“Before We Were Trans” with Kit Heyam

In part two of our festive end-of-year special, you will hear about queer families and mourning, gay novels and book festivals, cargo pants and Vaseline, and lesbians and travel. What’s the queerest thing you did in 2024? And how will you power bottom that in 2025?  References:Karen Tongson’s Norm PornAmber Jamilla MusserFeminist Keywords podcastAlexis Pauline Gumbs’ Survival is a Promise and UndrownedMabel MundyKerstin-Anja MuenderleinJack Strange’s Look Up, HandsomeGay on WyeOut and WildPigeon BooksLondon LGBTQ CentreBluestockingsLiz’s Book BarSweet Pickle BooksThe Ripped BodiceGay’s The WordHappiest Season  Victor Garber

In part one of our festive end-of-year special, you will hear about queer weddings and Madonna, intersex dinosaurs and PhDs, crafting and queer culture, and how all lesbians do kind of know each other. What’s the queerest thing you did in 2024? And how will you top that in 2025?  References:Hollis GriffinLibro.FmAshley Herring Blake’s Make the Season BrightBridgertonMaterial GirlsHannah McGregor’s Podcast or Perish and Clever GirlJurassic ParkTheoryishHannah AyresPaola Medina-GonzalezToshikazu Kawaguchi’s Before the Coffee Gets ColdMo MoultonSo Mayer’s Truth & Darelistenqueer.co.ukBlossom LGBTQThe Female GlazeKit SchusterMartha Wells’ The Murderbot DiariesMarquis Bey’s Black Trans Feminism

Fierce femme dinosaurs, intersex embodiment, Laura Dern – it’s surprisingly easy to read Jurassic Park as a feminist celebration of monstrous queer bodies, at least when you have the magnificent Hannah McGregor by your side. In Hannah’s ‘bookiest book yet,’ we learn about lesbian dinosaurs, the ignorance of white male adventurers, and how and why they’re erotically eviscerated for their flaws. Not to be missed!If you would like to observe us in the wild, follow us on Instagram: @hkpmcgregor and @queerlitpodcast.  References:Jurassic ParkHannah McGregor’s Podcast or PerishMaterial GirlsTheodor RexWhoopi GoldbergEmmanuel LevinasLaura MulveyHannah McGregor’s A Sentimental EducationThe Little MermaidUrsulaThe Last UnicornJen Sookfong Lee (Pop Classic series)Leah Lakshmi Piepzna-Samarasinha’s Femme Shark Manifesto!Terra nulliusLaura DernVerlyn Klinkenborg’s “What Were Dinosaurs For?”Prehistoric Planet with David AttenboroughEllen RipleyTales of the City@hkpmcgregor and @ohwitchplease (Instagram)Making Worlds podcast https://www.hannahmcgregor.com/Agatha All Along  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     Why/How can we read Jurassic Park as a feminist film?     What is the ‘monstrous-feminine’? How does Hannah speak about this? Can you find out which other scholar(s) we may associate with this term?     What does terra nullius mean? How is this relevant to Hannah’s reading of the film?     Lena calls Jurassic Park a queer ecology in the episode. Please name at least two reasons why this term might apply.     What does Hannah highlight about Indigenous and decolonial scholarship in relation to Jurassic Park?    How do you feel about Laura Dern?  

Have you thought to yourself recently: How come trans literature is having such a moment right now? Then this episode is for you. Sabine Sharp, editor of The Routledge Handbook of Trans Literature (2024), is joining me for a chat about the significance of trans literature today, as well as its roots and legacies, especially in the 20th century. Sabine speaks about the difficult implications of transness as a symbol of futurity in science fiction and contrasts a personal connection with 1970s feminist science fiction to contemporary frictions between some feminisms and transness.As you listen to this episode, we recommend transing transily through your house and following @queerlitpodcast on Instagram.  References:The Routledge Handbook of Trans Literature (2024)Material Girls podcastMaia Kobabe’s Gender QueerDouglas VakochThe Climate Deniers PlaybookRollie WilliamsNicole ConlanBecky Chambers’ Monk and Robot duologyMartha Wells’ The Murderbot DiariesJudith Butler’s Undoing GenderEman Abdelhadi and M. E. O'Brien’s Everything for Everyone: An Oral History of the New York Commune, 2052–2072Marge Piercy’s Woman on the Edge of TimeUrsula LeGuinPhilip K. DickCecilia Gentili’s Faltas: Letters to Everyone in My Hometown Who Isn't My RapistLittle Puss  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     How does Sabine describe the current moment in trans literature? Why do we need a handbook of trans literature now?     What might the relationship between trans literature and ecocriticism be?     Why is science fiction an interesting but also potentially problematic genre when it comes to depiction of transness and gender nonconformity?    What is Sabine gesturing to when speaking about the relationship between feminist science fiction and transness in the late 20th century and feminism and transness today?     What can we learn from trans literature?

How does your embodiment affect your perception and thus your writing? This is one of many questions Amber Jamilla Musser tackles in her most recent monograph, which builds on her brilliant work in Black feminism and queer femininity. Amber tells us how sensation and individual experience need to be part of an ethics of perception and why queerness is method that allows us to think capaciously and in connection with the body.Come and marinate in the unruliness of being with us! Follow @queerlitpodcast and @a_jamilla on Instagram for more.  References:https://www.amberjamillamusser.com/Sensational Flesh: Race, Power, and Masochism (NYU Press, 2014)Sensual Excess: Queer Femininity and Brown Jouissance (NYU Press, 2018)Between Shadows and Noise: Sensation, Situatedness, and the Undisciplined (Duke University Press, 2024)Queer Form (special issue of ASAP, edited by Kadji Amin, Amber Jamilla Musser and Roy Pérez)Keywords for Gender and Sexuality Studies (NYU Press, 2021)Feminist Keywords PodcastKaren TongsonAssociation for Study of the Arts of the Present (ASAP)Jordan Peele’s UsMing Smith’s Flamingo Fandango (West Berlin) (painted)Édouard GlissantRonak KapadiaStephanie ClareSharon Holland’s an otherTiffany Lethabo KingAlexis Pauline GumbsAudre LordeTitus Kaphar’s Pillow for Fragile FictionsAudre Lorde’s Zami: A BiomythographyMecca Jamilah Sullivan’s Big Girl  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     What does Amber mean when she speaks about masochism?     What might an ethics of perception be?     Amber speaks about how our bodily histories affect how we perceive. What is you bodily history?     Amber suggests that queerness is a method in Between Shadows and Noise. What does this method allow Amber to do?     How is knowledge embodied? Do you think about this when you read or write academic texts, which often suggest a neutral, disembodied perspective?

Have you heard of the wholesome queer Gothic? This is the cool new term that might just explain why so many of us were obsessed with monsters, witches, witches and vampires before we came out of the coffin, uhm, closet. Sarah Faber and Kerstin-Anja Münderlein join me for this spooky special to speak about their favourite Gothic books, games, and tropes, and about the amazing collection they co-edited. Tune in for seasonal reading recommendations and reflections on gender transgressions in Gothic narratives.  References:Rethinking Gothic Transgressions of Gender and Sexuality (Routledge, 2024)Horace Walpole’s The Castle of Otranto (1764)Ann Radcliffe’s The Italian (1797) and The Mysteries of Udolpho (1794)Daphne du Maurier’s RebeccaNaomi Novik’s Uprooted and The ScholomanceK.J. Charles’s Band SinisterVampire: The Masquerade -- BloodlinesBloodborneDark SoulsFallen LondonCastlevaniaSunless SeaDoppelgangerLara BrändleFranziska QuabeckCharles DickensAlycia GarbayGrace KingKit SchusterJennifer’s BodyDraculaEdgar Allan Poe’s The Fall of the House of UsherJulia Armfield’s Private RitesThe Hays CodeRuPaul’s Drag RaceHeartstopperCasey McQuistonBuffy The Vampire SlayerInterview with The VampireBrad PittNight CascadesHanako GamesCarolyn DinshawElizabeth FreemanKirsty Logan’s Things We Say in the DarkJuno Dawson’s Wonderland (2020)  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     Why is the Gothic both a genre and a mode? What do these terms mean?     What are typical tropes and features of Gothic writing?     Which century might we consider as an origin point of Gothic writing?     What is the wholesome queer Gothic?     What are male and female traditions of the Gothic?     What is your favourite kind of monster and why?            

Femme theory, bisexual butches, racy footnotes – the brand-new edited collection Queering Desire has it all. The brilliant editors, Róisín Ryan-Flood and Amy Tooth Murphy, join me for a chat about  what the book means to them and how challenging and rewarding interdisciplinary research on lesbians and sapphics can be. They dive into the multi-faceted contributions and how they matter to queer culture today and also generously share their personal experience in collecting the many gems that make up Queering Desire. Follow @roisinryanflood and @queerlitpodcast on Instagram to learn more!References:Holding Hands: Experiences of shame, pride and protest among LGBT relationship partnersCentre for Intimate and Sexual Citizenshiphttps://www.essex.ac.uk/centres-and-institutes/intimate-and-sexual-citizenshipNotchesEsther NewtonSally MuntAnne ListerLes FeinbergBillie EilishCharli XCXEleanor MedhurstSarah Joy FordSusan StrykerRosalind GillKimberley MatherMie Astrup JensenEl. Reid-BuckleyPhoebe Kisubi MbasalakiLiz MillwardMarie Lou DuretPrudence Bussey-Chamberlain #Ken PlummerAgnesElla Ben HagaiDominique Adams-SantosSkala EressosSapphoSadie LeeLibro Levi Bridgeman’s The Butch MonologuesJack Halberstam’s Female MasculinitiesLadies of LlangollenJosé Esteban MuñozK. Allison HammerGay’s The WordEsther Newton’s My Butch CareerBoots of Leather, Slippers of GoldPatricia Highsmith’s Carol (The Price of Salt)The Talented Mr RipleyAndrew Scott AlfredHitchcock Strangers on a TrainLillian Faderman’s Surpassing the Love of MenGrace Ellis’ Flung out of Space  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     The editors speak a lot about interdisciplinarity and their respective backgrounds in the humanities and in sociology. Which challenges and benefits of working across disciplines do they mention? Can you think of others?     Another important thread is queerness across different generations. How do you experience queer kinship across generations? What do you think the term ‘queer lineage’ might mean?     What might femme theory be? Please look up the term and see what you find.     What do the editors say about online and physical queer space?     Which essay of Queering Desire are you going to read first and why?  

Get ready, queer language enthusiasts and trans literature francophiles! In another spontaneous recording from Lesvos, Mélie Boltz Nasr aka May tells us all about their genderbending fairy tale collection for adult readers. We also speak about feminist fonts, French grammar and how queering language is not just an activist aim but also a beautiful creative practice. To learn more about May, follow them on Instagram and check out @queerlitpodcast while you’re there.  References:Skala EressosSapphoContes D’Un Autre Boishttps://www.editions-ixe.fr/catalogue/contes-dun-autre-bois/Charles PerraultGrimm brothersWalt DisneyHassan Abdulrazzak’s Laila Pines For The Wolfhttps://medium.com/@abdulrazzak/laila-pines-for-the-wolf-3710e81ebbd0Éditions iXeBye Bye Binaryhttps://typotheque.genderfluid.space/[email protected] BaskervvolGlyphAlpheratzUrsula Le Guin “Is Gender Necessary? Redux” https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/ursula-k-le-guin-is-gender-necessary-reduxAesopLettre Aux Copaines https://lettre-aux-copaines.kessel.media/posts  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     What might the political framework of your favourite fairy tale be?     Have you ever used an inclusive font? What do you think of this idea?     What is an example of feminist grammar in your native language?     Do you think nonbinary language is political? What is its place in creative practice?     If you were to invent a nonbinary font, what would it be called?    

Guess who I ran into on the beautiful island of Lesvos: Karen McLeod, author of the amazing memoir Lifting Off. Karen sat down with me at Ohana Saloon, a queer-owned beach bar in Skala Eressos, and told me about her performance art, about working as aircrew as a queer woman, experiences with addiction, and about a new Lesvos-related book she is just starting to write…Warning for the noise-sensitive: you will be able to hear the ocean, the wind, and the many, many lesbians.Learn more about Karen’s work on Instagram @therealkarenmcleod and see @queerlitpodcast for our newest episodes.  References: Out and WildBarbara BrownskirtLifting OffIn Search of a Missing EyelashMuswell PressThe Bookseller CrowCindy ShermanSection 28PolariShirley ValentineThe Short Tall Letter https://karenmcleod.substack.com/Julia Darling’s Crocodile SoupJackie KayStella Duffy  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     We are recording in Skala Eressos, which has a close connection to Lesbian poet Sappho. Why not take a moment to read more about Sappho right now?     Karen begins by speaking about her experience of not being able to be out at work. Do you ever have to hide parts of yourself, based on where you are and who you interact with?     Karen briefly mentions Section 28. If you are not familiar, please look up what this term means in the context of the United Kingdom and homophobic legislation.     Karen and I speak about how amazing intergenerational queer spaces are. Do you share that experience? Why do you think different age groups can learn from one another, especially in an LGBTQIA2S+ context?

Kit Heyam’s amazing history of gender nonconformity across the globe is a dazzling journey into the intricacies of trans history and if it’s not your favourite book already, it will be after listening to this episode. Learn why Kit particularly enjoyed writing about Edo Japan, what they discovered about intersex history and who their favourite person to write about was. We also have a discussion about how biological sex has always been a difficult thing to define and, drumroll, Kit even tells me what their next book will be about…Grab your earphones, start listening, and follow @kitheyamwriter and @queerlitpodcast on Instagram to learn more.  References:Kit Heyam’s Before We Were Trans (2022)Kit Heyam’s The Reputation of Edward II, 1305-1697 (2020)IgboEdo JapanShungaWakashūSexologyThomas/Thomasine HallRoberta CowellMeg-John BarkerPrincess SeraphinaBlake GuttIphis and IantheHarlan Weaver’s Bad Dog: Pit Bull Politics and Multispecies Justice (2011)Mo MoultonHijraJessica HinchyJules Gill-Peterson@kitheyamwriterSara Taylor’s The LaurasAda Palmer’s Terra IgnotaThe Iliad  Questions you should be able to respond to after listening:     What is Kit’s view of trans history? How do they feel about labels?     We speak about how gender expression and sexuality may intersect (although of course they are separate for some people). What does Kit see as a challenge here? Is your gender connected to your sexuality?     One of Kit’s favourite chapters is about biological sex. How would you define biological sex? How has it been defined historically in the examples Kit provides?     What does trans family mean to you?     Kit briefly speaks about the agency of children. Why is that an important topic in queer and trans studies and lives?