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Season 2 · Episode 1 – Small Crates Behind Big Rust Systems.In this first episode of season two of Netstack.fm, Glen talks with Jon Gjengset, principal engineer at Helsing, author of Rust for Rustaceans, and one of the best known teachers in the Rust community. They explore the craft of building small, sharply scoped crates, from arccstr, left-right, and HdrHistogram to atone, and discuss Fantoccini and the WebDriver protocol, maintaining open source sustainably, and why the Rust project should not bless crates.Learn more:https://www.youtube.com/@jonhoo — Jon's streams and Decrusting videoshttps://rust-for-rustaceans.com/ — Rust for Rustaceanshttps://github.com/jonhoo/rust-imap — imaphttps://github.com/jonhoo/arccstr — arccstrhttps://github.com/vorner/arc-swap — arc-swaphttps://github.com/jonhoo/left-right — left-righthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLNAMEoKAAc — Jon's walkthrough of the left-right algorithmhttps://github.com/jonhoo/fantoccini — Fantoccinihttps://github.com/helsing-ai/dson — DSON, a delta-state CRDThttps://github.com/helsing-ai/sguaba — Sguaba, type-safe coordinate transformshttps://github.com/HdrHistogram/HdrHistogram_rust — HdrHistogramhttps://github.com/jonhoo/inferno — Infernohttps://github.com/jonhoo/atone — atoneRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro01:16 Introduction to the Podcast and Guest02:02 Meet Jon Gjengset and His Career Path05:00 Embracing Challenges and Learning Opportunities06:10 From Using Rust in His PhD to Teaching It08:35 Decrusting Crates and Learning in Public13:17 Building High-Performance Crates15:33 Scoping Crates for Completeness19:26 Handing Off the IMAP Crate25:17 Compact Shared Strings: arccstr27:48 Comparing Concurrency Primitives: arc-swap vs. left-right30:39 Understanding Data Structures and Performance Trade-offs33:39 Sustainable Open Source Maintenance37:55 Reader-Writer Lock Contention41:18 Low-Level Programming, With or Without Rust45:42 Navigating Unfamiliar Codebases49:24 Exploring the WebDriver Protocol and Fantoccini58:32 Why Not Be a Researcher for Hire?01:02:50 Engineering at Helsing: CRDTs and Type-Safe Transforms01:05:34 Efficient Metrics with HdrHistogram01:10:54 Porting FlameGraph from Perl to Rust: Inferno01:13:49 Officially Endorsed or Independently Maintained Crates?01:20:33 Avoiding Resize Latency Spikes: atone01:23:13 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/episodes/small-crates-behind-big-rust-systemsJoin our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj

Episode 38: Building and testing network stacks with Rama.In this Protocol Shorts episode of Netstack.fm, Glen talks with Brecht Stamper about Rama, the modular Rust framework for building clients, servers, proxies, and other network systems. Brecht shares how he came to understand Rama’s core idea that everything is a service, and why that simple input to output contract makes it easier to compose complex stacks without constantly inventing new traits or glue code.They also discuss how Rama helps with testing, including gRPC client and server logic without spinning up real HTTP or TCP infrastructure. The conversation then moves into practical production lessons, such as gRPC latency caused by TCP_NODELAY, the role of OpenTelemetry and logging, and how Rama can provide better abstractions while still allowing low level control.Later in the episode, Glen and Brecht explore Rama’s evolving extension system, including the move toward append only extensions, clearer separation between request and connection state, and support for complex scenarios such as HTTP/2 streams and protocol upgrades. They close with thoughts on where Rama is heading next, including HTTP/3, QUIC, better developer tooling, performance work, and making more hard won network fixes available to everyone through the framework.Learn morehttps://ramaproxy.org/ — Rama homepage: modular Rust framework for proxies, clients, servers, inspection, tunneling, and network diagnostics.https://ramaproxy.org/book/ — Rama book: broader introduction to Rama and its approach to fine grained programmable control over network stacks.https://ramaproxy.org/docs/rama/index.html — Rama API documentation: generated Rust docs for the main Rama crate.https://github.com/plabayo/rama — Rama source code on GitHub.Chapters00:00 Intro00:48 Introduction to Rama and Brecht's Role02:46 Understanding Services in Rama08:22 Testing and Mocking in Rama10:23 gRPC and TCP Configuration Issues15:35 Evolution of Extensions in Rama24:58 Building with Rama and Rama's Horizon31:52 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-38Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj

episode 37: dial9: from black box to insight in Tokio.In this episode of Netstack.fm, Glen talks with Jess Izen and Russell Cohen from Amazon about Dial9, a new tool for understanding what’s happening inside Rust and Tokio applications. They explain how it captures events from different layers of your system and puts them into a single timeline, making it much easier to debug tricky performance issues and unexpected behavior.They also share how Dial9 came out of real debugging challenges at Amazon, where engineers often had to rely on complex, low level tools. The goal with Dial9 is to make those kinds of insights more accessible, so developers can diagnose problems faster and with less guesswork, while the tool continues to evolve with new features and improvements.Learn more:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTlThfOcslM — TokioConf 2026 - Lightning Talk: dial9: WTF is Tokio actually doing? by Russell Cohenhttps://tokio.rs/blog/2026-03-18-dial9 — Introducing dial9: a flight recorder for Tokiohttps://github.com/dial9-rs/dial9-tokio-telemetry — source code (Tokio Telemetry you can run in production)https://github.com/dial9-rs/dial9-tokio-telemetry/blob/main/dial9-trace-format/SPEC.md — trace format spechttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kr0RYMu57kU — demo walkthrough (slightly outdated)https://github.com/dial9-rs/dial9-tokio-telemetry/blob/main/dial9-tokio-telemetry/examples/production_use.rs — exampleRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro02:01 Meet Russell and Jess05:27 The Mission of the Rust Team at Amazon11:47 Integration with OpenTelemetry and Tracing13:49 The Evolution of Dial 917:17 Comparing Dial 9 with Existing Tools20:07 Continue exploring history and development and UX of Dial933:47 Building Self-Serve Solutions36:22 perf sched38:30 Task Dumps41:17 Dial 9: almost a free lunch43:00 Cross-Platform Considerations for Dial 946:20 Future Features and Improvements for Dial 950:20 Dial 9 usage today54:31 Considerations before using Dial 901:03:05 Getting Started with Dial 901:05:30 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-37Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj

Episode 36 – Protocol Shorts: WireGuardIn this Protocol Shorts episode of netstack.fm, we explore WireGuard, a modern and lightweight VPN protocol. Glen explains what makes it different from traditional VPNs and why its simplicity and security model are gaining attention among developers.The episode also highlights real world use cases and why VPNs like WireGuard remain essential for securely accessing private resources.Learn more:https://www.wireguard.com/ — official website of WireGuardhttps://www.wireguard.com/papers/wireguard.pdf — WireGuard whitepaperhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OipNNLHLphw — Black Hat USA 2018 - WireGuard Next Generation Secure Network Tunnel RamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro00:18 Introduction to WireGuard01:41 WireGuard Properties03:24 Why WireGuard?07:43 Current Use Cases and Adoption of WireGuard11:42 Get started with WireGuard14:37 Final Words15:17 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-36Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox.Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 35 – OpenTelemetry, eBPF and Metoro (Ep 3 Remastered).In this remastered episode, Chris Batterbee, co-founder of Metoro, discusses the importance of observability in modern software systems, particularly in Kubernetes environments. He explains how Metoro leverages eBPF technology to simplify observability by automatically instrumenting applications. The discussion also covers the integration of OpenTelemetry, the challenges faced by developers in implementing observability, and the potential of AI in diagnosing issues. Chris shares insights from his experience with Y Combinator and the competitive landscape of observability tools, emphasizing the unique position of Metoro in the market.Learn more about OpenTelemetry, eBPF and Metoro:https://opentelemetry.io/https://ebpf.io/https://metoro.io/metoro demo: https://demo.us-east.metoro.io/guardian?startEnd=&service=OpenTelemetry metric examplar: https://opentelemetry.io/docs/specs/otel/metrics/data-model/#exemplarsRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro00:34 Into to Chris Battarbee02:36 Understanding eBPF and Its Role in Observability10:13 Integrating OpenTelemetry with eBPF15:05 Challenges and Experiences with OpenTelemetry22:28 Future of eBPF and OpenTelemetry in Different Environments27:53 YCombinator Experience29:31 Insights from Y Combinator Experience32:31 Networking and Community in Y Combinator34:43 Raising Funds Post-Y Combinator35:39 Post-Y Combinator Relationship with YC36:27 OpenTelemetry Pain Points38:31 The Future of OpenTelemetry and Standards39:47 Competition with Major Cloud Providers41:40 Understanding eBPF and Its Challenges43:24 Prometheus vs. OpenTelemetry44:40 AI Integration in Telemetry45:36 Metoro49:03 Profiling51:43 Metoro Payment Models53:57 Customer Engagement and Support55:09 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-35Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 34 — Tokio with Carl Lerche (Ep 5 Remastered).In this remastered episode, Glen speaks with Carl Lerche, the creator and maintainer of the Tokio Runtime, about his journey into technology, the evolution of programming languages, and the impact of Rust on the software development landscape. They discuss the rise of async programming, the development of networking libraries, and the future of Rust in infrastructure. Carl shares insights on the creation of the Bytes crate, the implications of io_uring, and his role at Amazon. The conversation also touches on the upcoming Tokio conference and the introduction of Toasty, a new query engine for Rust.Learn more:https://tokio.rs/https://www.tokioconf.com/https://github.com/carllercheRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro01:26 Introduction to Carl and His Journey in Tech16:30 How Carl got into Rust21:18 How Mio/Tokio begun47:15 The Evolution of IO-URing and Its Practicality53:11 Amazon's Adoption of Rust and Tokyo55:06 Transitioning Leadership in the Tokyo Project57:15 Toasty01:08:55 AI in Software Development: A Tool for Productivity01:25:53 First Tokio Conference01:34:28 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-34Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 33 – Protocol Shorts: TLS Encrypted Client Hello.This episode explores TLS Encrypted Client Hello (ECH) and how it improves privacy on the internet by hiding sensitive metadata that was previously exposed during the TLS handshake. While traditional TLS encrypts the actual data exchanged between client and server, key details like the Server Name Indication (SNI), which reveals the website you are visiting, remained visible to intermediaries such as ISPs or network middleboxes.Glen explains how ECH addresses this gap by encrypting most of the Client Hello message using keys obtained via secure DNS, preventing third parties from easily identifying user activity. The discussion also covers real-world implications, including the impact on network infrastructure that relies on traffic inspection and the role of cloud providers in TLS termination.Learn more:https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc9849/ — TLS Encrypted Client Hellohttps://blog.cloudflare.com/encrypted-client-hello/ — Practical explanation of ECH and deploymenthttps://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Security/Transport_Layer_Security — TLS fundamentals and handshake overviewhttps://www.cloudflare.com/learning/ssl/what-happens-in-a-tls-handshake/ — another TLS handshake overviewhttps://tls12.xargs.org/ — a tls 1.2 handshake, explained byte by bytehttps://tls13.xargs.org/ — a tls 1.3 handshake, explained byte by bytehttps://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc8446 — TLS 1.3 specification and handshake detailshttps://blog.mozilla.org/security/2021/01/07/encrypted-client-hello-the-future-of-esni-in-firefox/ — Firefox perspective on ECH adoptionhttps://blog.mozilla.org/security/2021/01/07/encrypted-client-hello-the-future-of-esni-in-firefox/ — Firefox perspective on ECH adoptionhttps://samueloph.dev/blog/i-use-curl-with-ech-btw-in-debian/ — blog article about adding ECH into curlhttps://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9460 — a DNS record type that publishes connection parameters for a servicehttps://fosdem.org/2026/schedule/event/CKANPK-programmable_networking_with_rama/ — FOSDEM 2026 talk about RamaRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro00:27 Understanding the TLS Handshake Process06:54 Understanding Middle Boxes and Network Behavior08:33 The Privacy Gap in Network Traffic14:08 Current Usage and Future of ECH18:00 Consequences of ECH for Existing Infrastructures24:19 Future of ECH: Privacy vs. Trust26:32 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-33Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 32 – Datastar and Hypermedia.In this remastered episode, Glen interviews Delaney, the creator of DataStar, a lightweight framework designed for building real-time collaborative web applications. Delaney shares his journey from being a 3D artist to a developer, emphasizing the importance of hypermedia and real-time visualization. The conversation delves into the efficiency of DataStar, its use of Server-Sent Events (SSE), and the framework's potential for collaborative web experiences. Delaney also discusses the challenges of WebSockets and introduces future projects like DarkStar, aimed at enhancing networking capabilities. Overall, the episode highlights the transformative potential of DataStar in modern web development. In this conversation, Delaney discusses the intricacies of DataStar, a real-time system for handling large volumes of messages. He emphasizes the importance of simplicity in programming, the significance of measuring performance, and the role of abstraction in software development. Delaney also explains the core functions of DataStar, including patch elements and signals, and how they facilitate real-time interactivity. The discussion touches on offline support, the growth of the DataStar community, and the non-profit model that supports its development. Delaney encourages developers to engage with the community and emphasizes the importance of building solutions to real problems.Learn more about Datastar and Hypermedia:https://data-star.dev/https://data-star.dev/reference/datastar_prohttps://hypermedia.systems/RamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro01:12 Delaney and his background03:09 The Evolution of Hypermedia and Real-Time Systems06:58 SSE and Compression16:04 The Social Web23:32 Why use datastar?30:12 Web Transport and Darkstar34:26 Final Thoughts on DataStar and Future Directions46:35 Understanding Abstraction in Programming49:18 Event Sourcing and Efficiency in Systems50:50 DataStar: Key Functions and Concepts53:58 Signals in DataStar: When to Use Them57:56 Front-End Validation and User Experience59:58 Offline Support and Web Applications01:03:26 The Growth of DataStar and Community Engagement01:07:39 The Challenges of Web Development01:09:56 AI and Its Role in Development01:13:52 DataStar and WebTransport: Future Directions01:17:03 Dynamic Content and DataStar's Use Cases01:19:06 Funding and Sustainability of Open Source Projects01:31:32 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-32Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

episode 31 — Protocol Shorts: MITM Proxies and Transparent L4 Interception.In this second "Protocol Shorts" episode, we look at man-in-the-middle proxies from the transport layer up. The episode explains how HTTP proxies, HTTP CONNECT, and SOCKS5 differ, why they all assume a proxy-aware client, and what changes when a transparent layer 4 proxy is inserted by the operating system instead.From there, we dig into protocol detection from the first bytes on the wire and into the BridgeIo abstraction in Rama: a way to relay and inspect stacked handshakes incrementally instead of terminating every protocol upfront.Learn more:https://netstack.fm/#episode-23 — Protocol Shorts: HTTP as an Application Bushttps://ramaproxy.org/book/proxies/intro.html — Intro to proxies in the Ramabookhttps://ramaproxy.org/book/proxies/http.html — HTTP(S) proxies in the Rama boohttps://ramaproxy.org/book/proxies/socks5.html — SOCKS5 proxies in the Rama bookhttps://ramaproxy.org/book/proxies/mitm.html — MITM proxies in the Rama book</></li>https://ramaproxy.org/book/proxies/protocol_inspection.html — Protocolinspection in the Rama bookhttps://ramaproxy.org/book/proxies/operate/transparent.html — Operating transparent proxies with Ramahttps://github.com/plabayo/rama/tree/main/ffi/apple/examples/transparent_proxy — MacOS Transparent Proxy (Rama) exampleRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro01:00 Understanding Proxies: The Basics01:18 Diving Deeper into Proxy Types04:16 Layer 4 Proxies: A New Approach05:23 Challenges of Transparent Proxies07:53 Bridging Conversations: A New Insight09:53 Example: HTTPS request within a SOCKS5 tunnel13:41 Layer 4 Proxies and Protocol Reconstruction15:15 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-31Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj

episode 30: uReq with Martin Algesten.In this episode, we take a deep dive into uReq: why it was created, its history and origin, a high level overview, and explore in depth its protocols and implementation details. Learn more:https://github.com/algesten/ureq — A simple, safe HTTP clienthttps://github.com/algesten/ureq/blob/main/src/run.rs - example on how uReq and Sans IO come togetherhttps://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTTP/Reference/Headers/Expect — Expect 100 Continuehttps://github.com/algesten — Github profile of Martin Algestenhttps://github.com/algesten/str0m — A Sans I/O WebRTC implementation in Rusthttps://netstack.fm/#episode-16 — WebRTC and Sans IO with Martin AlgestenRamaIf you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.orgChapters00:00 Intro00:58 Get to know Martin06:46 Evolution of uReq: From Simplicity to Compliance20:35 Sans IO26:58 uReq prior to Sans IO30:57 Practical Examples: Handling Complex Protocols50:54 Sans IO in Str0m and uReq55:01 Handling Proxies and DNS Resolution01:02:51 The Future of uReq and uReq Proto01:07:06 Sans IO and h201:09:00 Final Thoughts and Community Feedback01:20:09 OutroNetstack.FMMore information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-30Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCDReach out to us: [email protected] for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj