The Drone Ultimatum

Adam Chan is the Senior National Security Counsel at the Federal Communications Commission (FCC).Request an invitation to The Drone Ultimatum Summit 2026 at the link here! Follow the show!Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatumLinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniThe Federal Communications Commission plays a much larger role in American national security than most people realize.From regulating the radio spectrum used by drones to restricting foreign-made equipment, the FCC has become an increasingly important player in the U.S. drone industry.Adam Chan, Senior National Security Counsel at the FCC, joins Steve to discuss how the agency is approaching drone security, counter-UAS regulations, and the effort to strengthen American drone manufacturing. Working directly with FCC Chairman Brendan Carr, Adam oversees the agency’s national security portfolio and helps coordinate regulatory actions affecting communications technology.The conversation covers the FCC’s restrictions on foreign-made drones, including DJI, and the reasoning behind limiting new equipment authorizations for certain foreign-produced systems. Adam explains why he believes these restrictions will create opportunities for American manufacturers and help prevent the United States from becoming dependent on foreign suppliers for critical technologies.Steve and Adam also discuss the legal restrictions surrounding drone jamming in the United States, how the FCC is expanding opportunities for counter-UAS testing, and the circumstances under which state and local law enforcement agencies can employ electronic countermeasures. For defense startups, Adam explains the differences between developing drones for military customers and selling systems into commercial or law enforcement markets.The discussion also explores the FCC’s approach to foreign-made robotics, enforcement actions against companies attempting to circumvent equipment restrictions, and the importance of maintaining bipartisan support for national security regulations. Adam offers an inside perspective on how a relatively small federal agency is making decisions with significant implications for the future of American defense technology.

Matt Kling is the Vice President and General Manager of AI Systems at MatrixSpace, a company developing compact, low-cost radar systems for counter-drone defense, airspace monitoring, and autonomous operations.Matt on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewkling/MatrixSpace: https://www.matrixspace.com/Follow the show!Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatumLinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniIn this episode of The Drone Ultimatum, Matt joins Steve to discuss how MatrixSpace is approaching one of the most important challenges in modern air defense: detecting increasingly capable drones without relying on expensive, centralized radar infrastructure. They explore the company’s origins, its development of a one-pound radar, and its early deployment supporting autonomous police drone operations in Palm Springs, California.The conversation examines how drone warfare is changing the economics of air defense. As inexpensive drones threaten military installations and high-value equipment, Matt explains why scalable, distributed sensing networks are becoming increasingly important. They also discuss the growing interceptor market, the challenges of manufacturing defense technology at scale, and MatrixSpace’s work integrating radar with autonomous ground vehicles and counter-UAS systems, including Allen Control Systems’ Bullfrog.Matt also shares his perspective on AI-powered sensor fusion, processing information at the edge, and the limitations of traditional centralized command-and-control architectures. Drawing on his experience at Raytheon, Northeastern University’s drone research lab, and MatrixSpace, he discusses the transition from large defense programs to a venture-backed technology company.The episode closes with a broader discussion of the future of drone warfare, GPS-denied threats, mobile military operations, and the challenge of defending increasingly vulnerable forward operating bases.

What happens when a drone needs to navigate underground, inside a building, or in an environment where GPS is unavailable?Dr. Stefan Hrabar is the Co-Founder and Chief Strategy Officer of Emesent, an Australian robotics company developing autonomous navigation and 3D mapping technology. After completing his PhD in robotics at USC, Stefan spent a decade researching drone autonomy at Australia’s CSIRO before co-founding Emesent in 2018.Stefan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stefanhrabar/Emesent: https://www.emesent.com/Follow the show!Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatumLinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniIn this episode of The Drone Ultimatum, Stefan joins Steve to discuss how Emesent developed Hovermap, a LiDAR-based system that enables drones and ground robots to navigate and map complex environments without GPS. Originally developed for underground mining, the technology has expanded into defense applications, including subterranean reconnaissance, building mapping, and battlefield damage assessment.They also discuss the challenges of building and scaling a hardware company, from raising venture capital and managing manufacturing costs to protecting intellectual property. Stefan explains why Emesent relies heavily on trade secrets rather than patents, how investor attitudes toward hardware have changed, and what it takes to adapt commercial technology for military customers.The conversation also covers defense supply chains, NDAA compliance, international distribution, and the growing role of AI in robotics and software development.From converting gas-powered helicopters into autonomous drones in the early 2000s to building a global robotics company, Stefan shares his experience bringing advanced autonomy research into real-world applications.

Malin Crewse and LeGrand Crewse are brothers and co-founders of Corvus Industries, where LeGrand serves as CEO and Malin as CTO. Corvus is developing small, low-cost kinetic interceptors designed to counter drones at ranges where electronic warfare and existing missile systems can fall short.Corvus Industries: https://corvusind.com/Malin on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/malin-crewse-268642ba/Follow the show!Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatumLinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniThe conversation covers Corvus’ counter-UAS interceptor, why fiber-optic drones are creating new demand for kinetic defenses, the importance of affordable mass, America’s interceptor stockpile problem, missile manufacturing, seeker technology, solid rocket motors, and the challenge of building systems capable of defeating maneuvering targets.They also discuss what it’s like building a company as brothers, splitting founder equity 50/50, cashing out retirement savings to fund the company, learning how government procurement actually works, and why successful defense companies may eventually be pushed toward becoming multi-product businesses.

Derek McBride, Portfolio Manager in the Autonomous Warfare portfolio at the Department of War Innovation Unit (DIU), joins the show to discuss how the Pentagon is approaching drones, autonomy, and the defense industrial base.Derek on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/derekmcbride/DIU Website: https://www.diu.mil/Follow the show!Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatum⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/They break down DIU’s role in defense acquisition, the $1.1 billion Drone Dominance program, and how challenge-based acquisition is being used to identify systems that work—and can actually be manufactured at scale.The conversation covers FPV training, resilient drone supply chains, U.S. manufacturing, counter-UAS systems, interceptors, electronic warfare, autonomy, swarms, private capital in defense, and the economics of modern drone warfare.

Josh Giegel is the Founder and CEO of Gambit AI, an autonomous systems software company building technology to coordinate teams of robots. Before founding Gambit, Josh worked at SpaceX on the Merlin 1D engine and co-founded Hyperloop Technologies, later Virgin Hyperloop. Ben Richardson, Gambit’s Chief Commercial Officer, brings a military and defense innovation background to the company.Josh on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/josh-giegel/Ben on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/benjamin-richardson-92029b5/Gambit: https://www.gambit.us/Follow the show!Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatum⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/In this episode of The Drone Ultimatum, Josh and Ben explain why the growing number of autonomous platforms creates a new problem: coordinating them. Rather than building another drone, Gambit is developing the orchestration layer that allows different autonomous systems, payloads, and platforms to work together toward a common objective.The conversation covers one-to-many control, AI-enabled electronic warfare, autonomous kill-chain workflows, ISR optimization, drone motherships, and the integration of aerial, ground, and maritime autonomous systems. Josh and Ben also discuss why future battlefields could increasingly become “robot engagement zones” where autonomous systems operate in areas too dangerous for humans.They also get into the business of building a defense startup: selling pure software to the government, working with traditional primes instead of treating them as competitors, surviving long procurement cycles, managing burn, and turning demonstrations into actual contracts.Josh also reflects on his path from SpaceX to Virgin Hyperloop to Gambit, what he learned scaling a company to hundreds of employees, and why building a software-focused defense company is a very different proposition from developing capital-intensive hardware.

Brian Taylor is the Founder & CEO of Lux Aeterna, a startup developing the world's first fully reusable satellite for high-tempo, reliable, and flexible timelines in orbit.Brian on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianjtaylor/Lux Aeterna: https://www.luxaeterna.com/Follow the show!Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatumLinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Brian joins Steve to discuss why falling launch costs are changing the economics of space and why he believes the next step is moving beyond satellites designed around attrition. He explains Lux Aeterna’s approach to operating fleets of reusable spacecraft and how bringing vehicles back creates new possibilities for rapid iteration, payload delivery, hypersonics, and in-space manufacturing.They also discuss the role SpaceX played in reshaping the space industry, why Brian believes dual-use space companies should often start with defense customers, and how government R&D funding can help early-stage hardware companies establish flight heritage before expanding commercially.The conversation moves into Brian’s experience as a solo founder, including how he structures his leadership team, hires experienced aerospace engineers, and thinks about fundraising. Brian also explains why raising money is not the same as winning and why founders should focus on investors who genuinely align with their worldview rather than trying to convince everyone.They close with lessons from hardware development, live demos, failure investigations, and why Lux Aeterna actively looks for engineers who have already experienced the full lifecycle of putting hardware and software into space.

Read the Global Drone Threat Report (2026): https://dronesec.com/resources/d479e340-f78f-11f0-ab58-9fListen to our first podcast with Mike: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2utl1hG9FcMike Monnik, founder and CEO of DroneSec, joins The Drone Ultimatum to explain what his team is seeing across the global drone threat landscape—from fiber-optic FPVs and jet-powered attack drones to maritime systems, humanoid robots, and drone-enabled gray-zone operations.DroneSec tracks how militaries, terrorist organizations, cartels, and other actors use drones, along with the tactics and countermeasures developing around them. Mike explains why that intelligence matters when a tactic that works today may look completely different a year from now.Follow the show!Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatum⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/

Bohdan Volyanyuk is the co-founder and COO of Autonomous Cyber, a company building autonomous capabilities for offensive cyber operations.Bohdan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bohdanvolyanyuk/Autonomous Cyber: https://www.acyber.com/Follow the show!Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatum⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Bohdan joins the show to explain how AI is changing the cyber kill chain, from discovering vulnerabilities to weaponizing exploits and conducting operations. He argues that cyber should be treated as a persistent domain of conflict rather than something reserved for a small number of exquisite, highly planned operations.The conversation also covers the similarities between autonomous cyber and autonomous weapons, the offense-defense cycle in cyberspace, Stuxnet, the challenges of selling cyber capabilities to the Department of Defense, startup fundraising, the current tech investment environment, and how cyber operations could shape a future conflict with China.Bohdan previously served five years in the U.S. Army infantry, including deployments to Iraq and Syria, before attending MIT, where he met his co-founder and started Autonomous Cyber.

Alex Fink is the President & US CEO of Swarmer (NASDAQ: SWMR), helping drones fly autonomously, without pilots, and work together in large teams. Alex on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/temuchin43/Swarmer: https://swarmer.com/Follow the show!Steve on X: https://x.com/StevenSimoniSteve on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoniSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3F1sc8yzQIF9WcdHQ3w7kfApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-drone-ultimatum/id1770994541⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to our newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://thedroneultimatum.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://x.com/DroneUltimatum⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-drone-ultimatum/Our website: https://www.thedroneultimatum.com/Alex Fink is the President and U.S. CEO of Swarmer, a defense technology company developing software for autonomous drone operations. Swarmer grew out of Ukraine’s wartime drone ecosystem after Alex’s co-founder identified a basic scaling problem: militaries could build millions of drones, but they could not produce millions of pilots.Alex explains how Swarmer approaches swarming differently from coordinated or leader-follower drone formations. Instead of choreographing individual aircraft, Swarmer is building software that allows drones to act as independent decision-makers, communicate with one another, allocate tasks, and continue operating when their connection to an operator is degraded or lost.The conversation covers the rapid expansion of Ukraine’s drone industry, what autonomy means for electronic warfare, and Swarmer’s bet that military robotics will eventually resemble the early PC industry: many competing hardware manufacturers running a smaller number of common software platforms. Alex also explains why integrating software across different drones remains difficult and why engineers who understand both hardware and software have become a major constraint.Alex and Steve discuss how Ukraine’s wartime acquisition model differs from traditional Western procurement, why combat units can drive product adoption quickly, and what the U.S. and Europe can learn from that model. They also get into Swarmer’s decision to go public, the challenges of operating a public defense company, and the potential for consolidation across the growing defense technology ecosystem.The episode closes with lessons from the battlefield itself: why fiber-optic drones may be transitional, why militaries are pulling old weapons back into service to address new threats, and why today’s drone and counter-drone systems are unlikely to represent the final form of either technology. According to Alex, the industry is still in an active arms race where products can become obsolete faster than traditional defense development cycles can produce them.