#112 - CIAM with Stephen Cox

Rick Scot, Global CIO and CISO at Elevate Textiles, joins Jim and Jeff to talk about how he went from leading a data team to holding both the CIO and CISO seats at a global manufacturing company. Rick shares the moment that pulled him into security, how his tight-knit Charlotte cyber community shapes his thinking, and how he balances speed and control when the two roles pull in different directions. The conversation moves into identity for the age of AI agents: whether an agent is a human or non-human identity (Rick argues it's neither), who should own accountability when something goes wrong, and how session termination has to extend beyond turning off an account. Rick also digs into shadow AI, the real cost of tokens versus flat-rate licenses, and how he evaluates new identity technology against his organization's size and risk appetite. The episode closes with what excites and concerns him most about AI over the next three to five years, his advice for identity practitioners, and a lighter look at hobbies people wouldn't expect.Connect with Rick: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rickscot/Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.com00:00 - Intro and community shoutouts07:06 - Introducing Rick Scot, Global CIO and CISO at Elevate Textiles07:46 - How Rick got into cybersecurity09:22 - Charlotte's tight-knit cyber community11:18 - The moment that made security the focus13:06 - Balancing the CIO and CISO roles16:17 - What "Identity at the Center" means to Rick19:26 - Where to start when building an IAM program23:29 - Balancing risk and innovation with AI27:46 - Who should own accountability for an AI agent29:38 - A hierarchy for agent identities33:31 - Terminating access and sessions, not just accounts36:25 - Dealing with shadow AI41:37 - Standing up a governance process for new AI projects43:19 - Evaluating new identity technology and token costs48:51 - Training and governance around AI usage52:22 - Established vendors versus disruptive startups56:56 - Looking three to five years ahead1:00:20 - Advice for identity practitioners1:01:41 - Lightning round: hobbies and surprises1:08:40 - Closing and where to find RickIDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Rick Scot, Elevate Textiles, CIO, CISO, identity and access management, IAM program, identity governance, AI agents, non-human identity, agentic identity, shadow AI, session management, offboarding, token costs, Charlotte cybersecurity community, identity leadership

Jim McDonald hosts this Sponsor Spotlight episode of Identity at the Center, made possible with support from Twine Security. Jim is joined by Benny Porat, co-founder and CEO of Twine Security and previously co-founder and CTO of Claroty. Benny shares how his cybersecurity background led him into identity and explains the concept of the "execution gap," the space where identity teams are accountable for outcomes but lack the full business context to act on their own. The conversation explores Twine Security's AI digital employee, Alex, and how it differs from traditional automation and RPA, where AI-driven execution fits best within identity operations today, and the balance between the parts of a task AI can handle easily versus the harder remaining work. Benny and Jim also dig into governance and trust, including why least privilege matters even more for AI agents and non-human identities, how organizations typically start with read-only access before expanding permissions, and how access reviews and recertification could evolve as AI takes on more of the process. They close with reflections on measuring success, how the identity practitioner's role changes as more execution shifts to AI, and a lighter round on what a personal AI digital employee might look like.Connect with Benny: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bennyporat/Learn more about Twine Security: https://www.twinesecurity.com/Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at idacpodcast.com00:00 - Introduction and welcoming Benny Porat, co-founder and CEO of Twine Security00:52 - How Benny found his way into identity and access management02:21 - The origin of the name Twine03:28 - Defining the IAM execution gap05:53 - AI digital employees versus RPA and automation08:07 - Where AI digital employees are best suited today09:45 - Why AI is strong at eighty percent and what makes the rest difficult14:45 - Where a digital employee like Alex fits within identity operations18:43 - Trust, governance, and giving AI agents the right permissions21:42 - Applying least privilege to AI agents and non-human identities25:19 - How organizations start using Alex, from read-only to full execution30:27 - Rethinking the role of access reviews with AI involved33:14 - Measuring efficiency gains and revocation rate improvements36:00 - Addressing concerns about AI replacing IAM practitioners39:12 - How customers define and measure success44:15 - How the practitioner's day-to-day role changes with AI agents47:12 - Closing thoughts and where to learn more47:37 - Lighter note: imagining a personal AI digital employeeKeywords: IDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Benny Porat, Twine Security, Sponsor Spotlight, AI digital employee, Alex, identity and access management, IAM, execution gap, least privilege, access reviews, recertification, agentic AI, non-human identity, NHI, Claroty, IGA, PAM, governance, human in the loop

Jeff and Jim open with the unavoidable topic of AI agents and the tension between enabling innovation and governing agent permissions, then run through a packed fall conference schedule. The August mailbag pulls questions from Singapore, Toronto, Prague, Johannesburg, Helsinki, and Seoul. They discuss when externalized authorization makes sense, why passkey recovery can become the weak link in phishing-resistant authentication, what EU digital identity wallets may mean for enterprises, how continuous access evaluation changes the meaning of terminating access, and how to build resilience around a centralized identity provider without creating a second full-scale IdP. The episode closes with a lighter question: if every IAM product needed a giant warning label, what should it say?Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.com00:10 - Welcome and have we talked about AI too much?01:32 - Governing AI agents without becoming the progress prevention department03:50 - Fall conference season and IDPro04:40 - Cybersecurity Summits in Chicago and Atlanta06:40 - SailPoint Navigate, InfoSec World, FIDO Authenticate, and Identiverse DC10:40 - 3D printing, challenge coins, and superfan status11:56 - August mailbag begins12:19 - Singapore: Is externalized authorization ready for mainstream IAM?20:30 - Toronto: Passkeys, account recovery, and help desk social engineering25:55 - Prague: What should enterprises do about EU digital identity wallets?31:44 - Johannesburg: Continuous session revocation and what “terminate access” really means38:04 - Helsinki: Designing identity resilience around a centralized IdP45:23 - Seoul: What warning label should every IAM product have?48:26 - Wrap-up and how to send future mailbag questionsIDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, IAM, identity and access management, August 2026 mailbag, externalized authorization, authorization, policy-based access control, passkeys, account recovery, phishing-resistant authentication, identity verification, EU digital identity wallet, continuous access evaluation, shared signals, session revocation, token revocation, identity resilience, identity provider, disaster recovery, business continuity, AI agents, agentic identity, IDPro, FIDO Authenticate, Identiverse DC, InfoSec World, SailPoint Navigate

Jeff and Jim are joined by John Huyette, AI Risk Leader at RSM, and Omer Arshed, North American Digital Identity Leader at RSM, to explore how identity controls can help organizations manage the growing risks of AI agents. John introduces five laws for managing AI risk: governability, lineage and integrity, trust boundaries, authority containment, and human impact. The conversation connects those ideas to familiar IAM principles including ownership, auditability, zero trust, least privilege, just-in-time access, privileged access management, and continuous monitoring. They also discuss prompt injection, shadow AI, human accountability, and why organizations should start by building an honest inventory of the AI capabilities already operating in their environments.5 Laws of AI Risk: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7487942457075257344/Connect with John: https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-huyette-1373906/Connect with Omer: https://www.linkedin.com/in/omerarshed/Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.comTimestamps00:00 Introduction, 3D printing, and conference updates06:58 Introducing John Huyette and Omer Arshed07:52 John’s path from technology risk to AI risk12:11 Omer’s identity origin story13:43 The five laws for managing AI risk18:00 What “ghosts in the machine” means for identity20:17 Governability and ownership of AI identities25:17 Do you know what has access to what?29:43 Applying decades of IAM lessons to AI32:35 Lineage and integrity35:20 Building an AI bill of materials37:12 Trust boundaries and external data38:36 Prompt injection and untrusted content42:48 Applying zero trust principles to AI agents47:26 Authority containment49:56 PAM, least privilege, and just-in-time agent access56:22 Human impact and accountability58:41 Is agentic AI really a new identity problem?01:02:35 Starting with lower-risk AI use cases01:04:21 Where organizations should start01:05:07 Shadow AI and zombie accounts01:07:09 What excuses would an AI give during an access review?01:12:20 Wrap-upKeywordsIDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, John Huyette, Omer Arshed, RSM, AI risk, AI agents, agentic AI, AI governance, governability, lineage and integrity, trust boundaries, authority containment, human impact, shadow AI, identity governance, IAM, zero trust, privileged access management, PAM, least privilege, just-in-time access, non-human identity, NHI, prompt injection, AI identity, access governance, continuous monitoring

Recorded live at Identiverse 2026 in Las Vegas on June 17, Jeff and Jim are joined by Bart Allan, General Manager at Bravura Security, for a live recording with a studio audience. In a late-night talk show format, the three host an open Q&A driven by IAM practitioners in the room. From securing AI identities to whether access reviews are headed the way of the password, this is an unscripted conversation driven by practitioners for practitioners. Topics include identity as a business enabler, zero standing privilege, agentic authentication, standards for AI agents, vendor relationships, the captive customer problem, community, and hiring IAM talent. Thanks to Bravura Security for supporting the Identity at the Center podcast.Connect with Bart: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bartholomewallan/Learn more about Bravura Security: http://bravurasecurity.com/idacConnect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.com00:00:00 Welcome and Introduction00:03:00 AI Identities: Should IAM Teams Panic?00:07:30 Identity as a Business Enabler vs. Cost Center00:24:00 Continuous Identity and the Future of Access Reviews00:35:00 Zero Standing Privilege and JIT Access00:38:00 Standards for Agentic AI00:46:00 Vendor Relationships and the Captive Customer Problem00:55:56 Normalizing Rip and Replace01:01:00 IDPro, Identity Beers, and Building Community01:11:00 Agentic Authentication and Non-Human Identities01:18:00 Hiring IAM Talent01:26:00 Team Diversity and Multiple Perspectives01:27:00 ClosingIdentity at the Center, IDAC, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Bart Allan, Bravura Security, Identiverse 2026, Identiverse, IAM, identity and access management, identity security, AI identities, agentic identity, agentic authentication, non-human identities, NHI, access reviews, zero standing privilege, JIT access, continuous identity, IGA, vendor selection, identity community, IDPro, IdentiBeer, live podcast

Live from Identiverse 2026 in Las Vegas, Jeff and Jim sit down with Sachini Siriwardene, winner of this year's Kim Cameron Award, along with Ian Glazer of the Digital Identity Advancement Foundation (DIAF). Sachini shares how she moved from open banking API security into consumer identity work at a bank, and what led her to apply for the award named after identity pioneer Kim Cameron. Ian explains DIAF's mission to remove financial barriers to industry participation and previews the upcoming Vittorio Bertocci award for standards contributors. The conversation covers agentic AI and non-human identity governance, the AuthZen specification, continuous access management, and how practitioners can separate real AI capability from marketing hype. The group also swaps favorite hallway conversations from the show floor, including a discussion on extending the shared signals framework beyond RISC and CAPE, before wrapping with some very Vegas talk about the Sphere.Connect with Sachini: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sachini-siriwardene/Connect with Ian: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iglazer/Learn more about the Digital Identity Advancement Foundation: https://diaf.org/Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.com00:00 - Cold open and conference banter01:35 - Jim's origin story with identity and Kim Cameron03:22 - Welcoming Sachini Siriwardene and Ian Glazer04:02 - Ian explains the Digital Identity Advancement Foundation05:54 - How Sachini got into identity through open banking08:46 - The moment identity clicked as mission critical09:47 - Agentic AI and non-human identity governance11:25 - Optimist or pessimist on AI and the job market14:45 - Applying for and winning the Kim Cameron Award15:41 - How DIAF selects award recipients17:21 - Standout sessions and the AuthZen specification18:36 - First impressions of Identiverse20:01 - Advice for future award applicants22:03 - Managing agentic identity in practice23:16 - Separating AI hype from real capability24:32 - Where the identity industry can improve27:08 - Acting fast without chasing hype28:05 - Favorite hallway conversations29:23 - Extending the shared signals framework30:39 - A D&D themed conference talk31:08 - Vegas talk and the Sphere experience34:19 - Wrap up and how to support DIAFIDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Sachini Siriwardene, Ian Glazer, Identiverse 2026, Kim Cameron Award, Vittorio Bertocci Award, Digital Identity Advancement Foundation, DIAF, agentic AI, non-human identity, AuthZen, continuous access management, open banking, OAuth2, FAPI, shared signals framework

Recorded live at Identiverse 2026, Jeff and Jim sit down with returning guest Mike Kiser, Director of Strategy and Standards at SailPoint, for a wide-ranging conversation that spans two of the standards world's most active frontiers. The first half breaks down C2PA, the Coalition for Content Provenance and Authenticity, explaining how it differs from digital watermarking, how metadata and cryptographic signatures build a chain of custody for media, and why this work connects directly back to identity. The conversation then shifts to AI agents and the challenge of defining and governing intent, with Mike drawing an extended analogy to the early, under-regulated days of space exploration. The episode closes with reflections on the value of hallway conversations and community at Identiverse.Connect with Mike: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-kiser/Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.com00:00 Introduction from Identiverse 202601:00 Mike previews his two Identiverse talks01:35 What C2PA is and how chain of custody works06:51 Watermarks versus C2PA explained10:06 Why content provenance matters for identity14:22 Is C2PA a standard or a working group16:23 The SpaceX and space debris analogy for agent intent20:13 Governing agent publishing without stifling innovation22:00 Action Identification Theory and the how versus the why27:47 Can an AI actually have intent32:34 Why people humanize and fall in love with chatbots38:37 The case for locking down intent early39:39 Does intent change, or is it a new intent46:19 Favorite hallway conversations at Identiverse51:03 Wrap up and where to find MikeIDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Mike Kiser, SailPoint, C2PA, Content Provenance and Authenticity, Identiverse 2026, Shared Signals Framework, AI Agents, Agentic Identity, Digital Watermarking, Decentralized Identity Foundation, Intent-Based Access Control

This Sponsor Spotlight episode, made possible with support from Tuebora, features Jim McDonald in conversation with Sanjay Nadimpalli, CEO and founder of Tuebora. Sanjay shares his path into identity beginning as one of the first engineers at Aveksa, then discusses how intelligence is reshaping identity governance and administration by replacing static configuration with continuous, context-aware decision making. The conversation covers the concept of governance debt, how AI can interpret organizational intent expressed in natural language, and where human oversight remains essential. The discussion also explores governance of agentic identities, including how they differ from traditional service accounts, the challenges posed by their ephemeral and dynamic nature, and the policy-driven frameworks needed to manage them. Sanjay closes with a reflection on what identity practitioners should be thinking about for the next few years.Connect with Sanjay: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sanjaynadimpalli/Learn more about Tuebora: https://www.tuebora.com/idacConnect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.com00:00:00 - Introduction and welcome00:00:56 - How Sanjay got into identity00:02:40 - Full circle moment with Deepak Taneja and Zilla00:03:05 - What Tuebora does00:04:14 - The story behind the name Tuebora00:05:20 - Can intelligence replace configuration00:10:05 - Why static configuration falls short today00:14:52 - Customer frustrations with legacy environments00:21:09 - Comparing this to everyday AI tool use00:23:31 - How intelligence drives outcomes00:28:42 - Maintaining security control alongside AI00:32:38 - The orchestra analogy for AI and human roles00:35:28 - Introducing agentic identity governance00:36:10 - Why agentic identities differ from service accounts00:42:20 - The scale problem of agentic identities00:44:00 - Building a framework for agent governance00:47:35 - Closing advice for identity practitioners00:52:06 - Where to find Tuebora nextIDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Sanjay Nadimpalli, Tuebora, Sponsor Spotlight, identity governance, IGA, agentic identity, AI agents, governance debt, explainability, IAM, access governance, non-human identity, Aveksa, continuous governance, identity governance and administration

Recorded live at Identiverse 2026 in Las Vegas, Jeff sits down with Decoded co-host Sean O'Dell for a wide-ranging state of the union on continuous identity, shared signals, and the identity questions AI keeps raising. Sean shares what he is hearing on the ground about the upcoming transaction tokens spec, why continuous identity has moved from concept to mainstream adoption, and how shared signals are expanding into commerce. The conversation shifts to AI: the real cost of securing it, why model provenance matters, and the murky question of who is on the hook when an AI agent makes an expensive or harmful decision on your behalf. They debate companion agents, consent versus power of attorney, and whether the identity industry even owns this problem. Sean closes with a simple piece of advice for anyone feeling overwhelmed by AI right now.Connect with Sean: https://www.linkedin.com/in/seanodentity/Connect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.comTimestamps:00:00 Intro and a Decoded update00:44 Transaction tokens spec preview01:51 State of the union on continuous identity03:39 The questions organizations are asking04:34 Is it still all about the data05:07 Shared signals framework moving into commerce06:40 Is AI a fad at Identiverse this year07:11 The real cost of securing AI08:00 Model provenance and indemnity09:39 IAM for AI versus AI for IAM10:18 Trusting agents to act without oversight14:51 Assigning authority to the who and the what16:13 The cruise booking example and who is on the hook20:16 Companion agents, consent, and power of attorney23:00 Does the identity industry own this problem25:00 Relationship and intent as the real issue28:03 Could an insurance market emerge for agentic AI29:18 An access review scenario gone wrong30:41 Small specialized language models for identity tasks32:11 Favorite hallway conversations at Identiverse36:05 Wrap up and words of wisdom on AI FOMOKeywords: IDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Sean O'Dell, Decoded, Identiverse 2026, continuous identity, transaction tokens, shared signals framework, agentic AI, AI security, model provenance, IAM, digital identity, identity and access management

Live from the IDAC booth at Identiverse 2026, Jeff and Jim sit down with Pam Dingle, Director of Identity Standards at Microsoft, to unpack agentic identity. Pam breaks down assistive versus autonomous agents, walks through where standards like SPIFFE and OAuth hold up, and explains the difference between delegation, impersonation, and partition. The conversation also covers credential discovery risk, shared signals and revocation, what enterprises should prioritize now, and the value of hallway conversations at Identiverse.Connect with Pam: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pameladingle/OAuth Actor Profile for Delegation: https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-mcguinness-oauth-actor-profile-00.htmlConnect with us on LinkedIn:Jim McDonald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmcdonaldpmp/Jeff Steadman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffsteadman/Visit the show on the web at http://idacpodcast.comTimestamps:00:00 Intro and Identiverse 2026 vibes04:01 Defining agentic identity07:06 Has the earth really shifted11:38 An old problem thats been bejeweled15:13 From Nulli Secundus to Microsoft16:00 How standards are holding up19:27 Client ID metadata and just in time trust21:41 Shared signals and the revocation problem24:43 Deploying agentic identity at scale28:11 Registries at scale29:04 Delegation authorization and attenuation32:33 Delegation vs impersonation vs partition36:03 The one thing you can fix right now37:56 Favorite hallway conversation42:29 The solar system of hallway conversations45:51 Remembering Kim Cameron48:00 New voices to watch52:08 Wrap up and thank youKeywords: IDAC, Identity at the Center, Jeff Steadman, Jim McDonald, Pam Dingle, Pamela Dingle, Microsoft, Identiverse 2026, agentic identity, agentic AI, non-human identity, delegation, impersonation, SPIFFE, OAuth, identity standards, IAM, digital identity, workload identity