The Built to Exit Podcast with Jason Sisneros

Building a business nobody wants to buy is a trap most owners walk into without realizing it. The real problem is not revenue or marketing. It is founder dependency, missing systems, and never asking who you are building this for.If you are grinding inside your company, overwhelmed by AI hype, unsure what to automate first, or quietly wondering whether your business could survive without you, this one cuts deep.In this episode of Built to Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Nathan Byrd, founder of Acquicon (Acquisition Conference), long-time advisor and investor in the lower middle market, to talk about what separates operators who build transferable value from those whose businesses own them.Together, we break down:Why founder dependency is the silent killer of business valueHow to use AI without drowning in ideas you cannot executeWhy SOPs come before automation and what happens when you skip themThe vetting process behind high-integrity business communitiesHow vision and reflection drive better decisions than speed ever willWhy AI-first companies will reshape the future of transactions and exitsThe difference between influence and impact, and which one comes firstThis episode is for business owners who want to:Build a company that runs without them in the roomStop confusing activity with progressKnow what to automate and what to protectYou did not start this business so it could own you. Nathan and Jason show where operators get stuck and how to build something worth transferring, to a buyer, to your team, or to your family.Chapters00:00 - Why the business you built might own you00:37 - Meet Nathan Byrd and the story behind Acquicon03:50 - What Acquicon solves for operators and investors05:22 - From personal training to architecting businesses10:02 - Why following expert advice actually works12:22 - What separates action takers from everyone else16:00 - How to vet people without a ten-question checklist22:30 - Where AI helps and where it creates overwhelm28:30 - Why SOPs come before automation30:30 - AI-first companies and the future of exits35:00 - How a PE firm used AI and what outperformed it39:40 - What attendees said after Acquicon44:55 - The biggest mistake: letting the business own you🔗 Guest and Event LinksAcquicon (Acquisition Conference), October 19-21, Salt Lake City: acquicon.comJason Sisneros: jasonsisneros.comBuilt to Exit: builttoexit.biz#BuiltToExit #BusinessExit #SmallBusinessGrowth

Business owners spending thousands on marketing to chase one client at a time are playing the wrong game. Most never consider that the largest buyer in the country already publishes exactly what they want, how much they'll pay, and where to find the opportunity, every single day.If you're stuck as the bottleneck in your business, burning cash on client attraction, or sitting on a great company with no idea how to exit it profitably, this conversation will shift how you think about revenue, risk, and what your business is actually worth.In this episode of Built to Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Kevin Jennings, government contracting expert, serial acquirer, and founder of The Government Cheese, to break down how everyday service businesses can tap into government contracts, why Kevin's first exit was a painful masterclass, and what it actually takes to go from running one company to building a nine-figure roll-up.Together, we break down:Why government contracts eliminate the hardest part of business: finding the customerHow a five-year street sweeping contract at the Las Vegas airport covers all the basesWhy 23% of every federal dollar is earmarked for small businesses and most never go after itWhat Kevin got wrong in his first exit and why he calls it a "paid MBA"How running eight businesses became easier than running oneThe four startup traits (arrogance, impatience, wrong team) that must flip before you scaleWhy knowing your worth as a person, not just a business, changes every negotiationThis episode is for business owners who want to:Add reliable, long-term revenue without spending more on marketingAvoid a dictated exit where the buyer controls price, timing, and termsBuild a business that runs without them so they can be present for what mattersYou do not have to figure out government contracts alone, and you do not have to repeat the mistakes Kevin made on his first exit. This episode shows where service-business owners leave money on the table and how to stop.Chapters00:00 - Why business owners never consider the government as a client02:54 - Kevin's journey: football, real estate crash, and the pivot to government contracts06:09 - What the government actually buys (hint: it's not just guns)09:30 - The janitor analogy: jobs the government stopped filling and now contracts out12:22 - How government contracts reduce concentration risk and boost your multiple13:56 - Five-year deals and guaranteed revenue: why Kevin locks in long-term contracts17:00 - Zero marketing spend: one website, every federal opportunity, every day19:30 - Running eight businesses is easier than one, here's why21:30 - The mindset shift: killing the ego to scale past eight figures26:30 - Kevin's NICU moment and why he had to change how he ran his business31:00 - Kevin's first exit: uneducated seller, dictated deal, and the lessons inside the pain37:30 - Building the seller's code: controlling price, timing, and terms43:00 - Kevin's one piece of advice: know your worth🔗 Connect with Kevin JenningsFind Kevin across all socials: @thegovernmentcheeseFacebook | Instagram | TikTok | YouTube: The Government Cheese🔗 Connect with Built to ExitWebsite: builttoexit.bizSubscribe for weekly conversations on building enterprise value and exiting on your terms.#GovernmentContracts #BuiltToExit #BusinessExit

Business owners who play it safe are just employees with more stress. Most entrepreneurs stay stuck not because they lack skill, they lack the guts to match the size of the opportunity to the size of the work they're already doing.If you're grinding every day but the payoff never feels worth it, if you're scared to go bigger, or if you've lost sight of why you even started, this one will hit.In this episode of Built to Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Kyle Auffray, former NFL player, venture capital operator, and private equity dealmaker, who scaled a company from $600K to $28M in revenue, closed a multi-seven-figure government PPE contract during COVID, and now builds billion-dollar sports development projects. Kyle breaks down exactly how the same skills that got him from undrafted free agent to four NFL teams translate directly into closing deals and building businesses worth owning.Together, we break down:-Why the same skillset produces wildly different income depending on what you attach it to-How Kyle sold himself into the NFL with no agent, no draft pick, and no guarantees-The COVID deal that paid more in three months than the previous four years combined-Why business owners take all the risk but refuse to chase the real reward-How to stop being an employee of your own company-What Kyle's father taught him about living with urgency and zero regret-Why The Forge exists and what the male suicide crisis means for entrepreneursThis episode is for business owners who:-Know they're capable of more but keep playing small-Haven't defined their endgame and can't explain why they're still grinding-Need a reality check on whether the juice is worth the squeezeYou don't have to figure this out alone. You don't have to keep selling used cars when you could be selling Lamborghinis. Kyle and Jason lay out the mindset, the moves, and the community that make the difference.Chapters00:00 - Why playing it safe as a business owner is the biggest risk00:30 - Kyle Auffray's journey: New York kid to NFL to dealmaker02:00 - The transition most athletes and business owners get wrong03:00 - Everything is sales, how Kyle sold his way into the NFL05:00 - Scaling a company from $600K to $28M in four years05:50 - The COVID PPE deal: multi-seven-figure matchmaking08:00 - Why the same work earns 10x more with the right product09:00 - The fearlessness factor: billion-dollar deals and Lake Como meetings10:00 - Why comfort kills business owners11:30 - The moment Kyle got the call from the Arizona Cardinals13:00 - One life, one shot: why your endgame matters more than your hustle15:00 - Know your endgame or you're just an employee of your own company17:30 - The Forge: why male suicide and fatherlessness are an entrepreneur crisis22:30 - Two books you need in your life, the Bible and your passport25:00 - What three days with B2X actually does to your business and your life🔗 ConnectThe Forge → betheforge.comDare to Exit Event (Nov 5-6, Atlanta) → daretoexit.comBuilt to Exit → builtexit.biz#BuiltToExit #BusinessExit #EntrepreneurMindset

Business owners in the trades are drowning in six platforms just to run one company. Most AI advice makes it worse because it skips the foundation, your SOPs, your workflows, your people, and jumps straight to the shiny tool. That is how you burn money and lose trust.If you are running an HVAC company, a roofing crew, electrical, plumbing, or any trade-based business and you feel stuck between ignoring AI and going all-in without a plan, this conversation will ground you.In this episode of Built to Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Joe Garner, tech entrepreneur, former Department of Defense cryptologist, and founder of a consulting-marketing-software firm with nine platforms in its portfolio. They unpack what AI adoption actually looks like when you do it right, what it costs when you do it wrong, and why the trades have a built-in moat that most industries do not.Together, we break down:Why SOPs are the only thing that will keep your business alive in the age of AIHow to tell the difference between a real AI use case and a shiny objectWhat "people, processes, and platforms" actually means when you audit your operationsWhy AI agents in dispatch, accounting, and HR are here now, not five years awayHow one platform (Evolve ERP) replaced six tools for a multi-trade companyThe three AI risks most business owners have not thought about: security, unknown cost, and hallucinationsWhy the trades are one of the few industries with a real moat against AI displacementThis episode is for business owners who want to:Stop paying for six platforms that do not talk to each otherUse AI to multiply their team instead of replacing themBuild enterprise value that commands top dollar when they exitYou do not have to guess at this. You do not have to throw AI at everything and hope it sticks. Jason and Joe lay out what works, what does not, and where to start, with your operations documented first and the tech layered on second.Chapters00:00 - Why ignoring AI will leave your business behind00:37 - Welcome to Built to Exit with Jason Sisneros01:00 - The due diligence mistake most business owners make with partners02:47 - Joe Garner's journey: DoD cryptology to tech entrepreneur05:05 - The rare combination: architecture mind meets marketing mind06:31 - How to pivot when the next wave hits your industry08:08 - Why SOPs are the only thing keeping you alive in the AI era10:10 - AI is turning business owners into zombies13:00 - Joe's true north: faith, family, and doing business with integrity14:50 - Trust in the age of AI deepfakes and generated personas17:50 - Evolve ERP: one platform replacing six for trades businesses22:50 - Why the trades have a moat against AI disruption24:50 - Price, timing, and terms: who really controls your exit28:15 - AI agents in the trades: the dispatch example that changes everything30:50 - Three AI risks no one talks about: security, cost, and hallucinations35:00 - The "super suit" philosophy: AI as leverage, not replacement39:30 - Dying breath: what to tell your kids about business41:00 - Where to find Joe Garner and Evolve ERP🔗 Connect with Joe GarnerWebsite: https://garner.agency/🔗 Built to ExitWebsite: builttoexit.bizDare To Exit live event: daretoexit.com#BuiltToExit #AIForBusiness #TradesBusiness

Most business owners have no idea what their company is actually worth, and neither does anyone else. Private companies don't trade on a market. There's no ticker, no graph, no daily price. So when it's time to raise capital, reward early employees, or sell, you're guessing. That guessing costs you real money.If you've been grinding for years, building something real, and you still can't answer "what's my company worth today?" this one is for you.In this episode of Built To Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Tomas Milar, founder of Eqvista, a company that issues stocks and provides equity valuations for private companies. Tomas has worked with over 20,000 clients and nearly half a billion dollars in client assets, all bootstrapped, no VC money.Together, we break down:How to price a private company when there's no public market to referenceWhy rewarding early employees with equity is a competitive weapon, not just a nice gestureHow a logistics company cut from 170 employees to 24 and went from $28M to $12M in revenue with better marginsWhy raising $35M on $5M in revenue can leave a founder with $8-10M after a $100M exitHow AI should be used to make your business efficient without replacing the human judgment that keeps clients safeWhy revenue before fundraising is the discipline that separates builders from burn-rate companiesWhat "cap table hygiene" means and why ignoring it kills your exitThis episode is for business owners who want to:Understand what their company is actually worth right nowStop diluting themselves into a corner with bad fundraising mathUse AI and lean operations to increase enterprise value before they sellYou don't have to figure out valuation, equity, and exit math alone. Tomas and Jason lay out where business owners go wrong and what the smartest operators are doing differently.Chapters00:00 - Why most business owners can't answer "what's my company worth?"00:27 - Welcome to Built To Exit01:07 - Tomas Milar's story: from Hong Kong incorporations to private-company valuations04:22 - The core question: how do you price something that doesn't trade?07:43 - What "always ready to sell" actually means11:01 - Operator vs. executor: the shift that makes a business transferable11:39 - Rewarding the believers: stock liquidity for early employees and investors15:11 - WIIFM: how gamifying your business changes everything19:29 - AI in business: why "automate but human-deliver" works22:26 - The real cost of replacing your analyst with AI25:51 - Two identical businesses, one with AI: what happens to valuation30:02 - Future revenue multiples and the three things owners can do today34:16 - The $35M raise on $5M revenue: a cautionary tale in dilution math🔗 Connect with Tomas Milar & EqvistaWebsite: eqvista.comLinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/tomasmilar/🔗 Built To ExitWebsite: builttoexit.bizDare To Exit live event: daretoexit.com#BuiltToExit #BusinessValuation #ExitStrategy

Selling your business should not destroy your family or your finances. Most owners get the company ready to sell but never get themselves ready, and that gap costs them their identity, their family, and sometimes the deal itself.If you are a business owner staring down an exit and wondering who you will be on the other side of it, or if you have never once talked to your family about what happens when the business is gone, this conversation is for you. In this episode of Built to Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Jeffrey Condren. Jeffrey is a wealth advisor who has spent over a decade helping business owners handle the money and the mindset that come with selling. Part advisor, part therapist; he breaks down the risks that nobody warns you about until it is too late.Together, we break down: -Why owner risk, client risk, and people risk determine what a buyer will actually pay -How losing your identity during a sale can blow the deal before it closes -What happens when a business owner who has never had that much cash suddenly sees it in a checking account -Why the first 30 to 90 days after the wire hits are when most owners blow through their money -How families fight over the money when the business owner never told them why it was split that way -Why one owner's $20 million exit turned into $1 million in less than two years -What a family office that has lasted nine generations can teach you about raising kids around moneyThis episode is for business owners who want to: -Exit without losing themselves in the process -Protect the wealth they spent decades building -Stop avoiding the family conversation that gets harder the longer they wait You do not have to figure this out alone. Jeffrey and Jason show where owners go wrong, and what it looks like when someone does it right.Chapters:00:00 - Why most business owners are not ready for what happens after the sale00:30 - Welcome to Built to Exit02:01 - Jeffrey Condren: wealth advisor, sometimes therapist, and the person you need on your team02:54 - Jeffrey's background and why he focuses on owners who are selling04:03 - The four traits that built your business and now hold you back06:01 - Three critical risks every buyer evaluates before writing a check09:00 - What buyers are really looking for: certainty across four quadrants10:04 - Involuntary, dictated, or custom-tailored: which exit are you headed toward11:45 - The horizon: the psychological danger zone between decision and closing12:55 - Why owners lose their identity mid-deal and how to reframe the next chapter15:17 - Sudden liquidity: why the first purchase after the wire is almost always a mistake17:00 - The 30-60-90 day rule: no major decisions after the sale20:00- From $20 million to $1 million: what happens when nobody manages the money22:00 - Why avoiding the family conversation creates more conflict than having it24:00 - Start with the why before the what: dividing assets among your children26:00 - Disaster story: the owner who died before signing the documents27:30 - Teaching kids about money at every age without handing them entitlement30:00 Shirt to shirt: why generational wealth disappears by the third generation31:00 - Nine generations deep: what one family office got right starting at age six34:00 - Jason's own kids and what it means to be the first-generation way maker35:30 - When to bring in a mediator, estate planner, or specialist37:30 - How to reach Jeffrey Condren and the Built to Exit teamConnect with Jeffrey Condren Website: mesirow.com/wealth-management Built To Exit Website: builttoexit.biz Dare To Exit live event: daretoexit.com #BuiltToExit #ExitPlanning #WealthAfterSale

Selling your business alone is the most expensive decision you will never see on the invoice. Most exits do not fail because the business was broken. They fail because the owner refused to get the right people around them before the deal started. If you have been telling yourself "I'll figure it out," grinding through every problem solo, and treating expert help like an expense instead of an investment, this conversation is going to cost you nothing and save you everything. In this episode of Built To Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Kevin Marron, serial entrepreneur, strategic investor, and founder of the 335,000-member Blue Collar Millionaires community. Kevin built and exited Gutter King across 29 states, planned that exit five years in advance, and now operates and invests in multiple businesses using the exact playbook he wishes someone had handed him at 23. Together, we break down: Why "I'll figure it out" is the four-word sentence that shrinks your exit and steals your time How Kevin left $100K on the table on his first exit by skipping the lawyer and the accountant What borrowed belief actually looks like and why it accelerates you faster than hard work alone Why your fractional CFO should show up on day one, not the year you decide to sell How to build a network that compounds into real deals instead of stacking business cards The difference between an architect and a specialist and why confusing them costs you everything Why wearing losses as a badge is overrated when you can learn from someone who already took the hitThis episode is for business owners who want to: Exit on their terms with their family, health, and wealth intact Stop guessing and start surrounding themselves with people who have already done it Build something worth $50 million instead of grinding alone toward $2 millionYou do not have to white-knuckle your way through this. Kevin and Jason have both taken the hits and come out the other side. This is what they wish someone had told them 20 years ago.Chapters00:00 - The four words that will shrink your exit00:37 - Who is Kevin Marron and why Jason showed up to his stage for free02:37 - How Blue Collar Millionaires grew to 335,000 members09:49 - Why work-life balance is a lie entrepreneurs need to stop repeating12:26 - How Kevin built a tribe from zero connections in Atlanta20:46 - Your mask meets my mask: why fake networking kills deals24:04 - What Kevin would tell his younger self before his first exit27:09 - Why Kevin started planning his Gutter King exit five years early32:50 - "I'll figure it out": four words that cost you everything34:13 - Architects vs. specialists: the mistake that looks like good advice39:53 - Borrowed belief: how two SCORE mentors changed Kevin's whole trajectory51:03 - Kevin's last piece of advice to any business owner watching🔗 Kevin Marron / Blue Collar Millionaires Website: bluecollarmillionaire.net Blue Collar Millionaire on Facebook (335,000+ members) Boardroom Elite Atlanta — October 23-24🔗 Built To Exit Website: builttoexit.biz Dare To Exit live event: daretoexit.com#bluecollarmillionaire #builttoexit #businessexit

Selling your business should not be the moment you realize you weren't ready. But for a majority of owners, that is exactly what happens. Most exits don't fall apart apart because the owner never cleaned up the financials, never built a team that could run without them, and never sat down long enough to figure out what comes after the wire hits the account. In this episode of Built to Exit, Jason Sisneros sits down with Todd Pollock, "The Todd Father." Todd is a CPA, Certified Exit Planning Advisor, and 35-year veteran known as Together, we covered: - Why financial statements built for tax savings destroy deal value when a buyer runs due diligence - How lifestyle expenses buried in your books become the red flags that kill buyer confidence - What "pro forma adjusted EBITDA" actually means and why it matters years before you list - Why most owners sabotage their own exit without seeing it coming - How the 18-month retirement cliff catches even the most successful founders off guard - What happens when an owner dies at their desk and the family inherits chaos instead of a plan - Why working with the wrong advisors — people chasing the fee — is worse than working with none Chapters 00:00 - Why most owners aren't ready when it's time to sell 00:39 - Welcome to Built to Exit with Jason Sisneros 02:59 - Todd Pollock: The Todd Father's 35-year track record 05:32 - What "clean financials" really means before a sale 08:34 - The add-backs and lifestyle expenses buyers catch first 11:25 - Why exit planning starts 5-10 years before you sell 14:33 - The 18-month retirement cliff that catches every owner 18:46 - Misdiagnosis: handing the business to your kids unprepared 26:20 - Contingency plans and buy-sell agreements most owners skip 30:51 - How to build a team that runs without you 37:04 - The blind spots nobody on your team will tell you about 38:34 - One piece of advice: Don't wait. Start now. Connect with Todd Pollock: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/todd-polyniak/ Firm: https://saxadvisorygroup.com/ Connect with Jason Sisneros: Built to Exit: https://builttoexit.com #BuiltToExit #ExitPlanning #BusinessExit

Your business should give you freedom, even when you step away. It should not grind to a halt without you. Stuart Burgess built a business that works without him through clear systems, smart delegation, and a strong culture. Burgex Mining Consultants now has 25 full-time employees. The team handles 100 projects at a time. In this episode of Built to Exit, host Jason Sisneros talks with Stuart Burgess, founder of Burgex Mining Consultants. Stuart's story starts in a grocery store, where he worked as a butcher. He went on to become a mining entrepreneur. Stuart explains how he gave up daily control and freed his calendar. He then built a company that no longer depends on his labor. Stuart also believes a commodity boom that will last for decades is starting. He points to rising copper demand, AI data centers, and old infrastructure that needs to be replaced. He also sees a severe lack of mining talent. This interview covers - The difference between a lifestyle company and a real business. - How SOPs and delegation stop knowledge from getting trapped in one person's head. - Why free time gives a founder room to build new sources of revenue. - How Burgex hires for "can do, will do, team fit." - Stuart's view on copper supply and demand. - The "gray tsunami" and the mining talent shortage. - How private equity can hurt a good company by replacing a strong culture with short-term thinking. This episode is for business owners who want a team that runs without them. It is also for business owners who want a company they can sell and more time for the next opportunity. If cash flow disappears when you step away, your first exit is not a sale. First, build a company that serves customers without depending on you each day. Chapters 00:00 - Why Built to Exit shares real business lessons 02:24 - From grocery-store butcher to mining founder 05:48 - When a lifestyle company becomes a real business 10:30 - Remove yourself from the business to test its value 13:19 - How owner freedom creates new revenue lines 17:30 - Why AI workflows depend on clear SOPs 20:57 - The multi-decade commodity boom Stuart sees ahead 22:34 - Copper demand, AI data centers, and declining supply 25:36 - Mining's gray tsunami and talent shortage 28:23 - Hiring for can do, will do, and team fit 30:20 - Why private equity deals fail when culture disappears 34:27 - Believe in yourself and let consistency compound Subscribe for more business-owner conversations about building companies that give you more freedom and choices. #BuiltToExit #BusinessSystems #Enterpreneur

If you own a business, organic growth may be the longest route to the exit you want. The right acquisition can add scale and raise your company's sale price. It can also bring that exit closer if you buy well and manage the handoff. You may know your company can do more, yet the market you serve feels too small. Cash is tight, and time is short, yet an acquisition may still be within reach. In this episode of Built to Exit, host Jason Sisneros talks with Tom Shipley. Tom is a consumer-brand builder, acquisition operator, and DealCon host. His businesses generated about $2 billion in revenue. One acquisition helped take a $300,000 business to $100 million. In 2021, Tom sold a portfolio of brands to private equity. Jason and Tom cover: - Why a mature company may grow faster through a purchase than through organic growth. Tom walks through the math. - How buyers can find motivated sellers through day-to-day conversations and trusted relationships. - What lenders look for when the buyer's current company is short on cash. - How seller financing and the right deal structure can cut the cash due at closing. - What to protect during the first 30 days and 90 days after you buy a company. - Which culture problems raise risk before and after closing. Learn what to spot before the deal. - How more scale can help you adopt AI, cut costs, and raise output. This episode is for business owners who want to: - Grow beyond what organic sales alone can produce. - Buy another company without harming either culture. - Build a company that can command a higher sale price at exit. Start with a clear acquisition thesis. Complete your due diligence, and work with experienced advisors. Everybody exits. How matters. YouTube Timestamps 00:00 - Meet Tom Shipley, a $2 billion brand builder and acquisition operator 02:54 - How a cash crisis led to buying a larger business 08:01 - The growth math behind a roll-up strategy 11:03 - How to buy a company with no cash and no spare time 15:15 - Scarcity vs. resourcefulness when a business is failing 19:24 - How the right room helps ambitious business owners grow 25:17 - Special Forces lessons for founders and CEOs 33:18 - Why acquisitions fail after the deal closes 42:10 - Culture problems that can break an acquisition 43:42 - How seller financing can fund a business purchase 47:23 - Using acquisitions to accelerate AI adoption 48:48 - The advice Tom would give his younger self #BusinessAcquisition #MergersAndAcquisitions #ExitPlanning