growing program focused on marathon development. He explains why the marathon became the team’s primary focus, how he evaluates athletes beyond just times, and what it takes to develop consistent, long-term success in a “blue collar” training environment.A major theme of the conversation is individualization. Sam shares how no two athletes on the team train the same, and why communication and trust matter more than any specific workout or mileage number. He also dives into how the team balances athletes at different stages, from those chasing their first OTQ to those already qualified and aiming to be competitive at the Trials.The episode also explores the less visible side of performance, including mobility, strength work, nutrition, and the importance of staying healthy over long training cycles. Sam emphasizes a process-driven approach, where stacking small habits and staying consistent ultimately leads to breakthrough performances.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error.Wahoo continues to redefine indoor training with the KICKR RUN treadmill, designed to respond dynamically to how athletes actually run. With features like automatic pace control, terrain simulation, lateral tilt, and seamless connectivity to platforms like Zwift and Strava, it delivers a more realistic and engaging training experience. Trusted by world-class runners and triathletes alike, Wahoo builds tools that keep athletes training smarter, not just harder.

JP Flavin joins the show after a breakthrough win at the Marathon Project and a massive leap forward to 2:09. His journey hasn’t followed a traditional path, but that’s exactly what makes it compelling. From a solid but not standout college career to becoming one of the top American marathoners, JP has built his success through consistency, self-awareness, and a willingness to evolve.JP shares how his approach to racing is shifting from chasing times to learning how to truly compete. After years of focusing on hitting splits and executing pace, the Marathon Project marked a turning point where he trusted his instincts, made moves late in the race, and ran for the win.A key theme in this conversation is understanding what works individually. JP explains how his training has evolved within the Hansons system, leaning into higher quality mileage and faster daily paces while still trusting the structure around him. He emphasizes that there’s no single formula for success in the marathon, and that belief in your approach is just as important as the training itself.The conversation also dives into the mental side of marathoning, from managing expectations after a breakthrough performance to navigating the comparison trap in a sport where everyone’s training is visible. Through it all, JP keeps the focus on long-term growth, learning from others, and continuing to build toward future goals.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error.Wahoo continues to redefine indoor training with the KICKR RUN treadmill, designed to respond dynamically to how athletes actually run. With features like automatic pace control, terrain simulation, lateral tilt, and seamless connectivity to platforms like Zwift and Strava, it delivers a more realistic and engaging training experience. Trusted by world-class runners and triathletes alike, Wahoo builds tools that keep athletes training smarter, not just harder.

Matt Lenehan joins Road to the Trials after qualifying for his third Olympic Trials, most recently breaking 2:16 at CIM. What stands out most about Matt’s journey isn’t just the progression from 2:38 to sub-2:16, but how he’s approached running the entire time: with consistency, curiosity, and a commitment to keeping it fun.Matt shares how his progression has been steady rather than explosive, built on years of simply showing up. He talks about why he avoids overthinking races, often running without checking his watch, and how trusting effort over splits has helped him perform at his best.A major theme throughout the conversation is community. From early training groups in San Francisco to his long-standing connection with Peninsula Distance Club, Matt emphasizes that running with others is the most important factor in improvement. He believes that finding people faster than you, and enjoying the process together, matters more than any specific training plan.The conversation also explores Matt’s approach to racing and training philosophy. He discusses being “workout agnostic,” focusing less on the exact structure of workouts and more on effort and consistency. He also reflects on the difference between external goals like qualifying times and internal satisfaction, highlighting how the meaning of a performance can shift depending on context.Beyond the roads, Matt talks about trail racing, cycling, and creative projects, including his unique running videos inspired by skate culture. Through it all, he keeps returning to the same idea: longevity in the sport comes from finding ways to enjoy it.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error.Wahoo continues to redefine indoor training with the KICKR RUN treadmill, designed to respond dynamically to how athletes actually run. With features like automatic pace control, terrain simulation, lateral tilt, and seamless connectivity to platforms like Zwift and Strava, it delivers a more realistic and engaging training experience. Trusted by world-class runners and triathletes alike, Wahoo builds tools that keep athletes training smarter, not just harder.

Emily Saul joins Road to the Trials for a thoughtful conversation about the mental side of racing and what it takes to pursue big goals without letting pressure take over. A sports psychologist based in Boston, Emily works with athletes at every level and brings both professional expertise and personal experience as a marathoner to this conversation.This episode explores the psychology behind chasing time-based goals like a Boston qualifier or Olympic Trials standard, and how athletes can stay connected to the process instead of getting consumed by the outcome. Emily shares her perspective on fear, motivation, focus, and how runners can define success in a way that supports both performance and growth.Emily also talks about the unique mental demands of racing, from handling nerves on the start line to staying present during a marathon, and how athletes can build practical mental skills in training instead of waiting until race day to figure it out. They also get into how pressure, identity, social media, and outside expectations can shape an athlete’s experience for better or worse.Whether you are chasing a personal best, a major qualifier, or simply trying to become a stronger and steadier competitor, this conversation offers a valuable look at the mindset side of the sport.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error. Use code "Trials26" for 15% off at precisionhydration.com.The Marathon Project returns December 11–13, 2026 in Chandler, Arizona, offering one of the fastest, most athlete-focused marathon experiences in the country. The event features a Gold Wave amateur race on Saturday and the professional race on Sunday, giving runners the chance to race fast and then watch some of the best athletes in the sport compete the next day. The course is flat and criteria-style with pacers every five minutes from 2:20 to 3:30, bottle service, bag drop, and a top-tier race experience designed for performance. The Gold Wave is open to runners who have run under 3:30 since 2022, and last year 81% of finishers hit their Boston Qualifier. Registration is currently $400 but increases to $500 on April 1. Visit themarathonproject.com and use code roadtothetrials (all lowercase, no spaces) to save $25 on your entry.

Kristoffer Mugrage joins Road to the Trials to talk about his journey through multiple Olympic Trials cycles and what it takes to build a career in the marathon over the long term. Kris first came close to the Trials standard at CIM in 2019, missing by just seconds, and has steadily improved since then through years of high-mileage training and consistent racing.Kris shares how his confidence as a marathoner grew through races like his win at the Columbus Marathon and his breakthrough performances at CIM. He reflects on finally making the Olympic Trials in 2024, the lessons learned from racing in the challenging Orlando conditions, and the balance between chasing fast times and competing for wins.The conversation also dives into Kris’s training philosophy, including years of gradually building toward extremely high mileage and why patience is essential for endurance development. Kris talks about learning to embrace the marathon process, experimenting with training cycles, and what gives him confidence that faster performances are still ahead.After recently running a personal best of 2:14:59 at the Marathon Project to secure the Olympic Trials standard, Kris is focused on continuing to compete at a high level, with Boston Marathon up next and his eyes set on bringing his best performance to the 2028 Olympic Trials.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error. Use code "Trials26" for 15% off at precisionhydration.com.The Marathon Project returns December 11–13, 2026 in Chandler, Arizona, offering one of the fastest, most athlete-focused marathon experiences in the country. The event features a Gold Wave amateur race on Saturday and the professional race on Sunday, giving runners the chance to race fast and then watch some of the best athletes in the sport compete the next day. The course is flat and criteria-style with pacers every five minutes from 2:20 to 3:30, bottle service, bag drop, and a top-tier race experience designed for performance. The Gold Wave is open to runners who have run under 3:30 since 2022, and last year 81% of finishers hit their Boston Qualifier. Registration is currently $400 but increases to $500 on April 1. Visit themarathonproject.com and use code roadtothetrials (all lowercase, no spaces) to save $25 on your entry.

This week on Road to the Trials, Peter Bromka talks with Macy McRowe, whose marathon training looks very different from the typical elite approach.Instead of the standard 7-day training cycle, Macy structures her training around a 14-day schedule, often running long only once every two weeks and mixing in significant cross training alongside limited running volume. Despite the unconventional structure, the approach helped her finish 6th at the Indianapolis Monumental Marathon.Macy shares how this training style developed, why it works for her body, and what it takes to compete at a high level while doing things differently than most marathoners.They also talk about her background in Division III running, her progression through the half marathon to the full marathon, and how she thinks about pacing, training balance, and long-term development.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error. Use code "Trials26" for 15% off at precisionhydration.com.The Marathon Project returns December 11–13, 2026 in Chandler, Arizona, offering one of the fastest, most athlete-focused marathon experiences in the country. The event features a Gold Wave amateur race on Saturday and the professional race on Sunday, giving runners the chance to race fast and then watch some of the best athletes in the sport compete the next day. The course is flat and criteria-style with pacers every five minutes from 2:20 to 3:30, bottle service, bag drop, and a top-tier race experience designed for performance. The Gold Wave is open to runners who have run under 3:30 since 2022, and last year 81% of finishers hit their Boston Qualifier. Registration is currently $400 but increases to $500 on April 1. Visit themarathonproject.com and use code roadtothetrials (all lowercase, no spaces) to save $25 on your entry.

Zach Kreft joins Road to the Trials after a remarkable 2025 season that included five marathons and a major breakthrough at the California International Marathon. After narrowly missing the Olympic Trials standard at the Chicago Marathon with a 2:16:30, Zach returned later in the year and delivered a huge performance at CIM, running 2:13:05 to secure his place at the Olympic Trials.Zach shares what it was like to stack multiple marathons in one season and how each race helped build toward his breakthrough. Despite working a full-time job in the technology industry, he’s found a training approach that balances serious racing goals with a sustainable workload.The conversation dives into how Zach structures his training, why his schedule looks different from many elite marathoners, and how confidence from earlier races helped set up his big day at CIM. His story is a great example of patience, consistency, and making the most of each opportunity to race.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error. Use code "Trials26" for 15% off at precisionhydration.com.The Marathon Project returns December 11–13, 2026 in Chandler, Arizona, offering one of the fastest, most athlete-focused marathon experiences in the country. The event features a Gold Wave amateur race on Saturday and the professional race on Sunday, giving runners the chance to race fast and then watch some of the best athletes in the sport compete the next day. The course is flat and criteria-style with pacers every five minutes from 2:20 to 3:30, bottle service, bag drop, and a top-tier race experience designed for performance. The Gold Wave is open to runners who have run under 3:30 since 2022, and last year 81% of finishers hit their Boston Qualifier. Registration is currently $400 but increases to $500 on April 1. Visit themarathonproject.com and use code roadtothetrials (all lowercase, no spaces) to save $25 on your entry.

Felicia Pasadyn joins Road to the Trials after qualifying for the Olympic Trials Marathon in New York City with a 2:35 performance—her third marathon and part of a rapid progression from 2:49 to 2:44 to 2:35. At just 23 years old, Felicia brings one of the most unique backgrounds in the field.A former Harvard swimmer who later swam while completing her master’s at Ohio State, Felicia spent most of her life focused on the pool before rediscovering competitive running. Now a newly graduated medical student awaiting residency placement, she balances elite-level endurance training with one of the most demanding academic paths imaginable.Felicia shares how her swimming background shaped her aerobic engine, why she caps her running at about 50 miles per week, and how heavy cross-training and strength work form the backbone of her marathon preparation. The conversation highlights a different model for endurance success—one built on efficiency, creative training, and a willingness to challenge conventional mileage-based approaches.It’s an inspiring look at a young athlete who seems to do everything quickly—whether it’s finishing medical school in three years or progressing rapidly in the marathon.

Ethan Shuley joins Road to the Trials after running 2:07:14, the seventh fastest marathon in American history. At just 27 years old and only a few years into serious marathoning, his rise has been fast, from 2:18 to 2:11 to 2:07 in a short window. But as Ethan explains, the breakthrough didn’t happen overnight. It’s the result of years of trial, error, and steadily applying simple principles at a very high level.Peter and Ethan dig into what actually changed: training progression, volume, patience, and learning how to execute the fundamentals consistently. They talk through the difference between knowing what works and fully committing to it.Ethan also shares how living and working in Japan shaped his approach to the marathon, what he’s absorbed from Japanese racing culture, and how that contrasts with the American system. With roots at BYU and connections to elite training groups in both countries, he offers a unique perspective on what it takes to move from “promising” to historically fast.This is a deep, marathon-heavy conversation about how big jumps actually happen and what it looks like when an athlete fully buys in.Thank you to our sponsors:Precision Fuel and Hydration helps athletes take the guesswork out of fueling by breaking performance down into its essential components: carbohydrates, fluids, and sodium. Their science-backed approach allows runners to dial in each variable independently, making it easier to troubleshoot training issues and race-day execution. With extensive educational resources and practical tools, Precision supports athletes who want to fuel with intention rather than trial and error. Use code "Trials26" for 15% off at precisionhydration.com.Wahoo continues to redefine indoor training with the KICKR RUN treadmill, designed to respond dynamically to how athletes actually run. With features like automatic pace control, terrain simulation, lateral tilt, and seamless connectivity to platforms like Zwift and Strava, it delivers a more realistic and engaging training experience. Trusted by world-class runners and triathletes alike, Wahoo builds tools that keep athletes training smarter, not just harder. Use code "Trials28" for a free heart rate strap at wahoofitness.com.