CCEF Podcast: Where Life & Scripture Meet

We all want to be loved, accepted, and approved of by others. But when that desire becomes something we need in order to be okay, it can begin to shape our relationships, decisions, and even our obedience to God. In this episode, Gunner Gundersen sits down with Ed Welch and Mike Emlet to revisit Ed's influential book, When People Are Big and God Is Small: Overcoming Peer Pressure, Codependency, and the Fear of Man. Ed shares the story behind the book and how his exploration of the codependency movement led him to discover the rich ways Scripture speaks to our longing for approval. Together, they reflect on personal experiences with people-pleasing, consider how our desires can become demands, and explore how the fear of man shows up in everyday relationships. They also discuss practical questions that help uncover what we're looking for from others and how we can grow in love. Ultimately, the way forward isn't simply greater self-awareness, but a deeper knowledge of Christ—one that turns our attention from ourselves and others toward the beauty and greatness of God. Mentioned in this episode: - When Divorce is Mercy | book my Michael Gembola and Darby Strickland - When People are Big and God is Small | book by Ed Welch

When work feels repetitive, fruitless, or disconnected from our gifts, it's easy to wonder whether it really matters. In this episode, Gunner Gundersen talks with CCEF colleagues Lauren Whitman, Darby Strickland, and Todd Stryd about why even good work can feel meaningless. They explore how the brokenness of work, cultural expectations, and the temptation to find our identity in our jobs can shape our experience of our daily responsibilities. Scripture offers a different perspective: Work is a good gift from God, an opportunity to love our neighbors, and a place to serve the Lord—even when our efforts go unnoticed or produce little visible fruit. The conversation considers how to discern whether it's time for a job change, how to seek wise counsel and grow in self-understanding, and how to encourage loved ones who are struggling at work. Through the mundane and the difficult, God sees our labor, and in Christ, our work is not in vain.

Comparison and envy are such ordinary parts of human experience that we often barely notice them. But what do they reveal about our hearts, and how do they affect our relationships with God and others? In this episode, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Ed Welch and Aaron Sironi to explore how envy takes root in the things we value, from recognition and influence to relationships and abilities. They consider how social media can fuel comparison, how envy undermines love and contentment, and how it can expose our doubts about God's generosity. Rather than simply telling ourselves to stop comparing, we need something more profound: a renewed vision of Christ and all we have received in him. Through Scripture, gratitude, and a growing appreciation of God's character, we can learn to loosen the grip of envy, celebrate the gifts of others, and find our worth in Christ.

How should biblical counselors engage secular psychology and the many other voices seeking to understand human desires and motivations? In this final episode of our seven-part series on CCEF's distinctives, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes, Dr. Mike Emlet, and Dr. Todd Stryd to explore CCEF's seventh distinctive: "Biblical counseling engages with the voices around us." They discuss how biblical counselors can neither simply embrace nor dismiss other perspectives, but instead engage them charitably and critically. The conversation explores what it means to reframe, translate, and be provoked by observations from secular psychology and other sources, always interpreting and refining them through the question, "Who is the Lord, and what does he say?" The group considers practical examples from OCD treatment and trauma, as well as how this approach shapes pastoral care in the local church. Throughout, they emphasize that Christians don't need to be fearful of other voices or diagnoses. Instead, we can listen with curiosity, bring the richness of Scripture to people's experiences, and minister as fellow saints, sufferers, and sinners. Mentioned in this episode: - Explore or purchase our new course: Theology and Secular Psychology at ccef.org/school - Learn more about our beliefs and distinctives at ccef.org/about- Cure of Souls and the Modern Psychotherapies | Article by Dr. David Powlison - Saints, Sufferers, and Sinners: Loving Others as God Loves Us | Book by Dr. Mike Emlet

What makes the local church the natural home for biblical counseling? In part 6 of our 7-part series on CCEF's distinctives, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes and Ed Welch to discuss why care and counsel are pastoral and at home in the church. Together they explore the beauty of face-to-face ministry—the calling of every Christian, and the unique role of parachurch organizations in serving the local church. Along the way, they reflect on stories of faithful ministry, the ordinary conversations God uses to bring change, and the vision of a church where every member participates in caring for one another. Mentioned in this episode: - Explore CCEF books at ccef.org/book - Learn more about our beliefs and distinctives at ccef.org/about - Instruments in the Redeemer's Hands | Book by Paul David Tripp - Side by Side | Book by Ed Welch

In this fifth episode of our series exploring CCEF's seven distinctives, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes, Darby Strickland, and Lauren Whitman to discuss our fifth distinctive: "Help and change follow a path, but not a script." Together they explore the importance of dependence on the Lord and his work in the lives of those we help. They consider the importance of seeking input from others, the dangers of following a script, how to navigate our feelings of inadequacy, and why this distinctive matters for our local churches. Rather than fixing problems or changing others, our role is to be fellow travelers on the path God is already leading them on. Mentioned in this episode: - Read about CCEF's seven distinctives: ccef.org/about - Learn more about CCEF courses: ccef.org/school

Our circumstances, emotions, and relationships all shape us, but they don't define us. At the center of who we are is something deeper: the heart. In this fourth episode of our series exploring CCEF's seven distinctives, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes and Esther Liu to discuss what we mean when we say, "Our hearts are active." Together they explore how Scripture describes the heart as the center of our desires, fears, loves, worship, and choices. How does understanding the heart change the way we pursue personal growth, care for others, and participate in the life of the local church? The conversation moves beyond behavior modification to consider how God meets us at the deepest level of who we are. Jonathan, Esther, and Gunner share personal stories of how this distinctive has shaped their own walks with Christ and explain why curiosity, humility, and hope are essential when helping others. In this episode, you'll learn: • What CCEF means by "our hearts are active." • Why biblical change is more than changing outward behavior. • How desires, fears, and loves reveal what's happening in our hearts. • Why understanding the heart leads to deeper relationships and wiser care. • How this distinctive equips churches to cultivate meaningful, gospel-centered conversations. Mentioned in this episode: - Register for Dynamics of Biblical Change and our other courses at ccef.org/school- Learn more about our beliefs and distinctives at ccef.org/about Related Resources: - "How do I know when my actions are a result of sin in my heart or because of bodily weakness?" | video by Mike Emlet

Our bodies, relationships, culture, suffering, work, spiritual battles, and life experiences all shape us in significant ways. Yet none of these influences alone defines who we are. As image bearers created by God, we are embodied souls who live before him, responding to both blessings and hardships in a world full of competing influences. In this episode, Mike Emlet, Jonathan Holmes, and Gunner Gundersen continue CCEF's series on our seven distinctives by exploring the third distinctive: We are embodied souls shaped by a world of influences. Together they discuss: Why our bodies matter for faithful care How relationships, culture, and suffering shape our lives Why spiritual warfare remains an important reality in counseling The danger of reducing people to a single explanation or diagnosis How slowing down helps us care for people more wisely Why the local church is uniquely equipped to know, love, and walk alongside people in all their complexity This conversation invites us to see people more fully—and to reflect the patient, compassionate care of Christ as we walk with them. Mentioned in this episode: - Download three free talks on anger at ccef.org/free-audio-for-anger- Learn more about our beliefs and distinctives at ccef.org/about - Descriptions and Prescriptions | Book by Dr. Mike Emlet

CCEF's second distinctive states: "Scripture comes from the mouth of God." But what does that mean for everyday ministry, counseling, and relationships? In this episode, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes and Aaron Sironi to discuss how God's Word does more than provide answers—it shapes the way we listen, care, pray, discern, and walk alongside others. Together they explore how Scripture forms our priorities in counseling, helps us understand people, and serves as the lens through which we interpret both life and the world around us. The conversation also considers the richness of Scripture's many genres—from the Psalms and Wisdom Literature to the Gospels and Song of Songs—and how each uniquely equips us to care for others. Along the way, they reflect on parenting, marriage counseling, personal devotional life, and the indispensable role of Scripture in the life of the local church. Mentioned in this episode: Register for our conference at ccef.org/nc26 Learn more about our video series that equips churches to wisely handle domestic abuse: ccef.org/becoming-a-refuge Learn more about CCEF's Seven Distinctives Listen to Part 1: "The Personal God Gets Personal with Us"

In this first episode of a new seven-part series on CCEF's distinctives, Gunner Gundersen sits down with Ed Welch and Jonathan Holmes to discuss the first distinctive: "The personal God gets personal with us." Together, they reflect on how Scripture presents a God who draws near to his people: from the garden of Eden to the incarnation of Christ to the promised future where God will dwell with his people forever. The conversation explores how the Trinity shapes our understanding of relationships, counseling, church life, and personal ministry. These truths help churches to embody a "culture of pursuit" with warmth and hospitality as natural overflows of a real relationship with God. The episode also introduces CCEF's broader distinctives and explains why these priorities continue to shape the ministry's counseling, teaching, and care for the church. Mentioned in this episode: Our latest episode of the JBC: ccef.org/jbcOur distinctives: ccef.org/about/#distinctives Related resource: The Personal God | Article by David Powlison