Ending a 22 Year Legal Career for a New Career in Counseling with Karen Gulde

Today’s podcast episode features another conversation with previous guest Annie Little. Sarah is chatting with her about thoughts and advice when it comes to finding a therapist as a lawyer. They discuss the differences between Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT) and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) and share their experiences and observations. If you have been thinking about seeking out a therapist or have experienced this process, this conversation will be helpful. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/232  

In today’s podcast, Sarah discusses how to know when it’s the right time to leave law. Many people listening are grappling with this question, and often, when they ask it, they are looking for an external answer. There is no external answer. You are the only person that can decide when the time is right. The reality is that you need to ask yourself two questions to know if now is the right time for YOU to leave the law. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/231  

Today’s podcast episode features a returning guest, Kelcey Baker, talking to Sarah. There is a content warning because they are discussing a recent story about a junior Biglaw partner in the UK passing away during an acute mental health episode. They discuss mental health issues and suicide. The story is important because it highlights some of the issues seen within the legal profession and helps others feel seen, so let’s dive in. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/230  

Today’s podcast episode is an important reminder every lawyer needs to hear. Sarah reminds listeners that nothing about your job is as important as you and your emotional, mental, and physical health. For lawyers, it’s easy to feel their value as human beings is basically in job performance.  It’s tough for lawyers to feel like they exist outside the lawyer bubble. Working a lot and being chronically sleep-deprived keeps your nervous system in a state that makes it hard to maintain perspective. The systems are designed to cause you to lose perspective, especially in large firms. The system benefits when you are all caught up in your own performance for the organization. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/229  

Sarah sees many clients who change careers within the law, like becoming in-house lawyers, but at the end of the day, they are still lawyers. When people think that switching to entertainment law will be a fun and exciting change, it’s important to step back and ask some more questions. Today’s podcast episode features a conversation with Jordan Nahmias. Jordan used to practice law as an entertainment lawyer and is now a coach and strategist in Toronto, Canada. He talks about his experience and his path out of law. Many people consider exploring this area when thinking about leaving the law. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/228  

In today’s podcast episode, Sarah addresses a question that many people start asking themselves when the economy is unstable: Is now really the right time to consider leaving the law? Layoffs and challenging circumstances can add an added layer of stress and concern when it comes to changing industries and leaving your job. Sarah shares some thoughts and advice about these concerns and questions.  See show notes at formerlawyer.com/227  

In today’s podcast episode, Sarah chats with one of her one-on-one clients, Ann Marie Cowdrey. She has had a lot of experience working for regional and international law firms throughout her career. She hit a rough patch and thought it was time for a chance, so she started working with Sarah. Today, she’s sharing her experience in law and how she flipped things around. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/226  

Many lawyers find themselves asking, “Am I depressed, or am I burnt out?” This comes up when they are thinking about leaving the law, and it’s not a new topic on the podcast. In the episode where Sarah spoke to Ilona Salmons, they did a deep dive into burnout and what it is. Mental health is a common topic brought up in the Former Lawyer community, and many lawyers deal with misery by intellectualizing things. Today, Sarah is revisiting this topic and sharing a few important thoughts. Sarah often talks about therapy on the podcast. It is extremely helpful if you feel burned out or depressed. Engage a qualified mental health therapist to work with. They can help you evaluate what’s going on in your mind in your life with some objectivity and clinical expertise.  See show notes at formerlawyer.com/225  

On today’s podcast episode, Sarah chats with Lynley Ogilvie about her career pivot. She left her job as a lawyer to become a landscape designer. The conversation was exciting, and her path was unique compared to other guests on the podcast. Lynley lives just outside of Washington, DC, and she has her own landscape design firm.  See show notes at formerlawyer.com/224  

Today’s podcast topic was sparked by a recent call for the Guided Track Sarah is facilitating this spring. This program is designed to assist lawyers in navigating their career paths and offers a safe space for self-reflection. It helps individuals determine if leaving the law is the right choice for them and guides them toward their next steps. The program fosters a close-knit community where participants can share their experiences, exchange ideas, and support each other through the process, providing a sense of camaraderie and accountability. The discussion centered around a common yet often unspoken experience of guilt when one doesn’t enjoy being a lawyer. This feeling of guilt can be pervasive, making one feel like they’re complaining, even when they perceive their situation to be better than others. Sarah has talked about this before on the podcast, so obviously, it’s a topic that comes up often and is important to re-address.